Keeping guns from criminals - liberals, what is your plan?

[2aguy]

All we've asked is that you prove the dynamics behind your idea, and you can't do it.

I myself have pointed out that the mass murders that we have seen had nothing to do with registration, purchases from gun shows, or licensing. Whether legally allowed to have a firearm or not, they got one, usually through theft.

So we register all guns, now what? Do you think that's going to stop one murder when you can get a gun on the street in less than ten minutes?

That's the point. Making it more difficult to get a gun. Too fucking bad if it slightly infringes on your rights; I suspect you're one of those happy to make it more difficult to vote based on the meme that voter fraud is rampant.

If so, you too support the callous conservative ethos, "I've got mine, fuck the rest of you".

It ONLY infringes on our rights. We jump through the hoops to get the legal gun. Criminals just buy an illegal gun. Here's the inside scoop on that homes, they're CRIMINALS.

But your plan to make the streets safer to commit crimes is working. Nice body counts you're getting on these shootings, well done. You must be very proud

"criminals just buy an illegal gun"!

What makes a gun illegal (within the context of your rant)?

Selling a gun to an unlicensed person would be a criminal act. Assuming all convicted felons and persons on probation, parole or with outstanding warrants cannot have a license, or may have had one but is suspended based on such factors, anyone giving, selling, loaning such a gun is themselves a criminal, and thus no honest, law abiding citizen is infringed.

You're simply too biased or not bright enough to think through this suggestion, thus you rely on personal attacks and whine about your rights, when there are real victims whose rights are violated by the proliferation of guns in America.

Of course being an asshole can't be fixed, so Fuck off.

selling or giving a gun to a felon is already a crime

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

It doesn't matter if I know or not.....he knows.....and when he is caught with it he goes to jail.....there is no need to bother the normal, law abiding citizen......just to show what a fair guy I am...fine the seller if he isn't a gun trafficker...say, 1000 dollars, no misdemeanor, no felony...it is enough of a punishment to cause a bite, but not extreme the way the anti gun extremists want to punish him.....

A major trafficker, who knows he is actively breaking the law, by selling lots of guns to people he knows can't own them legally.....you arrest him and send him to jail.

Leave the law abiding alone.

 

[paulitician]

Then go work in a slaughterhouse. At least then i could give you some credibility. Because i don't buy your 'I hunt for food' B.S. Hunters hunt because they like killing and maiming. It's not for food or survival.

I don't hunt at all, dumb ass. What part of I'm a vegetarian don't you grasp? I do like to shoot targets, like skeet. But I've not been out for a while. When I retire I'd like to do that again and take up golf again.

As for the slaughterhouse, you're not a hypocrite for eating meat while everything you say is pure hypocrisy over your own diet and how they kill your animals if I work in a slaughterhouse? You're going to have to explain that one. It's vacuous ... even for you ...

Check out a hunting magazine sometime. All the camo-wearing ghouls posing with their tortured 'Trophies.' It's not about food or survival for them. Stick with golf. Now that's a sport.

Look....we know you couldn't sell a gun to save your life, and you are really bitter about it. Don't blame the buyers, they like salemen who can actually do their job.......try another line of work.....like greeting at Wal Mart.....

Isn't too difficult selling a gun to a gun-obsessed Gun Nut. For them, guns & bullets are what crack is to crack addicts. Like shooting fish in a barrel. However, i did grow tired of the loons. And i do regret selling firearms to so many of em. Many of them shouldn't have been anywhere near firearms. But that's something i'll have to live with.

So....while the other sales people were selling guns like hot cakes, the actual gun enthusiasts sensed something odd about you and didn't buy anything from you.....got it.....no reason to be bitter about it....

I sold many. Like i said, it ain't too difficult selling a gun to an obsessed Gun Nut. For them, guns & bullets are like crack cocaine is for crack addicts.

 

[2aguy]

All we've asked is that you prove the dynamics behind your idea, and you can't do it.

I myself have pointed out that the mass murders that we have seen had nothing to do with registration, purchases from gun shows, or licensing. Whether legally allowed to have a firearm or not, they got one, usually through theft.

So we register all guns, now what? Do you think that's going to stop one murder when you can get a gun on the street in less than ten minutes?

That's the point. Making it more difficult to get a gun. Too fucking bad if it slightly infringes on your rights; I suspect you're one of those happy to make it more difficult to vote based on the meme that voter fraud is rampant.

If so, you too support the callous conservative ethos, "I've got mine, fuck the rest of you".

It ONLY infringes on our rights. We jump through the hoops to get the legal gun. Criminals just buy an illegal gun. Here's the inside scoop on that homes, they're CRIMINALS.

But your plan to make the streets safer to commit crimes is working. Nice body counts you're getting on these shootings, well done. You must be very proud

"criminals just buy an illegal gun"!

What makes a gun illegal (within the context of your rant)?

Selling a gun to an unlicensed person would be a criminal act. Assuming all convicted felons and persons on probation, parole or with outstanding warrants cannot have a license, or may have had one but is suspended based on such factors, anyone giving, selling, loaning such a gun is themselves a criminal, and thus no honest, law abiding citizen is infringed.

You're simply too biased or not bright enough to think through this suggestion, thus you rely on personal attacks and whine about your rights, when there are real victims whose rights are violated by the proliferation of guns in America.

Of course being an asshole can't be fixed, so Fuck off.

selling or giving a gun to a felon is already a crime

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

Selling one or more guns to a neighbor is not the problem, and shouldn't be the focus.....make it a fine, say....1000 dollars a gun, no misdeneanor and no felony.....to teach him to check next time. Maybe...I'll have to think about the way the anti gun extremists could exploit that policy.

 

[paulitician]

That's the point. Making it more difficult to get a gun. Too fucking bad if it slightly infringes on your rights; I suspect you're one of those happy to make it more difficult to vote based on the meme that voter fraud is rampant.

If so, you too support the callous conservative ethos, "I've got mine, fuck the rest of you".

It ONLY infringes on our rights. We jump through the hoops to get the legal gun. Criminals just buy an illegal gun. Here's the inside scoop on that homes, they're CRIMINALS.

But your plan to make the streets safer to commit crimes is working. Nice body counts you're getting on these shootings, well done. You must be very proud

"criminals just buy an illegal gun"!

What makes a gun illegal (within the context of your rant)?

Selling a gun to an unlicensed person would be a criminal act. Assuming all convicted felons and persons on probation, parole or with outstanding warrants cannot have a license, or may have had one but is suspended based on such factors, anyone giving, selling, loaning such a gun is themselves a criminal, and thus no honest, law abiding citizen is infringed.

You're simply too biased or not bright enough to think through this suggestion, thus you rely on personal attacks and whine about your rights, when there are real victims whose rights are violated by the proliferation of guns in America.

Of course being an asshole can't be fixed, so Fuck off.

selling or giving a gun to a felon is already a crime

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

It doesn't matter if I know or not.....he knows.....and when he is caught with it he goes to jail.....there is no need to bother the normal, law abiding citizen......just to show what a fair guy I am...fine the seller if he isn't a gun trafficker...say, 1000 dollars, no misdemeanor, no felony...it is enough of a punishment to cause a bite, but not extreme the way the anti gun extremists want to punish him.....

A major trafficker, who knows he is actively breaking the law, by selling lots of guns to people he knows can't own them legally.....you arrest him and send him to jail.

Leave the law abiding alone.

Are you saying you're fine with people selling guns to Felons? Are you saying the gun seller shouldn't be held accountable?

 

[paulitician]

That's the point. Making it more difficult to get a gun. Too fucking bad if it slightly infringes on your rights; I suspect you're one of those happy to make it more difficult to vote based on the meme that voter fraud is rampant.

If so, you too support the callous conservative ethos, "I've got mine, fuck the rest of you".

It ONLY infringes on our rights. We jump through the hoops to get the legal gun. Criminals just buy an illegal gun. Here's the inside scoop on that homes, they're CRIMINALS.

But your plan to make the streets safer to commit crimes is working. Nice body counts you're getting on these shootings, well done. You must be very proud

"criminals just buy an illegal gun"!

What makes a gun illegal (within the context of your rant)?

Selling a gun to an unlicensed person would be a criminal act. Assuming all convicted felons and persons on probation, parole or with outstanding warrants cannot have a license, or may have had one but is suspended based on such factors, anyone giving, selling, loaning such a gun is themselves a criminal, and thus no honest, law abiding citizen is infringed.

You're simply too biased or not bright enough to think through this suggestion, thus you rely on personal attacks and whine about your rights, when there are real victims whose rights are violated by the proliferation of guns in America.

Of course being an asshole can't be fixed, so Fuck off.

selling or giving a gun to a felon is already a crime

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

Selling one or more guns to a neighbor is not the problem, and shouldn't be the focus.....make it a fine, say....1000 dollars a gun, no misdeneanor and no felony.....to teach him to check next time. Maybe...I'll have to think about the way the anti gun extremists could exploit that policy.

If you sell a firearm to a neighbor who's a Felon, you will have to be held accountable. You have a responsibility. A small fine isn't gonna cut it.

 

[2aguy]

Then why can't you show where any of the links present actual proposals to get guns out of the hands of criminals? All you can make are empty statements

Only assholes and abject fools continue to ask this same stupid question.

You've proven to be both.

Assholes and fools continue to post claims that millions of times a year a gun is used by a good guy to stop a bad thing from happening. Yet, no credible evidence is ever posted to prove the truth of thus claim.

I've made a very simple suggestion which you cannot refute, you cannot prove that licensing won't reduce the number of guns in the hands of those who should not have them in their possession.

Prove to me it won't work or continue to be the fool and asshole you are. The same challenge goes out to M14 and the dude from Cleveland - 2aguy is terminally stupid, thus I won't expect anything intelligible from that clown.

All we've asked is that you prove the dynamics behind your idea, and you can't do it.

I myself have pointed out that the mass murders that we have seen had nothing to do with registration, purchases from gun shows, or licensing. Whether legally allowed to have a firearm or not, they got one, usually through theft.

So we register all guns, now what? Do you think that's going to stop one murder when you can get a gun on the street in less than ten minutes?

That's the point. Making it more difficult to get a gun. Too fucking bad if it slightly infringes on your rights; I suspect you're one of those happy to make it more difficult to vote based on the meme that voter fraud is rampant.

If so, you too support the callous conservative ethos, "I've got mine, fuck the rest of you".

I think any one of us would do what it takes to prevent a mass shooting or simple murders, but as we all know, licensing a gun will do none of that because murderers don't use legal guns unless it's a murder/ suicide. And the only place licensing would happen is in the sales of legal guns.

As for all those illegal guns that criminals use, it won't change one thing.

What defines an illegal gun?

BTW, I've not suggested the gun be licensed, only the person who wants to own, possess or have in his or her custody or control a gun. This does not mean gun registration - something I've not proposed - and thus a license allows for one gun or many guns.

Point of fact, some of the mass murderers used a gun they legally purchased. Some of them had known psychiatric problems, hipaa might need to be looked at in terms of gun of licensing, making it mandatory to notify the licensing agency if the mental health professional believes their patient is potentially violent and or has made threats. Family members could also make such a statement, under penalty of perjury, if they feel a member of their family is potentially violent and should not be licensed.

Point of Fact: I'm not writing the law, doing so requires much more detail then I'm willing to post. It's awfully easy for others to simply write, "ain't if awful" and call me stupid, a common response by those who have no interest in mitigating gun violence in our country.

BTW, I've not suggested the gun be licensed, only the person who wants to own, possess or have in his or her custody or control a gun. This does not mean gun registration - something I've not proposed - and thus a license allows for one gun or many guns.

How does this do anything to achieve what you say you want to achieve. Criminals can't be licensed under your concept already under existing law...they already can't own or touch or carry a gun right now......no need to license anyone to do that.

The handfull of mass shooters who were nuts is tiny...tiny, to base implementing your policy on those events. The various mass shooters who were nuts were not under any care by a psychaitrist or other professional that would ban their ability to get a gun....and once you implement that, then the more lucid nuts will make sure not to get any medical attention...dittos normal gun owners who may want to see a grief counselor, or family counselor...you will be teaching them to not get help with their minor problems for fear they will be put on a list.......

 

[2aguy]

It ONLY infringes on our rights. We jump through the hoops to get the legal gun. Criminals just buy an illegal gun. Here's the inside scoop on that homes, they're CRIMINALS.

But your plan to make the streets safer to commit crimes is working. Nice body counts you're getting on these shootings, well done. You must be very proud

"criminals just buy an illegal gun"!

What makes a gun illegal (within the context of your rant)?

Selling a gun to an unlicensed person would be a criminal act. Assuming all convicted felons and persons on probation, parole or with outstanding warrants cannot have a license, or may have had one but is suspended based on such factors, anyone giving, selling, loaning such a gun is themselves a criminal, and thus no honest, law abiding citizen is infringed.

You're simply too biased or not bright enough to think through this suggestion, thus you rely on personal attacks and whine about your rights, when there are real victims whose rights are violated by the proliferation of guns in America.

Of course being an asshole can't be fixed, so Fuck off.

selling or giving a gun to a felon is already a crime

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

It doesn't matter if I know or not.....he knows.....and when he is caught with it he goes to jail.....there is no need to bother the normal, law abiding citizen......just to show what a fair guy I am...fine the seller if he isn't a gun trafficker...say, 1000 dollars, no misdemeanor, no felony...it is enough of a punishment to cause a bite, but not extreme the way the anti gun extremists want to punish him.....

A major trafficker, who knows he is actively breaking the law, by selling lots of guns to people he knows can't own them legally.....you arrest him and send him to jail.

Leave the law abiding alone.

Are you saying you're fine with people selling guns to Felons? Are you saying the gun seller shouldn't be held accountable?

No. I am saying a gun store needs to check. A person selling one gun to a neighbor or even several shouldnt' be put in jail for it. Guns are legal products just like cars. I can sell a car to a person with a DUI who has had his license revoked without being penalized...the responsiblity is put on them, not me. The felon already knows they can't buy the gun so if he is caught with the gun you can already arrest them, right now without licensing anyone.

I say for the non trafficker, put a fine on them.....also, put out PSA about never selling guns without knowing who you are selling them to.....

That is how you target actual criminals without violating the rights of normal citizens....

 

[2aguy]

It ONLY infringes on our rights. We jump through the hoops to get the legal gun. Criminals just buy an illegal gun. Here's the inside scoop on that homes, they're CRIMINALS.

But your plan to make the streets safer to commit crimes is working. Nice body counts you're getting on these shootings, well done. You must be very proud

"criminals just buy an illegal gun"!

What makes a gun illegal (within the context of your rant)?

Selling a gun to an unlicensed person would be a criminal act. Assuming all convicted felons and persons on probation, parole or with outstanding warrants cannot have a license, or may have had one but is suspended based on such factors, anyone giving, selling, loaning such a gun is themselves a criminal, and thus no honest, law abiding citizen is infringed.

You're simply too biased or not bright enough to think through this suggestion, thus you rely on personal attacks and whine about your rights, when there are real victims whose rights are violated by the proliferation of guns in America.

Of course being an asshole can't be fixed, so Fuck off.

selling or giving a gun to a felon is already a crime

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

Selling one or more guns to a neighbor is not the problem, and shouldn't be the focus.....make it a fine, say....1000 dollars a gun, no misdeneanor and no felony.....to teach him to check next time. Maybe...I'll have to think about the way the anti gun extremists could exploit that policy.

If you sell a firearm to a neighbor who's a Felon, you will have to be held accountable. You have a responsibility. A small fine isn't gonna cut it.

No you don't. Guns are legal products and we are not cops. The felon already knows that they can't buy the gun...so when he is caught you arrest him on the spot...no need to license anyone, no need to punish the law abiding citizen.

Guns are legal products. It is no different when a person who has lost their license goes to buy a used car....you do not require the seller of the car to research the driving history of the buyer or hold him to account for abuse of the car by the drunk driver. The same applies to guns.....

We are not cops. It is not on us to investigate possible criminals on our own dime....catch the felon when they have the gun....you can already arrest them, they knowingly broke the law.

 

[paulitician]

"criminals just buy an illegal gun"!

What makes a gun illegal (within the context of your rant)?

Selling a gun to an unlicensed person would be a criminal act. Assuming all convicted felons and persons on probation, parole or with outstanding warrants cannot have a license, or may have had one but is suspended based on such factors, anyone giving, selling, loaning such a gun is themselves a criminal, and thus no honest, law abiding citizen is infringed.

You're simply too biased or not bright enough to think through this suggestion, thus you rely on personal attacks and whine about your rights, when there are real victims whose rights are violated by the proliferation of guns in America.

Of course being an asshole can't be fixed, so Fuck off.

selling or giving a gun to a felon is already a crime

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

It doesn't matter if I know or not.....he knows.....and when he is caught with it he goes to jail.....there is no need to bother the normal, law abiding citizen......just to show what a fair guy I am...fine the seller if he isn't a gun trafficker...say, 1000 dollars, no misdemeanor, no felony...it is enough of a punishment to cause a bite, but not extreme the way the anti gun extremists want to punish him.....

A major trafficker, who knows he is actively breaking the law, by selling lots of guns to people he knows can't own them legally.....you arrest him and send him to jail.

Leave the law abiding alone.

Are you saying you're fine with people selling guns to Felons? Are you saying the gun seller shouldn't be held accountable?

No. I am saying a gun store needs to check. A person selling one gun to a neighbor or even several shouldnt' be put in jail for it. Guns are legal products just like cars. I can sell a car to a person with a DUI who has had his license revoked without being penalized...the responsiblity is put on them, not me. The felon already knows they can't buy the gun so if he is caught with the gun you can already arrest them, right now without licensing anyone.

I say for the non trafficker, put a fine on them.....also, put out PSA about never selling guns without knowing who you are selling them to.....

That is how you target actual criminals without violating the rights of normal citizens....

Sorry man, but that's a hard sell. You sell a gun to a Felon, you have to be held accountable. It's on you. And a small fine probably isn't gonna suffice.

 

[paulitician]

"criminals just buy an illegal gun"!

What makes a gun illegal (within the context of your rant)?

Selling a gun to an unlicensed person would be a criminal act. Assuming all convicted felons and persons on probation, parole or with outstanding warrants cannot have a license, or may have had one but is suspended based on such factors, anyone giving, selling, loaning such a gun is themselves a criminal, and thus no honest, law abiding citizen is infringed.

You're simply too biased or not bright enough to think through this suggestion, thus you rely on personal attacks and whine about your rights, when there are real victims whose rights are violated by the proliferation of guns in America.

Of course being an asshole can't be fixed, so Fuck off.

selling or giving a gun to a felon is already a crime

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

Selling one or more guns to a neighbor is not the problem, and shouldn't be the focus.....make it a fine, say....1000 dollars a gun, no misdeneanor and no felony.....to teach him to check next time. Maybe...I'll have to think about the way the anti gun extremists could exploit that policy.

If you sell a firearm to a neighbor who's a Felon, you will have to be held accountable. You have a responsibility. A small fine isn't gonna cut it.

No you don't. Guns are legal products and we are not cops. The felon already knows that they can't buy the gun...so when he is caught you arrest him on the spot...no need to license anyone, no need to punish the law abiding citizen.

Guns are legal products. It is no different when a person who has lost their license goes to buy a used car....you do not require the seller of the car to research the driving history of the buyer or hold him to account for abuse of the car by the drunk driver. The same applies to guns.....

We are not cops. It is not on us to investigate possible criminals on our own dime....catch the felon when they have the gun....you can already arrest them, they knowingly broke the law.

There are loopholes. But they'll be closed eventually. You sell a firearm to a Felon, you need to be held accountable.

 

[2aguy]

selling or giving a gun to a felon is already a crime

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

It doesn't matter if I know or not.....he knows.....and when he is caught with it he goes to jail.....there is no need to bother the normal, law abiding citizen......just to show what a fair guy I am...fine the seller if he isn't a gun trafficker...say, 1000 dollars, no misdemeanor, no felony...it is enough of a punishment to cause a bite, but not extreme the way the anti gun extremists want to punish him.....

A major trafficker, who knows he is actively breaking the law, by selling lots of guns to people he knows can't own them legally.....you arrest him and send him to jail.

Leave the law abiding alone.

Are you saying you're fine with people selling guns to Felons? Are you saying the gun seller shouldn't be held accountable?

No. I am saying a gun store needs to check. A person selling one gun to a neighbor or even several shouldnt' be put in jail for it. Guns are legal products just like cars. I can sell a car to a person with a DUI who has had his license revoked without being penalized...the responsiblity is put on them, not me. The felon already knows they can't buy the gun so if he is caught with the gun you can already arrest them, right now without licensing anyone.

I say for the non trafficker, put a fine on them.....also, put out PSA about never selling guns without knowing who you are selling them to.....

That is how you target actual criminals without violating the rights of normal citizens....

Sorry man, but that's a hard sell. You sell a gun to a Felon, you have to be held accountable. It's on you. And a small fine probably isn't gonna suffice.

If you sell a used car to a guy with a DUI and he drives the car and kills someone...are you on the hook for that?

No.

We are not cops....finding people breaking the law is their job, not ours. The felon already knows he can't own the gun, if you catch him with it you can send him to jail without bothering the normal, law abiding citizen.

Guns are legal products, and we are free citizens. Joe Citizen selling his hunting rifle or extra pistol to a neighbor is not the problem we have with guns in this country. The problem is criminal gangs, stealing guns (which makes licensing gun owners useless), buying from criminal gun dealers ( which makes licensing law abiding gun owners useless), using a family or friend who has a license buy the gun for them and report it stolen (Which makes licensing gun owners useless), or buying a gun from someone who already stole it ( again, making licensing gun owners pointless)


With all those ways a criminal gets passed needing a license to own a gun, the paperwork, manpower and cost to license gun owners is pointless and stupid.

 

[2aguy]

selling or giving a gun to a felon is already a crime

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

Selling one or more guns to a neighbor is not the problem, and shouldn't be the focus.....make it a fine, say....1000 dollars a gun, no misdeneanor and no felony.....to teach him to check next time. Maybe...I'll have to think about the way the anti gun extremists could exploit that policy.

If you sell a firearm to a neighbor who's a Felon, you will have to be held accountable. You have a responsibility. A small fine isn't gonna cut it.

No you don't. Guns are legal products and we are not cops. The felon already knows that they can't buy the gun...so when he is caught you arrest him on the spot...no need to license anyone, no need to punish the law abiding citizen.

Guns are legal products. It is no different when a person who has lost their license goes to buy a used car....you do not require the seller of the car to research the driving history of the buyer or hold him to account for abuse of the car by the drunk driver. The same applies to guns.....

We are not cops. It is not on us to investigate possible criminals on our own dime....catch the felon when they have the gun....you can already arrest them, they knowingly broke the law.

There are loopholes. But they'll be closed eventually. You sell a firearm to a Felon, you need to be held accountable.

So if you sell your computer to a convicted child porn guy who is legally barred from ever touching a computer, which is one part of that conviction...are you on the hook for selling that computer to a known felon....

No.

Guns are no different.

 

[2aguy]

selling or giving a gun to a felon is already a crime

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

Selling one or more guns to a neighbor is not the problem, and shouldn't be the focus.....make it a fine, say....1000 dollars a gun, no misdeneanor and no felony.....to teach him to check next time. Maybe...I'll have to think about the way the anti gun extremists could exploit that policy.

If you sell a firearm to a neighbor who's a Felon, you will have to be held accountable. You have a responsibility. A small fine isn't gonna cut it.

No you don't. Guns are legal products and we are not cops. The felon already knows that they can't buy the gun...so when he is caught you arrest him on the spot...no need to license anyone, no need to punish the law abiding citizen.

Guns are legal products. It is no different when a person who has lost their license goes to buy a used car....you do not require the seller of the car to research the driving history of the buyer or hold him to account for abuse of the car by the drunk driver. The same applies to guns.....

We are not cops. It is not on us to investigate possible criminals on our own dime....catch the felon when they have the gun....you can already arrest them, they knowingly broke the law.

There are loopholes. But they'll be closed eventually. You sell a firearm to a Felon, you need to be held accountable.

Do you realize that Illinois has licenses for all gun owners called the Firearm Owners Identification CArd.....you submit to a State Police background check and then you get your "license" and you need it to buy guns, ammo and to shoot on a commercial range, as well as to transport guns.

I have one. I have never committed a crime.

And you know what...it has no effect on the shooting gallery that we call the city of Chicago....so....with that actual application also showing how dumb gun licensing is.....why do we need it again?

 

[paulitician]

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

It doesn't matter if I know or not.....he knows.....and when he is caught with it he goes to jail.....there is no need to bother the normal, law abiding citizen......just to show what a fair guy I am...fine the seller if he isn't a gun trafficker...say, 1000 dollars, no misdemeanor, no felony...it is enough of a punishment to cause a bite, but not extreme the way the anti gun extremists want to punish him.....

A major trafficker, who knows he is actively breaking the law, by selling lots of guns to people he knows can't own them legally.....you arrest him and send him to jail.

Leave the law abiding alone.

Are you saying you're fine with people selling guns to Felons? Are you saying the gun seller shouldn't be held accountable?

No. I am saying a gun store needs to check. A person selling one gun to a neighbor or even several shouldnt' be put in jail for it. Guns are legal products just like cars. I can sell a car to a person with a DUI who has had his license revoked without being penalized...the responsiblity is put on them, not me. The felon already knows they can't buy the gun so if he is caught with the gun you can already arrest them, right now without licensing anyone.

I say for the non trafficker, put a fine on them.....also, put out PSA about never selling guns without knowing who you are selling them to.....

That is how you target actual criminals without violating the rights of normal citizens....

Sorry man, but that's a hard sell. You sell a gun to a Felon, you have to be held accountable. It's on you. And a small fine probably isn't gonna suffice.

If you sell a used car to a guy with a DUI and he drives the car and kills someone...are you on the hook for that?

No.

We are not cops....finding people breaking the law is their job, not ours. The felon already knows he can't own the gun, if you catch him with it you can send him to jail without bothering the normal, law abiding citizen.

Guns are legal products, and we are free citizens. Joe Citizen selling his hunting rifle or extra pistol to a neighbor is not the problem we have with guns in this country. The problem is criminal gangs, stealing guns (which makes licensing gun owners useless), buying from criminal gun dealers ( which makes licensing law abiding gun owners useless), using a family or friend who has a license buy the gun for them and report it stolen (Which makes licensing gun owners useless), or buying a gun from someone who already stole it ( again, making licensing gun owners pointless)


With all those ways a criminal gets passed needing a license to own a gun, the paperwork, manpower and cost to license gun owners is pointless and stupid.

You can spin it anyway you like, but you sell a firearm to a Felon, it's on you. You have to pay the price.

 

[fanofthepower]

Every time there's a shooting, liberals run around saying this proves we need more gun laws. I ask liberals over and over how exactly you are going to keep guns out of the hands of criminals every time you say you want more gun laws.

In particular, address given that drugs are illegal, and yet any parent knows any kid can get as much pot as they want. There are millions of guns in the US, millions more in the world. So don't just say more laws, explain how more laws are going to actually work.

So, there have been 7 shootings killing at least 10 people in the last decade. The only thing you've achieved so far is that no one was shooting back.

Simple stuff...outlaw guns, get rid of them...you don't have access to them because they don't exist...criminals don't have access to them because they don't exist...simple stuff.....

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Do you need someone else to kill your cow to survive? At least hunters take responsibility, instead of facing the reality of life and death yourself.

Check out a hunting magazine cover sometime. Those despicable cretins don't hunt for food or survival. They hunt for 'Trophies.' They enjoy killing & maiming innocent defenseless animals. They're deranged pussies.

Did you know that camo isn't just an erotic gay sex pattern you wear on weekends, but it helps hunters to not be seen by their prey?

Ha, they're dumb loons hiding in trees waiting for an animal to walk by. Not 'Sporting' at all. They should call it 'Waiting' instead. Because that's all they're doing. Obviously an animal is gonna walk by at some point. It's the bleepin woods for God's sake!

And i especially despise the pussies who use attractants like salt blocks and sprays. I mean really? Attracting a poor hungry animal to you just so you can brutally murder it? Wow, pretty damn sick. Yeah, put the camo away and find another hobby.

But someone putting a bolt through a cow's head so you can shred and cook it, that's not "murder," is it Holmes? What if hunters eat their meat with fries and slaw like you do? Would it be cool then?

Then go work in a slaughterhouse. At least then i could give you some credibility. Because i don't buy your 'I hunt for food' B.S. Hunters hunt because they like killing and maiming. It's not for food or survival.

Actually it's both. Hunters do enjoy hunting, but they also enjoy eating their kill. Do you have this same hang-up with fishing too? You know, those poor little fish being tricked that they are going to be eating something only to find out it's a lure with hooks on it?

 

[2aguy]

It doesn't matter if I know or not.....he knows.....and when he is caught with it he goes to jail.....there is no need to bother the normal, law abiding citizen......just to show what a fair guy I am...fine the seller if he isn't a gun trafficker...say, 1000 dollars, no misdemeanor, no felony...it is enough of a punishment to cause a bite, but not extreme the way the anti gun extremists want to punish him.....

A major trafficker, who knows he is actively breaking the law, by selling lots of guns to people he knows can't own them legally.....you arrest him and send him to jail.

Leave the law abiding alone.

Are you saying you're fine with people selling guns to Felons? Are you saying the gun seller shouldn't be held accountable?

No. I am saying a gun store needs to check. A person selling one gun to a neighbor or even several shouldnt' be put in jail for it. Guns are legal products just like cars. I can sell a car to a person with a DUI who has had his license revoked without being penalized...the responsiblity is put on them, not me. The felon already knows they can't buy the gun so if he is caught with the gun you can already arrest them, right now without licensing anyone.

I say for the non trafficker, put a fine on them.....also, put out PSA about never selling guns without knowing who you are selling them to.....

That is how you target actual criminals without violating the rights of normal citizens....

Sorry man, but that's a hard sell. You sell a gun to a Felon, you have to be held accountable. It's on you. And a small fine probably isn't gonna suffice.

If you sell a used car to a guy with a DUI and he drives the car and kills someone...are you on the hook for that?

No.

We are not cops....finding people breaking the law is their job, not ours. The felon already knows he can't own the gun, if you catch him with it you can send him to jail without bothering the normal, law abiding citizen.

Guns are legal products, and we are free citizens. Joe Citizen selling his hunting rifle or extra pistol to a neighbor is not the problem we have with guns in this country. The problem is criminal gangs, stealing guns (which makes licensing gun owners useless), buying from criminal gun dealers ( which makes licensing law abiding gun owners useless), using a family or friend who has a license buy the gun for them and report it stolen (Which makes licensing gun owners useless), or buying a gun from someone who already stole it ( again, making licensing gun owners pointless)


With all those ways a criminal gets passed needing a license to own a gun, the paperwork, manpower and cost to license gun owners is pointless and stupid.

You can spin it anyway you like, but you sell a firearm to a Felon, it's on you. You have to pay the price.

Sorry, I am not interested in tripping up law abiding people...considering licensing has never worked here in Illinois.....the gangs in Chicago don't seem to need licenses to get their guns and 80% of all gun crime in Chicago is by gang members........

 

[paulitician]

True. How would you know the gun you are selling to a friend or neighbor is not a convicted felon?

Selling one or more guns to a neighbor is not the problem, and shouldn't be the focus.....make it a fine, say....1000 dollars a gun, no misdeneanor and no felony.....to teach him to check next time. Maybe...I'll have to think about the way the anti gun extremists could exploit that policy.

If you sell a firearm to a neighbor who's a Felon, you will have to be held accountable. You have a responsibility. A small fine isn't gonna cut it.

No you don't. Guns are legal products and we are not cops. The felon already knows that they can't buy the gun...so when he is caught you arrest him on the spot...no need to license anyone, no need to punish the law abiding citizen.

Guns are legal products. It is no different when a person who has lost their license goes to buy a used car....you do not require the seller of the car to research the driving history of the buyer or hold him to account for abuse of the car by the drunk driver. The same applies to guns.....

We are not cops. It is not on us to investigate possible criminals on our own dime....catch the felon when they have the gun....you can already arrest them, they knowingly broke the law.

There are loopholes. But they'll be closed eventually. You sell a firearm to a Felon, you need to be held accountable.

Do you realize that Illinois has licenses for all gun owners called the Firearm Owners Identification CArd.....you submit to a State Police background check and then you get your "license" and you need it to buy guns, ammo and to shoot on a commercial range, as well as to transport guns.

I have one. I have never committed a crime.

And you know what...it has no effect on the shooting gallery that we call the city of Chicago....so....with that actual application also showing how dumb gun licensing is.....why do we need it again?

I don't support those laws. But if you're gonna sell a firearm, i suggest you do your due diligence. If the purchaser turns out to be a Felon, you have to be held accountable.

 

[2aguy]

Every time there's a shooting, liberals run around saying this proves we need more gun laws. I ask liberals over and over how exactly you are going to keep guns out of the hands of criminals every time you say you want more gun laws.

In particular, address given that drugs are illegal, and yet any parent knows any kid can get as much pot as they want. There are millions of guns in the US, millions more in the world. So don't just say more laws, explain how more laws are going to actually work.

So, there have been 7 shootings killing at least 10 people in the last decade. The only thing you've achieved so far is that no one was shooting back.

Simple stuff...outlaw guns, get rid of them...you don't have access to them because they don't exist...criminals don't have access to them because they don't exist...simple stuff.....

Wow...you are a genius........

You know...we actually had a time when there were no guns on the planet.....and people butchered each other with swords, axes, spears and arrows.....and the weak were enslaved by the strong.

Then guns came along and the weak could actually fight off the strong and slavery was ended.......

 

[Wry Catcher]

Selling a gun to an unlicensed person would be a criminal act

Bam, the first point you processed. They are CRIMINALS. That's quite a breakthrough for you

Assuming all convicted felons and persons on probation, parole or with outstanding warrants cannot have a license, or may have had one but is suspended based on such factors, anyone giving, selling, loaning such a gun is themselves a criminal, and thus no honest, law abiding citizen is infringed

Really? Then why in Sandy Hook, Virginia Tech, Columbine, Aurora and the other mass slaughters were there so many bodies and no one shooting back? Even in the freaking Washington NAVY yard there were no guns to be found in a victim pool of gun owners.

Here's the 411, sparky, having a gun at home in your safe isn't defense when you're being shot. Now, can you get a second point or are you still just too proud of yourself for figuring out that criminals don't follow the law

Still being an asshole, I guess you always have been and always will be. Fuck Off. I'll respond when you are civil and not lying (a day that will never come).