We are not going to let them take our businesses any longer. It's not going to happen.

[Moonglow]

By imposing tariffs on items manufactured abroad that make it uneconomical to continue to manufacture them abroad.

If you put a tariff on a nations goods that are imported,, what does that do to the prices of items you send to their nation for sales? How will Trump keep inflation and recession repressed to change all this?

Hasn't the US been artificially repressing inflation?
Sooner or later the shit has to hit the fan when we have to stop printing money.
OR is that a lie and we CAN print money without limit?
Which is true?

Yes, Obama has been shipping our jobs and industry overseas to suppress inflation from his money printing and QE....the piper will be paid....and the pain may destroy America.....democrats are evil pieces of shit.....

Man you dream alot, you should think about writing B movie science fiction novels, or short stories.......

Your dogs eat you IQ?

In English please...

 

[owebo]

If you put a tariff on a nations goods that are imported,, what does that do to the prices of items you send to their nation for sales? How will Trump keep inflation and recession repressed to change all this?

Hasn't the US been artificially repressing inflation?
Sooner or later the shit has to hit the fan when we have to stop printing money.
OR is that a lie and we CAN print money without limit?
Which is true?

Yes, Obama has been shipping our jobs and industry overseas to suppress inflation from his money printing and QE....the piper will be paid....and the pain may destroy America.....democrats are evil pieces of shit.....

Man you dream alot, you should think about writing B movie science fiction novels, or short stories.......

Your dogs eat you IQ?

In English please...

Good doggies....

 

[Moonglow]

Hasn't the US been artificially repressing inflation?
Sooner or later the shit has to hit the fan when we have to stop printing money.
OR is that a lie and we CAN print money without limit?
Which is true?

Yes, Obama has been shipping our jobs and industry overseas to suppress inflation from his money printing and QE....the piper will be paid....and the pain may destroy America.....democrats are evil pieces of shit.....

Man you dream alot, you should think about writing B movie science fiction novels, or short stories.......

Your dogs eat you IQ?

In English please...

Good doggies....

That's better...

 

[Indeependent]

Ignorance, when worn with hubris, is such an ugly thing.

The US, thru NORAD, picks up just about 88% of all military costs for defending Canada, the US, and Mexico (you didn't even know that Mexico was included, did you?)

Let's allow both countries to pay for their own defense - the resulting cost of military increase would bankrupt both.

Further, let's move all those US businesses currently in Canada and Mexico back to the US - simply done, btw -- and see how well their economies hold up. What, again, would be the influence of bringing those businesses back to the US??

You've got to remember - we have the customers, and we have the capital - with that kind of power, you can make corporations dance.

How in the hell do you bring back companies? Come on, tell us big boy....

By imposing tariffs on items manufactured abroad that make it uneconomical to continue to manufacture them abroad.

If you put a tariff on a nations goods that are imported,, what does that do to the prices of items you send to their nation for sales? How will Trump keep inflation and recession repressed to change all this?

Hasn't the US been artificially repressing inflation?
Sooner or later the shit has to hit the fan when we have to stop printing money.
OR is that a lie and we CAN print money without limit?
Which is true?

Yes, Obama has been shipping our jobs and industry overseas to suppress inflation from his money printing and QE....the piper will be paid....and the pain may destroy America.....democrats are evil pieces of shit.....

It started way prior to Obama.
Obama ran on his second term to stop what GW accelerated into warp speed but he didn't extend himself beyond telling the Arab world we would love them from now on.

 

[Slade3200]

What happened to trickle down?? Save somebody some money on their car so they can go create more jobs... Isn't that how it is supposed to work?

No, that's not how it works ---- you've just demonstrated the fundamental ignorance of the issues at hand.

What happened to deregulation on businesses so they can be free to operate without the stranglehold, create more profits, which in turn creates more jobs... Isn't that how it is supposed to work?

Cutting costs creates jobs. Redirection of corporate capital means more jobs.

Saving somebody money on their car does NOT create jobs. The buyer has a finite amount of money, and can only spend as much as he has. In the larger scheme of things, he can only buy as much "labor" as his funds.

I guess sarcasm doesn't play well via text... The irony I was alluding to was the conservative fiscal view of less taxes and less regulation to stimulate the economy and the apparent paradox that comes with the free trade situation... Lower prices save money for consumers and raise profits for businesses, in theory this should stimulate the economy and grow GDP... Same thing with deregulation, less expenses right?. Funny how the conservative proposal to the free trade delema is to impose contraints on businesses so they can't afford to leave and the end result is higher prices for the consumer.

I'm not disagreeing with the idea I just point out the irony. It is a very difficult issue.

You're missing the main point. It's true that free trade and minimal regulation produces a robust economy, but which economy are we talking about, the global economy or our national economy? Since at least the 1990's many people assumed wrongly they were the same thing. When the Clintons pushed NAFTA and the WTO, there was strong support from Republicans for whom free trade was a mantra, but much opposition from Democrats who feared correctly it would hurt Americans workers.

Trump says these treaties were a mistake he will correct and he will have the support of all those disillusioned Republicans who supported them in the 1990's along with all those Democrats who mourn the loss of US jobs they created. Trump will still support minimal regulation within our national economy and in trade with other developed countries.

I get it and you articulate the situation very well. I agree with your points, free trade is a good thing in concept but got exploited by big business and we are now in a very tough imbalanced situation. I think trump has tapped into the anger and has done a good job at spotlighting the problems. I don't think his proposed solutions are going to be as simple as he makes them out to be. I wish our political discussions would analyze and scutinize the details. Maybe if we took a break from all the finger pointing, name calling and mud slinging, we could get there...

 

[Slade3200]

Ignorance, when worn with hubris, is such an ugly thing.

The US, thru NORAD, picks up just about 88% of all military costs for defending Canada, the US, and Mexico (you didn't even know that Mexico was included, did you?)

Let's allow both countries to pay for their own defense - the resulting cost of military increase would bankrupt both.

Further, let's move all those US businesses currently in Canada and Mexico back to the US - simply done, btw -- and see how well their economies hold up. What, again, would be the influence of bringing those businesses back to the US??

You've got to remember - we have the customers, and we have the capital - with that kind of power, you can make corporations dance.

How in the hell do you bring back companies? Come on, tell us big boy....

By imposing tariffs on items manufactured abroad that make it uneconomical to continue to manufacture them abroad.

If you put a tariff on a nations goods that are imported,, what does that do to the prices of items you send to their nation for sales? How will Trump keep inflation and recession repressed to change all this?

Hasn't the US been artificially repressing inflation?
Sooner or later the shit has to hit the fan when we have to stop printing money.
OR is that a lie and we CAN print money without limit?
Which is true?

Yes, Obama has been shipping our jobs and industry overseas to suppress inflation from his money printing and QE....the piper will be paid....and the pain may destroy America.....democrats are evil pieces of shit.....

Which jobs has Obama shipped over seas and how exactly did he do it?

 

[KissMy]

Watching a Trump speech today, Trump said, "We are not going to let them take our businesses any longer. It's not going to happen".

What does that mean?

He is Lying!
Under Clinton China's GDP fell & US GDP rose.
Under Bush China's GDP soared while US GDP fell.
Under Obama China's GDP fell & US GDP rose.

 

[Moonglow]

Trump has been blowing the line about trade imbalances since Reagan, he was using Japan as an example then....

 

[Indeependent]

Watching a Trump speech today, Trump said, "We are not going to let them take our businesses any longer. It's not going to happen".

What does that mean?

He is Lying!
Under Clinton China's GDP fell & US GDP rose.
Under Bush China's GDP soared while US GDP fell.
Under Obama China's GDP fell & US GDP rose.

And almost 99% of that GDP went to almost only 1% of Americans.

 

[12icer]

REAL History anyone? the first Clinton signed nafta, he also started what turned into the war in Afghanistan, and Iraq. He did not wipe out the deficit, He did have a balanced budget that was written entirely by the house of representatives voted for in the senate and he signed it. Guess who ran the congress. A balanced budget does not mean there is no deficit. It means revenue and budgetary spending for that year are equal, a surplus means there was more revenue than spending THAT YEAR, a YEARLY DEFICIT means there was LESS revenue than spending for that year. The outstanding debt from all other years is NOT erased by a balanced YEARLY BUDGET, unless the surplus is equal to the total deficit, and it is USED to pay the same. As for The idea that WE can't determine our trade balance, that is ludicrous. The "WE tariff, they retaliate and we lose" is BS too. When you are trading at an extremely unfavorable rate you have very little to lose by increasing your incoming capital by whatever means you can. When you are the largest consumer nation in the world, If we cut out Mexico, then China, Vietnam, Korea or some other country will fill the void instantly, and at a rate we propose. If an American company is the entity trying to increase capital gains by moving jobs out of the country, you could require a REINTRODUCTION tariff of 100 percent. That will make the product cost twice as much and the product will be cost prohibitive to market. Another move is to require all imports to go through a series of tests designed to prohibit their sale in this country AND when they meet the standard change it. You liberals should like that you do it to the manufacturing and raw materials companies in this country daily with EPA regulations based on fantasy science. "Green" energy produces many times more poisonous chemicals that any other type of energy production, yet the EPA has few regulations on it's expansion. Cmon use the rest of your 50 IQs and try to impress me. HAHAHAHA

 

[Slade3200]

Nobody is "Taking" our businesses. Our businesses are leaving on their own to lower expenses. Cheap labor and Lower taxes being the main factors. It is a big mess that I don't see a clear path to recover from yet.

Then, logic would say that if you want to keep the businesses - keep the jobs - you need to be more competitive on the labor and tax fronts.

Why do people try to make this rocket surgery?

Or, the "analysts" have to stop putting insane goals on ever growing profits. Once upon a time, companies employed people and paid a fair wage. They made money for the CEO and the shareholders. The employees had enough income to actually buy the stuff they made. long term plans were made. Now it's all about the shareholder and the quaterly results. I've been in places where they actually stopped entering orders near the end of a quarter if they made the 'numbers". Because going over them does not reward much, but if they fell short next quarter, the share price would suffer. The entire stock market is screwed up. More so when you factor in that stocks being traded, outside of IPOs, bring nothing to the company.

If stocks couldn't be traded, how would you ever be able to get your investment back, and if you couldn't get your investment back, how many people would want to buy initial offerings?

I don't think he is proposing the elimination of trading stocks. I understood his statement as saying there needs to be a balance between executive/shareholder profits and the health of the business operations. Ie wages, work environment, employee benefits, and providing a valued service to consumers and the local community. This spirit is getting lost in corporate America and greed/corruption seems to be on the rise.

 

[KissMy]

The Deficit was cut as soon as Clinton took over under Democrat House & Senate creating a Surplus to fund Baby Boomers SS Retirement!

The Deficit Exploded as soon as Bush took over under Republican House & Senate!!!

 

[jknowgood]

Of course not because like all business people, he wants to make money, but by placing tariffs on goods made outside the US it becomes possible for US companies to make the same profits by manufacturing goods here as the would by making them in Mexico, for example.

Which would cause a sharp increase in the price of goods . Add to that retaliation by other. Countries .

Since righties freak over shit like higher min wage, I'm surprised they are cool with this plan?

Some goods might cost slightly more but it is unlikely these less developed countries could do much damage to our exports to them. What kind of American are you if you are willing to put other Americans out of work in order to get a slight discount on your next car?

What happened to trickle down?? Save somebody some money on their car so they can go create more jobs... Isn't that how it is supposed to work?

No, that's not how it works ---- you've just demonstrated the fundamental ignorance of the issues at hand.

What happened to deregulation on businesses so they can be free to operate without the stranglehold, create more profits, which in turn creates more jobs... Isn't that how it is supposed to work?

He says he will do that also.

 

[rdean]

What difference does it make what he means? You're just going to contort it and lie once your pathetic little mind wraps around it.

It might take several days but you'll understand what he meant Rtard, eventually.

By then though you'll be parroting some other bed wetters opinion about it.

What difference does it make?

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Watching a Trump speech today, Trump said, "We are not going to let them take our businesses any longer. It's not going to happen".

What does that mean?

It means you've spammed the board with another butthurt thread.

 

[rdean]

The Deficit was cut as soon as Clinton took over under Democrat House & Senate creating a Surplus to fund Baby Boomers SS Retirement!

The Deficit Exploded as soon as Bush took over under Republican House & Senate!!!

Oh, these Republicans. I really thought one of them would say something besides delusional fantasies. Man, was I mistaken.

Perhaps before a "real" discussion is possible, some of you might want to do a little reading:

Outsourcing Not the Culprit in Manufacturing Job Loss | Automation World

Over the past decade, U.S. manufacturing jobs have declined by more than 11 percent, Miklovic noted. But at the same time, Japan’s manufacturing employment base has dropped by 16 percent, while the number of manufacturing jobs in countries including Brazil have declined by some 20 percent, he pointed out. “And one of the largest losers of manufacturing jobs has been China,” Miklovic added. “We like to pick on China and say that all of these jobs are going to China, but they’re losing jobs in manufacturing as well.”

The reason for the job losses? Miklovic summed it up in one word: automation. Through automation, he said, “we are really doing a good job of improving the productivity of people.”

Automation vs. Outsourcing

Unfortunately, some manufacturers realize they've made a mistake before it's too late to turn around. For instance, several high-profile companies that rushed head-first into outsourcing several years ago have recently brought work back in house. In fact, it's not unheard of to find manufacturers shifting production to the United States from China and other offshore locations.

Tom Kramer, president of Sortimat Technology (Schaumburg, IL), recently encountered two instances of large medical device companies abandoning assembly plants in Mexico due to quality issues with their final assemblies. "The operations were replaced with automation in U.S. manufacturing environments," says Kramer.

---------------------------------

Can you see what's happening? Jobs have disappeared in so many countries and even those other countries have blamed it on China. Only China, a country that is "taking" our jobs, is also losing jobs.

How can that be? The two companies they are talking about in the article tried to go cheap and moved to Mexico. Then it discovered the Mexicans were even worse at assembling sophisticated medical devices, so it moved the company back, invested in modernization and automation to bring up the quality.

Read the highlighted line: "The operations were replaced with automation in U.S. manufacturing environments," says Kramer.

You get it? The jobs that did come back were automated. That means no net increase in jobs.

Trump is scamming. He is hearing what you want and promising the moon. Only, in the end, he will moon you.

The jobs don't exist. They aren't coming back. Notice he doesn't describe the jobs? Why do you think that is?

Now, about the small car production Ford is moving to Mexico:

Trump Blatantly Lied About Ford Motors Moving Everything to Mexico. In Fact, They're Creating U.S. Jobs | RedState

The Ford corporation's CEO, Mike Fields, wasn't taking that lying down, and appeared on CNN to correct the record.

"It's really unfortunate when politics get in the way of the facts," he told Poppy Harlow. “And the facts are, Ford’s investment in the U.S. and commitment to American jobs has never been stronger. I mean, we’ve created more than 28,000 jobs in the U.S. in the last five years.”

But the truth of the matter is, Ford has brought jobs from Mexico to the U.S. recently as Yahoo Finance reports.

-----------------------------
I'll talk about the laughable idea of the US government stopping companies from moving overseas in a separate post. As soon as I stop laughing.

 

[Spare_change]

Of course, he will be able to persuade Congress, and this is why:

A new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that 50% of Likely U.S. Voters think the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA) with Canada and Mexico needs to be renegotiated. Just 27% disagree, but nearly as many (23%) are not sure. (To see survey question wording, click here.)

Voters Aren’t Happy with NAFTA, Other Free Trade Deals - Rasmussen Reports™

Among those who will support him are the trade unions which have always been opposed to NAFTA. Even Hillary now says NAFTA was a mistake.

Don't forget the other part of the equation, because Mexico has to accept it as well. If they don't like it, they won't sign it.

And there is nothing Trump can do to force them.

Therein lies the "art of the deal" - you position Mexico, and Canada, so that they can't afford NOT to accept the deal. Suppose, for example, Trump were to say "Either sign it or we will completely close the border to all Mexican (or Canadian) goods. In addition, we will no longer provide military support for your country's security."

I'm guessing that would work.

Completely close the border to trade with Canada and Mexico? Are you nuts? That would screw up our economy even worse than what it is right now. Besides..............Republicans want to have the Keystone pipeline, so shutting off trade with Canada is a non starter.

As far as military support? Mexico and Canada don't start wars very often. Usually it's the USA asking them to send troops in support of US.

Ignorance, when worn with hubris, is such an ugly thing.

The US, thru NORAD, picks up just about 88% of all military costs for defending Canada, the US, and Mexico (you didn't even know that Mexico was included, did you?)

Let's allow both countries to pay for their own defense - the resulting cost of military increase would bankrupt both.

Further, let's move all those US businesses currently in Canada and Mexico back to the US - simply done, btw -- and see how well their economies hold up. What, again, would be the influence of bringing those businesses back to the US??

You've got to remember - we have the customers, and we have the capital - with that kind of power, you can make corporations dance.

How in the hell do you bring back companies? Come on, tell us big boy....

Sorry --- that was such a stupid question, I didn't think you were serious.

Bring back companies? Hmmm ... let me see.

Company A's primary customer base is in the US. Tariffs, because they are made in Mexico, make the company's products non-competitive. Company A is faced with a choice ---- move its operation to the States or give up its primary customer base.

What to do ! What to do! Call Allied Van Lines - we're going north.

See how simple it is ... if there's a need, somebody is going to fill it. It can be the company you relocated from Mexico, or it can be a new company. But, one way or the other, the need will be filled.

 

[Spare_change]

Nobody is "Taking" our businesses. Our businesses are leaving on their own to lower expenses. Cheap labor and Lower taxes being the main factors. It is a big mess that I don't see a clear path to recover from yet.

Then, logic would say that if you want to keep the businesses - keep the jobs - you need to be more competitive on the labor and tax fronts.

Why do people try to make this rocket surgery?

Or, the "analysts" have to stop putting insane goals on ever growing profits. Once upon a time, companies employed people and paid a fair wage. They made money for the CEO and the shareholders. The employees had enough income to actually buy the stuff they made. long term plans were made. Now it's all about the shareholder and the quaterly results. I've been in places where they actually stopped entering orders near the end of a quarter if they made the 'numbers". Because going over them does not reward much, but if they fell short next quarter, the share price would suffer. The entire stock market is screwed up. More so when you factor in that stocks being traded, outside of IPOs, bring nothing to the company.

The average profit margin for a company in the US for the past 10 years has been 6.75% Why Are Corporate Profit Margins So High? | Pragmatic Capitalism or The public thinks the average company makes a 36% profit margin, which is about 5X too high - AEI. Some industries, typically those that are government subsidized (energy, etc.) show a larger profit, but not nearly what most seem to believe.

All this talk about massive profits is simply liberal talking points --- they typically use gross profit (especially when they talk about drug companies) and don't consider net profit. In fact, if the profit gets too high, the stocks "mean revert", thus driving the profitability back toward 6.5%. (There's a discussion in the first reference)

In short, most people don't know what the hell they're talking about --- instead, they simply spout what they are told by their respective political propagandists.

 

[rdean]

Don't forget the other part of the equation, because Mexico has to accept it as well. If they don't like it, they won't sign it.

And there is nothing Trump can do to force them.

Therein lies the "art of the deal" - you position Mexico, and Canada, so that they can't afford NOT to accept the deal. Suppose, for example, Trump were to say "Either sign it or we will completely close the border to all Mexican (or Canadian) goods. In addition, we will no longer provide military support for your country's security."

I'm guessing that would work.

Completely close the border to trade with Canada and Mexico? Are you nuts? That would screw up our economy even worse than what it is right now. Besides..............Republicans want to have the Keystone pipeline, so shutting off trade with Canada is a non starter.

As far as military support? Mexico and Canada don't start wars very often. Usually it's the USA asking them to send troops in support of US.

Ignorance, when worn with hubris, is such an ugly thing.

The US, thru NORAD, picks up just about 88% of all military costs for defending Canada, the US, and Mexico (you didn't even know that Mexico was included, did you?)

Let's allow both countries to pay for their own defense - the resulting cost of military increase would bankrupt both.

Further, let's move all those US businesses currently in Canada and Mexico back to the US - simply done, btw -- and see how well their economies hold up. What, again, would be the influence of bringing those businesses back to the US??

You've got to remember - we have the customers, and we have the capital - with that kind of power, you can make corporations dance.

How in the hell do you bring back companies? Come on, tell us big boy....

Sorry --- that was such a stupid question, I didn't think you were serious.

Bring back companies? Hmmm ... let me see.

Company A's primary customer base is in the US. Tariffs, because they are made in Mexico, make the company's products non-competitive. Company A is faced with a choice ---- move its operation to the States or give up its primary customer base.

What to do ! What to do! Call Allied Van Lines - we're going north.

See how simple it is ... if there's a need, somebody is going to fill it. It can be the company you relocated from Mexico, or it can be a new company. But, one way or the other, the need will be filled.

Then entire Trump argument is to bring back jobs. Bringing back an automated company is good. Not saying it isn't. But if it doesn't increase the job count, then how does it help the GOP base?

 

[rdean]

Nobody is "Taking" our businesses. Our businesses are leaving on their own to lower expenses. Cheap labor and Lower taxes being the main factors. It is a big mess that I don't see a clear path to recover from yet.

Then, logic would say that if you want to keep the businesses - keep the jobs - you need to be more competitive on the labor and tax fronts.

Why do people try to make this rocket surgery?

Or, the "analysts" have to stop putting insane goals on ever growing profits. Once upon a time, companies employed people and paid a fair wage. They made money for the CEO and the shareholders. The employees had enough income to actually buy the stuff they made. long term plans were made. Now it's all about the shareholder and the quaterly results. I've been in places where they actually stopped entering orders near the end of a quarter if they made the 'numbers". Because going over them does not reward much, but if they fell short next quarter, the share price would suffer. The entire stock market is screwed up. More so when you factor in that stocks being traded, outside of IPOs, bring nothing to the company.

The average profit margin for a company in the US for the past 10 years has been 6.75% Why Are Corporate Profit Margins So High? | Pragmatic Capitalism or The public thinks the average company makes a 36% profit margin, which is about 5X too high - AEI. Some industries, typically those that are government subsidized (energy, etc.) show a larger profit, but not nearly what most seem to believe.

All this talk about massive profits is simply liberal talking points --- they typically use gross profit (especially when they talk about drug companies) and don't consider net profit. In fact, if the profit gets too high, the stocks "mean revert", thus driving the profitability back toward 6.5%. (There's a discussion in the first reference)

In short, most people don't know what the hell they're talking about --- instead, they simply spout what they are told by their respective political propagandists.

Make up some situation, then says that's what liberals believe. Then make up some "solution". Then say "I won because Democrats are stupid". Works every time.