The Red State War On Gay Marriage

[martybegan]

they always claim that is the issue. it isn't.

they don't have a religious right to deny others' THEIR rights.

but they'll figure it out.

So a lesbian couple has a right to force a baker to bake a cake for them?

Yes, in some states they do, they're called public accommodation laws. It's the same law that says I have to bake a cake for you.

But not requiring a baker to bake a cake isn't the only thing the Kansas bill would have done.

In addition to barring all anti-discrimination lawsuits against private employers, the new law permits government employees to deny service to gays in the name of “religious liberty.” This is nothing new, but the sweep of Kansas’ statute is breathtaking. Any government employee is given explicit permission to discriminate against gay couples—not just county clerks and DMV employees, but literally anyone who works for the state of Kansas. If a gay couple calls the police, an officer may refuse to help them if interacting with a gay couple violates his religious principles. State hospitals can turn away gay couples at the door and deny them treatment with impunity. Gay couples can be banned from public parks, public pools, anything that operates under the aegis of the Kansas state government.

HOUSE BILL No. 2453

The part about government employees is unconsitutional, as the government has to be neutral. If they limit it to private industries that are not of a mandatory nature, I'm good with it.

 

[martybegan]

Interesting how states have public accomodation laws on the books, but if they are used by gay citizens, its suddenly the gays' fault. We're only about 5% of the population....how DID we get these laws passed anywho????

They don't care about the laws until they apply to the gays...

Because it seems gays are litigeous assholes.

 

[Seawytch]

Interesting how states have public accomodation laws on the books, but if they are used by gay citizens, its suddenly the gays' fault. We're only about 5% of the population....how DID we get these laws passed anywho????

They don't care about the laws until they apply to the gays...

Because it seems gays are litigeous assholes.

Right...because a STATE sued a baker "the gheys" are litigious assholes.

Do we have these laws because blacks, women, religious folks and cripples are litigious assholes too?

 

[martybegan]

And they can continue practicing that way. For example no Pope will ever condone gay marriage and that's fine.

again, should a lesbian couple be able to force a baker to bake a cake for their wedding? No ramblings about a glorious future where this won't even be an issue. Yes, or No.

[MENTION=23094]martybegan[/MENTION]

Yes. That precedent has been established and will continue to be upheld. If their business operates in the public domain they cannot discriminate based on race, religion, or sexual preference.

These are excerpts from the Judge's statement on last year's Colorado case:

"Respondents’ refusal to provide a cake for Complainants’ same-sex wedding is distinctly the type of conduct that the Supreme Court has repeatedly found subject to legitimate regulation. Such discrimination is against the law; it adversely affects the rights of Complainants to be free from discrimination in the marketplace; and the impact upon Respondents is incidental to the state’s legitimate regulation of commercial activity. Respondents therefore have no valid claim that barring them from discriminating against same-sex customers violates their right to free exercise of religion. Conceptually, Respondents’ refusal to serve a same-sex couple due to religious objection to same-sex weddings is no different from refusing to serve a biracial couple because of religious objection to biracial marriage. However, that argument was struck down long ago in Bob Jones Univ. v. United States."

"Respondents argue that if they are compelled to make a cake for a same-sex wedding, then a black baker could not refuse to make a cake bearing a white-supremacist message for a member of the Aryan Nation; and an Islamic baker could not refuse to make a cake denigrating the Koran for the Westboro Baptist Church. However, neither of these fanciful hypothetical situations proves Respondents’ point. In both cases, it is the explicit, unmistakable, offensive message that the bakers are asked to put on the cake that gives rise to the bakers’ free speech right to refuse. That, however, is not the case here, where Respodnents refused to bake any cake for Complainants regardless of what was written on it or what it looked like. Respondents have no free speech right to refuse because they were only asked to bake a cake, not make a speech."

I'm assuming your response will be that the government will try to force Churches to conduct gay weddings. That has happened in some countries in Europe but they are not America. America has rights set aside for Churches that cannot be infringed upon which is why religious institutions are right now winning in the courts against some of Obamacare's provisions.

Bakeries are not Churches.

That judge is wrong, and is an asshole.

 

[Seawytch]

So a lesbian couple has a right to force a baker to bake a cake for them?

Yes, in some states they do, they're called public accommodation laws. It's the same law that says I have to bake a cake for you.

But not requiring a baker to bake a cake isn't the only thing the Kansas bill would have done.

In addition to barring all anti-discrimination lawsuits against private employers, the new law permits government employees to deny service to gays in the name of “religious liberty.” This is nothing new, but the sweep of Kansas’ statute is breathtaking. Any government employee is given explicit permission to discriminate against gay couples—not just county clerks and DMV employees, but literally anyone who works for the state of Kansas. If a gay couple calls the police, an officer may refuse to help them if interacting with a gay couple violates his religious principles. State hospitals can turn away gay couples at the door and deny them treatment with impunity. Gay couples can be banned from public parks, public pools, anything that operates under the aegis of the Kansas state government.

HOUSE BILL No. 2453

The part about government employees is unconsitutional, as the government has to be neutral. If they limit it to private industries that are not of a mandatory nature, I'm good with it.

But they didn't. They didn't even try to hide the animus in this law.

And I still wouldn't be "good with it" because you get to discriminate and I don't.

 

[blackhawk]

Can you answer the very simple question: how does a gay marriage threaten a heterosexual marriage?

I have never claimed it did gay marriage is not now and never has been a major concern of mine this will no doubt screw up your talking points sorry about that.

So then normal people can count on you to help educate other Conservatives about the fact that gay marriage doesn't effect their lives at all in any possible way other than from their own fear and imagination?

Let me start by educating you opposing gay marriage does mean a person is not normal it simply means they have a different view usually based on their religious faith as for me if people ask why I feel the way I do about gay marriage I will tell them I don't however try and force my personal views on people or insinuate they are not normal for not believing as I do.

 

[blackhawk]

I have never claimed it did gay marriage is not now and never has been a major concern of mine this will no doubt screw up your talking points sorry about that.

So then normal people can count on you to help educate other Conservatives about the fact that gay marriage doesn't effect their lives at all in any possible way other than from their own fear and imagination?

Me thinks you just screwed up his talking points. Good work.

Funny coming from the king of talking points.

 

[martybegan]

Yes, in some states they do, they're called public accommodation laws. It's the same law that says I have to bake a cake for you.

But not requiring a baker to bake a cake isn't the only thing the Kansas bill would have done.

In addition to barring all anti-discrimination lawsuits against private employers, the new law permits government employees to deny service to gays in the name of “religious liberty.” This is nothing new, but the sweep of Kansas’ statute is breathtaking. Any government employee is given explicit permission to discriminate against gay couples—not just county clerks and DMV employees, but literally anyone who works for the state of Kansas. If a gay couple calls the police, an officer may refuse to help them if interacting with a gay couple violates his religious principles. State hospitals can turn away gay couples at the door and deny them treatment with impunity. Gay couples can be banned from public parks, public pools, anything that operates under the aegis of the Kansas state government.

HOUSE BILL No. 2453

The part about government employees is unconsitutional, as the government has to be neutral. If they limit it to private industries that are not of a mandatory nature, I'm good with it.

But they didn't. They didn't even try to hide the animus in this law.

And I still wouldn't be "good with it" because you get to discriminate and I don't.

Then strike down ANY and ALL public accomodation laws, except for governmental services and nessasary services then we are all good.

 

[Seawytch]

The part about government employees is unconsitutional, as the government has to be neutral. If they limit it to private industries that are not of a mandatory nature, I'm good with it.

But they didn't. They didn't even try to hide the animus in this law.

And I still wouldn't be "good with it" because you get to discriminate and I don't.

Then strike down ANY and ALL public accomodation laws, except for governmental services and nessasary services then we are all good.

And yet nobody anywhere is doing that...just for the icky gays.

Fill the pool, so the black kids can't swim. Do it already.

 

[Nyvin]

The part about government employees is unconsitutional, as the government has to be neutral. If they limit it to private industries that are not of a mandatory nature, I'm good with it.

But they didn't. They didn't even try to hide the animus in this law.

And I still wouldn't be "good with it" because you get to discriminate and I don't.

Then strike down ANY and ALL public accomodation laws, except for governmental services and nessasary services then we are all good.

Why stop there? Just strike down the 1964 civil rights act...That's obviously moving in the right direction huh?

 

[martybegan]

But they didn't. They didn't even try to hide the animus in this law.

And I still wouldn't be "good with it" because you get to discriminate and I don't.

Then strike down ANY and ALL public accomodation laws, except for governmental services and nessasary services then we are all good.

And yet nobody anywhere is doing that...just for the icky gays.

Fill the pool, so the black kids can't swim. Do it already.

Look at seabitch, getting all racist and shit.

 

[Stephanie]

All this stupid over a cake

the non gheys need protection from them

they are so intolerant and militant...they think they should be special

 

[martybegan]

But they didn't. They didn't even try to hide the animus in this law.

And I still wouldn't be "good with it" because you get to discriminate and I don't.

Then strike down ANY and ALL public accomodation laws, except for governmental services and nessasary services then we are all good.

Why stop there? Just strike down the 1964 civil rights act...That's obviously moving in the right direction huh?

No, because governments need to be neutral with respect to all parties. and certain industries need to be neutral due to their mandatory nature, things like gas stations, grocery stores, and utilities.

There is no benefit to society in forcing people to provide services to gay weddings, same as there is no benefit in forcing a black bakery to provide cakes for a KKK rally.

 

[The Rabbi]

They don't care about the laws until they apply to the gays...

Because it seems gays are litigeous assholes.

Right...because a STATE sued a baker "the gheys" are litigious assholes.

Do we have these laws because blacks, women, religious folks and cripples are litigious assholes too?

Because the state has listeners in every business, right?
No, the faggots made a complaint to the state's equality board or whatever agency oversees civil rights and made a big enough stink they went and investigated and brought charges. That's hwo these things work. Or can we add that to the myriad of things you dont know?

 

[Jarhead]

They don't care about the laws until they apply to the gays...

Because it seems gays are litigeous assholes.

Right...because a STATE sued a baker "the gheys" are litigious assholes.

Do we have these laws because blacks, women, religious folks and cripples are litigious assholes too?

challenged. They prefer to be deemed as physically challenged. Not cripples.
Unless they are midgets.

 

[Bombur]

Gay marriage is a great thing for the gay community as it helps establish long term loving relationships as the ideal. They have been shunned for so long by those who find it easier to hate their neighbor than to love them. It has been a horrible sin on the part of mainstream society but those days are numbered. The side of hate will not go without a fight. They will hide behind all sorts of excuses for their behavior but in the end they will go down as just another example of human kind's failings.

So why can gays not get married now, in all 57 states, plus Alaska, Hawaii and 2 others? Nothing is preventing them from having marriage ceremonies.

They are getting married. They are also being shunned and pushed out of society by those who find it easier to hate their neighbor than love them.

The government has no right to perpetuate this discrimination and has an obligation to protect them from discriminatory treatment.

 

[Stephanie]

Gay marriage is a great thing for the gay community as it helps establish long term loving relationships as the ideal. They have been shunned for so long by those who find it easier to hate their neighbor than to love them. It has been a horrible sin on the part of mainstream society but those days are numbered. The side of hate will not go without a fight. They will hide behind all sorts of excuses for their behavior but in the end they will go down as just another example of human kind's failings.

So why can gays not get married now, in all 57 states, plus Alaska, Hawaii and 2 others? Nothing is preventing them from having marriage ceremonies.

They are getting married. They are also being shunned and pushed out of society by those who find it easier to hate their neighbor than love them.

The government has no right to perpetuate this discrimination and has an obligation to protect them from discriminatory treatment.

wow are you for real?

 

[The Rabbi]

Gay marriage is a great thing for the gay community as it helps establish long term loving relationships as the ideal. They have been shunned for so long by those who find it easier to hate their neighbor than to love them. It has been a horrible sin on the part of mainstream society but those days are numbered. The side of hate will not go without a fight. They will hide behind all sorts of excuses for their behavior but in the end they will go down as just another example of human kind's failings.

So why can gays not get married now, in all 57 states, plus Alaska, Hawaii and 2 others? Nothing is preventing them from having marriage ceremonies.

They are getting married. They are also being shunned and pushed out of society by those who find it easier to hate their neighbor than love them.

The government has no right to perpetuate this discrimination and has an obligation to protect them from discriminatory treatment.

So if they're getting married, what's the big deal?
Can you show widespread shunning and pushing out of society? No, you cannot. There is no discrimination. It is a myth.

 

[Jarhead]

Gay marriage is a great thing for the gay community as it helps establish long term loving relationships as the ideal. They have been shunned for so long by those who find it easier to hate their neighbor than to love them. It has been a horrible sin on the part of mainstream society but those days are numbered. The side of hate will not go without a fight. They will hide behind all sorts of excuses for their behavior but in the end they will go down as just another example of human kind's failings.

So why can gays not get married now, in all 57 states, plus Alaska, Hawaii and 2 others? Nothing is preventing them from having marriage ceremonies.

They are getting married. They are also being shunned and pushed out of society by those who find it easier to hate their neighbor than love them.

The government has no right to perpetuate this discrimination and has an obligation to protect them from discriminatory treatment.

Yes.

Give it time.

People will ultimately get it.

 

[Jarhead]

So why can gays not get married now, in all 57 states, plus Alaska, Hawaii and 2 others? Nothing is preventing them from having marriage ceremonies.

They are getting married. They are also being shunned and pushed out of society by those who find it easier to hate their neighbor than love them.

The government has no right to perpetuate this discrimination and has an obligation to protect them from discriminatory treatment.

wow are you for real?

I bet you would feel differently if you were gay.

Not being gay and having grown up in a society where it was considered "taboo", it took me time to get it.

But I do.