Trump Pardons Convicted War Criminals

[RealDave]

Now, just to show I am fair, I really don't have a problem with this....

Handing out murder convictions in a war zone is like handing out speeding tickets at the Indy 500.

Trump Pardons 2 Service Members Accused Of War Crimes And Restores Another's Rank

President Trump has issued pardons for two Army officers accused of war crimes in Afghanistan and restored the rank of a Navy SEAL who was acquitted of murder in Iraq.

"For more than two hundred years, presidents have used their authority to offer second chances to deserving individuals, including those in uniform who have served our country," said White House Press Secretary Stephanie Grisham in a statement released late Friday. "These actions are in keeping with this long history."

The officers include 1st Lt. Clint Lorance who has served six years of a 19-year sentence on two charges of second-degree murder and obstruction of justice after ordering his soldiers to open fire on three unarmed men in Afghanistan, killing two of them. He had been convicted in 2013.

The other pardoned officer is Maj. Matthew Golsteyn, a West Point graduate, who was awaiting trial for allegedly murdering a suspected Afghan bombmaker in 2010. The trial was scheduled for next year.

Obama trades 5 top terrorists for 1 deserter

They weren't top terrorists. Until proven otherwise, the soldier was captured. Are we supposed to abandon our soldiers based on rumors?

Evidently war is a valid excuse to drive a soldier to murder but war is not an excuse to become mentally ill.

 

[SavannahMann]

In another thread on this issue I wrote something like this.

I agree with the charges, and believe the convictions were earned. I also absolutely agree that the President has the right to pardon any damned person he or she wants. It is in the Constitution that the President has the right. I don’t have to agree. It isn’t up to me. Nowhere in any of the Constitutional Writings does it say I have to agree, or I get a say. I don’t. I will defend the right of any President, no matter which political party, to use the powers granted by the Constitution legally.

The political, I don’t care. Trump could pardon everyone in Prison, or who had been in prison, and I wouldn’t care. There are a lot of people I think should be pardoned, but won’t be.

 

[CowboyTed]

Now, just to show I am fair, I really don't have a problem with this....

Handing out murder convictions in a war zone is like handing out speeding tickets at the Indy 500.

Trump Pardons 2 Service Members Accused Of War Crimes And Restores Another's Rank

President Trump has issued pardons for two Army officers accused of war crimes in Afghanistan and restored the rank of a Navy SEAL who was acquitted of murder in Iraq.

"For more than two hundred years, presidents have used their authority to offer second chances to deserving individuals, including those in uniform who have served our country," said White House Press Secretary Stephanie Grisham in a statement released late Friday. "These actions are in keeping with this long history."

The officers include 1st Lt. Clint Lorance who has served six years of a 19-year sentence on two charges of second-degree murder and obstruction of justice after ordering his soldiers to open fire on three unarmed men in Afghanistan, killing two of them. He had been convicted in 2013.

The other pardoned officer is Maj. Matthew Golsteyn, a West Point graduate, who was awaiting trial for allegedly murdering a suspected Afghan bombmaker in 2010. The trial was scheduled for next year.

There is a difference between what happens in combat and what happens when you have people captive.

I know we are the good guys, we are on the side of truth, justice and the American Way. What OUR guys do is excusable.

But there is a Golden Rule, treat others like you want to be treated

Other countries think they are right too. If we look the other way when our soldiers cross the line, we have no right to expect others to not do the same in protecting American captives

I tried to explain to them they are for killing US soldiers in captive..

 

[rightwinger]

But there is a Golden Rule, treat others like you want to be treated

Other countries think they are right too. If we look the other way when our soldiers cross the line, we have no right to expect others to not do the same in protecting American captives

The Rules of Engagement forced on our fighting men forced them into untenable situations. Those rules have been changed by President Donald Trump and he has pardoned men convicted of things that are no longer against the rules.

As for the Golden Rule in the field of battle, I'm with you 100%!

Exactly

Because we are the good guys and when the good guys do it, it is OK

As long as we can claim to be better than ISIS we have the moral high ground. It might not be a very high ground, but as long as we are not chopping off heads, nobody can complain

 

[rightwinger]

Now, just to show I am fair, I really don't have a problem with this....

Handing out murder convictions in a war zone is like handing out speeding tickets at the Indy 500.

Trump Pardons 2 Service Members Accused Of War Crimes And Restores Another's Rank

President Trump has issued pardons for two Army officers accused of war crimes in Afghanistan and restored the rank of a Navy SEAL who was acquitted of murder in Iraq.

"For more than two hundred years, presidents have used their authority to offer second chances to deserving individuals, including those in uniform who have served our country," said White House Press Secretary Stephanie Grisham in a statement released late Friday. "These actions are in keeping with this long history."

The officers include 1st Lt. Clint Lorance who has served six years of a 19-year sentence on two charges of second-degree murder and obstruction of justice after ordering his soldiers to open fire on three unarmed men in Afghanistan, killing two of them. He had been convicted in 2013.

The other pardoned officer is Maj. Matthew Golsteyn, a West Point graduate, who was awaiting trial for allegedly murdering a suspected Afghan bombmaker in 2010. The trial was scheduled for next year.

There is a difference between what happens in combat and what happens when you have people captive.

I know we are the good guys, we are on the side of truth, justice and the American Way. What OUR guys do is excusable.

But there is a Golden Rule, treat others like you want to be treated

Other countries think they are right too. If we look the other way when our soldiers cross the line, we have no right to expect others to not do the same in protecting American captives

I tried to explain to them they are for killing US soldiers in captive..

N Vietnam also had a moral high ground

Our pilots were dropping napalm, hitting civilian targets, destroying dams needed for irrigation.

As far as N Vietnam was concerned, these men were war criminals worthy of torturing to death unless they gave up military secrets.

Japan and Germany had the same claim in WWII. Yet, after WWII we prosecuted for war crimes. Now, we have no way of complaining about the treatment of our POWs

 

[Paulie]

Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

The Orange Creature may actually have been right about this.

Imagine what else he’s right about

 

[sparky]

Because we are the good guys and when the good guys do it, it is OK

We used to do the VA run, mostly transferes, (no lights/siren) , which was an hour away for the aging vets, not much more than a taxi ride w/vitals. We were also supposed to 'keep 'em talkin' , in order to assess their mentation, on short we were no more than bartenders w/stethoscopes.

Often it was, when did you serve? where did you go? what did you do?

And just as often, we'd be getting the death bed confessionals .....

Some were very stark dark admissions that, they probably told nobody in decades , not their families, wives, kids, no one...

I couldn't help but think they did what they had to do, in situations most of us just could not comprehend.

~S~

 

[Kondor3]

Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

The Orange Creature may actually have been right about this.

Imagine what else he’s right about

As well as Immigration and Trade... yessir-ree-bob... a regular Three-Trick Orange Pony...

 

[Paulie]

Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

The Orange Creature may actually have been right about this.

Imagine what else he’s right about

As well as Immigration and Trade... yessir-ree-bob... a regular Three-Trick Orange Pony...

We haven’t had a president that’s been right about those things for decades. Enjoy it.

 

[Kondor3]

...We haven’t had a president that’s been right about those things for decades. Enjoy it.

Trouble is, the Orange Baboon is sssooooo frigging problematic in other areas, that he ends-up just not being worth the price.

And, in those areas where he IS actually right, he's so frigging clue-less about how to properly execute those policies that he's ineffective.

Bottom line: he looked halfway-good on paper but has proven to be a mortifying embarrassment and crushing political liability.

Time to cut the dead weight in the White House: through Impeachment or the Ballot Box... soon... before he can do more damage.

 

[Paulie]

^^^

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Back in the day People like Bradley Manning would of been shot as a spy for revealing classified information, but in Obama's presidency even the sick bitch was passing classified info around and she is still walking.. She should be shot also. [The sick bitch is the wife of Bill "the Rapist" Clinton]

What day was that?

Manning revealled information the Army was hiding from the American People, not the enemy.

So you are okay with spies in the military?

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

...We haven’t had a president that’s been right about those things for decades. Enjoy it.

Trouble is, the Orange Baboon is sssooooo frigging problematic in other areas, that he ends-up just not being worth the price.

And, in those areas where he IS actually right, he's so frigging clue-less about how to properly execute those policies that he's ineffective.

Bottom line: he looked halfway-good on paper but has proven to be a mortifying embarrassment and crushing political liability.

Time to cut the dead weight in the White House: through Impeachment or the Ballot Box... soon... before he can do more damage.

clue-less about how to properly execute those policies

ISIS is dead, the leaders of ISIS is dead. The economy is roaring, most ever employed by blacks, latinos and women. The wall being built in the southern border, yep The Brown Turn Obama could only dream of a magic wand that President Trump is using. Takes a man to be president not a queer and his tranny buddy.

 

[Seawytch]

Except there is a reason they are called war crimes. Should we not have tried Nazis at Nuremburg? Remember the Japanese we charged with war crimes for waterboarding?

And these guys weren't even charged by another country, but their own.

I don't think anything these guys did should be considered war crimes. In a moment of stress, they maybe made bad decisions. I made all sorts of bad decisions when I was a young Sergeant, but none of them got people killed.

We put young men in these impossible situations, some of them are going to make bad decisions.

I should also point out, the vast majority of people who commited war crimes for the Axis never saw a jail cell or any justice.

Some of them even worked their way back into polite society in Germany and Japan.

Torturing and murdering a captured prisoner isn't something that just happened in the heat of battle.

And the vast majority of war crimes still aren't prosecuted...doesn't mean we stop trying.

 

[Seawytch]

Except there is a reason they are called war crimes. Should we not have tried Nazis at Nuremburg? Remember the Japanese we charged with war crimes for waterboarding?

And these guys weren't even charged by another country, but their own.

As you know, waterboarding was an incidental element of the charges against the Japanese. They were guilty of far more barbaric treatment of our prisoners.

So? Doesn't make it less of a crime.

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Except there is a reason they are called war crimes. Should we not have tried Nazis at Nuremburg? Remember the Japanese we charged with war crimes for waterboarding?

And these guys weren't even charged by another country, but their own.

I don't think anything these guys did should be considered war crimes. In a moment of stress, they maybe made bad decisions. I made all sorts of bad decisions when I was a young Sergeant, but none of them got people killed.

We put young men in these impossible situations, some of them are going to make bad decisions.

I should also point out, the vast majority of people who commited war crimes for the Axis never saw a jail cell or any justice.

Some of them even worked their way back into polite society in Germany and Japan.

Torturing and murdering a captured prisoner isn't something that just happened in the heat of battle.

And the vast majority of war crimes still aren't prosecuted...doesn't mean we stop trying.

Have you been in the military? Do you know Terrorists arent covered in the Geneva Convention and if one Terrorist got his hands on you, you would be so tortured that you would pray for death? I know how much you lefties hate the US and our military, why dont you move to Egypt or Libya and spend some time with your Mooooslim Buddies?

 

[rightwinger]

Except there is a reason they are called war crimes. Should we not have tried Nazis at Nuremburg? Remember the Japanese we charged with war crimes for waterboarding?

And these guys weren't even charged by another country, but their own.

I don't think anything these guys did should be considered war crimes. In a moment of stress, they maybe made bad decisions. I made all sorts of bad decisions when I was a young Sergeant, but none of them got people killed.

We put young men in these impossible situations, some of them are going to make bad decisions.

I should also point out, the vast majority of people who commited war crimes for the Axis never saw a jail cell or any justice.

Some of them even worked their way back into polite society in Germany and Japan.

Torturing and murdering a captured prisoner isn't something that just happened in the heat of battle.

And the vast majority of war crimes still aren't prosecuted...doesn't mean we stop trying.

Have you been in the military? Do you know Terrorists arent covered in the Geneva Convention and if one Terrorist got his hands on you, you would be so tortured that you would pray for death? I know how much you lefties hate the US and our military, why dont you move to Egypt or Libya and spend some time with your Mooooslim Buddies?

Link

 

[Seawytch]

Except there is a reason they are called war crimes. Should we not have tried Nazis at Nuremburg? Remember the Japanese we charged with war crimes for waterboarding?

And these guys weren't even charged by another country, but their own.

I don't think anything these guys did should be considered war crimes. In a moment of stress, they maybe made bad decisions. I made all sorts of bad decisions when I was a young Sergeant, but none of them got people killed.

We put young men in these impossible situations, some of them are going to make bad decisions.

I should also point out, the vast majority of people who commited war crimes for the Axis never saw a jail cell or any justice.

Some of them even worked their way back into polite society in Germany and Japan.

Torturing and murdering a captured prisoner isn't something that just happened in the heat of battle.

And the vast majority of war crimes still aren't prosecuted...doesn't mean we stop trying.

Have you been in the military? Do you know Terrorists arent covered in the Geneva Convention and if one Terrorist got his hands on you, you would be so tortured that you would pray for death? I know how much you lefties hate the US and our military, why dont you move to Egypt or Libya and spend some time with your Mooooslim Buddies?

20 years and retired. You're welcome.

It doesn't matter if "terrorists" are covered or not. We signed. When we start acting like them, they really do win.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

What better way to end a conflict show no mercy and the enemy will stop fighting. If we can't get to you we'll get your family and anyone connected to them lol
A tactic Sherman used

yet today there are still some inbreds who are flying Confederate flags.... so maybe what Sherman did wasn't such a good idea.

Says an inbread

What kind of bread?

 

[Seawytch]

And, yes, terrorists ARE protected under the Geneva convention.

What undercuts the accuracy of Cheney’s claim, however, is a different part of what he said. It’s misleading for him to say that such combatants are "not covered by the Geneva Convention." While detainees who do not have POW status don’t get the top level of protection, they do get more basic protections from the Geneva Conventions.

And glossing over those less-stringent protections hides an important point: Even the lower level of protection would have shielded detainees, at least on paper, against some of the harsh treatments now alleged in the Senate report.

Experts pointed us to identical passages in each of the four conventions, known as "Common Article 3."

Among other things"prohibited at any time and in any place whatsoever" by Common Article 3 are "violence to life and person, in particular murder of all kinds, mutilation, cruel treatment and torture" as well as "outrages upon personal dignity, in particular humiliating and degrading treatment."

In other words, despite the implications from what Cheney said, even unlawful combatants "have minimum protections under the Geneva Conventions," Richard D. Rosen, director of the Center for Military Law & Policy at Texas Tech University Law School.
​

In wake of Senate report, Dick Cheney says terrorists 'not covered by the Geneva Convention'