Roe is just the latest example of all-or-nothing politics

[bendog]

Abortion law varies widely throughout the world. In many cases, there is a gestation period in which abortion is legal.

On Abortion Law, the U.S. Is Unusual. Without Roe, It Would Be, Too. (Published 2022)

Many rich democracies have earlier cutoffs for abortion — but allow it later for a variety of reasons. And around the world, it has been much more common to expand access than restrict it.

www.nytimes.com

I have to wonder what would be happening if the Pro Choice movement had just been willing to agree to some kind of time restriction, instead of refusing to seriously discuss it and (apparently) backing abortion to the end of the pregnancy.

So now, the Pro Life movement can be expected to push this as far as they can, because they "won". After all, America is now all-or-nothing, right? Us vs. Them!

I know that many are just fine with all-or-nothing "wars". I just don't get it. They seem to do far more to divide than to actually improve things.

I don't think the pro-choice folks were mainstream supporting abortion on demand in all instances. Rather, the Xians wanted a total ban on abortions in States they can be majorities in. And it Xian. The RR spent billions to elect Justices committed to overturning Roe. And there is NO Xian political movement to increase taxes to care for women and the children who will be born. Like or hate Roe, thems is the facts.

So now it will be "purely" a political issue. And imo it will not end well for Xians.

I do think you link has some validity in that nations like Ireland and Italy that 50 years ago were much more conservative on abortion than the US have "evolved" and passed the Xian position. At the time Roe was decided I don't recall it really being unpopular, it was a 7-2 vote authored by a Republican. It was more sociology than law, imo, and based on a humanitarian concern that women were being injured. And at the time, politically speaking, pro-choice advocates were "winning."
1970: By the early 1970s, 20 states have passed abortion reform or repeal laws. Hawaii, Alaska, New York and Washington state have legalized abortion.
And early restrictions on abortions just outlawed aborting fetuses who had "quickened."

Before and after Roe v. Wade | CNN

A look at the years before and after Roe v. Wade, the ruling that legalized abortion 40 years ago Tuesday.

www.cnn.com

For a broader "history" of reproductive rights in America

Roe v. Wade: Decision, Summary & Background

Roe v. Wade was a landmark legal decision issued on January 22, 1973, in which the U.S. Supreme Court struck down a Texas statute banning abortion, effectively legalizing the procedure across the United States.

www.history.com

 

[jc456]

Maybe getting rid of tax write-offs for kids would help.
And extra welfare bennies.

well that doesn't align to drunken sex and killing the baby afterward though.

 

[jc456]

At the time Roe was decided I don't recall it really being unpopular, it was a 7-2 vote authored by a Republican. It was more sociology than law, imo, and based on a humanitarian concern that women were being injured. And at the time, politically speaking, pro-choice advocates were "winning."

I disagree with your opinion.

 

[marvin martian]

I don't think the pro-choice folks were mainstream supporting abortion on demand in all instances. Rather, the Xians wanted a total ban on abortions in States they can be majorities in. And it Xian. The RR spent billions to elect Justices committed to overturning Roe. And there is NO Xian political movement to increase taxes to care for women and the children who will be born. Like or hate Roe, thems is the facts.

So now it will be "purely" a political issue. And imo it will not end well for Xians.

I do think you link has some validity in that nations like Ireland and Italy that 50 years ago were much more conservative on abortion than the US have "evolved" and passed the Xian position. At the time Roe was decided I don't recall it really being unpopular, it was a 7-2 vote authored by a Republican. It was more sociology than law, imo, and based on a humanitarian concern that women were being injured. And at the time, politically speaking, pro-choice advocates were "winning."
1970: By the early 1970s, 20 states have passed abortion reform or repeal laws. Hawaii, Alaska, New York and Washington state have legalized abortion.
And early restrictions on abortions just outlawed aborting fetuses who had "quickened."

Before and after Roe v. Wade | CNN

A look at the years before and after Roe v. Wade, the ruling that legalized abortion 40 years ago Tuesday.

www.cnn.com

For a broader "history" of reproductive rights in America

Roe v. Wade: Decision, Summary & Background

Roe v. Wade was a landmark legal decision issued on January 22, 1973, in which the U.S. Supreme Court struck down a Texas statute banning abortion, effectively legalizing the procedure across the United States.

www.history.com

Your side has pigs gobbling abortion pills in front of a courthouse and laughing about it. Something had to be done.

 

[Orangecat]

Where does the constitution give rights to State governments to ban abortion?

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

 

[bendog]

I disagree with your opinion.

I don't care, but my opinion is really just that I'm happy this will be a political issue, because it's time to "bury" the Xians (not conservative libertarian leaning Goldwater republicans) but I'm sorry some women will suffer.

 

[Mac-7]

I don't belong to a tribe that thinks it has all the answers. If you need a number, let's try 12 weeks and see what happens.

Actually you do belong to a tribe

Its called biden voters

And they think they have all the answers on abortion, educating children, and immigration to name just a few

Biden is welcoming 2 million illegal aliens into America every year thanks to you and others who oppose border security

 

[martybegan]

Abortion law varies widely throughout the world. In many cases, there is a gestation period in which abortion is legal.

On Abortion Law, the U.S. Is Unusual. Without Roe, It Would Be, Too. (Published 2022)

Many rich democracies have earlier cutoffs for abortion — but allow it later for a variety of reasons. And around the world, it has been much more common to expand access than restrict it.

www.nytimes.com

I have to wonder what would be happening if the Pro Choice movement had just been willing to agree to some kind of time restriction, instead of refusing to seriously discuss it and (apparently) backing abortion to the end of the pregnancy.

So now, the Pro Life movement can be expected to push this as far as they can, because they "won". After all, America is now all-or-nothing, right? Us vs. Them!

I know that many are just fine with all-or-nothing "wars". I just don't get it. They seem to do far more to divide than to actually improve things.

The thing is the pro-life movement will lose the Federalists if they try to do things like a federal ban or even restriction, or try the bullshit of prosecuting people going from one State to another to get an abortion (limited to adults, of course, being the ones doing it, or a minor with parental consent)

 

[jc456]

Where does the constitution give rights to State governments to ban abortion? It doesnt.

yes it does, state's rights.

State Constitutions and Abortion Rights - Center for Reproductive Rights

How cases in state supreme courts can offer stronger and expanded legal grounds for protecting abortion rights.

reproductiverights.org

Roe vs Wade is actually unconstitutional and isn't a law since it wasn't through the legislative branch of our government that write laws.

 

[jc456]

I don't care, but my opinion is really just that I'm happy this will be a political issue, because it's time to "bury" the Xians (not conservative libertarian leaning Goldwater republicans) but I'm sorry some women will suffer.

I just want our country to do the processes within the constitution of the country rather than cheat the people out of their constitutional rights.

 

[cnm]

Roe is just the latest example of all-or-nothing politics​

The salient point to me is that it is the USSC playing the game.

What a spectacle!

 

[cnm]

I just want our country to do the processes within the constitution of the country rather than cheat the people out of their constitutional rights.

The USSC is not constitutional?

TIL

 

[2aguy]

Abortion law varies widely throughout the world. In many cases, there is a gestation period in which abortion is legal.

On Abortion Law, the U.S. Is Unusual. Without Roe, It Would Be, Too. (Published 2022)

Many rich democracies have earlier cutoffs for abortion — but allow it later for a variety of reasons. And around the world, it has been much more common to expand access than restrict it.

www.nytimes.com

I have to wonder what would be happening if the Pro Choice movement had just been willing to agree to some kind of time restriction, instead of refusing to seriously discuss it and (apparently) backing abortion to the end of the pregnancy.

So now, the Pro Life movement can be expected to push this as far as they can, because they "won". After all, America is now all-or-nothing, right? Us vs. Them!

I know that many are just fine with all-or-nothing "wars". I just don't get it. They seem to do far more to divide than to actually improve things.

No...what will happen if the Supreme Court does over turn Roe, is you will have baby killing states, states where you can kill babies under certain circumstances, and then some states where you won't be able to murder your baby.

 

[2aguy]

The salient point to me is that it is the USSC playing the game.

What a spectacle!

No, dipshit......all this ruling will do is leave it up to the states to decide, based on what the people of the state want...you fascist asshat.......

 

[jc456]

The USSC is not constitutional?

TIL

Not writing laws

 

[easyt65]

what is it based on?

So you are admitting you don't know what a 'woman' / a viable human being is either....

Priceless..

 

[Harpy Eagle]

So you are admitting you don't know what a 'woman' / a viable human being is either....

Priceless..

You did not answer the question...priceless, as they say

 

[kyzr]

You did not answer the question...priceless, as they say

What do you mean you're Pro-Choice??

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Could a state make murder legal? By that could a state remove all laws that define "unlawful killing" and just let people kill each other without the Fed Govt having the power to step in?

No because murder is also a federal crime.

 

[bendog]

I just want our country to do the processes within the constitution of the country rather than cheat the people out of their constitutional rights.

I respect that. I don't totally disagree. My daughter and I discussed that this morning while I worked from home. I've thought for years that Roe was a bad decision legally, but three generations grew up with Roe as a right.

Not writing laws

I'm not defending the rationale of Roe and Blackmun, but they didn't "write" a law. They said antiabortion laws can't be written.

Remember Robert Bork saying "he can't find a right to privacy in the const (or BoR)." But that's actually an interesting comment. Most of us agree the State can't interferewith out child rearing unless there's something very wrong. Child rearing isn't in the const. Where's the right for a black and white couple to marry? How about gays having sex? Can we say 'nononno?"

so it's not exactly the easy argument Alito would like to make it out to be.