Trump Seeks To Calm Markets

[Ray From Cleveland]

I wouldn’t go that far. The stock market isn’t completely unrelated to the economy but it is prone to skittish behavior like we are seeing. Just because the market tanks does not necessarily mean we are in recession.

Losing over 2,000 points in one day isn't "skittish." Not after steady overall losses for two weeks.

Maybe I’m just really out of the loop but I haven’t really seen any actual economic data to explain such sharp losses.

Which is why I would label it as skittish. They’re operating of fear rather than data.

didn't they say yesterday's drop was due to the drop in oil prices?

Yes, China and Russia are in an oil war right now.

That makes no sense to me?! Its like two billionaires arguing who is burning a bigger pile of cash?? WTF??

To be totally honest, I didn't dig up any stories on it yet. I'm only going by what's being reported on the news. We got hit with the double whammy is all. Just really bad timing. What pisses me off is that I just filled up the other day, and it's likely to last me several weeks. Lower fuel prices will also help with the economy; a little more money in everybody's pocket.

 

[bendog]

I don't really care about short term indices but Chris Hayes, of all people, had an interesting analysis (through guests) about the effect of Trump's deficits coupled with already low rates and the corp debt especially of oil producers make the likelihood of a prolonged recession possible. I was thinking a worldwide coronavirus slowdown was at most 3 qtrs. But shedding debt, even if it's not at 2008 levels, would be about consistent with HW's recession.

 

[Natural Citizen]

There was no economic weakness before the virus hit.

That 23 trillion dollar can of debt they're kickin down the road says otherwise. As does that 4 cents on the dollar worth of purchasing power.

Whatever, though.

Proceed. lol.

 

[OldLady]

Pretty much.

I've never understood the connection people make with the stock market and the economy. It's baffling to me. The stock market doesn't in any way reflect the actual economy. The stock market is completely counterfeit.

I wouldn’t go that far. The stock market isn’t completely unrelated to the economy but it is prone to skittish behavior like we are seeing. Just because the market tanks does not necessarily mean we are in recession.

Losing over 2,000 points in one day isn't "skittish." Not after steady overall losses for two weeks.

Maybe I’m just really out of the loop but I haven’t really seen any actual economic data to explain such sharp losses.

Which is why I would label it as skittish. They’re operating of fear rather than data.

didn't they say yesterday's drop was due to the drop in oil prices?

The drop in oil prices was a direct result of the drop in trade due to the coronavirus.

Oh. And other oil producing countries said let's not screw everyone over by dropping prices, but Saudi Arabia did it anyway--I heard it was them waging economic war on Russia--I don't know what that's all about, but I have read it.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

I suspect the stock market will react positively to this development. I hope so.

Stocks are rallying in the final hour of trading as Wall Street measures fiscal stimulus prospects

Woo hoo!

What’s to celebrate exactly?

The Dow is surging. That's what. Bigly.

Surging seems like a dramatic way to put it.

Seems like an admission of economic weakness.

There was no economic weakness before the virus hit.
What we don't know is how the virus will affect earnings or stock prices.
Have a few weeks of tap dancing before we can say we're back to normal.

Now that is just stupid. If there had not been weakness the virus would not have had the effect it has.

 

[ABikerSailor]

You know, for all you people who are saying that this will go away when the warm weather hits would do yourselves good to check up on what happened with the Spanish Flu. Granted, it was pretty bad when it started, and it went away when the weather got warmer, but when it started to get cold again, it came back with a fury and was much worse the second time around.

People are saying that this will probably go away when warm weather hits and we can quit worrying. Only problem is, we don't know if it is going to come back, and we still don't have a vaccine for it.

 

[OldLady]

Pretty much.

I've never understood the connection people make with the stock market and the economy. It's baffling to me. The stock market doesn't in any way reflect the actual economy. The stock market is completely counterfeit.

I wouldn’t go that far. The stock market isn’t completely unrelated to the economy but it is prone to skittish behavior like we are seeing. Just because the market tanks does not necessarily mean we are in recession.

Losing over 2,000 points in one day isn't "skittish." Not after steady overall losses for two weeks.

Maybe I’m just really out of the loop but I haven’t really seen any actual economic data to explain such sharp losses.

Which is why I would label it as skittish. They’re operating of fear rather than data.

didn't they say yesterday's drop was due to the drop in oil prices?

Yes, China and Russia are in an oil war right now.

CHINA? How do the Saudi's factor in, then?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I wouldn’t go that far. The stock market isn’t completely unrelated to the economy but it is prone to skittish behavior like we are seeing. Just because the market tanks does not necessarily mean we are in recession.

Losing over 2,000 points in one day isn't "skittish." Not after steady overall losses for two weeks.

Maybe I’m just really out of the loop but I haven’t really seen any actual economic data to explain such sharp losses.

Which is why I would label it as skittish. They’re operating of fear rather than data.

didn't they say yesterday's drop was due to the drop in oil prices?

Yes, China and Russia are in an oil war right now.

CHINA? How do the Saudi's factor in, then?

I'm sorry, my mistake. I meant to say Saudi and Russia.

 

[bendog]

I wouldn’t go that far. The stock market isn’t completely unrelated to the economy but it is prone to skittish behavior like we are seeing. Just because the market tanks does not necessarily mean we are in recession.

Losing over 2,000 points in one day isn't "skittish." Not after steady overall losses for two weeks.

Maybe I’m just really out of the loop but I haven’t really seen any actual economic data to explain such sharp losses.

Which is why I would label it as skittish. They’re operating of fear rather than data.

didn't they say yesterday's drop was due to the drop in oil prices?

The drop in oil prices was a direct result of the drop in trade due to the coronavirus.

Oh. And other oil producing countries said let's not screw everyone over by dropping prices, but Saudi Arabia did it anyway--I heard it was them waging economic war on Russia--I don't know what that's all about, but I have read it.

I'm not sure exactly what G5000 means but with Russia wanting drastic reductions in oil prices, coupled with a collapse in demand from a world wide economic contraction because of coronavirus tanking consumer buying EVERYWHERE, the Saudis threw in the towel on trying to keep the price up

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

You know, for all you people who are saying that this will go away when the warm weather hits would do yourselves good to check up on what happened with the Spanish Flu. Granted, it was pretty bad when it started, and it went away when the weather got warmer, but when it started to get cold again, it came back with a fury and was much worse the second time around.

People are saying that this will probably go away when warm weather hits and we can quit worrying. Only problem is, we don't know if it is going to come back, and we still don't have a vaccine for it.

Actually, we do have a vaccine for it, but it has to go through the government red tape before it's marketed. When a new drug is put out on the market, you can't say it worked on a couple of animals, so it's ready to go. It may be out by the end of the year is what one physical said that's dealing with this matter. I forget now which show it was on, but it was either on Hannity last night or Laura's show.

 

[OldLady]

Losing over 2,000 points in one day isn't "skittish." Not after steady overall losses for two weeks.

Maybe I’m just really out of the loop but I haven’t really seen any actual economic data to explain such sharp losses.

Which is why I would label it as skittish. They’re operating of fear rather than data.

didn't they say yesterday's drop was due to the drop in oil prices?

The drop in oil prices was a direct result of the drop in trade due to the coronavirus.

Oh. And other oil producing countries said let's not screw everyone over by dropping prices, but Saudi Arabia did it anyway--I heard it was them waging economic war on Russia--I don't know what that's all about, but I have read it.

I'm not sure exactly what G5000 means but with Russia wanting drastic reductions in oil prices, coupled with a collapse in demand from a world wide economic contraction because of coronavirus tanking consumer buying EVERYWHERE, the Saudis threw in the towel on trying to keep the price up

Hmmmm.....another perspective noted.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

I'm not sure exactly what G5000 means but with Russia wanting drastic reductions in oil prices, coupled with a collapse in demand from a world wide economic contraction because of coronavirus tanking consumer buying EVERYWHERE, the Saudis threw in the towel on trying to keep the price up

Wow, did you ever read that wrong. The Saudis are happy with a price cut for a while. They have the means to survive it. Russia not so much and our companies squeezing oil out of shale not so much. If the price goes low enough oil produced from shale is being sold at less than it cost to produce it.

 

[colfax_m]

The stock market isn’t the economy. It’s a casino.

Pretty much.

I've never understood the connection people make with the stock market and the economy. It's baffling to me. The stock market doesn't in any way reflect the actual economy. The stock market is completely counterfeit.

I wouldn’t go that far. The stock market isn’t completely unrelated to the economy but it is prone to skittish behavior like we are seeing. Just because the market tanks does not necessarily mean we are in recession.

Losing over 2,000 points in one day isn't "skittish." Not after steady overall losses for two weeks.

Maybe I’m just really out of the loop but I haven’t really seen any actual economic data to explain such sharp losses.

Which is why I would label it as skittish. They’re operating of fear rather than data.

didn't they say yesterday's drop was due to the drop in oil prices?

Oil prices aren’t much different than stock prices, no?

 

[colfax_m]

I suspect the stock market will react positively to this development. I hope so.

Stocks are rallying in the final hour of trading as Wall Street measures fiscal stimulus prospects

Woo hoo!

What’s to celebrate exactly?

The Dow is surging. That's what. Bigly.

Surging seems like a dramatic way to put it.

Seems like an admission of economic weakness.

There was no economic weakness before the virus hit.
What we don't know is how the virus will affect earnings or stock prices.
Have a few weeks of tap dancing before we can say we're back to normal.

Which is why I think it’s very premature to talk stimulus. If the economy is strong, we don’t need a stimulus. We just need the virus to go away.

 

[kyzr]

There was no economic weakness before the virus hit.

That 23 trillion dollar can of debt they're kickin down the road says otherwise. As does that 4 cents on the dollar worth of purchasing power.

Whatever, though.

Proceed. lol.

You're whining to the choir. Nancy and the dems in the House didn't do anything to help the budget deficit did they?
Its all play money in the District of Criminals. Helicopter Ben on steroids.

 

[kyzr]

Stocks are rallying in the final hour of trading as Wall Street measures fiscal stimulus prospects

Woo hoo!

What’s to celebrate exactly?

The Dow is surging. That's what. Bigly.

Surging seems like a dramatic way to put it.

Seems like an admission of economic weakness.

There was no economic weakness before the virus hit.
What we don't know is how the virus will affect earnings or stock prices.
Have a few weeks of tap dancing before we can say we're back to normal.

Which is why I think it’s very premature to talk stimulus. If the economy is strong, we don’t need a stimulus. We just need the virus to go away.

Its more of a "do something" than a "wait and see do nothing". Throwing money around helps them get re-elected.

 

[bendog]

I'm not sure exactly what G5000 means but with Russia wanting drastic reductions in oil prices, coupled with a collapse in demand from a world wide economic contraction because of coronavirus tanking consumer buying EVERYWHERE, the Saudis threw in the towel on trying to keep the price up

Wow, did you ever read that wrong. The Saudis are happy with a price cut for a while. They have the means to survive it. Russia not so much and our companies squeezing oil out of shale not so much. If the price goes low enough oil produced from shale is being sold at less than it cost to produce it.

Saudis Plan Big Oil Output Hike, Beginning All-Out Price War

 

[colfax_m]

What’s to celebrate exactly?

The Dow is surging. That's what. Bigly.

Surging seems like a dramatic way to put it.

Seems like an admission of economic weakness.

There was no economic weakness before the virus hit.
What we don't know is how the virus will affect earnings or stock prices.
Have a few weeks of tap dancing before we can say we're back to normal.

Which is why I think it’s very premature to talk stimulus. If the economy is strong, we don’t need a stimulus. We just need the virus to go away.

Its more of a "do something" than a "wait and see do nothing". Throwing money around helps them get re-elected.

So Trump is just trying to buy votes?

 

[Natural Citizen]

You're whining to the choir. Nancy and the dems in the House didn't do anything to help the budget deficit did they?
Its all play money in the District of Criminals. Helicopter Ben on steroids.

I wasn't whining. I was just making sure we're staying honest about it is all. People read this stuff, so to contend the economy was all rainbows and unicorns before some flu is intellectually dishonest.

I don't really do the blue helmets versus red helmets thing, though. They're all on the same team. During that impeachment charade, the dems gave Trump trillions to do everything he wanted. So much for the joke about opposing him. And there wasn't a peep around here about it from anyone until I mentioned it. And it still went ignored. And now Trump has introduced another 4.8 trillion dollar 2021 fiscal budget. The largest in American history. Again, not a peep around here about it until I mentioned it. Again ignored. Where's that money coming from? The Fed gonna open up their checkbook and write a hot check drawn on an account that has nothing in it in order to buy that debt from the banks after the banks go compete to purchase the debt at the next Treasury bond auction? What do you think that's gonna do to the dollar? What's it gonna do to the electorate's savings? Their purchasing power? I'll tell you what it's gonna do. It's gonna keep doing the same thing it's been doing to all of those things over the last 50 years. Destroying it. And last I checked, I'm the only choir singing that song around here. From where I'm standing people seem to avoid reality like the plague. lol.

Again. They're on the same team. Both sides of the party of one are trustees in a failed, socialist monetary policy. Both sides of the party of one have a belief in deficit finance. Both sides of the party of one have a belief in central economic planning by a central bank and a distaste for genuine free markets. Both sides of the party of one have a belief in a welfare/warfare state.

To make this about some flu or oil or dems and republicans is laughable. To repeat yet again, counterfeit money produces a counterfeit economy. A counterfeit economy is bolstered by counterfeit news. All of this leads to a counterfeit society, and America's counterfeit society is heading towards a disaster. The real problem is the Fed itself. The monetary policy itself. It's a complete distortion. But when the chickens come home to roost, and they are as we speak, it will be the natural market itself that decides that fate. Not the Fed. Not the government, no matter what color helmets they're wearing. All they can control is the printing press. And now they're demonstrating that they can't even do that. But this is predicatable. Never before in the history of man has a counterfeit fiat system lasted this long. They can't keep propping it up artificially. It's impossible. The market itself will ultimately be the decider. And we're almost there.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

I'm not sure exactly what G5000 means but with Russia wanting drastic reductions in oil prices, coupled with a collapse in demand from a world wide economic contraction because of coronavirus tanking consumer buying EVERYWHERE, the Saudis threw in the towel on trying to keep the price up

Wow, did you ever read that wrong. The Saudis are happy with a price cut for a while. They have the means to survive it. Russia not so much and our companies squeezing oil out of shale not so much. If the price goes low enough oil produced from shale is being sold at less than it cost to produce it.

Saudis Plan Big Oil Output Hike, Beginning All-Out Price War

Yep...add to that this...

Shale In Crisis As Oil Prices Collapse | OilPrice.com

For U.S. shale, a disaster lies ahead. The industry has been largely unprofitable to date, but had received several rounds of huge injections of capital in the last decade, most recently following the 2016 downturn. But by last year, investors had begun to sour on unprofitable shale drilling.