Should The Rich Be Required To Pay Higher Taxes In the US?

[eagle1462010]

I think the rich should ABSOLUTELY pay more because the majority of them are selfish and don't care about anybody but themselves! Trust me, if you are a millionaire, it is NOT going to hurt you if you just pay a little more in taxes. I believe that if you are a good and righteous person, you would want to help the poor or people that are less fortunate. It's as simple as that! People need to stop being so selfish.

The top 10% of wage earners in this country already pay over 70% of the collected income taxes in this country. If that's not enough, then how much more should they pay? 75%? 80%? 95%?

About 45% of our population pays no income tax at all. Maybe it's about time those on the bottom start paying their fare share for a change. And remember, the US is the most generous people in the entire world. We give more of our money to the so-called poor than anybody, and it's not those Wal-Mart people that are giving, it's those greedy millionaires you speak of.

Seriously, how much money do you think increasing taxes on the poor will get you? That'll balance our budget? Maybe we could buy A tank. The people running Walmart manage to get out of quite a bit of taxes while paying their workers a low enough wage that taxpayers foot the bill for their food stamps.

1 in 4 corporations get out of paying taxes, so yeah tax the rich

Earlier on this thread I stated that a Flat Tax could be tiered and most Flat tax proposals do exactly that. Where the poor pay 0% or 1% into the system. So they wouldn't be paying Federal Taxes on most proposals. So how is 0% or 1% increasing the tax on the poor............

Now if you want to address the Tax Credits under the current system............then yes the savings to the Gov't would be over 200 Billion a year to these same people. As in the end their Federal Tax burden is 0%, but they get a check back anyway.......to the tune of thousands of dollars every year.

I call that what it is.............A Welfare Check every year without calling it one. Paying 0% is enough of a break................and if we were to write Welfare checks then do it outside of tax law. We have safety nets already in place for those needing assistance..............and 0% tax rates are enough already under the system.

EITC “the best anti-poverty, the best pro-family, the best job creation measure to come out of Congress,” Ronnie Reagan


Mark Everson, who served as IRS commissioner under President George W. Bush, called the EITC “one of the government’s most successful anti-poverty programs.”**


The Federal Earned Income Tax Credit Draws Praise Across the Political Spectrum - Jonathan Kantrowitz

And Bush pushed the TAX CREDITS FOR THE POOR AS WELL...........while your side yelled tax breaks for the rich, tax breaks for the rich, the BRITISH ARE COMING................

When most of the credits were aimed at the poor and the middle class............

Face it.............you don't want to lose the 200 Billion a year Welfare checks under the current system.

0% isn't enough for you...............

And the Flat tax system would end the danged loop holes you bitch about all the time.

 

[David_42]

Yes, and a "flat tax" would never work. For all of those bitching about the poor not paying taxes, they do, just not the specific federal tax, since they already have enough burden to worry about. You wonder why the rich pay most taxes? They hold most of the taxable income.

I've already stated that earlier in the thread..................They pay taxes on property, sales tax, and etc.............
Like the Gasoline tax to pay for our roads.................as another poster has already stated as well.

The simplified code ends the BS under the current system. It is too large for a reason............because the lobbies want the loop holes to avoid paying already. The flat tax would end those loop holes.............and make paying taxes simple...............

Exactly HOW IS THAT BAD.......Unless you think 0% isn't enough already under the Federal Tax rates.............and want to maintain a 200 BIllion a year Welfare system under the tax code without really calling it that..................

Progressive taxation and crack down on loop holes, like every other country.

 

[2aguy]

Only about 95%+ of economists say a flat tax is regressive

My question is this, of the 5% who disagree, how many work for one or more of the foundations funded by the Koch Brothers?

By definition a flat tax is not regressive. It's flat. that's what "flat" means. Regressive would be where the poor pay a higher percentage than the rich.

Liberals have so warped the English language that no one even agrees on the definition of common words like "flat."

Consequences of tax policy matter. Do you really want to live in an Oligarchy, where the very rich and power elite write laws and establish the regulations for their benefit? Or, do want to live in a nation of, by and for the people.

By and for the people? You mean like the system we have today where a non-working or working poor person can vote money out of the pockets of those more successful for their own advantage?

I don't know that I'm crazy about this system either.

• Most of the working poor would be deprived of the right to vote by the current iteration of conservatives
• Most of the non working poor are considered to be reprobates by the current iteration of conservatives
• Labor unions are under attack by the current iteration of conservatives
• The current iteration of conservatives want to give to the rich and take from the poor

Pick your poison, give to the few, or provide for the many. Which do you think will be

1. Consistent with Judeo-Christian Ethics
2. insure domestic Tranquility, and
3. Promote the general Welfare

You are a moron.....not one thing you posted is true. trying to get people to show the same id they use to drive or cash checks to vote is not denying people the right to vote......you know, like South Africa and Neslon Mandela made their people show id to vote and how they vote everywhere else in e world.......and if the poor in this modern age have somehow avoided cashing checks, or driving...then they get the voter id for free and it is driven to them by the state.....so sell your bull shot somewhere else.....

Labor unions have bankrupted state after state....they are crushing Illinois in debt we can never pay back and the pension system is going to collapse...fixing that problem is not attacking unions....

Please explain how making a flat tax or a sales tax is taking from the poor and giving to the rich, considering that the flat tax will have upwards of 30-50 grand tax free, and the sales tax will be voluntary and you get to keep everything you earn....


You left wingers are liars and vile people.....

 

[NYcarbineer]

Going to a flat tax assumes that currently the rich are overtaxed and the not rich are undertaxed. It assumes that the Americans who are most in need of tax relief are the rich,

and the Americans who can most easily afford to pay more taxes are the not rich.

I don't think that's so.

No....what it assumes is that the flat tax is fair to everyone. Everyone pays the same rate. And you lefty morons still get to get more taxes from the rich...a win win....

Fairness is more than a math measurement.

In a Society of 320 million people fairness is a flat tax rate or a sales tax. Not taking from some because they work harder, longer or smarter than others......

Think (I know, that's silly of me to ask you to think) of the consequences of what you've advocated. Really try to think. Use paper, pencil, a calculator and do the math.

Take the income of the highest paid ball player and your salary/wages and take 10% for taxes away and see how much you will each net in 10 years.

Then consider your investment income, and the investment income of an insider.

the government doesn't deserve more than 10-15% of anyone's income even if they are billionaires. It doesn't matter how much we fucking net....he paid 10-15% and that is all anyone should be asked to give. Hating the ball player because his talent allows him to have a lot of money after he pays 10-15% is your fucking mental psychosis....envy, jealousy on your part doesn't mean we need to give even greedier, even more corrupt people more of our money.


Please, none of you twits has explained how it makes any freaking sense to give politicians even more money when right now you bitch and moan about them giving tax breaks to the rich........do you think these same politicians, these politicians will behave the way you want them too if you give them more of our money?

Please, answer that question...you guys never do...showing you are twits and morons....

Rich people give the politicians money to buy tax breaks with.

 

[eagle1462010]

Yes, and a "flat tax" would never work. For all of those bitching about the poor not paying taxes, they do, just not the specific federal tax, since they already have enough burden to worry about. You wonder why the rich pay most taxes? They hold most of the taxable income.

I've already stated that earlier in the thread..................They pay taxes on property, sales tax, and etc.............
Like the Gasoline tax to pay for our roads.................as another poster has already stated as well.

The simplified code ends the BS under the current system. It is too large for a reason............because the lobbies want the loop holes to avoid paying already. The flat tax would end those loop holes.............and make paying taxes simple...............

Exactly HOW IS THAT BAD.......Unless you think 0% isn't enough already under the Federal Tax rates.............and want to maintain a 200 BIllion a year Welfare system under the tax code without really calling it that..................

Progressive taxation and crack down on loop holes, like every other country.

Are you agreeing with the Flat tax then..................

Because it gets rid of most of the ridiculous code and ends the loop holes...............
And I've stated that it would have to be progressive or it would never pass anyway...........
Either way........I'd like to use a post card to pay my taxes...........

Like another poster early in the thread said.................Tell me what I owe and be done with it.

 

[2aguy]

Yes, and a "flat tax" would never work. For all of those bitching about the poor not paying taxes, they do, just not the specific federal tax, since they already have enough burden to worry about. You wonder why the rich pay most taxes? They hold most of the taxable income.

I've already stated that earlier in the thread..................They pay taxes on property, sales tax, and etc.............
Like the Gasoline tax to pay for our roads.................as another poster has already stated as well.

The simplified code ends the BS under the current system. It is too large for a reason............because the lobbies want the loop holes to avoid paying already. The flat tax would end those loop holes.............and make paying taxes simple...............

Exactly HOW IS THAT BAD.......Unless you think 0% isn't enough already under the Federal Tax rates.............and want to maintain a 200 BIllion a year Welfare system under the tax code without really calling it that..................

Progressive taxation and crack down on loop holes, like every other country.

No, a flat tax with a 50 thousand dollar exemption for all people or a national sales tax are the two fairest ways to generate tax revenue. anything else is based in hate and greed.

 

[David_42]

Yes, and a "flat tax" would never work. For all of those bitching about the poor not paying taxes, they do, just not the specific federal tax, since they already have enough burden to worry about. You wonder why the rich pay most taxes? They hold most of the taxable income.

I've already stated that earlier in the thread..................They pay taxes on property, sales tax, and etc.............
Like the Gasoline tax to pay for our roads.................as another poster has already stated as well.

The simplified code ends the BS under the current system. It is too large for a reason............because the lobbies want the loop holes to avoid paying already. The flat tax would end those loop holes.............and make paying taxes simple...............

Exactly HOW IS THAT BAD.......Unless you think 0% isn't enough already under the Federal Tax rates.............and want to maintain a 200 BIllion a year Welfare system under the tax code without really calling it that..................

Progressive taxation and crack down on loop holes, like every other country.

No, a flat tax with a 50 thousand dollar exemption for all people or a national sales tax are the two fairest ways to generate tax revenue. anything else is based in hate and greed.

Except anyone who understands basic math knows how much revenue would be lost, social programs would be mercilessly gutted.

 

[NYcarbineer]

GW Bush and the Republicans let PAYGO expire in 2001 so they could bust the budget with borrow and spend and 'free' wars.

And then they proceeded to do so.

 

[David_42]

Yes, and a "flat tax" would never work. For all of those bitching about the poor not paying taxes, they do, just not the specific federal tax, since they already have enough burden to worry about. You wonder why the rich pay most taxes? They hold most of the taxable income.

I've already stated that earlier in the thread..................They pay taxes on property, sales tax, and etc.............
Like the Gasoline tax to pay for our roads.................as another poster has already stated as well.

The simplified code ends the BS under the current system. It is too large for a reason............because the lobbies want the loop holes to avoid paying already. The flat tax would end those loop holes.............and make paying taxes simple...............

Exactly HOW IS THAT BAD.......Unless you think 0% isn't enough already under the Federal Tax rates.............and want to maintain a 200 BIllion a year Welfare system under the tax code without really calling it that..................

Progressive taxation and crack down on loop holes, like every other country.

Are you agreeing with the Flat tax then..................

Because it gets rid of most of the ridiculous code and ends the loop holes...............
And I've stated that it would have to be progressive or it would never pass anyway...........
Either way........I'd like to use a post card to pay my taxes...........

Like another poster early in the thread said.................Tell me what I owe and be done with it.

That doesn't sound like a flat tax if it's progressive.

 

[2aguy]

No....what it assumes is that the flat tax is fair to everyone. Everyone pays the same rate. And you lefty morons still get to get more taxes from the rich...a win win....

Fairness is more than a math measurement.

In a Society of 320 million people fairness is a flat tax rate or a sales tax. Not taking from some because they work harder, longer or smarter than others......

Think (I know, that's silly of me to ask you to think) of the consequences of what you've advocated. Really try to think. Use paper, pencil, a calculator and do the math.

Take the income of the highest paid ball player and your salary/wages and take 10% for taxes away and see how much you will each net in 10 years.

Then consider your investment income, and the investment income of an insider.

the government doesn't deserve more than 10-15% of anyone's income even if they are billionaires. It doesn't matter how much we fucking net....he paid 10-15% and that is all anyone should be asked to give. Hating the ball player because his talent allows him to have a lot of money after he pays 10-15% is your fucking mental psychosis....envy, jealousy on your part doesn't mean we need to give even greedier, even more corrupt people more of our money.


Please, none of you twits has explained how it makes any freaking sense to give politicians even more money when right now you bitch and moan about them giving tax breaks to the rich........do you think these same politicians, these politicians will behave the way you want them too if you give them more of our money?

Please, answer that question...you guys never do...showing you are twits and morons....

Rich people give the politicians money to buy tax breaks with.

yeah....so if you give those politicians more money how does that stop it........it doesn't........since. The politician can only give money to rich people by first taking it from us....right? Twit. so if they don't have our money, they can't give it away, can they? and letting someone keep the money they earn is not a tax break....it is not stealing their money......

 

[NYcarbineer]

Yes, and a "flat tax" would never work. For all of those bitching about the poor not paying taxes, they do, just not the specific federal tax, since they already have enough burden to worry about. You wonder why the rich pay most taxes? They hold most of the taxable income.

I've already stated that earlier in the thread..................They pay taxes on property, sales tax, and etc.............
Like the Gasoline tax to pay for our roads.................as another poster has already stated as well.

The simplified code ends the BS under the current system. It is too large for a reason............because the lobbies want the loop holes to avoid paying already. The flat tax would end those loop holes.............and make paying taxes simple...............

Exactly HOW IS THAT BAD.......Unless you think 0% isn't enough already under the Federal Tax rates.............and want to maintain a 200 BIllion a year Welfare system under the tax code without really calling it that..................

Progressive taxation and crack down on loop holes, like every other country.

No, a flat tax with a 50 thousand dollar exemption for all people or a national sales tax are the two fairest ways to generate tax revenue. anything else is based in hate and greed.

lol, so under your scheme every household with less than the average income, which happens to be around 50,000,

would pay NO income tax?

Wasn't that what you 'nuts were just bitching about? The people who pay no tax?

 

[LeftofLeft]

Guys like you worship government, you believe it does no wrong and that government has first claim on anything you earn...and after that you can keep what they don't need right now........and there is never enough money for the government to spend.....

And you anti Gov't types do EVERYTHING to undermine effective Gov't AND US as a society.

......this coming from the side that believes tripling the deficit and increasing debt ceiling is effective government. That mindset definition of efficiency makes about as much sense as a financial advisor telling consumers in debt to triple their credit card debt levels and ask for more credit when they have hit their limit.

Most sound financial minds are all about limiting that level of "effectiveness" ; conservative and otherwise.

 

[eagle1462010]

Yes, and a "flat tax" would never work. For all of those bitching about the poor not paying taxes, they do, just not the specific federal tax, since they already have enough burden to worry about. You wonder why the rich pay most taxes? They hold most of the taxable income.

I've already stated that earlier in the thread..................They pay taxes on property, sales tax, and etc.............
Like the Gasoline tax to pay for our roads.................as another poster has already stated as well.

The simplified code ends the BS under the current system. It is too large for a reason............because the lobbies want the loop holes to avoid paying already. The flat tax would end those loop holes.............and make paying taxes simple...............

Exactly HOW IS THAT BAD.......Unless you think 0% isn't enough already under the Federal Tax rates.............and want to maintain a 200 BIllion a year Welfare system under the tax code without really calling it that..................

Progressive taxation and crack down on loop holes, like every other country.

No, a flat tax with a 50 thousand dollar exemption for all people or a national sales tax are the two fairest ways to generate tax revenue. anything else is based in hate and greed.

Except anyone who understands basic math knows how much revenue would be lost, social programs would be mercilessly gutted.

BS...........the effective rates under the current system are far lower than the percentages of tax rates...........The massive tax codes have ensured that.....................The massive code is for loop holes and twisting of tax law to keep people from paying the rates and nothing more.

 

[Wry Catcher]

First, Fuck you, only an asshole starts a rebuttal with such a stupid comment.

Yes, both parties solicit money, seems to be stupid for one party to take the high road and allow the other party to buy the elections. Even a bonehead understands that.

Take it up with the five members of SCOTUS who repealed campaign finance reform.

You have no idea how much high speed rail should cost.

Private sector contractors are culpable for cost overruns; many times government's hands are tied, do to the requirement to accept the low bid.

Fuck you back. You happy now.............
Both sides pander to the Lobbyist and both sides of the lobby pander to the rich.............The GOP doesn't own stock and barrel to the rich..............Your side has filthy rich types too you just try to avoid that side of the equation................When I hear the actors and other millionaires on your side yell tax the rich...............I simply laugh at them because many times they are much richer than the ones they are bitching about.

I will not discuss the high speed rail costs............as I addressed it on anther thread............Texas built one...........from Dallas to Houston for a fraction of the cost of the one from Los Angeles to San Fran Sicko...............and I'll top it off that only a NUT thinks that the Gov't does these projects cheaper................

To top it off you should have been using the money more wisely.................water is more important than the danged high speed rail.................You should have been building desalination plants and resevoirs instead.

Who funded the Houston to Dallas high speed rail?

A spur line will connect SF to LA, the main line is scheduled to go up the Central Valley from LA (later San Diego) to Sacramento. The air corridor between SF, SJ, OAK and LA is jam packed, rail will stimulate building of transit villages benefiting the economy of small towns and cities along the route and the movement of produce - which feeds much of the nation - will get to market without being trucked, saving fuel, tires going into the land fills and reducing grid lock on the highways.

Learn to think panoptically

 

[NYcarbineer]

Fairness is more than a math measurement.

In a Society of 320 million people fairness is a flat tax rate or a sales tax. Not taking from some because they work harder, longer or smarter than others......

Think (I know, that's silly of me to ask you to think) of the consequences of what you've advocated. Really try to think. Use paper, pencil, a calculator and do the math.

Take the income of the highest paid ball player and your salary/wages and take 10% for taxes away and see how much you will each net in 10 years.

Then consider your investment income, and the investment income of an insider.

the government doesn't deserve more than 10-15% of anyone's income even if they are billionaires. It doesn't matter how much we fucking net....he paid 10-15% and that is all anyone should be asked to give. Hating the ball player because his talent allows him to have a lot of money after he pays 10-15% is your fucking mental psychosis....envy, jealousy on your part doesn't mean we need to give even greedier, even more corrupt people more of our money.


Please, none of you twits has explained how it makes any freaking sense to give politicians even more money when right now you bitch and moan about them giving tax breaks to the rich........do you think these same politicians, these politicians will behave the way you want them too if you give them more of our money?

Please, answer that question...you guys never do...showing you are twits and morons....

Rich people give the politicians money to buy tax breaks with.

yeah....so if you give those politicians more money how does that stop it........it doesn't........since. The politician can only give money to rich people by first taking it from us....right? Twit. so if they don't have our money, they can't give it away, can they? and letting someone keep the money they earn is not a tax break....it is not stealing their money......

The politicians also pass the spending bills.

 

[David_42]

Guys like you worship government, you believe it does no wrong and that government has first claim on anything you earn...and after that you can keep what they don't need right now........and there is never enough money for the government to spend.....

And you anti Gov't types do EVERYTHING to undermine effective Gov't AND US as a society.

......this coming from the side that believes tripling the deficit and increasing debt ceiling is effective government. That mindset definition of efficiency makes about as much sense as a financial advisor telling consumers in debt to triple their credit card debt levels and ask for more credit when they have hit their limit.

Most sound financial minds are all about limiting that level of "effectiveness" ; conservative and otherwise.

Reagan tripled the debt.

 

[2aguy]

Yes, and a "flat tax" would never work. For all of those bitching about the poor not paying taxes, they do, just not the specific federal tax, since they already have enough burden to worry about. You wonder why the rich pay most taxes? They hold most of the taxable income.

I've already stated that earlier in the thread..................They pay taxes on property, sales tax, and etc.............
Like the Gasoline tax to pay for our roads.................as another poster has already stated as well.

The simplified code ends the BS under the current system. It is too large for a reason............because the lobbies want the loop holes to avoid paying already. The flat tax would end those loop holes.............and make paying taxes simple...............

Exactly HOW IS THAT BAD.......Unless you think 0% isn't enough already under the Federal Tax rates.............and want to maintain a 200 BIllion a year Welfare system under the tax code without really calling it that..................

Progressive taxation and crack down on loop holes, like every other country.

Are you agreeing with the Flat tax then..................

Because it gets rid of most of the ridiculous code and ends the loop holes...............
And I've stated that it would have to be progressive or it would never pass anyway...........
Either way........I'd like to use a post card to pay my taxes...........

Like another poster early in the thread said.................Tell me what I owe and be done with it.

a flat tax is progressive...10% of 100,000 is less than 10% of 1 million.

you get your tax post card, deduct up to 50,000 dollars, take 10% of the rest and send it in. done in 3 minutes, no reason to cheat, no loopholes.

 

[2aguy]

Guys like you worship government, you believe it does no wrong and that government has first claim on anything you earn...and after that you can keep what they don't need right now........and there is never enough money for the government to spend.....

And you anti Gov't types do EVERYTHING to undermine effective Gov't AND US as a society.

......this coming from the side that believes tripling the deficit and increasing debt ceiling is effective government. That mindset definition of efficiency makes about as much sense as a financial advisor telling consumers in debt to triple their credit card debt levels and ask for more credit when they have hit their limit.

Most sound financial minds are all about limiting that level of "effectiveness" ; conservative and otherwise.

Reagan tripled the debt.

No, the democrats broke their deal and spent every penny of the increased revenue from his tax cuts.

 

[eagle1462010]

Yes, and a "flat tax" would never work. For all of those bitching about the poor not paying taxes, they do, just not the specific federal tax, since they already have enough burden to worry about. You wonder why the rich pay most taxes? They hold most of the taxable income.

I've already stated that earlier in the thread..................They pay taxes on property, sales tax, and etc.............
Like the Gasoline tax to pay for our roads.................as another poster has already stated as well.

The simplified code ends the BS under the current system. It is too large for a reason............because the lobbies want the loop holes to avoid paying already. The flat tax would end those loop holes.............and make paying taxes simple...............

Exactly HOW IS THAT BAD.......Unless you think 0% isn't enough already under the Federal Tax rates.............and want to maintain a 200 BIllion a year Welfare system under the tax code without really calling it that..................

Progressive taxation and crack down on loop holes, like every other country.

No, a flat tax with a 50 thousand dollar exemption for all people or a national sales tax are the two fairest ways to generate tax revenue. anything else is based in hate and greed.

lol, so under your scheme every household with less than the average income, which happens to be around 50,000,

would pay NO income tax?

Wasn't that what you 'nuts were just bitching about? The people who pay no tax?

It would save this country 200 Billion plus a year as I have stated many times................

The cut in rate of taxation can be negotiated in the final form.

We need to simplify the code in any case...........whether it be a new system or an overhaul of the old.

 

[2aguy]

In a Society of 320 million people fairness is a flat tax rate or a sales tax. Not taking from some because they work harder, longer or smarter than others......

Think (I know, that's silly of me to ask you to think) of the consequences of what you've advocated. Really try to think. Use paper, pencil, a calculator and do the math.

Take the income of the highest paid ball player and your salary/wages and take 10% for taxes away and see how much you will each net in 10 years.

Then consider your investment income, and the investment income of an insider.

the government doesn't deserve more than 10-15% of anyone's income even if they are billionaires. It doesn't matter how much we fucking net....he paid 10-15% and that is all anyone should be asked to give. Hating the ball player because his talent allows him to have a lot of money after he pays 10-15% is your fucking mental psychosis....envy, jealousy on your part doesn't mean we need to give even greedier, even more corrupt people more of our money.


Please, none of you twits has explained how it makes any freaking sense to give politicians even more money when right now you bitch and moan about them giving tax breaks to the rich........do you think these same politicians, these politicians will behave the way you want them too if you give them more of our money?

Please, answer that question...you guys never do...showing you are twits and morons....

Rich people give the politicians money to buy tax breaks with.

yeah....so if you give those politicians more money how does that stop it........it doesn't........since. The politician can only give money to rich people by first taking it from us....right? Twit. so if they don't have our money, they can't give it away, can they? and letting someone keep the money they earn is not a tax break....it is not stealing their money......

The politicians also pass the spending bills.

Yes they do.....and the more money you send them the more they spend. and they can reward their friends and push their enemies with the budget...so why would you give your hard earned money to them....beyond 10%-15%....... When you know, and bitch already about how they spend the money you give them now.....?