New Deal: Another Name For Fascism

[rdean]

And I thought this was going to be about anti civil-rights policies and turning over the country to corporations. Besides calling it Republican policies, what are the other names you could call it?

 

[Polk]

Ironically, it was the COMMUNISTS who were pissed at FDR and complained that he was "SAVING CAPITALISM"

Meanwhile, the radical right of the day was pissed at FDR and called the NEW DEALER a communist?

The right wing BANKSTER CLASS even when so far as to call him "A TRAITOR TO HIS CLASS." (how that for honesty on their part?...they KNEW that classism was alive and well in this nation)

Meanwhile, the vast majority of saner Amercans just thanked him for trying to mitigate the worst effects of the worst economic disater this nation had EVER faced. (that's why he kept getting elected time after time, ya know?)

But his efforts to rejuvinate our eonomy didn't really work until when?

1941 when the government really started spending money it did not have to fight the Axis powers.

You really hit on it there at the end. They claim it was the Second World War that ended the Depression. Fair enough, but what was the mechanism by which it happened? A massive increase in government spending.

 

[Polk]

And I thought this was going to be about anti civil-rights policies and turning over the country to corporations. Besides calling it Republican policies, what are the other names you could call it?

Unless workers can be chained to their machines, is anyone truly free?

 

[Big Fitz]

FDR saved capitalism.

Next...

Only tardtard would make this connection. How state property saved private property. Yet some more "Slavery is Freedom" 'wisdumb' of the left.

Film at 11.

Are you really naive enough to believe that people would have put up with the existing state of affairs forever?

Which state of affairs are you referring to. I'm sorry, my psychic powers are in the shop and I can't read advanced pronoun usage without context.

You know, that thing which you do about that over there? You know... that guy... has a nose... wears a shirt.

 

[Big Fitz]

FDR saved capitalism.

Next...

Only tardtard would make this connection. How state property saved private property. Yet some more "Slavery is Freedom" 'wisdumb' of the left.

Film at 11.

Only a retard would try to label FDR a fascist. Especially when there is evidence America's wealthiest industrialists and bankers plotted to overthrow the government of President Franklin D. Roosevelt and replace it with a fascist dictatorship.

Roosevelt did save capitalism from it's radical and extreme right wing form...fascism.

Maybe a better way of stating it is FDR saved America from fascism. Because there were fascists in the Republican ranks and the biggest backers of Hitler in America were industrialists and bankers.

But the word 'save' must be understood in proper context...100% of nothing is still NOTHING.

A wealthy man in a fine suit and top hat fell into deep water. He didn't know how to swim and was on the verge of drowning. Hearing his cries, another man dived into the water and saved him as his top hat floated away. The man who had almost drowned regained his breath and, for a moment, seemed grateful. Three years later, though, he returned and denounced his rescuer for not saving his hat, too.

That story is one that Franklin D. Roosevelt is said to have told describing what he had done for big- business men in 1933 when, in the words of Raymond Moley, a member of Roosevelt's New Deal brain trust, "capitalism was saved in eight days."

...Pipes up our resident expert on being retarded.

Please explain to me the functional difference between the two political stances:

1. The state takes ownership of your business, and tells you what to do.
2. The state lets you keep your business as LONG as you do what they tell you.

What is the functional difference between the two, save option 2 having less paperwork and government bureaucracy.

Now, compare that to the position of the Conservative (classical liberal), which is 'right wing'. How can either of these positions be right wing since the very nature of Conservatism is the rejection of government control of industry?

 

[Polk]

Only tardtard would make this connection. How state property saved private property. Yet some more "Slavery is Freedom" 'wisdumb' of the left.

Film at 11.

Are you really naive enough to believe that people would have put up with the existing state of affairs forever?

Which state of affairs are you referring to. I'm sorry, my psychic powers are in the shop and I can't read advanced pronoun usage without context.

You know, that thing which you do about that over there? You know... that guy... has a nose... wears a shirt.

25% unemployment and a massive decline in output.

P.S.: The context is provided by the discussion. Please keep up.

 

[Polk]

Only tardtard would make this connection. How state property saved private property. Yet some more "Slavery is Freedom" 'wisdumb' of the left.

Film at 11.

Only a retard would try to label FDR a fascist. Especially when there is evidence America's wealthiest industrialists and bankers plotted to overthrow the government of President Franklin D. Roosevelt and replace it with a fascist dictatorship.

Roosevelt did save capitalism from it's radical and extreme right wing form...fascism.

Maybe a better way of stating it is FDR saved America from fascism. Because there were fascists in the Republican ranks and the biggest backers of Hitler in America were industrialists and bankers.

But the word 'save' must be understood in proper context...100% of nothing is still NOTHING.

A wealthy man in a fine suit and top hat fell into deep water. He didn't know how to swim and was on the verge of drowning. Hearing his cries, another man dived into the water and saved him as his top hat floated away. The man who had almost drowned regained his breath and, for a moment, seemed grateful. Three years later, though, he returned and denounced his rescuer for not saving his hat, too.

That story is one that Franklin D. Roosevelt is said to have told describing what he had done for big- business men in 1933 when, in the words of Raymond Moley, a member of Roosevelt's New Deal brain trust, "capitalism was saved in eight days."

...Pipes up our resident expert on being retarded.

Please explain to me the functional difference between the two political stances:

1. The state takes ownership of your business, and tells you what to do.
2. The state lets you keep your business as LONG as you do what they tell you.

What is the functional difference between the two, save option 2 having less paperwork and government bureaucracy.

Now, compare that to the position of the Conservative (classical liberal), which is 'right wing'. How can either of these positions be right wing since the very nature of Conservatism is the rejection of government control of industry?

There's actually a rather significant difference between the two. For starters, the returns on production go to the state in the first case, while the returns still go to the business owners in the second. If you think that difference isn't significant, why did the Bolsheviks not have the support of the business community, while they were overwhelming in support of the Nazis?

 

[Bfgrn]

Only tardtard would make this connection. How state property saved private property. Yet some more "Slavery is Freedom" 'wisdumb' of the left.

Film at 11.

Only a retard would try to label FDR a fascist. Especially when there is evidence America's wealthiest industrialists and bankers plotted to overthrow the government of President Franklin D. Roosevelt and replace it with a fascist dictatorship.

Roosevelt did save capitalism from it's radical and extreme right wing form...fascism.

Maybe a better way of stating it is FDR saved America from fascism. Because there were fascists in the Republican ranks and the biggest backers of Hitler in America were industrialists and bankers.

But the word 'save' must be understood in proper context...100% of nothing is still NOTHING.

A wealthy man in a fine suit and top hat fell into deep water. He didn't know how to swim and was on the verge of drowning. Hearing his cries, another man dived into the water and saved him as his top hat floated away. The man who had almost drowned regained his breath and, for a moment, seemed grateful. Three years later, though, he returned and denounced his rescuer for not saving his hat, too.

That story is one that Franklin D. Roosevelt is said to have told describing what he had done for big- business men in 1933 when, in the words of Raymond Moley, a member of Roosevelt's New Deal brain trust, "capitalism was saved in eight days."

...Pipes up our resident expert on being retarded.

Please explain to me the functional difference between the two political stances:

1. The state takes ownership of your business, and tells you what to do.
2. The state lets you keep your business as LONG as you do what they tell you.

What is the functional difference between the two, save option 2 having less paperwork and government bureaucracy.

Now, compare that to the position of the Conservative (classical liberal), which is 'right wing'. How can either of these positions be right wing since the very nature of Conservatism is the rejection of government control of industry?

What would you call the political stance that corporations should run our government? That is NOT classic liberalism, it is today's conservatism.

Is that what our founding fathers believed? OR, did they heavily regulate corporations, require corporations to serve the public good, hold owners and stockholders personally liable for any harm caused, prevent corporations from making any political or charitable contributions to influence law-making, and not allow corporations to own stock in other corporations or own any property that was not essential to fulfilling their chartered purpose?

A quiz for our resident obtuse:

What was the entity, vehicle or instrument our founding fathers created to run our nation? Was it a corporation? Was it a private entity?

We tried 'rejection of government control of industry' from the end of the Civil War into the early 1900's...do you know what that era was called?

Did you ever take a course in civics?

 

[rdean]

Only a retard would try to label FDR a fascist. Especially when there is evidence America's wealthiest industrialists and bankers plotted to overthrow the government of President Franklin D. Roosevelt and replace it with a fascist dictatorship.

Roosevelt did save capitalism from it's radical and extreme right wing form...fascism.

Maybe a better way of stating it is FDR saved America from fascism. Because there were fascists in the Republican ranks and the biggest backers of Hitler in America were industrialists and bankers.

But the word 'save' must be understood in proper context...100% of nothing is still NOTHING.

A wealthy man in a fine suit and top hat fell into deep water. He didn't know how to swim and was on the verge of drowning. Hearing his cries, another man dived into the water and saved him as his top hat floated away. The man who had almost drowned regained his breath and, for a moment, seemed grateful. Three years later, though, he returned and denounced his rescuer for not saving his hat, too.

That story is one that Franklin D. Roosevelt is said to have told describing what he had done for big- business men in 1933 when, in the words of Raymond Moley, a member of Roosevelt's New Deal brain trust, "capitalism was saved in eight days."

...Pipes up our resident expert on being retarded.

Please explain to me the functional difference between the two political stances:

1. The state takes ownership of your business, and tells you what to do.
2. The state lets you keep your business as LONG as you do what they tell you.

What is the functional difference between the two, save option 2 having less paperwork and government bureaucracy.

Now, compare that to the position of the Conservative (classical liberal), which is 'right wing'. How can either of these positions be right wing since the very nature of Conservatism is the rejection of government control of industry?

There's actually a rather significant difference between the two. For starters, the returns on production go to the state in the first case, while the returns still go to the business owners in the second. If you think that difference isn't significant, why did the Bolsheviks not have the support of the business community, while they were overwhelming in support of the Nazis?

Today's conservatives want "industry" to BE the government. They want to turn over control of the country to corporations. Why they think organizations with a profit motive would be better then what we have now is beyond me.

 

[Big Fitz]

Only a retard would try to label FDR a fascist. Especially when there is evidence America's wealthiest industrialists and bankers plotted to overthrow the government of President Franklin D. Roosevelt and replace it with a fascist dictatorship.

Roosevelt did save capitalism from it's radical and extreme right wing form...fascism.

Maybe a better way of stating it is FDR saved America from fascism. Because there were fascists in the Republican ranks and the biggest backers of Hitler in America were industrialists and bankers.

But the word 'save' must be understood in proper context...100% of nothing is still NOTHING.

A wealthy man in a fine suit and top hat fell into deep water. He didn't know how to swim and was on the verge of drowning. Hearing his cries, another man dived into the water and saved him as his top hat floated away. The man who had almost drowned regained his breath and, for a moment, seemed grateful. Three years later, though, he returned and denounced his rescuer for not saving his hat, too.

That story is one that Franklin D. Roosevelt is said to have told describing what he had done for big- business men in 1933 when, in the words of Raymond Moley, a member of Roosevelt's New Deal brain trust, "capitalism was saved in eight days."

...Pipes up our resident expert on being retarded.

Please explain to me the functional difference between the two political stances:

1. The state takes ownership of your business, and tells you what to do.
2. The state lets you keep your business as LONG as you do what they tell you.

What is the functional difference between the two, save option 2 having less paperwork and government bureaucracy.

Now, compare that to the position of the Conservative (classical liberal), which is 'right wing'. How can either of these positions be right wing since the very nature of Conservatism is the rejection of government control of industry?

What would you call the political stance that corporations should run our government? That is NOT classic liberalism, it is today's conservatism.

Is that what our founding fathers believed? OR, did they heavily regulate corporations, require corporations to serve the public good, hold owners and stockholders personally liable for any harm caused, prevent corporations from making any political or charitable contributions to influence law-making, and not allow corporations to own stock in other corporations or own any property that was not essential to fulfilling their chartered purpose?

A quiz for our resident obtuse:

What was the entity, vehicle or instrument our founding fathers created to run our nation? Was it a corporation? Was it a private entity?

We tried 'rejection of government control of industry' from the end of the Civil War into the early 1900's...do you know what that era was called?

Did you ever take a course in civics?

Obviously I got more from my civics studies than you did.

Lassaiez faire capitalism is not a governmental system, but economic. It is an extra-governmental concept, and not integral to our form of government. How we select candidates on the other hand seems to be the source of your problem. The fact that government does not prosecute those corrupting it

The founding fathers did not give us a collectivist system of government ownership. They protected our individual rights from the power of the mob as well as provide the confines of which majority rule must operate. They created a system of checks and balances to make sure power did not build up too much in any one area. You are talking about an imbalance that must be corrected in governance, but are going at it the wrong way. quelle suprise!

Unfortunately, you do not seem able to separate the concepts of industry from government, I don't think I'm capable of explaining such foreign concepts to you. The depth of your envy and hate towards capitalism and individualism is too great.

 

[Big Fitz]

...Pipes up our resident expert on being retarded.

Please explain to me the functional difference between the two political stances:

1. The state takes ownership of your business, and tells you what to do.
2. The state lets you keep your business as LONG as you do what they tell you.

What is the functional difference between the two, save option 2 having less paperwork and government bureaucracy.

Now, compare that to the position of the Conservative (classical liberal), which is 'right wing'. How can either of these positions be right wing since the very nature of Conservatism is the rejection of government control of industry?

There's actually a rather significant difference between the two. For starters, the returns on production go to the state in the first case, while the returns still go to the business owners in the second. If you think that difference isn't significant, why did the Bolsheviks not have the support of the business community, while they were overwhelming in support of the Nazis?

Today's conservatives want "industry" to BE the government. They want to turn over control of the country to corporations. Why they think organizations with a profit motive would be better then what we have now is beyond me.

Show where I've stated such, since you are implying I said it.

Why does a profit motive make someone more efficient and effective? Simple. No one will buy or support a defective or insufficient or poorly functioning device. They will always find the functional alternative. Same goes for government. It's why the Soviet Union and all the communist eastern bloc governments fell. There were many better options out there.

Of course, no system is perfect, but there are many better than communism and it's collectivist ilk.

 

[Big Fitz]

Only a retard would try to label FDR a fascist. Especially when there is evidence America's wealthiest industrialists and bankers plotted to overthrow the government of President Franklin D. Roosevelt and replace it with a fascist dictatorship.

Roosevelt did save capitalism from it's radical and extreme right wing form...fascism.

Maybe a better way of stating it is FDR saved America from fascism. Because there were fascists in the Republican ranks and the biggest backers of Hitler in America were industrialists and bankers.

But the word 'save' must be understood in proper context...100% of nothing is still NOTHING.

A wealthy man in a fine suit and top hat fell into deep water. He didn't know how to swim and was on the verge of drowning. Hearing his cries, another man dived into the water and saved him as his top hat floated away. The man who had almost drowned regained his breath and, for a moment, seemed grateful. Three years later, though, he returned and denounced his rescuer for not saving his hat, too.

That story is one that Franklin D. Roosevelt is said to have told describing what he had done for big- business men in 1933 when, in the words of Raymond Moley, a member of Roosevelt's New Deal brain trust, "capitalism was saved in eight days."

...Pipes up our resident expert on being retarded.

Please explain to me the functional difference between the two political stances:

1. The state takes ownership of your business, and tells you what to do.
2. The state lets you keep your business as LONG as you do what they tell you.

What is the functional difference between the two, save option 2 having less paperwork and government bureaucracy.

Now, compare that to the position of the Conservative (classical liberal), which is 'right wing'. How can either of these positions be right wing since the very nature of Conservatism is the rejection of government control of industry?

There's actually a rather significant difference between the two. For starters, the returns on production go to the state in the first case, while the returns still go to the business owners in the second. If you think that difference isn't significant, why did the Bolsheviks not have the support of the business community, while they were overwhelming in support of the Nazis?

I'd call it stupidity. They hoped they'd be getting richer by cooperating with the fascists. There is hope they will survive if they just go along. Communists made it clear that the capitalists would be removed and probably executed regardless of cooperation. I think that makes it damn clear why capitalists will tolerate fascism a little better: a slim chance of survival and potential for huge corrupt profits (if they're corrupt too).

In communist nations, the bureaucrats who replace the former capitalist owners grow very fat and profit personally off of their corruption inherent to the function of their collectivist government. Under fascism, they don't replace the owners with bureaucrats out of hand, they wait for them to fail to obey to replace them. Otherwise, there's no need, and the owners get just as fat off of government corruption as long as they do what they're told and don't rock the boat.

As Al Capone said, you can get further with a kind word and a gun, than you can with just a kind word.

Let's all welcome the new boss... same as the old boss.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Yeah. Damn that FDR, with the falling unemployment and massive increases in output.

1933: 24.9, 1934: 21.7%, 1935: 20.1%, 1936: 16.9%, 1937: 14.3%, 1938: 19.0%, 1939: 17.2%, 1940 14.6%

Here's the data set.

You need to thank Hitler for invading Poland for pulling US out of the FDR Depression

I'd say the fall from 24.9% to 14.3% was pretty significant. The reason unemployment ticks back up in 1938-1939 is that he paid too much attention to the conservatives of his day and cut spending.

Seriously?

You think 15% unemployment after 7 full years is a job well done?

As usual your facts are all fucked up, in 1920-21 Conservative crushed unemployed in 18 months dropping it from 12% to 4%, if FDR was great for 15% unemployment after 7 years Conservatives are Gods.

 

[Big Fitz]

1933: 24.9, 1934: 21.7%, 1935: 20.1%, 1936: 16.9%, 1937: 14.3%, 1938: 19.0%, 1939: 17.2%, 1940 14.6%

Here's the data set.

You need to thank Hitler for invading Poland for pulling US out of the FDR Depression

I'd say the fall from 24.9% to 14.3% was pretty significant. The reason unemployment ticks back up in 1938-1939 is that he paid too much attention to the conservatives of his day and cut spending.

Seriously?

You think 15% unemployment after 7 full years is a job well done?

As usual you facts are all fucked up, in 1920-21 Conservative crushed unemployed in 18 months dropping it from 12% to 4%, if FDR was great for 15% unemployment after 7 years Conservatives are Gods.

I prefer the Harding/Coolidge approach.

Depression of 1920

 

[Bfgrn]

...Pipes up our resident expert on being retarded.

Please explain to me the functional difference between the two political stances:

1. The state takes ownership of your business, and tells you what to do.
2. The state lets you keep your business as LONG as you do what they tell you.

What is the functional difference between the two, save option 2 having less paperwork and government bureaucracy.

Now, compare that to the position of the Conservative (classical liberal), which is 'right wing'. How can either of these positions be right wing since the very nature of Conservatism is the rejection of government control of industry?

What would you call the political stance that corporations should run our government? That is NOT classic liberalism, it is today's conservatism.

Is that what our founding fathers believed? OR, did they heavily regulate corporations, require corporations to serve the public good, hold owners and stockholders personally liable for any harm caused, prevent corporations from making any political or charitable contributions to influence law-making, and not allow corporations to own stock in other corporations or own any property that was not essential to fulfilling their chartered purpose?

A quiz for our resident obtuse:

What was the entity, vehicle or instrument our founding fathers created to run our nation? Was it a corporation? Was it a private entity?

We tried 'rejection of government control of industry' from the end of the Civil War into the early 1900's...do you know what that era was called?

Did you ever take a course in civics?

Obviously I got more from my civics studies than you did.

Lassaiez faire capitalism is not a governmental system, but economic. It is an extra-governmental concept, and not integral to our form of government. How we select candidates on the other hand seems to be the source of your problem. The fact that government does not prosecute those corrupting it

The founding fathers did not give us a collectivist system of government ownership. They protected our individual rights from the power of the mob as well as provide the confines of which majority rule must operate. They created a system of checks and balances to make sure power did not build up too much in any one area. You are talking about an imbalance that must be corrected in governance, but are going at it the wrong way. quelle suprise!

Unfortunately, you do not seem able to separate the concepts of industry from government, I don't think I'm capable of explaining such foreign concepts to you. The depth of your envy and hate towards capitalism and individualism is too great.

The 'imbalance that must be corrected in governance' was done...It was called The New Deal. And Republicans and conservatives have been trying to systematically dismantle it for 70 years. The New Deal 'created a system of checks and balances to make sure power did not build up too much in any one area'...

 

[Truthmatters]

Clearly the relationship between the central government and the rest of society changed post the crash of 1929.

You can call it any word that flaots your boat.

You can call it SAVING CAPITALISM from itself" if you approve.

You can call it FASCISM if you hate it (or if you like it and also like facism)

But whatever you call it, it was what it was.

It really wasn't until WWII when the government started SERIOULY deficit spending (and did so in a highly organized way that certainly resembles FASCISM) that the economy improved.

But the thing is, after the war, all those wage and price controls were lifted.

So the USA war emergency powers facism was temporary.

File:GDP depression.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

if you check this chart you will see the recovery WAS underway during FDRs first years.

In 1937 the republicans cried out for the efforts to be trimmed back to balence the budget,
FDR compromised with the republicans and they truimmed back the recovery effort and the recession of 1938 started.

He reupped the recovery and then things got better, then we entered WWII and the rest is history.

That is the reason the people of this country ( you know the ones who lived through it and won WWII for us) LOVED FDR.

They lived the history and whern these people Trash FDR they Trash this generation of Americans who supported him.

 

[Big Fitz]

The 'imbalance that must be corrected in governance' was done...It was called The New Deal.

Ahhh yes. To save the constitution, we must violate it!

Bullshit. It caused power to flow into government hands from the private sector by violating the tax code, Interstate Commerce Clause and stripped bare states rights and individual rights all the more.

 

[Bfgrn]

I'd say the fall from 24.9% to 14.3% was pretty significant. The reason unemployment ticks back up in 1938-1939 is that he paid too much attention to the conservatives of his day and cut spending.

Seriously?

You think 15% unemployment after 7 full years is a job well done?

As usual you facts are all fucked up, in 1920-21 Conservative crushed unemployed in 18 months dropping it from 12% to 4%, if FDR was great for 15% unemployment after 7 years Conservatives are Gods.

I prefer the Harding/Coolidge approach.

Depression of 1920

Hey Big Fizzzzzzzzzzzz...if you cut your knee as a kid and mommy took you to the doctor and he stitched you up, would you go back to be stitched up if you had cancer?

Why is it you right wing ideologues believe every cause requires the same solution? Do you EVER look at cause before you blurt out your dogma?

Was the 1929 market crash caused by a transition from a wartime economy to a peaceful economy?


The great enemy of truth is very often not the lie – deliberate, contrived and dishonest – but the myth – persistent, persuasive, and unrealistic. Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought.
President John F. Kennedy

 

[Bfgrn]

The 'imbalance that must be corrected in governance' was done...It was called The New Deal.

Ahhh yes. To save the constitution, we must violate it!

Bullshit. It caused power to flow into government hands from the private sector by violating the tax code, Interstate Commerce Clause and stripped bare states rights and individual rights all the more.

And the balance the New Deal through the Great Society created was marked by an era of corporate wealth and boom, American innovation and dominance in technology, the mass building of infrastructure, the growth of a burgeoning middle class, the vast expansion of individual rights and men on the moon.

The conservative era that followed has built.............................................................

 

[Big Fitz]

The 'imbalance that must be corrected in governance' was done...It was called The New Deal.

Ahhh yes. To save the constitution, we must violate it!

Bullshit. It caused power to flow into government hands from the private sector by violating the tax code, Interstate Commerce Clause and stripped bare states rights and individual rights all the more.

And the balance the New Deal through the Great Society created was marked by an era of corporate wealth and boom, American innovation and dominance in technology, the mass building of infrastructure, the growth of a burgeoning middle class, the vast expansion of individual rights and men on the moon.

The conservative era that followed has built.............................................................

Nooo.. the fact that our main industrial competitors were bombed into the stone age had NOTHING to do with it. It was alllll social spending and government waste.

Nor did the hundreds of millions of dollars in repaid war bonds making their way into private individual hands allowing for large amounts of disposable income that never had before existed for the middle class.

Nor the new application of technologies garnered from wartime scientific investment, both private and public causing the creating of new industries and products to become economically viable for the masses to buy.

Nope. It was all socialist spending of the government violating the constitution to buy voting blocs and create identity politics to support corrupt politicians enriching themselves off the largess of taxpayer monies they had no right to in the first place doing things they had no enumerated power to do.

Imbecile.