[POLL] - Liberals, how much is a "fair share?" - Taxes

[PMZ]

How did Republicans have anything to do with this debacle? Everyone in the forum is dying to know.

They have been an unrelenting and and unprincipled enemy of this progress as part of their strategy to drag President Obama, Democrats, and the country down to below their performance under Bush.

Obamacare stands as tangible evidence of their failure under Bush, and their failure to recover their performance, and even their failure to support the country under Obama.

True, Republicans do have an unrelenting hostility to Obama, Democrats and their socialist boondoggles, but that still doesn't explain how they are responsible for the failure of Obamacare. They have had absolutely no input into Obamacare. Claiming they are responsible is like claiming Poland was responsible for the defeat of Nazi Germany.

Please explain how anything any Republican did caused Obama's website to be a failure. So far all you've done is whine.

You idiot. Obamacare is a success. It's being fully implemented.

The Republican Party is losing. Big time. They should have invested their energy in improving rather than lying about Democrats.

 

[bripat9643]

I know many conservatives are upset by personal responsibility. People paying their own way.

What you really mean by "personal responsibility" is being responsible for whatever you and your ilk want to make us responsible for. You're right about that, I don't have the slightest interest in the responsibilities you and your fellow Komrades want to assign to me. The whole point of Obamacare is for some to pay the way for others. It's the opposite of "personal responsibility, as is all democrat social programs.

And many conservative business people hate workers getting paid what they're worth. That’s why business avoids doing that.

Slaves are just so much more obedient.

What you and the other turds hate is that workers get paid exactly what they're worth. What you earn is determined by the value that your fellow consumers place on what you produce. That's why you hate the free market so much. You know deep down what the value of what you produce is.

Businesses go to great lengths to determine the market wage to pay their workers. Failure to do so means either losing a lot of money or losing a lot of valuable skilled workers.

Businesses do the research that you refer to, not to determine the value that workers add, but to find out how little others are getting away with paying workers, and how much to executives.

I've told you a thousand times that the Labor Theory of Value has been thoroughly discredited, but here you are again using it in a post.

When are you going to admit what is obvious to everyone: that you're a commie?

 

[PMZ]

What you really mean by "personal responsibility" is being responsible for whatever you and your ilk want to make us responsible for. You're right about that, I don't have the slightest interest in the responsibilities you and your fellow Komrades want to assign to me. The whole point of Obamacare is for some to pay the way for others. It's the opposite of "personal responsibility, as is all democrat social programs.



What you and the other turds hate is that workers get paid exactly what they're worth. What you earn is determined by the value that your fellow consumers place on what you produce. That's why you hate the free market so much. You know deep down what the value of what you produce is.

Businesses go to great lengths to determine the market wage to pay their workers. Failure to do so means either losing a lot of money or losing a lot of valuable skilled workers.

Businesses do the research that you refer to, not to determine the value that workers add, but to find out how little others are getting away with paying workers, and how much to executives.

I've told you a thousand times that the Labor Theory of Value has been thoroughly discredited, but here you are again using it in a post.

When are you going to admit what is obvious to everyone, that you're a commie?

You're a Nazi. To them, everyone except them is a Communist.

 

[bripat9643]

This is exactly the opposite of what I said, Adolf.

Those that business is taking advantage of by not paying a living to are required and enabled to be responsible for their health care costs.

Without that enabling they only have the choice of not paying their health care bills.

We choose to not make business accountable for living wages. That choice puts the responsibility on us.

I know that responsibility sucks if you're you.

Tough shit.

Your first error is in believing that business is responsible for paying a "living wage." I've never seen any drone, no matter how devoted or deluded, ever even attempt to support that contention. Your second error is your belief that business is responsible for your healthcare. Businesses are responsible only for what their owners agree to be responsible for. You cannot impose responsibilities on someone with their consent. All you can do is make them follow orders at gunpoint. The latter course of action is called the ethic of liberalism.

All laws make it harder for people to impose what's best for them on others. They encourage responsibility. Clearly potential criminals don't like that. They consider not being able to so impose, a restriction on their freedom. Which it is. They don't deserve to be free at the expense of others.

Laws do not make anyone more responsible anymore than pointing a gun at your temple makes you more responsible.

Business serves we the people. Not vice versa. Government serves we, the people. Not vice versa.

Wrong. Business servers the purposes of their owners, and if they are smart, they serve the purposes of their customers. Everyone else can butt out.

If certain businesses aren't of use to us, they deserve our disdain. They certainly don't deserve our business. Businesses are not an arm of the government.

Such businesses need to be taught. Remember the Chick A Fil CEO?

Who is "us?" If a business wasn't of use to someone, then it wouldn't exist. Your opinion of its usefulness isn't relevant.

You need to be taught that you're a fascist asshole who thinks he's entitled to run other people's lives. Then you go around sanctimoniously spouting off about freedom as if you favored the idea.

What I recall about Chick Fil A is that some gay thugs attempted to extort certain concessions from the business and they got their asses handed to them.

 

[bripat9643]

Businesses do the research that you refer to, not to determine the value that workers add, but to find out how little others are getting away with paying workers, and how much to executives.

I've told you a thousand times that the Labor Theory of Value has been thoroughly discredited, but here you are again using it in a post.

When are you going to admit what is obvious to everyone, that you're a commie?

You're a Nazi. To them, everyone except them is a Communist.

Who is "them?" What you don't understand is that commies and Nazis are just two sides of the same coin, and you are that coin. You're the one who wants to run everyone else's life. You're the one who thinks a business is just an extension of the government, that is has "obligations." Those are Nazi ideas.

 

[PMZ]

Actually, you're the extreme right wing extremist Nazi.

 

[bripat9643]

Actually, you're the extreme right wing extremist Nazi.

You're the one who has been spouting all the Nazi ideas:

1. Businesses have "obligations" determined by the government
   
2. Businesses exist to serve government purposes.
   
3. People exist to serve the purposes of the government.
   
4. Government has the authority to use people to accomplish it's aims.
   
5. everything you own is a gift of the government which it can revoke whenever it likes.

Those ideas are all consistent with Nazi ideology, not with mine.

 

[PMZ]

Actually, you're the extreme right wing extremist Nazi.

You're the one who has been spouting all the Nazi ideas:

1. Businesses have "obligations" determined by the government
   
2. Businesses exist to serve government purposes.
   
3. People exist to serve the purposes of the government.
   
4. Government has the authority to use people to accomplish it's aims.
   
5. everything you own is a gift of the government which it can revoke whenever it likes.

Those ideas are all consistent with Nazi ideology, not with mine.

Who did you think was responsible for our country. Business?

 

[dcraelin]

like I said in an earlier post. Both left and right can agree to do away with tax-exempt bonds. They fund most of the idiotic wasteful projects at the local government level.

They allow communities to build assets more affordably. It's not up to you to judge what they need or not.

No, your right in that its not up to me to judge the projects,but it should be up to voters not corrupt local officials which is usually the case. But even so, if they decide to build idiotic projects they should pay the market rate for the funds, not essentially crowding out productive investment in the private sector.

 

[Gadawg73]

Re: this specious note: Communism sucks, but I want to piss rich people off.

The 91% tax rate didn't seriously diminish the incomes or the net worth of its designated tax bracket, which was the multi-millionaire class. Even at that rate of taxation the net worth and income taxes of these people still substantially exceeded those of the average person.

In other words the 91% rate didn't make the rich poor. It simply made them a little less rich -- and it served to heal a badly damaged economy by effecting a productive redistribution of the Nation's wealth resource.

Very funny.
They ended that top rate of 91% as all that did was run investment dollars into non taxable income such as municipal bonds and the other tax free places in the 20,000 page which is now 70,000 page IRS code.
People with money pay little to no taxes on their income under the current code. Raise the tax to over 50% those people do not show any income that is taxable. They receive stock options, deferred payments, load up the SEP IRAs and regular IRA, max their HSA and the rest goes into tax free investments.
Most of which are in the bond market which is low return.
Add in the rest that goes overseas where as of now just the large corporations have over 20 trillion there now untaxable.
End the capital gains and corporate tax and that money comes home in 24 hours, all of it.
Imagine the boom with all that money being invested in this country.
But no, how dare someone make a profit and not be forced to have government plunder it from them. Not fair.
What is fair is everyone should have the same and all suffer.

I've seen the lives of migrant workers and the lives of the megawealthy. I agree that many of the megawealthy live miserable lives but that's their choice. Choice is freedom. Poverty enslaves.

20% of us have 85% of the wealth. They didn't earn it. Nobody earns billions.

My grandfather started growing apples in the Hudson River valley west of the Hudson river across from Poughkeepsie NY in 1919 on land owned by my grandmothers family the Terhunes since the 1680s. Grandpa would drive to Miami and charter a plane over to Cuba and bring back migrant workers to pick the apples every year and charter a bus to bring them to NY where he had living quarters built for them. Bus and fly them home every year. We owned 450 acres of land in Cuba until Castro stole it from us. Grandpa hated the Batista government and supported the reform but that was when Castro stated all land owners regardless of nationality could keep their property. I travel through Bainbridge Ga. often and see migrant workers there. Few are in poverty.
They have LEFT poverty to come here. Your claim that they left a better life to live in poverty is the typical knee jerk leftist lie.

 

[RKMBrown]

This is exactly the opposite of what I said, Adolf.

Those that business is taking advantage of by not paying a living to are required and enabled to be responsible for their health care costs.

Without that enabling they only have the choice of not paying their health care bills.

We choose to not make business accountable for living wages. That choice puts the responsibility on us.

I know that responsibility sucks if you're you.

Tough shit.

Your first error is in believing that business is responsible for paying a "living wage." I've never seen any drone, no matter how devoted or deluded, ever even attempt to support that contention. Your second error is your belief that business is responsible for your healthcare. Businesses are responsible only for what their owners agree to be responsible for. You cannot impose responsibilities on someone with their consent. All you can do is make them follow orders at gunpoint. The latter course of action is called the ethic of liberalism.

All laws make it harder for people to impose what's best for them on others. They encourage responsibility. Clearly potential criminals don't like that. They consider not being able to so impose, a restriction on their freedom. Which it is. They don't deserve to be free at the expense of others.

Business serves we the people. Not vice versa. Government serves we, the people. Not vice versa.

If certain businesses aren't of use to us, they deserve our disdain. They certainly don't deserve our business.

Such businesses need to be taught. Remember the Chick A Fil CEO?

You are just a retarded turd, bubbling toxic fumes. A business is nothing more than a group of people. You don't own people, you ass hole. They are not your slave you prick. We don't owe you shit. You want to exchange money or services for products & services maybe we can make a deal, but not for you. I would not "serve" you for any amount of money. Not a billion dollars for an hour of work. I don't serve satan.

 

[PMZ]

Your first error is in believing that business is responsible for paying a "living wage." I've never seen any drone, no matter how devoted or deluded, ever even attempt to support that contention. Your second error is your belief that business is responsible for your healthcare. Businesses are responsible only for what their owners agree to be responsible for. You cannot impose responsibilities on someone with their consent. All you can do is make them follow orders at gunpoint. The latter course of action is called the ethic of liberalism.

All laws make it harder for people to impose what's best for them on others. They encourage responsibility. Clearly potential criminals don't like that. They consider not being able to so impose, a restriction on their freedom. Which it is. They don't deserve to be free at the expense of others.

Business serves we the people. Not vice versa. Government serves we, the people. Not vice versa.

If certain businesses aren't of use to us, they deserve our disdain. They certainly don't deserve our business.

Such businesses need to be taught. Remember the Chick A Fil CEO?

You are just a retarded turd, bubbling toxic fumes. A business is nothing more than a group of people. You don't own people, you ass hole. They are not your slave you prick. We don't owe you shit. You want to exchange money or services for products & services maybe we can make a deal, but not for you. I would not "serve" you for any amount of money. Not a billion dollars for an hour of work. I don't serve satan.

I love it when conservatives show their true colors. I hope that every voter is thinking about rants like this on the way to the polls.

 

[bripat9643]

Your first error is in believing that business is responsible for paying a "living wage." I've never seen any drone, no matter how devoted or deluded, ever even attempt to support that contention. Your second error is your belief that business is responsible for your healthcare. Businesses are responsible only for what their owners agree to be responsible for. You cannot impose responsibilities on someone with their consent. All you can do is make them follow orders at gunpoint. The latter course of action is called the ethic of liberalism.

All laws make it harder for people to impose what's best for them on others. They encourage responsibility. Clearly potential criminals don't like that. They consider not being able to so impose, a restriction on their freedom. Which it is. They don't deserve to be free at the expense of others.

Business serves we the people. Not vice versa. Government serves we, the people. Not vice versa.

If certain businesses aren't of use to us, they deserve our disdain. They certainly don't deserve our business.

Such businesses need to be taught. Remember the Chick A Fil CEO?

You are just a retarded turd, bubbling toxic fumes. A business is nothing more than a group of people. You don't own people, you ass hole. They are not your slave you prick. We don't owe you shit. You want to exchange money or services for products & services maybe we can make a deal, but not for you. I would not "serve" you for any amount of money. Not a billion dollars for an hour of work. I don't serve satan.

Now you're starting to understand PMS. He's the worst kind of Nazi.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Adolf, as long as we have you representing the Nazis we never have to worry about them getting elected.

Comrade Retard;

You believe that calling me "Adolf" has some sort of meaning - that because I oppose Marxism, you can smear me as a Nazi.

You believe this because you are mentally retarded, with at best a second grade education.

You don't know what capitalism is, you don't know what the market is. You spew Communist rhetoric, buy have no grasp of Marx.

Thanks for being you.

Back atcha, Comrade.

 

[RKMBrown]

All laws make it harder for people to impose what's best for them on others. They encourage responsibility. Clearly potential criminals don't like that. They consider not being able to so impose, a restriction on their freedom. Which it is. They don't deserve to be free at the expense of others.

Business serves we the people. Not vice versa. Government serves we, the people. Not vice versa.

If certain businesses aren't of use to us, they deserve our disdain. They certainly don't deserve our business.

Such businesses need to be taught. Remember the Chick A Fil CEO?

You are just a retarded turd, bubbling toxic fumes. A business is nothing more than a group of people. You don't own people, you ass hole. They are not your slave you prick. We don't owe you shit. You want to exchange money or services for products & services maybe we can make a deal, but not for you. I would not "serve" you for any amount of money. Not a billion dollars for an hour of work. I don't serve satan.

Now you're starting to understand PMS. He's the worst kind of Nazi.

What's worse, the NAZI stormtroopers who gassed the jews or the germans like PMZ that looked the other way while backing their government to the very end pretending to this day that the gassing never happened, or worse was justified?

 

[PMZ]

All laws make it harder for people to impose what's best for them on others. They encourage responsibility. Clearly potential criminals don't like that. They consider not being able to so impose, a restriction on their freedom. Which it is. They don't deserve to be free at the expense of others.

Business serves we the people. Not vice versa. Government serves we, the people. Not vice versa.

If certain businesses aren't of use to us, they deserve our disdain. They certainly don't deserve our business.

Such businesses need to be taught. Remember the Chick A Fil CEO?

You are just a retarded turd, bubbling toxic fumes. A business is nothing more than a group of people. You don't own people, you ass hole. They are not your slave you prick. We don't owe you shit. You want to exchange money or services for products & services maybe we can make a deal, but not for you. I would not "serve" you for any amount of money. Not a billion dollars for an hour of work. I don't serve satan.

Now you're starting to understand PMS. He's the worst kind of Nazi.

And you are the best kind of Nazi????

 

[PMZ]

You are just a retarded turd, bubbling toxic fumes. A business is nothing more than a group of people. You don't own people, you ass hole. They are not your slave you prick. We don't owe you shit. You want to exchange money or services for products & services maybe we can make a deal, but not for you. I would not "serve" you for any amount of money. Not a billion dollars for an hour of work. I don't serve satan.

Now you're starting to understand PMS. He's the worst kind of Nazi.

What's worse, the NAZI stormtroopers who gassed the jews or the germans like PMZ that looked the other way while backing their government to the very end pretending to this day that the gassing never happened, or worse was justified?

What's worse, criminals or cops that don't prevent 100% of crimes?

 

[PMZ]

Adolf, as long as we have you representing the Nazis we never have to worry about them getting elected.

Comrade Retard;

You believe that calling me "Adolf" has some sort of meaning - that because I oppose Marxism, you can smear me as a Nazi.

You believe this because you are mentally retarded, with at best a second grade education.

You don't know what capitalism is, you don't know what the market is. You spew Communist rhetoric, buy have no grasp of Marx.

Thanks for being you.

Back atcha, Comrade.

We'll see what's working on election day, won't we.

 

[RKMBrown]

Now you're starting to understand PMS. He's the worst kind of Nazi.

What's worse, the NAZI stormtroopers who gassed the jews or the germans like PMZ that looked the other way while backing their government to the very end pretending to this day that the gassing never happened, or worse was justified?

What's worse, criminals or cops that don't prevent 100% of crimes?

Criminals.

 

[Uncensored2008]

We'll see what's working on election day, won't we.

And you think this has some sort of meaning or relevance, Comrade Retard...