Reparations???

[PoliticalChic]

View attachment 247558

Perhaps it's time to rid ourselves of a few government funded programs. Programs such as Affirmative Action and other things meant to supposedly make reparations to specific minority groups are pretty vague in my humble opinion. The blacks site that it's reparations for slavery and things that happened to violate their civil rights since that time. However today is not then and since then there have been a large number of new immigrants who have no justification to claim such reparations just because they happen to be from Africa and elsewhere.

In what way do the American people owe "reparations" or Affirmative Action to people who immigrated here after the Civil War, much less after the Civil Rights Acts of the 50's and 60's, just because a person has dark skin?

If these programs are meant as reparations and such then the person applying for said programs should have to prove that their families were citizens of the United States during those times.

Additionally if there are immigrants who have used these programs then they should be required to return said money to the United States with interest.

*****SMILE*****

Slavery ended seven generations ago.

No one can point to even a great-grandparent who was a slave, and the only cotton any living American can say they picked was out of an aspirin bottle.

 

[Markle]

True, this can be a problem and needs to be considered. But there are also many people out there working really hard to help the disadvantaged and the black community, there are many out there that are still being belittled and marginalized. It’s not a game of absolutes. Not everybody is entitled and gaming the system. Theres good work being done and there are also abuses. Both can and do exist

After six generations, how much is enough help?

 

[task0778]

You know what? At some point you gotta stand up and say "It's on me, not anybody else. I'm responsible for myself, shit happens but my successes and failures are mine to live with and deal with". It's called being an adult.

 

[PoliticalChic]

You know what? At some point you gotta stand up and say "It's on me, not anybody else. I'm responsible for myself, shit happens but my successes and failures are mine to live with and deal with". It's called being an adult.

"It's called being an adult."

Exactly!

And the opposite is the infantilization that big government produces in its 'subjects.'

 

[PoliticalChic]

True, this can be a problem and needs to be considered. But there are also many people out there working really hard to help the disadvantaged and the black community, there are many out there that are still being belittled and marginalized. It’s not a game of absolutes. Not everybody is entitled and gaming the system. Theres good work being done and there are also abuses. Both can and do exist

After six generations, how much is enough help?

"...how much is enough help?"

Coulter writes, in "Mugged"....

1. It was the misfortune of black Americans that they were just on the verge of passing through the immigrant experience when damaging ideas about welfare and the lenient attitude about crime took hold. It could have happened to the Italians, Germans, Jews or Irish, but luckily for them, there were no Liberals around to “help” when they arrived.
2. In fact, black Americans were doing better in individual pursuits than many immigrants. Barone compared their American journey to the Irish: “Both rise smartly in hierarchies (government bureaucracies, the military) but haven't fared as well in free-market commerce.” http://www.usnews.com/usnews/news/articles/941114/archive_013670.htm

 

[Slade3200]

The difference between your poor parents, the foreigners with 20 bucks in their pockets and the disadvanged Blacks is the fact that only one of those groups was oppressed for generations by our government which resulted in their challenging position. Do you understand that?

View attachment 247985

So what you're saying is that government funding of Affirmative Action and other programs, which immigrants who came here after the Civil Rights Acts who never experienced all oppression and the 'challenging position' of blacks who's families have been here for generations, was not needed and should be paid back.

*****SMILE*****

No that’s what YOU are saying not me, you often confuse the two and have a hard time understanding what I’m actually saying. A little advice, just read my words, they aren’t complicated. Save the interpretations, you are wrong more often than not.

And learn how to answer direct questions. You’ve dodged the majority of question I’ve asked you. Can’t respect that

View attachment 247992

When did you answer the opening question in the OP?

*****CHUCKLE*****

Probably in my first post. I have no problem giving direct answers to direct questions. You should try it sometime.

Perhaps since I'm just so slow and to quote you an 'idiot' in your mind you should point out said answer out for all of us.

*****CHUCKLE*****

I’m not digging though pages of posts. Ask me a question and I’ll answer it

 

[Slade3200]

True, this can be a problem and needs to be considered. But there are also many people out there working really hard to help the disadvantaged and the black community, there are many out there that are still being belittled and marginalized. It’s not a game of absolutes. Not everybody is entitled and gaming the system. Theres good work being done and there are also abuses. Both can and do exist

After six generations, how much is enough help?

1964 -2019 equals 6 generations in your mind? Tell you what after 6 real generations all should be good. How about that?

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

Do you still live in the 50's or something? Let me tell you some of our customers are replacing their mostly white crew with blacks. It's not reparations or laws, it's that blacks will work for less money. My handyman that I use is black, my exterminator is black. Why? Because I feel guilty? Because I'm afraid to hire whites? No, it's because they provide good work at a more than reasonable price.

When I publish my work, I'll send you link and can see for yourself that the white citizen council is still alive and well in the good ole U.S. of A in 2019.

 

[Markle]

1964 -2019 equals 6 generations in your mind? Tell you what after 6 real generations all should be good. How about that?

1863 - 2019 equals six generations in anyone's mind.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

View attachment 247558

Perhaps it's time to rid ourselves of a few government funded programs. Programs such as Affirmative Action and other things meant to supposedly make reparations to specific minority groups are pretty vague in my humble opinion. The blacks site that it's reparations for slavery and things that happened to violate their civil rights since that time. However today is not then and since then there have been a large number of new immigrants who have no justification to claim such reparations just because they happen to be from Africa and elsewhere.

In what way do the American people owe "reparations" or Affirmative Action to people who immigrated here after the Civil War, much less after the Civil Rights Acts of the 50's and 60's, just because a person has dark skin?

If these programs are meant as reparations and such then the person applying for said programs should have to prove that their families were citizens of the United States during those times.

Additionally if there are immigrants who have used these programs then they should be required to return said money to the United States with interest.

*****SMILE*****

What is with this obsession with the political affiliation of others, particularly Democrats? One's political affiliation is not something a person is born with and cannot change, in fact a person can change party with little or minimal effort required. Hell your president has done so 5 different times

Trump registered as a Republican in Manhattan in 1987 and since that time has changed his party affiliation five times. In 1999, Trump changed his party affiliation to the Independence Party of New York. In August 2001, Trump changed his party affiliation to Democratic. In September 2009, Trump changed his party affiliation back to the Republican Party. In December 2011, Trump changed to "no party affiliation" (independent). In April 2012, Trump again returned to the Republican Party
Political positions of Donald Trump - Wikipedia​

View attachment 247967

1. Where did I mention any political affiliation or party in the OP?

2. In what way does your post deal with the OP topic content?

******SMILE*****

Sorry, I was planning on responding to you first, so your post was in my response window, then decided to reply to the 2nd comment instead and forgot that I hadn't deleted and requoted the 2nd post.

 

[Lesh]

The point of the article is that slavery and Jim Crow are cheap excuses for failures of today. As I pointed out in the story of my father, he got handed nothing but more challenges from his parents. You will find that most white people are the same way. And again, if anything is handed down, our generation will probably be the first for most whites.

Black are not getting less of an education, however blacks take much less advantage of it, and that's not our fault. If you took a middle-class white student body, and put them in these same low-income schools, they will continue to do fine. The black student body that got their school? They will continue to fail.

The school is not the failure, the parent is. When people shove their children on the school bus and that ends their educational involvement, of course you're going to get poorer results.

I've told this story before on USMB before, so if you read it already, skip over.

My former next door neighbor bought a portable basketball hoop. Before you knew it, kids were coming here from everywhere. They played from the time they came home from school until well past dark; sometimes to 10:00 pm. They tried to play later, but I told them to cut it out or called the police.

This didn't happen in the white neighborhood I grew up in. We were in the house well before dark. Our parents made sure our homework was done, we had a shower, and in bed at a reasonable enough time for ample sleep for the next school day. They knew where we were every minute, and it wasn't several streets away.

In other words, place the blame where it rightly belongs.

What you aren’t understanding is the difference between your parents and grandparents and their challenges vs those of generation old blacks who’s challenges were a direct result of our laws and government. Generations of discrimination by our system that resulted in poverty, low education, broken families, high crime and many other factors that impact the black population today. How can you gloss over all that as insignificant?

You admitted earlier that a child from an uneducated low income family has worse odds of achieving success than a child from a high income family. Well millions of blacks were stuffed into that low income bracket because of generations of racist laws made by our country. Take a second to think about that before reacting.

I've thought about it over and over again because the left keeps regurgitating this topic and has been for years.

If my parents (for whatever reason) were restricted in income, unable to provide us with the extras, kept us in low income housing, that's mostly the responsibility of my parents. Nobody should be having children they can't afford, or bringing them into the world of poverty or low income areas. That's personal responsibility.

But even if that was the case, it's up to me as an adult to overcome and do better than my parents. It's up to me to learn from their mistakes.

Can you explain to me how some foreigners come here, first generation, barely speaking the language, and do better than our blacks in America today? Who is more disadvantaged in your opinion, those foreigners who came here with twenty bucks in their pockets or our African Americans who's parents or grandparents were held back?

The beverage store I patron is owned by an Indian guy. He came here, worked night and day, opened up his own beverage store, and provided service no other competitor could. I never have to worry about him being out of the products I purchase. His personality, his attentiveness to customers needs, his hours all beat out his competition.

After he started doing well, he took on buying rental property which he still manages. On top of that, he purchased a small hotel outside of town about 40 miles, and it's doing fantastic as well. He and his wife seldom see each other because she quit working the beverage store to run the hotel.

If he can do this, why can't any other American including a black one?

If you are told by those in the media, those in government, those in education, those in entertainment again and again and again how much you are disadvantaged, how much you are oppressed, how much you are mistreated disrespected, being held back, being denied opportunity, are started out on so unlevel a playing field that you are victimized on every side, and you should be angry, resentful, and retaliatory because of it, a whole bunch of people will believe it and won't even try. And they will look to the powers to be to rescue them which of course isn[t going to happen because those powers need them to believe they are victims to keep those powers in power and increasing their own prestige, influence, and personal wealth.

True, this can be a problem and needs to be considered. But there are also many people out there working really hard to help the disadvantaged and the black community, there are many out there that are still being belittled and marginalized. It’s not a game of absolutes. Not everybody is entitled and gaming the system. Theres good work being done and there are also abuses. Both can and do exist

I don't take away from all the people out there trying to improve the lives of the disadvantaged, and I can assure you the the vast majority of those are not reinforcing a victim mentality in the people they are working with. I count myself as one of them. A few of us date back to the time that segregation of black people was condemned and stopped. I count myself as one of those too though I was very young at the time.

But nobody with any intellectual honesty is helping black people by telling them how victimized they are and how 'whitey' or the police or any other groups are keeping them down and make it impossible for them to reach for the American dream. Those who continue to convince black people how disadvantaged they are, especially those who do that to increase their own power, influence, and/or personal wealth, in my opinion are doing evil.

And yet discrimination still exists.

It is all around us.

Does that mean we should start writing checks?

In my mind absolutely not.

What we SHOULD be doing is making sure that

A. Voting rights are sacrosanct.

B.Education is funded properly

C/ Low interest/no interest loans and grants are available for start up businesses

And those things should be done across the board. Not based on race but they MUST be done.

And sadly Republicans are either actively against those things or simply not interested.

Do that and "reparations" have been addressed and everyone is better off.

 

[Slade3200]

1964 -2019 equals 6 generations in your mind? Tell you what after 6 real generations all should be good. How about that?

1863 - 2019 equals six generations in anyone's mind.

True but blacks were oppressed by law until the civil rights act of 1964. Many are still alive today who experience that.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

What you aren’t understanding is the difference between your parents and grandparents and their challenges vs those of generation old blacks who’s challenges were a direct result of our laws and government. Generations of discrimination by our system that resulted in poverty, low education, broken families, high crime and many other factors that impact the black population today. How can you gloss over all that as insignificant?

You admitted earlier that a child from an uneducated low income family has worse odds of achieving success than a child from a high income family. Well millions of blacks were stuffed into that low income bracket because of generations of racist laws made by our country. Take a second to think about that before reacting.

I've thought about it over and over again because the left keeps regurgitating this topic and has been for years.

If my parents (for whatever reason) were restricted in income, unable to provide us with the extras, kept us in low income housing, that's mostly the responsibility of my parents. Nobody should be having children they can't afford, or bringing them into the world of poverty or low income areas. That's personal responsibility.

But even if that was the case, it's up to me as an adult to overcome and do better than my parents. It's up to me to learn from their mistakes.

Can you explain to me how some foreigners come here, first generation, barely speaking the language, and do better than our blacks in America today? Who is more disadvantaged in your opinion, those foreigners who came here with twenty bucks in their pockets or our African Americans who's parents or grandparents were held back?

The beverage store I patron is owned by an Indian guy. He came here, worked night and day, opened up his own beverage store, and provided service no other competitor could. I never have to worry about him being out of the products I purchase. His personality, his attentiveness to customers needs, his hours all beat out his competition.

After he started doing well, he took on buying rental property which he still manages. On top of that, he purchased a small hotel outside of town about 40 miles, and it's doing fantastic as well. He and his wife seldom see each other because she quit working the beverage store to run the hotel.

If he can do this, why can't any other American including a black one?

If you are told by those in the media, those in government, those in education, those in entertainment again and again and again how much you are disadvantaged, how much you are oppressed, how much you are mistreated disrespected, being held back, being denied opportunity, are started out on so unlevel a playing field that you are victimized on every side, and you should be angry, resentful, and retaliatory because of it, a whole bunch of people will believe it and won't even try. And they will look to the powers to be to rescue them which of course isn[t going to happen because those powers need them to believe they are victims to keep those powers in power and increasing their own prestige, influence, and personal wealth.

True, this can be a problem and needs to be considered. But there are also many people out there working really hard to help the disadvantaged and the black community, there are many out there that are still being belittled and marginalized. It’s not a game of absolutes. Not everybody is entitled and gaming the system. Theres good work being done and there are also abuses. Both can and do exist

I don't take away from all the people out there trying to improve the lives of the disadvantaged, and I can assure you the the vast majority of those are not reinforcing a victim mentality in the people they are working with. I count myself as one of them. A few of us date back to the time that segregation of black people was condemned and stopped. I count myself as one of those too though I was very young at the time.

But nobody with any intellectual honesty is helping black people by telling them how victimized they are and how 'whitey' or the police or any other groups are keeping them down and make it impossible for them to reach for the American dream. Those who continue to convince black people how disadvantaged they are, especially those who do that to increase their own power, influence, and/or personal wealth, in my opinion are doing evil.

And yet discrimination still exists.

It is all around us.

Does that mean we should start writing checks?

In my mind absolutely not.

What we SHOULD be doing is making sure that

A. Voting rights are sacrosanct.

B.Education is funded properly

C/ Low interest/no interest loans and grants are available for start up businesses

And those things should be done across the board. Not based on race but they MUST be done.

And sadly Republicans are either actively against those things or simply not interested.

Do that and "reparations" have been addressed and everyone is better off.

So WTF do you think Trump is doing and why are Democrats against it?

How Trump Regulatory Rollback Boosts Small Businesses | Investor's Business Daily

 

[Lesh]

He sure as hell isn't making small business loans or grants available.

 

[Lesh]

1964 -2019 equals 6 generations in your mind? Tell you what after 6 real generations all should be good. How about that?

1863 - 2019 equals six generations in anyone's mind.

True but blacks were oppressed by law until the civil rights act of 1964. Many are still alive today who experience that.

And many are having their right to vote infringed

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

He sure as hell isn't making small business loans or grants available.

Small business loans have always been available in this country. What country are you from?

 

[protectionist]

And yet discrimination still exists.

It is all around us.

Does that mean we should start writing checks?

In my mind absolutely not.

What we SHOULD be doing is making sure that

A. Voting rights are sacrosanct.

B.Education is funded properly

C/ Low interest/no interest loans and grants are available for start up businesses

And those things should be done across the board. Not based on race but they MUST be done.

And sadly Republicans are either actively against those things or simply not interested.

Do that and "reparations" have been addressed and everyone is better off.

Yes, discrimination still exists. In 42 states, where Affirmative Action is still legal. This is, by far, the largest and most significant racial discrimination, in America, against the largest group of people (WHITES), and yes there should be reparations$$ to compensate those white people.

In addition, there should be reparations to the families of now deceased whites who suffered AA discrimination during the past 54 years. This money should be paid only by those who support AA, not the government.

 

[Markle]

1964 -2019 equals 6 generations in your mind? Tell you what after 6 real generations all should be good. How about that?

1863 - 2019 equals six generations in anyone's mind.

True but blacks were oppressed by law until the civil rights act of 1964. Many are still alive today who experience that.

Virtually every group of immigrants have been oppressed. Most don't make a career out of it.

All my grandparents came here from Norway (3) or Denmark (1). My mother's mother came from Denmark around the turn of the last century with a 4th-grade education (probably equal to a master's degree today) and no money. None spoke English. All had to be sponsored by someone who agreed to support them if they did not get jobs. His first job was driving a horsedrawn milk wagon. There was no Social Security and they did not expect anything. "Granpop" ended up buying several apartment buildings which supported them when he retired from driving buses in Chicago and my grandmother until she passed at 102.

The difference? MOTIVATION!

 

[Markle]

He sure as hell isn't making small business loans or grants available.

PLEASE. Are you really this whacky?

 

[Damaged Eagle]

View attachment 247985

So what you're saying is that government funding of Affirmative Action and other programs, which immigrants who came here after the Civil Rights Acts who never experienced all oppression and the 'challenging position' of blacks who's families have been here for generations, was not needed and should be paid back.

*****SMILE*****

No that’s what YOU are saying not me, you often confuse the two and have a hard time understanding what I’m actually saying. A little advice, just read my words, they aren’t complicated. Save the interpretations, you are wrong more often than not.

And learn how to answer direct questions. You’ve dodged the majority of question I’ve asked you. Can’t respect that

View attachment 247992

When did you answer the opening question in the OP?

*****CHUCKLE*****

Probably in my first post. I have no problem giving direct answers to direct questions. You should try it sometime.

Perhaps since I'm just so slow and to quote you an 'idiot' in your mind you should point out said answer out for all of us.

*****CHUCKLE*****

I’m not digging though pages of posts. Ask me a question and I’ll answer it

So now you're saying you're to lazy or (more likely>>>) that you never did post an answer to the opening OP question then you complain and become rude when your questions are only responded to with questions in turn..... Does that about sum it up?

*****CHUCKLE*****