Should only taxpayers be allowed to vote?

[thereisnospoon]

why? what's your purpose of taking her vote away? What will it do that makes you so happy? why would you even think about discriminating against her....? Honestly, why??? you want to punish her? She's broken no laws? you hate her??? why??? you are jealous? why???

"HAppy"? What it is with you libs and "happy"?. Who told you that you were supposed to be happy?
Let's see, why would we rather not see a person have the right to voter her or himself favorable goodies courtesy of state and federal government when that person has ZERO responsibility in funding those goodies...Is this a trick question?
It has nothing to do with personal feelings or emotion. It's business and logic. There is no "hate"..There is not even "dislike". This is about protecting assets from those whose perception of compassion starts with other people's money.
Few of us would mind paying taxes if government was required to be good stewards of our money. It isn't.
Look, if your heart bleeds for the welfare mothers who have 6 kids with 6 different men and who have chosen to make babies instead of a living, YOU write a check to pay them their dowry. Don't demand I do it as well.

I'm not going to mention 2 unfunded wars. Not going to mention hundreds of useless deployment /outposts. Not going to mention the largest defense budget in the history of the world. Not going to mention the lowest tax rates, for the wealthy, in many decades.

And you're worried about a mother, playing not only the system, but decency as well.

If the government made a law to allow having only 2 children, you would probably would scream from here to heaven. And maybe... Rightfully so. But if the birth rates geometrically keep soaring... Its exactly where we are going.

I will remind you the next time you decide to post, please FOCUS.
And if you're "not going to mention it" please do not mention it.
Since you opened the door, well over half of the federal budget is social spending.
Decency? I will give you my version of decency. Have the federal friggin government enforce its own laws and regulations. Stop the revolving door of one generation after another of those living off the dole. Start purging the cheats off the welfare rolls.
Slash government employment. And yes, get out military personnel out of these places in wherever and put troops on the borders, airports and sea ports.

 

[thereisnospoon]

We are not equal.

Our votes are...as it should be.

Well actually, they are not.
Depends on the rules.
If the each state had proportioned out it's votes according to House district instead of "winner take all" Romney would have won by a wide margin.
Funny thing is, there was a thread on here some months ago with the liberals railing against the Electoral College. Hmm.
i believe there is change afoot. Many states are taking a hard look at how their electoral votes are distributed. There is already precedent for this. Nebraska and Maine apportion their electoral votes based on House districts. Seems to me this should get traction.

 

[GreatestIam]

[

Given the fact that the top 10% of wage earners are saddled with 70% of the overall tax burden, you can believe your own nonsense if it makes you feel better.
None of you will answer the question regarding what a "fair share" of the tax burden is for high earners. In other words " if an effective tax rate averaging over 60% ( includes ALL taxes paid) how much SHOULD they pay?
A caller to the Sean Hannity show last week was given TWO segments( about 20 miuntes of air time including commercial breaks) to answer ONE question....How much is the "fair share"..The caller refused to answer. She kept spewing radical liberal talking points. Jumping from "it's not fair that some people get to have all that money" to spouting off about corporate welfare.
Then of course she whipped out that old liberal standby of the pre JFK tax rate of 91%. Which we all know did not apply to more than 200 people in the entire country AND only taxed at that rate less than 1% of their total income.
So, go ahead, come up with a number.

The number must be allowed to fluctuate to whatever the needs of the country are. The ideal is for all citizens to pay the same %.

The initial % would be is therefore ---- as required.

Your question and number can be fixed if you wish to give the amount required divided by the number of taxpayers and the amount of wealth they would pay taxes on.

Regards
DL

 

[thereisnospoon]

One last thing, my friend... There is a very small chance that the mother you mentioned, and the fathers that bore the 6 children... Don't vote anyway.

And lets keep it that way.
Lots of liberals were talking "skin in the game" when the issue of taxes on the wealthy and fair share were being discussed. Why not everyone then?

 

[GreatestIam]

[

Well that would pretty much include everyone who pays a sales tax, real estate tax, income tax, inheritance tax,,etc.

If on the dole, those VAT's are paid for by other taxpayers that put funds in the taxtakers pocket to pay that tax.

So who is really paying that tax, again?

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

[
Surely someone has pointed out that "tax payers" is damn everyone. If you buy something, you're a tax payer.

If you mean only those who pay income taxes, OMG, there is so much wrong with that, I don't know where to start.

But, surely others have pointed out that, in spite of the election rigging on the part of the right, this is still the US and you don't have be rich in order to get a vote. But, if the GObP gets their way, our votes won't be counted next time.

The issue is more as to where those on the dole get their funds to pay those VAT's. They are paid for by other taxpayers that put funds in the taxtakers pocket to pay that tax.

So who is really paying that tax, again?

Regards
DL

 

[dblack]

This thread illustrates the tag-team 'war on freedom' being waged by the Democrats and the Republicans. The Democrats build up federal power and dependency on government, and the Republicans use it as an excuse to strip us of our basic rights.

 

[GreatestIam]

Sales tax, income tax, property tax, fuel tax, and a myriad other taxes and fees.
You'd be hard pressed to find somebody who isn't taxed.

Same answer as the last two posts.

Those on the dole use your funds to pay those fees.

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

Everyone pays taxes, even people who can't vote.

True. The poor use taxpayer's money and not money they have earned.

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

Voting is a fundamental right, period. Try having better ideas instead of taking away fundamental rights.

Strange then that religions would deny women that right just because they are women. He will rule over you was used to deny women the vote for hundreds of years.

You might remember what the sufferance movement had to say about Religions. Nothing good.

Regards
DL

Religion has what to do with the subject or my statement?

Fundamental rights were not around when the U S was formed.

If your fundamental right, how droll a term, where real then this would not happen.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EAyiA5Rmf0]RACHEL MADDOW - THE NEW POLL TAX - PAYING TO VOTE - YouTube[/ame]

All your fundamental rights give is the right for the poor to pick a rich pocket.
Governments now enforce their right to pick pockets but not the right for the rich to easily get to the voting booth.

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

[

As long as we define taxpayers as anyone who pays at least $1 into the system. There are tons of people who file tax returns who not only DO NOT pay into the system, they extract taxpayer funds without making one dime of contribution.

+ 1

Regards
DL

If they take money out of your paycheck - you've contributed. You may get 100% of that money back, but the government got to hold and use your money without paying you any interest.

Understood but I do not have a big issue with that. If they paid you, and all of us, interest, then that would add to the tax burden and drive your/our % even higher.

The net gain, if any after they take admin fees, I think would be negligible.
If it was other than tax dollars you are right in that other companies would be brought to task.

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

We force people to take and pass an exam to paint toe nails or cut hair, yet we allow any dumbass who can make it to 18 without getting a felony conviction to vote. Prior to being issued a voter ID card a peson should have to pass exams in Civics, 20th century World History, Reading Comprehension and American History. If you cannot score at least a 75% on all these exams, you're too stupid to be trusted to pick the leader of the free world, as we have just seen twice in the past 5yrs.

A valid point but your dating is off the mark.

This Canadian thinks that you Yanks have finally smartened up.
Some of you that is.

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

Problem is that with our current tax code, it's difficult to tell who is actually paying taxes and who isn't. And which taxes are we talking about? Income taxes? State taxes?

I've always said that if "No taxation without representation" is true, that "No representation without taxation" would likewise be true. Mainly because the two are intimately connected.

However, the solution to remedy that is not denying people the right to vote, but rather requiring everyone to pay taxes.

Impossible as we will always have some in our welfare safety net. I do not mind this but just do not think they should be powerful enough to vote their raises.

Regards
DL

But unlimited and anonymous buckets of cash from corporations are just dandy. Let's let them keep buying legislators, but stop some "welfare queen" from exercising their right to vote. Sounds perfect.

Off the mark/issue my friend.

We were speaking of sending wealth down to the poor. Not sending wealth up to the rich.

Regards
DL

 

[Care4all]

EVERYONE, including those collecting some welfare money, pays taxes....in one form or another...

so, are you talking about "income taxes"?

 

[Care4all]

And who the hell are you, to tell another citizen equal to you, that they can't vote or shouldn't be able to vote?

Sheesh, you guys are horrible American citizens...just horrible to the very core of your souls imho. May God have mercy on you.

 

[GreatestIam]

Should only taxpayers be allowed to vote?

When Socrates and his friends were talking of voters, they were talking of land owners. In today’s terms, that means, ---- taxpayer. The core of democracy.

There are two types of citizens. The taxpayer and the taxtaker.

Once the taxpayer hands over his wealth, he loses control of where it is spent.

This is counter to the taxpayer’s wishes.

Why do taxpayers allow this situation and defer their right to spend their wealth to others?

If taxtakers had done a good job with that wealth, I do not think any would complain. That is not the case.

Should those who pay the way of our society be the ones who decide where our wealth is spent?

Since the right to do so is tied to our vote, should only taxpayers be allowed to vote on spending issues?

Regards
DL

I'm more apt to agree with Robert Heinlien, (sp), only veterans should be allowed to vote.
What do you think about that, oh great one?

All who are contributing to the good health, safety and security of the state should vote.

Those who do not should not.

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

[
A terrible idea:
A disable veteran who has given everything for his country shouldn't have a voice in selecting it's leaders? An elderly person who has worked all their life and paid taxes is now to be denied the right to vote? A mother with 4 kids who has been abandoned by her husband is to have no voice in how her country is run because she doesn't make enough a money.

Your veteran and elderly would be judged on a long term basis as would all citizens. They would retain a vote.

Your abandoned wife is able to chase her husband for support and would likely vote.

An unwed mother living on the dole with her kids would not make the grade.

Regards
DL

why? what's your purpose of taking her vote away? What will it do that makes you so happy? why would you even think about discriminating against her....? Honestly, why??? you want to punish her? She's broken no laws? you hate her??? why??? you are jealous? why???

I hold women above men in importance to a society and as a part of my moral tenets. In that sense I do not believe in equality. Equality under the law yes but not from my moral POV. ---- Think sanctity as shown in this clip please.

The real difference between liberals and conservatives: Jonathan Haidt on TED.com

I also demand more from women to justify my holding them above men.

When younger, I was asked to father a child by an unwed mother so that she could see her welfare check increase. I refused.

Need I say more?

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

Your veteran and elderly would be judged on a long term basis as would all citizens. They would retain a vote.

Your abandoned wife is able to chase her husband for support and would likely vote.

An unwed mother living on the dole with her kids would not make the grade.

Regards
DL

why? what's your purpose of taking her vote away? What will it do that makes you so happy? why would you even think about discriminating against her....? Honestly, why??? you want to punish her? She's broken no laws? you hate her??? why??? you are jealous? why???

You are asking for the impossible.
"why"... Was beaten out of them, when they were toddlers.

And yet I gave a clear answer. Thanks for pre-judging.

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

Even someone who lives in a box under an overpass deserves a vote

Elected officials are representing him too

No taxation without representation says that if one wants representation, ---- then he must pay a tax.

It is saying, pay me and I will represent you. Do not pay and I will not.

Regards
DL

Logic is not your friend

Chastisement without correction just cruelty and shows a hateful heart and also shows that you have no argument to refute what is at issue.

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

And who the hell are you, to tell another citizen equal to you, that they can't vote or shouldn't be able to vote?

Sheesh, you guys are horrible American citizens...just horrible to the very core of your souls imho. May God have mercy on you.

If all citizens are equal, then why is it only the poor who can have their hands in the rich pockets and the rich cannot prevent it?

Regards
DL