Unions say Obama is destroying the foundation of the 40-hour work week

[thereisnospoon]

I didnt know you were guaranteed 40 hours of work each week.

Nobody said 40 hours were guaranteed. But Obama is making sure they aren't even a possibility for many.

Do you think that the POTUS wants to harm people or do you think this may be an example of momentary discomfort to reach a better state for the American worker?

What makes you think ACA is for the betterment of the American worker?
My cost to insure is going to triple for the same coverage we have now. Unless of course we choose that shitty Bronze Plan which will leave us with 40% of the cost.
This is Obama's plan to increase dependency on government.
This is all part of the grand scheme to increase the base of democrat voters.
It all goes back to 'free shit'...The more people dependent on government, the more voters for those who provide 'free shit'...
Betterment of the American worker. MY ASS...

 

[thereisnospoon]

Do you think that the POTUS wants to harm people or do you think this may be an example of momentary discomfort to reach a better state for the American worker?

I think Barry is an illiterate in regards to business and economics, and a true believe in Big Government. His policies are utopian blather which cause a great deal of harm in the real world.

Interesting point of view. I thought we should strive to be as utopian as possible instead of the American worker continuing to get the shaft. I think after the dust has settled we will see a more informed American worker and lower healthcare costs.

You are indeed a dreamer.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Interesting point of view. I thought we should strive to be as utopian as possible instead of the American worker continuing to get the shaft. I think after the dust has settled we will see a more informed American worker and lower healthcare costs.

The road to ruin is paved with clueless utopian ideals.

The same thing could be said of those that are afraid of change.

What the hell is that supposed to mean?
One of the most dangerous of all human ideas is change for the sake of change.
How many bazillions of times does it take for people like you to realize that 'if it isn't broke, don't fix it' are words of very wise people?

 

[Asclepias]

Nobody said 40 hours were guaranteed. But Obama is making sure they aren't even a possibility for many.

Do you think that the POTUS wants to harm people or do you think this may be an example of momentary discomfort to reach a better state for the American worker?

What makes you think ACA is for the betterment of the American worker?
My cost to insure is going to triple for the same coverage we have now. Unless of course we choose that shitty Bronze Plan which will leave us with 40% of the cost.
This is Obama's plan to increase dependency on government.
This is all part of the grand scheme to increase the base of democrat voters.
It all goes back to 'free shit'...The more people dependent on government, the more voters for those who provide 'free shit'...
Betterment of the American worker. MY ASS...

Well if its going to screw the public I would think it would lose votes for the Dems. Did you ever consider that?

 

[Asclepias]

The road to ruin is paved with clueless utopian ideals.

The same thing could be said of those that are afraid of change.

What the hell is that supposed to mean?
One of the most dangerous of all human ideas is change for the sake of change.
How many bazillions of times does it take for people like you to realize that 'if it isn't broke, don't fix it' are words of very wise people?

It means that if you belong to the flat earth contingent you usually bring up the rear in the race to evolve.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Interesting point of view. I thought we should strive to be as utopian as possible instead of the American worker continuing to get the shaft. I think after the dust has settled we will see a more informed American worker and lower healthcare costs.

The road to ruin is paved with clueless utopian ideals.

The same thing could be said of those that are afraid of change.

It has become painfully obvious that those who support of Obamacare do so because they think something is in it for THEM...

 

[thereisnospoon]

Interesting point of view. I thought we should strive to be as utopian as possible instead of the American worker continuing to get the shaft. I think after the dust has settled we will see a more informed American worker and lower healthcare costs.

And passing a law that makes it more sensible to cut the hours of employees back to 20 hours isn't giving them the shaft?

Really?

Its only giving them the shaft if they decide to stay loyal to that business thats cutting their hours instead of the business cutting their profit margin. I found out long ago that there is a business principle that mandates the compensation you as an employee receive is roughly a 3rd of the profit your work generates.

The reduction of hours will eventually be across the board.
Jobs will be lost to automation. They will be lost to businesses closing up shop. Jobs will be lost to consolidation.
All because of increased costs due to ACA.

 

[Asclepias]

The road to ruin is paved with clueless utopian ideals.

The same thing could be said of those that are afraid of change.

It has become painfully obvious that those who support of Obamacare do so because they think something is in it for THEM...

Actually I already have my medical taken care of. i think its the necrotic part of our society that wishes people to not have access to affordable health care that constantly live in fear something new is going to hurt them.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Its only giving them the shaft if they decide to stay loyal to that business thats cutting their hours instead of the business cutting their profit margin. I found out long ago that there is a business principle that mandates the compensation you receive is roughly a 3rd of the profit your work generates.

Wow....You really aren't that bright at all.

When your labor costs go up beyond that 1/3, then it's the employee that takes the hit....Either that or prices get raised.

Like I asked in my first post on the topic, you really aren't so naive to believe that the employers were just going to eat the added costs, are you?

Initially no the employers wont want to eat it. They know that they can get people to work harder and for less. AS employees become more savvy and less loyal, the businesses will be forced to either hire more people or raise hours and wages. Prices wont go up past a certain point or they will price themselves out of business.

That's stupid. Everything is relative. All business will be under the same law. Business will do what it must to protect itself. Business owners will find ways around the ACA regulations. One of those is reducing hours so that employees are not eligible for ACA.
Small business with slightly more than 50 employees, will get that number below 50 so as to evade Obamacare. Mid sized firms will split up to form smaller companies which will reclassify them as small business.
Of course people on your side will scream from the roof tops that "business is being selfish. The business owner is screwing their workers!!!"...No, not at all. Business owners will do what they must to protect their investment and the jobs those investments create.
What's better, jobs where the hours are fewer? Or no jobs at all?

 

[Asclepias]

And passing a law that makes it more sensible to cut the hours of employees back to 20 hours isn't giving them the shaft?

Really?

Its only giving them the shaft if they decide to stay loyal to that business thats cutting their hours instead of the business cutting their profit margin. I found out long ago that there is a business principle that mandates the compensation you as an employee receive is roughly a 3rd of the profit your work generates.

The reduction of hours will eventually be across the board.
Jobs will be lost to automation. They will be lost to businesses closing up shop. Jobs will be lost to consolidation.
All because of increased costs due to ACA.

That was going to happen anyway with or without ACA. People dont seem to understand times are changing. Most business owners are only looking out for themselves and their shareholders. Just wait until all jobs become totally commision or partly commision based.

 

[Asclepias]

Wow....You really aren't that bright at all.

When your labor costs go up beyond that 1/3, then it's the employee that takes the hit....Either that or prices get raised.

Like I asked in my first post on the topic, you really aren't so naive to believe that the employers were just going to eat the added costs, are you?

Initially no the employers wont want to eat it. They know that they can get people to work harder and for less. AS employees become more savvy and less loyal, the businesses will be forced to either hire more people or raise hours and wages. Prices wont go up past a certain point or they will price themselves out of business.

That's stupid. Everything is relative. All business will be under the same law. Business will do what it must to protect itself. Business owners will find ways around the ACA regulations. One of those is reducing hours so that employees are not eligible for ACA.
Small business with slightly more than 50 employees, will get that number below 50 so as to evade Obamacare. Mid sized firms will split up to form smaller companies which will reclassify them as small business.
Of course people on your side will scream from the roof tops that "business is being selfish. The business owner is screwing their workers!!!"...No, not at all. Business owners will do what they must to protect their investment and the jobs those investments create.
What's better, jobs where the hours are fewer? Or no jobs at all?

I agree everything is relative. Everyone will adjust to the new reality including employers and employees. All this noise is just that...noise.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Pretty simple. 2 reasons.

There is a profit but it will be smaller.

They dont want to become an employee themselves because they know the game. The laws are written to give people every reason to be a business owner instead of an employee.

In the 25 years I've been in corporate management, management consulting and owned my own business, I have yet to meet any of these businesses that just eat taxes that you refer to. Any examples?

BTW, we got where we are because we're smarter than you are and no matter what you do, we will figure out a way to make you pay for your own stupid policies. No one got where i am by saying what you said, gosh, I'll just make less. If you're employed, pay attention to what your employer is doing to give your bills right back to you.

I happen to have a business partner that owns a string of hotels and he is extremely successful. He is onboard with this. If a billionaire is ok with this then I think I'm going to go with what he thinks. He goes above what is required. He pays for preschool for his employees children, he built some K-12 schools to educate the children, and He pays the tuition for the employees children when they go to college. Did i forget to say he was a billionaire?

Right...We believe you.
You pal around with billionaire.
Not only is this alleged billionaire successful.. He is EXTREMELY successful...Wow..I'm impressed...
Ever see the movie "Oceans 11"? When Terry Benedict says to Danny Ocean "you know a guy"....Then Danny still ends up back in the slammer?
That's because Mr Ocean was not credible. Get it?

 

[thereisnospoon]

They will if they want to stay in business. People will adjust to the new reality both employees and employers alike. Contrary to popular belief the sky is not falling.

Ah. So you support the policy of lower expectations for everyone.

Not that there was any doubt, but thank you for the refreshing honesty.

No. I actually believe in exceeding expectations instead of crying that the sky is falling. Sorry its my utopian side. Every massively successful person I know believes this is a time of opportunity. The cheese has moved. Better get to work finding it instead of complaining.

Utopia is not coming. There is no promised land.

 

[Asclepias]

In the 25 years I've been in corporate management, management consulting and owned my own business, I have yet to meet any of these businesses that just eat taxes that you refer to. Any examples?

BTW, we got where we are because we're smarter than you are and no matter what you do, we will figure out a way to make you pay for your own stupid policies. No one got where i am by saying what you said, gosh, I'll just make less. If you're employed, pay attention to what your employer is doing to give your bills right back to you.

I happen to have a business partner that owns a string of hotels and he is extremely successful. He is onboard with this. If a billionaire is ok with this then I think I'm going to go with what he thinks. He goes above what is required. He pays for preschool for his employees children, he built some K-12 schools to educate the children, and He pays the tuition for the employees children when they go to college. Did i forget to say he was a billionaire?

Right...We believe you.
You pal around with billionaire.
Not only is this alleged billionaire successful.. He is EXTREMELY successful...Wow..I'm impressed...
Ever see the movie "Oceans 11"? When Terry Benedict says to Danny Ocean "you know a guy"....Then Danny still ends up back in the slammer?
That's because Mr Ocean was not credible. Get it?

I understand your disbelief. I really dont mind. I just told the story to relay that the guy is onboard with it. If you choose to doubt it then thats your right.

 

[Asclepias]

Ah. So you support the policy of lower expectations for everyone.

Not that there was any doubt, but thank you for the refreshing honesty.

No. I actually believe in exceeding expectations instead of crying that the sky is falling. Sorry its my utopian side. Every massively successful person I know believes this is a time of opportunity. The cheese has moved. Better get to work finding it instead of complaining.

Utopia is not coming. There is no promised land.

Thats what all people say that are frightened and have given up.

 

[thereisnospoon]

I happen to have a business partner that owns a string of hotels and he is extremely successful. He is onboard with this. If a billionaire is ok with this then I think I'm going to go with what he thinks. He goes above what is required. He pays for preschool for his employees children, he built some K-12 schools to educate the children, and He pays the tuition for the employees children when they go to college. Did i forget to say he was a billionaire?

And yet Bill Gates and Warren Buffett evade taxes, did you know they are billionaires?

I do like your inability to distinguish charity from taxes though. I give a lot of money to charity. Paying taxes and government mandates aren't charity. Your friend is going to find a way to make his employees pay for their own health care if he is what you say he is. Being "on board" isn't the same as "I'll eat it."

No actually he already pays for their health care 100% He believes paying taxes is the price you pay for being able to be a capitalist.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7Arnq_moPY]It's Not a Lie if YOU Believe it - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Asclepias]

And yet Bill Gates and Warren Buffett evade taxes, did you know they are billionaires?

I do like your inability to distinguish charity from taxes though. I give a lot of money to charity. Paying taxes and government mandates aren't charity. Your friend is going to find a way to make his employees pay for their own health care if he is what you say he is. Being "on board" isn't the same as "I'll eat it."

No actually he already pays for their health care 100% He believes paying taxes is the price you pay for being able to be a capitalist.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7Arnq_moPY]It's Not a Lie if YOU Believe it - YouTube[/ame]

I would say that too if I didnt know any successful people.

 

[thereisnospoon]

No actually he already pays for their health care 100% He believes paying taxes is the price you pay for being able to be a capitalist.

This contradicts nothing that I said. Capitalists count the total cost of an employee. At GE we referred to it as the "loaded cost." Our budgets were charged a fixed percentage above their salaries and then corporate took care of their benefits. So for example if someone made $100K and their charge that year was 35%, our budget would be charged $135K.

Your friend isn't just eating the cost, he is calculating what his employees cost and paying them more in benefits as a part of that calculation. If he's not, he's probably your neighbor who hasn't left his apartment in 30 years and is telling you these stories because it's business 101.

I'm not trying to contradict what you are saying. I'm just saying youre wrong. People choose to do business in certain ways. You assertion that everything is going down the toilet because of higher taxes on business owners is ridiculous. There is a reason i only listen to wealthy business owners. You start buying peoples opinions you usually end up with their lifestyle

Just exactly what is your interest in supporting Obamacare? Expect to get it free off the backs of other taxpayers. do you?..Have a few relatives who are mooching off you and when Obamacare kicks in, you can finally get them the hell out of your house?
Or may be a couple boomerang kids you are sick of having gobble up a weeks worth of groceries by Tuesday of each week?
Either way, like I said, those who support Obamacare do so because they believe there is something in it for THEM..

 

[Asclepias]

This contradicts nothing that I said. Capitalists count the total cost of an employee. At GE we referred to it as the "loaded cost." Our budgets were charged a fixed percentage above their salaries and then corporate took care of their benefits. So for example if someone made $100K and their charge that year was 35%, our budget would be charged $135K.

Your friend isn't just eating the cost, he is calculating what his employees cost and paying them more in benefits as a part of that calculation. If he's not, he's probably your neighbor who hasn't left his apartment in 30 years and is telling you these stories because it's business 101.

I'm not trying to contradict what you are saying. I'm just saying youre wrong. People choose to do business in certain ways. You assertion that everything is going down the toilet because of higher taxes on business owners is ridiculous. There is a reason i only listen to wealthy business owners. You start buying peoples opinions you usually end up with their lifestyle

Just exactly what is your interest in supporting Obamacare? Expect to get it free off the backs of other taxpayers. do you?..Have a few relatives who are mooching off you and when Obamacare kicks in, you can finally get them the hell out of your house?
Or may be a couple boomerang kids you are sick of having gobble up a weeks worth of groceries by Tuesday of each week?
Either way, like I said, those who support Obamacare do so because they believe there is something in it for THEM..

My interest is in making sure people in our nation have health care. All of my family is employed or own businesses. it doesnt make sense that we didnt have this in place. Suck it up for the betterment of our nation. We can iron out the wrinkles as we go.

 

[syrenn]

Last month, leaders of three of the largest labor unions sent a scathing letter to Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) and House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-CA),
warning that if the problems with the insurance program are not addressed,
the new health care law will “shatter not only our hard-earned health benefits,
but destroy the foundation of the 40-hour work week that is the backbone of the American middle class.”

Why Organized Labor Is Organizing Against Obamacare | The Fiscal Times

So why the name "Affordable Care Act" if there are no jobs that can "afford care"???

aaawww..... the unions are reaping what they sowed. I hope this is their death knell