The confederates were assholes but knocking down their statues makes you an asshole too

[iamwhatiseem]

 

[BlueGin]

That argument went out the window when the left went after all statues including those of our founding fathers.

How come? It's not as if the founding fathers didn't keep blacks enslaved, after a rebellion that enabled them to keep blacks enslaved.

Because you are obviously ignorant of American history.
You are too uneducated to know that the founding fathers DESIGNED the new America with ending slavery in mind. If you knew how to read and comprehend - you would know this.

Why did it take them so long? And why did they think it was okay to enslave another person at any time?

For the first couple generations America was a very fragile country. A significant number were still British loyalist, there were also French colonist who were still loyal to France. America was held together with twine. Trying to abolish slavery would have ended America. PERIOD. Even as "long as they waited" it almost ended America then. The central government barely - and I mean BARELY had any power over the individual states. Indeed, several state armies were large than the "national" army...that barely existed.

So basically they were vile, selfish men who thought it was fine to enslave other men as long as it served their own desires.

I say no statues for slave owners. Fucking evil.

You idiots are such cowards. You go after statues of men that lived hundreds of years ago instead of addressing modern day slavery in places like Africa,India,China,Pakistan.

 

[colfax_m]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

 

[martybegan]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

There was honor at the end, when they admitted they lost, surrendered, and willingly integrated back into the United States.

They could have kept fighting non conventionally, they didn't.

 

[BlindBoo]

Assholes? Yes, but on an order of magnitude much less than the wannabe country based on draconian Chattel Slavery.

What? The effect was much the same for 90 odd years.

The oppression of the Jim Crow era in the South should be documented and preserved as well. Most of the statues were erected after the end of reconstruction when the former white power structure regained political power.

 

[cnm]

Oh yes... it would have been sooo much better to absolve America, and allow economic slavery for EVERYONE under French and British rule.
yeah,... great.
[...]

Well obviously not if you could avoid it by keeping an entire population enslaved. I mean, white America had the superior claim to a good life, right?

 

[colfax_m]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

There was honor at the end, when they admitted they lost, surrendered, and willingly integrated back into the United States.

They could have kept fighting non conventionally, they didn't.

Yes. The best thing you can say about the confederacy is they gave up.

Kinda.

The south spent the next 100 years finding new ways to subjugate black people. Which is part of how these statutes came to be in the first place.

 

[cnm]

Oh yes... it would have been sooo much better to absolve America, and allow economic slavery for EVERYONE under French and British rule.
yeah,... great.

So it really is all about money. No wonder talk of reparation has people running scared.

 

[BlindBoo]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

There was honor at the end, when they admitted they lost, surrendered, and willingly integrated back into the United States.

They could have kept fighting non conventionally, they didn't.

Thousands of Republicans, black and white, were killed in Louisiana by insurgents during the Federal occupation after the surrender. After the last troops left in 1877, the Southern Democrats began working to gain control again.

 

[martybegan]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

There was honor at the end, when they admitted they lost, surrendered, and willingly integrated back into the United States.

They could have kept fighting non conventionally, they didn't.

Yes. The best thing you can say about the confederacy is they gave up.

Kinda.

The south spent the next 100 years finding new ways to subjugate black people. Which is part of how these statutes came to be in the first place.

The issues of the failure of Reconstruction are separate. The issue here is the honoring of fallen Confederates as well as their failed leaders.

Considering that the Jim Crow laws were subjugating blacks de jure, the installation of monuments pales in comparison.

The one exception is that one memorial in New Orleans that was specifically a memorial to an white "uprising" that happened during reconstruction.

Battle of Liberty Place Monument - Wikipedia

 

[BlueGin]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

Lefties don’t even know what honor is. Look at the things you support. Torturing puppies while live streaming, Stabbing police horses ,watching a man die as shown by looters who shot him via live streaming on social media ),shooting cops in the back of the head. Mobs beating people with bricks.

You can shut up about “ honor”.

 

[martybegan]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

There was honor at the end, when they admitted they lost, surrendered, and willingly integrated back into the United States.

They could have kept fighting non conventionally, they didn't.

Thousands of Republicans, black and white, were killed in Louisiana by insurgents during the Federal occupation after the surrender. After the last troops left in 1877, the Southern Democrats began working to gain control again.

That fight wasn't about leaving the union again, that was about local power.

 

[colfax_m]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

Lefties don’t even know what honor is. Look at the things you support. Torturing puppies while live streaming, Stabbing police horses ,watching a man die as shown by looters who shot him via live streaming on social media ),shooting cops in the back of the head. Mobs beating people with bricks.

You can shut up about “ honor”.

Someone has seriously abused your mind.

 

[colfax_m]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

There was honor at the end, when they admitted they lost, surrendered, and willingly integrated back into the United States.

They could have kept fighting non conventionally, they didn't.

Yes. The best thing you can say about the confederacy is they gave up.

Kinda.

The south spent the next 100 years finding new ways to subjugate black people. Which is part of how these statutes came to be in the first place.

The issues of the failure of Reconstruction are separate. The issue here is the honoring of fallen Confederates as well as their failed leaders.

Considering that the Jim Crow laws were subjugating blacks de jure, the installation of monuments pales in comparison.

The one exception is that one memorial in New Orleans that was specifically a memorial to an white "uprising" that happened during reconstruction.

Battle of Liberty Place Monument - Wikipedia

They are not separate. The statues were placed during segregation as a reminder of who retained power.

They are, by and large, explicit symbols of oppression.

 

[BlindBoo]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

There was honor at the end, when they admitted they lost, surrendered, and willingly integrated back into the United States.

They could have kept fighting non conventionally, they didn't.

Thousands of Republicans, black and white, were killed in Louisiana by insurgents during the Federal occupation after the surrender. After the last troops left in 1877, the Southern Democrats began working to gain control again.

That fight wasn't about leaving the union again, that was about local power.

The had no choice but to submit, the south was in shambles by 1865. The next few decade were about White power and reversing the effects of the occupation and reconstruction, which gave the short lived rights to the former Slaves.

 

[martybegan]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

There was honor at the end, when they admitted they lost, surrendered, and willingly integrated back into the United States.

They could have kept fighting non conventionally, they didn't.

Yes. The best thing you can say about the confederacy is they gave up.

Kinda.

The south spent the next 100 years finding new ways to subjugate black people. Which is part of how these statutes came to be in the first place.

The issues of the failure of Reconstruction are separate. The issue here is the honoring of fallen Confederates as well as their failed leaders.

Considering that the Jim Crow laws were subjugating blacks de jure, the installation of monuments pales in comparison.

The one exception is that one memorial in New Orleans that was specifically a memorial to an white "uprising" that happened during reconstruction.

Battle of Liberty Place Monument - Wikipedia

They are not separate. The statues were placed during segregation as a reminder of who retained power.

They are, by and large, explicit symbols of oppression.

Why would they need reminders when they had all the power, and were abusing it?

This was also the time the leaders were dying off, and the veterans were getting older.

 

[martybegan]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

There was honor at the end, when they admitted they lost, surrendered, and willingly integrated back into the United States.

They could have kept fighting non conventionally, they didn't.

Thousands of Republicans, black and white, were killed in Louisiana by insurgents during the Federal occupation after the surrender. After the last troops left in 1877, the Southern Democrats began working to gain control again.

That fight wasn't about leaving the union again, that was about local power.

The had no choice but to submit, the south was in shambles by 1865. The next few decade were about White power and reversing the effects of the occupation and reconstruction, which gave the short lived rights to the former Slaves.

Reconstruction was bungled, and the courts didn't help, Plessey is the prime example of that.

Which is why I always wonder why progressives run to the courts to get what they want.

 

[easyt65]

NEWSFLASH:

Knocking down statues that remind us of the past DOES NOT CHANGE OUR PAST.


One way to look at these statues and monuments of famous confederate generals, etc... is to think of them as giant, marble / stone 'stick notes' to ourselves reminding us where we came from, to learn from the past, and to do better - to NOT repeat the mistakes of the past, to be better!

.

 

[colfax_m]

That's the way I look at it.

For the most part they were also forgiven and rehabilitated assholes. If the Union wanted to execute them for treason, they could have, but that might have started a gorilla campaign we could still be fighting today.

They surrendered, they came back to the Union, and in return the people who beat them forgave them and allowed them to honor the loss and their dead as they saw fit.

There is no honor in what the Confederacy did.

There was honor at the end, when they admitted they lost, surrendered, and willingly integrated back into the United States.

They could have kept fighting non conventionally, they didn't.

Yes. The best thing you can say about the confederacy is they gave up.

Kinda.

The south spent the next 100 years finding new ways to subjugate black people. Which is part of how these statutes came to be in the first place.

The issues of the failure of Reconstruction are separate. The issue here is the honoring of fallen Confederates as well as their failed leaders.

Considering that the Jim Crow laws were subjugating blacks de jure, the installation of monuments pales in comparison.

The one exception is that one memorial in New Orleans that was specifically a memorial to an white "uprising" that happened during reconstruction.

Battle of Liberty Place Monument - Wikipedia

They are not separate. The statues were placed during segregation as a reminder of who retained power.

They are, by and large, explicit symbols of oppression.

Why would they need reminders when they had all the power, and were abusing it?

This was also the time the leaders were dying off, and the veterans were getting older.

Their leaders died well before the vast majority of these were placed. Lee died just a few years after they surrendered, having lost his property and ability to vote or hold office.

The civil war should be remembered most for being the biggest mistake we’ve ever made. Not to honor those who made it.

 

[colfax_m]

NEWSFLASH:

Knocking down statues that remind us of the past DOES NOT CHANGE OUR PAST.


One way to look at these statues and monuments of famous confederate generals, etc... is to think of them as giant, marble / stone 'stick notes' to ourselves reminding us where we came from, to learn from the past, and to do better - to NOT repeat the mistakes of the past, to be better!

.

Absolute nonsense.

No one is trying to change the past. We should chose not to honor it. If you want sticky notes about how not to repeat the past, you don’t put up monuments to those who caused such pain.

Total revisionism.