Message to Libertarians and others: The founding fathers believed in regulation

[The Rabbi]

Message to Libertarians and others: The founding fathers believed in regulation

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

Madison as well as Hamilton believed the nation needed a strong and more powerful central government than had previously existed. Federalist papers?

So why are people who are hostile to regulation like the Federalist Society always claiming to be the heirs of the traditions and ideals of Madison and Hamilton as well as claiming them as their inspiration and role models?

I understand the clueless, ill-educated here and elsewhere on the web making such ridiculous and absurd errors, but...

Like it's news here, you are a total dunce. "Well regulated" does not mean larded over with government regulations.
/Fail.

Regulation is regulation. Free Marketeers would have us go with no regulation.'


Others, no regulation all while claiming Madison and Hamilton as authority

A straw man wrapped in a fallacy adds up to a big ole FAIL.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

[MENTION=20947]The Rabbi[/MENTION] [MENTION=33194]PredFan[/MENTION]

Funny. The Founding Fathers believed in limited government, acknowledging that some regulations are required. The extreme left quotes them for their tyrannical ends, and the extreme right quotes them for their selfish ends. Libertarians are in the middle with the founders. I don't expect a hack idiot like Dante to agree but hey, I can't FORCE him to be right.

Limited? All the founding fathers? Or only some?

define limited? Did they all agree?

 

[Avorysuds]

LOLz~


There is another difference there too, None of that stuff in 2010 existed in the picture before it.

Man, you just made an epic size ass of yourself.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Message to Libertarians and others: The founding fathers believed in regulation

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

Madison as well as Hamilton believed the nation needed a strong and more powerful central government than had previously existed. Federalist papers?

So why are people who are hostile to regulation like the Federalist Society always claiming to be the heirs of the traditions and ideals of Madison and Hamilton as well as claiming them as their inspiration and role models?

I understand the clueless, ill-educated here and elsewhere on the web making such ridiculous and absurd errors, but...

True.

Since the advent of the Republic it was accepted and understood by the founding generation that the Constitution affords Congress powers both enumerated and implied (McCulloch v. Maryland (1819)), that the Commerce Clause authorizes Congress to enact regulatory policies (Gibbons v. Ogden (1824)), and that Congress has the power to regulate all markets, regardless how local or their size, where all markets are interrelated (Wickard v. Filburn (1942)).

 

[Avorysuds]

[MENTION=20947]The Rabbi[/MENTION] [MENTION=33194]PredFan[/MENTION]

Funny. The Founding Fathers believed in limited government, acknowledging that some regulations are required. The extreme left quotes them for their tyrannical ends, and the extreme right quotes them for their selfish ends. Libertarians are in the middle with the founders. I don't expect a hack idiot like Dante to agree but hey, I can't FORCE him to be right.

Limited? All the founding fathers? Or only some?

define limited? Did they all agree?

You can find the definitions in the constitution.... But you would have to read it.

Also the guy you like, Hamilton, he believed only rich people should vote... Go figure that's the guy you support.

OPS!~

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

[MENTION=30190]M.D. Rawlings[/MENTION] [MENTION=45418]Spiderman[/MENTION]

Message to Libertarians and others: The founding fathers believed in regulation

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

Madison as well as Hamilton believed the nation needed a strong and more powerful central government than had previously existed. Federalist papers?

So why are people who are hostile to regulation like the Federalist Society always claiming to be the heirs of the traditions and ideals of Madison and Hamilton as well as claiming them as their inspiration and role models?

I understand the clueless, ill-educated here and elsewhere on the web making such ridiculous and absurd errors, but...

The term well regulated does not necessarily mean government controlled.

It can also mean efficient, in good working order.

Meaning of the phrase "well-regulated"

Indeed. It did not mean regulated by the federal government at all.

A national government in charge of the militia would presuppose national regulation. Of course the states have a role.

Article 1, Section 8, Clause 16

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

READ THE FRIGGIN CONSTITUTION!

 

[Avorysuds]

[MENTION=30190]M.D. Rawlings[/MENTION] [MENTION=45418]Spiderman[/MENTION]

The term well regulated does not necessarily mean government controlled.

It can also mean efficient, in good working order.

Meaning of the phrase "well-regulated"

Indeed. It did not mean regulated by the federal government at all.

A national government in charge of the militia would presuppose national regulation. Of course the states have a role.

Article 1, Section 8, Clause 16

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

READ THE FRIGGIN CONSTITUTION!

I don't understand... No one is really arguing with you. You want a "well regulated milita" to mean controlling what guns they can have, if any. Basically you read one part of the constitution and decided that the other part (the second amendment) should not be in there.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

[MENTION=20947]The Rabbi[/MENTION] [MENTION=33194]PredFan[/MENTION]

Funny. The Founding Fathers believed in limited government, acknowledging that some regulations are required. The extreme left quotes them for their tyrannical ends, and the extreme right quotes them for their selfish ends. Libertarians are in the middle with the founders. I don't expect a hack idiot like Dante to agree but hey, I can't FORCE him to be right.

Limited? All the founding fathers? Or only some?

define limited? Did they all agree?

You can find the definitions in the constitution.... But you would have to read it.

Also the guy you like, Hamilton, he believed only rich people should vote... Go figure that's the guy you support.

OPS!~

Back in those days people defended slavery too.

go figure

and the framers compromised Human beings: slaves = 3/5

 

[Avorysuds]

[MENTION=20947]The Rabbi[/MENTION] [MENTION=33194]PredFan[/MENTION]

Limited? All the founding fathers? Or only some?

define limited? Did they all agree?

You can find the definitions in the constitution.... But you would have to read it.

Also the guy you like, Hamilton, he believed only rich people should vote... Go figure that's the guy you support.

OPS!~

Back in those days people defended slavery too.

go figure

and the framers compromised Human beings: slaves = 3/5

Yes, they were called Democrats, not libertarians.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

[MENTION=30190]M.D. Rawlings[/MENTION] [MENTION=45418]Spiderman[/MENTION]

Indeed. It did not mean regulated by the federal government at all.

A national government in charge of the militia would presuppose national regulation. Of course the states have a role.

Article 1, Section 8, Clause 16

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

READ THE FRIGGIN CONSTITUTION!

I don't understand... No one is really arguing with you. You want a "well regulated milita" to mean controlling what guns they can have, if any. Basically you read one part of the constitution and decided that the other part (the second amendment) should not be in there.

Nope. The OP is NOT about the 2nd amendment

It is about the nutty notion that America's founders were against regulation

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

You can find the definitions in the constitution.... But you would have to read it.

Also the guy you like, Hamilton, he believed only rich people should vote... Go figure that's the guy you support.

OPS!~

Back in those days people defended slavery too.

go figure

and the framers compromised Human beings: slaves = 3/5

Yes, they were called Democrats, not libertarians.

Southern, White, Conservative, Christians

 

[Avorysuds]

[MENTION=30190]M.D. Rawlings[/MENTION] [MENTION=45418]Spiderman[/MENTION]

A national government in charge of the militia would presuppose national regulation. Of course the states have a role.

Article 1, Section 8, Clause 16

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

READ THE FRIGGIN CONSTITUTION!

I don't understand... No one is really arguing with you. You want a "well regulated milita" to mean controlling what guns they can have, if any. Basically you read one part of the constitution and decided that the other part (the second amendment) should not be in there.

Nope. The OP is NOT about the 2nd amendment

It is about the nutty notion that America's founders were against regulation

And libertarians being supportive of the regulations that the constitution clearly outlines as powers means we understand regulations... You keep ma,king up new ones, at a 40k or so a year.

 

[Avorysuds]

Back in those days people defended slavery too.

go figure

and the framers compromised Human beings: slaves = 3/5

Yes, they were called Democrats, not libertarians.

Southern, White, Conservative, Christians

Yeah, we know, the Republicans decided to go to war with Dems to stop slavery.

 

[Agit8r]

Certainly all disinterested colonists believed in sensible regulation. Unfortunately common sense fell out of fashion during the 20th Century.

"The first Thing I remember of this kind, was a general discourse in Boston when I was a Boy, of a Complaint from North Carolina against New England Rum, that it poison'd their People, giving them the Dry Bellyach, with a Loss of the Use of their Limbs. The Distilleries being examin'd on the Occasion, it was found that several of them used leaden Still-heads and Worms, and the Physicians were of the Opinion that the Mischief was occasion'd by that Use of Lead. The Legislature of the Massachusetts thereupon pass'd an Act prohibiting under severe Penalties the Use of such Still-heads & Worms thereafter"
-- Benjamin Franklin; letter to Benjamin Vaughan (July 31, 1786)

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

I don't understand... No one is really arguing with you. You want a "well regulated milita" to mean controlling what guns they can have, if any. Basically you read one part of the constitution and decided that the other part (the second amendment) should not be in there.

Nope. The OP is NOT about the 2nd amendment

It is about the nutty notion that America's founders were against regulation

And libertarians being supportive of the regulations that the constitution clearly outlines as powers means we understand regulations... You keep ma,king up new ones, at a 40k or so a year.

Fighting all regulation on principle (before honestly evaluating) is nutty and it is what nutty libertarians do

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Yes, they were called Democrats, not libertarians.

Southern, White, Conservative, Christians

Yeah, we know, the Republicans decided to go to war with Dems to stop slavery.

The Republicans who fought against slavery were Liberals.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Certainly all disinterested colonists believed in sensible regulation. Unfortunately common sense fell out of fashion during the 20th Century.

"The first Thing I remember of this kind, was a general discourse in Boston when I was a Boy, of a Complaint from North Carolina against New England Rum, that it poison'd their People, giving them the Dry Bellyach, with a Loss of the Use of their Limbs. The Distilleries being examin'd on the Occasion, it was found that several of them used leaden Still-heads and Worms, and the Physicians were of the Opinion that the Mischief was occasion'd by that Use of Lead. The Legislature of the Massachusetts thereupon pass'd an Act prohibiting under severe Penalties the Use of such Still-heads & Worms thereafter"
-- Benjamin Franklin; letter to Benjamin Vaughan (July 31, 1786)

an agitator is a spinning wheel that goes back and forth in a washing machine.

sort of describes your foolishness

20th century America gave citizens a far better life than any before them

 

[Sallow]

Indeed. It did not mean regulated by the federal government at all.

For you and every other conservative.

U.S. Constitution | Constitution | US Law | LII / Legal Information Institute

Do yourselves a favor.

Take an hour or two.

And read it.

Show me where well regulated means under government control.

Post 13.

You guys are really incredible.

 

[Avorysuds]

Southern, White, Conservative, Christians

Yeah, we know, the Republicans decided to go to war with Dems to stop slavery.

The Republicans who fought against slavery were Liberals.

I see...

All good things are done by Democrats unless it's done by a Republican who secretly is a Democrat?

Did you know Mormons can convert people to their church even after that person has died? So in a very real way you're like a Mormon, you simply convert people you like in history to be Democrats and the ones you hate to Republicans...


And for the record you ignorant pos, most the nation was white and christian then, just like it is now. So it wouldn't mater if you talk about Republican or Democrat being white and Christian, seeing as almost everyone was.

And I can say that because I'm not ignorant, despite not being a Christian.

 

[Sallow]

What does that have to do witha well regulated militia? Darn you're stupid, aren't you?

Dayum Rabbi..are you even an American?

To make rules for the government and regulation of the land and naval forces;

To provide for calling forth the militia to execute the laws of the union, suppress insurrections and repel invasions;

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the militia, and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States, reserving to the states respectively, the appointment of the officers, and the authority of training the militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

You know so little about the Constitution, I really am having doubts that you live here.

Are you posting from North Korea or something?

Attention, Dumbass: that has diddly squat to do with well regulated militia.
Attention, Brainfart: Because the constitution allows federal regulation in some areas does not empower it to regulate in all areas.

I realize you're dumb as shit and have to compensate somehow. But can you at least refrain from talking about stuff you don't know? I realize that would include everything outside of scrubbing floors but if I ever need an expert opinoon I'll ask you.

It's written in English.

Seriously.

English.

Do you want the Russian translation? Comrade?