Well it didn't take the screamer long to get his lawyers lined up

[Winston]

United has been incompetent for years, I'll never fly them again.

I'm back home for my mother's funeral and unfortunately have to fly them back to my home...but that will be the last time for me and mine.

Sorry about your mom but it's a free country. Drive, ride the bus, walk, ride a horse. Your choice. However, if you buy an airline ticket, you are agreeing to the carriage contract.

Again, Dr. Dao had every right to refuse the request to disembark the plane. He was not in violation of the contract of carriage. There are numerous reasons that the airlines can remove a passenger once they are seated. To make room for their employees IS NOT one of them. Nor does the contract of carriage require a passenger to follow EVERY order of the flight crew. Unless Dr. Dao was endangering the flight crew or other passengers, or significantly hindering the flight crews ability to perform their duties, he was not required to leave the plane. I am willing to bet that Dr. Dao's lawyer had already informed him of that reality before the confrontation.

But just deal with the facts on the ground. No charges have been filed against Dr. Dao. United Airlines has apologized immensely. The security officers involved have been suspended from duty. United Airlines offered all passengers on the plane refunds and compensation, provided they agreed not to sue. Nothing, and I mean nothing, that has happened since the incident would indicate that Dr. Dao either broke a single law, or violated the contract of carriage.

 

[xband]

United has been incompetent for years, I'll never fly them again.

I'm back home for my mother's funeral and unfortunately have to fly them back to my home...but that will be the last time for me and mine.

Sorry about your mom but it's a free country. Drive, ride the bus, walk, ride a horse. Your choice. However, if you buy an airline ticket, you are agreeing to the carriage contract.

Again, Dr. Dao had every right to refuse the request to disembark the plane. He was not in violation of the contract of carriage. There are numerous reasons that the airlines can remove a passenger once they are seated. To make room for their employees IS NOT one of them. Nor does the contract of carriage require a passenger to follow EVERY order of the flight crew. Unless Dr. Dao was endangering the flight crew or other passengers, or significantly hindering the flight crews ability to perform their duties, he was not required to leave the plane. I am willing to bet that Dr. Dao's lawyer had already informed him of that reality before the confrontation.

But just deal with the facts on the ground. No charges have been filed against Dr. Dao. United Airlines has apologized immensely. The security officers involved have been suspended from duty. United Airlines offered all passengers on the plane refunds and compensation, provided they agreed not to sue. Nothing, and I mean nothing, that has happened since the incident would indicate that Dr. Dao either broke a single law, or violated the contract of carriage.

Dr. Dao bought the airline ticket and it depends what the FAA says because that is their jurisdiction.

 

[paperview]

It's a real shitty thing to get fucked over by an airline when traveling. But in the end it is their aircraft and their business, it's not public transportation. I think they have the right to refuse service or bump people, legally. I know it sucks when it happens because it's often out of your control. But if it happens, act like an adult, not a petulant child. If the airline asks you to leave the aircraft then you must do it. At that point the decision has been made, they aren't taking off with you on it. Refusal will only get you marked as a "troublemaker" and you could end up on a no-fly list. In this day and age there is no fucking around with safety and security on a plane.

If Dr Dao had done that then things would have returned to business as usual. Nobody would have ever heard about it

By standing up for his rights, he forced a major Airline to change it's policy and will probably impact how all airlines can bump their passengers

I hope it does change the way they overbook and bump people. But the airline isn't responsible for his injuries from the police.

I hold United responsible

They are the ones who decided to bump seated passengers to accommodate more crew. Given that the next flight was not available until 3PM the next day, they should have anticipated an unruly crowd once their offers of compensation were ignored

It was United who made the decision to call in the Brute Squad instead of backing down on their bumping decision

United should not have been surprised when the Brute Squad acted like brutes

Another thing we learned to day -- is the Dr. was on the plane with his wife.

Is it policy to separate a husband & wife to "re-accommodate" an involuntary volunteer?

And what of his luggage?

His wife was on the plane, in a back row seat when it all happened (unlike what the Div Wad said earlier - that the wife got off the plane and Dao was going to "abandon" her in Chicago) - and was visibly shaken by it all according to passengers. She followed him off the plane, and came back to get their carry ons.

 

[xband]

If Dr Dao had done that then things would have returned to business as usual. Nobody would have ever heard about it

By standing up for his rights, he forced a major Airline to change it's policy and will probably impact how all airlines can bump their passengers

I hope it does change the way they overbook and bump people. But the airline isn't responsible for his injuries from the police.

I hold United responsible

They are the ones who decided to bump seated passengers to accommodate more crew. Given that the next flight was not available until 3PM the next day, they should have anticipated an unruly crowd once their offers of compensation were ignored

It was United who made the decision to call in the Brute Squad instead of backing down on their bumping decision

United should not have been surprised when the Brute Squad acted like brutes

Another thing we learned to day -- is the Dr. was on the plane with his wife.

Is it policy to separate a husband & wife to "re-accommodate" an involuntary volunteer?

And what of his luggage?

His wife was on the plane, in a back row seat when it all happened (unlike what the Div Wad said earlier - that the wife got off the plane and Dao was going to "abandon" her in Chicago) - and was visibly shaken by it all according to passengers. She followed him off the plane, and came back to get their carry ons.

Only 1% supports Dr. Dao and those dudes live in Canada and can't be Jurors in the US. Dr. Dao shot himself in the foot.

 

[Divine Wind]

His wife was on the plane, in a back row seat when it all happened (unlike what the Div Wad said earlier - that the wife got off the plane and Dao was going to "abandon" her in Chicago) - and was visibly shaken by it all according to passengers. She followed him off the plane, and came back to get their carry ons.

Thanks for both the juvenile name-calling and the possible correction.

Just another reason why the Chicago police should have deplaned everyone else first before focusing on Dao.

 

[Divine Wind]

United has been incompetent for years, I'll never fly them again.

I'm back home for my mother's funeral and unfortunately have to fly them back to my home...but that will be the last time for me and mine.

Sorry about your mom but it's a free country. Drive, ride the bus, walk, ride a horse. Your choice. However, if you buy an airline ticket, you are agreeing to the carriage contract.

Again, Dr. Dao had every right to refuse the request to disembark the plane. He was not in violation of the contract of carriage. There are numerous reasons that the airlines can remove a passenger once they are seated. To make room for their employees IS NOT one of them. Nor does the contract of carriage require a passenger to follow EVERY order of the flight crew. Unless Dr. Dao was endangering the flight crew or other passengers, or significantly hindering the flight crews ability to perform their duties, he was not required to leave the plane. I am willing to bet that Dr. Dao's lawyer had already informed him of that reality before the confrontation.

But just deal with the facts on the ground. No charges have been filed against Dr. Dao. United Airlines has apologized immensely. The security officers involved have been suspended from duty. United Airlines offered all passengers on the plane refunds and compensation, provided they agreed not to sue. Nothing, and I mean nothing, that has happened since the incident would indicate that Dr. Dao either broke a single law, or violated the contract of carriage.

Disagreed, but we'll see what the Feds think over the next few weeks.

In the meantime, I hope all the Liberals on this forum tell flight crews to go fuck themselves.

 

[paperview]

The police itself admitted the cop's actions were not condoned and not in accordance with procedures
--- its pretty clear they did screw up.

Officer involved in dragging man off United flight put on leave | Chicago Sun-Times

“The incident on United flight 3411 was not in accordance with our standard operating procedure and the actions of the aviation security officer are obviously not condoned,” Aviation Department spokeswoman Karen Pride said. “That officer has been placed on leave effective today pending a thorough review of the situation.”

 

[rightwinger]

His wife was on the plane, in a back row seat when it all happened (unlike what the Div Wad said earlier - that the wife got off the plane and Dao was going to "abandon" her in Chicago) - and was visibly shaken by it all according to passengers. She followed him off the plane, and came back to get their carry ons.

Thanks for both the juvenile name-calling and the possible correction.

Just another reason why the Chicago police should have deplaned everyone else first before focusing on Dao.

United should have backed off once nobody accepted their offer of compensation (or else raised the ante)

Demanding paying passengers leave a flight when they were already seated was obviously going to create a scene

 

[paperview]

& this:

United Airlines Did Not Have the Legal Right to Refuse Service to the Doctor Dragged Off Its Plane

<snip>

The fact that the flight was not overbooked may seem trivial, or pedantic, but there is very important legal distinction to be made. There may not be a difference in how an airline (typically) responds when it needs additional seats, such as asking for volunteers who wish to give up their seat for a voucher or cash. But there is a legal difference between bumping a passenger in the instance of overselling a flight versus bumping a passenger to give priority to another passenger. Any thoughtful person can see the problem that arises if an airline were allowed to legally remove one fare-paying passenger to allow for another passenger it prefers.

Since the flight was not actually overbooked, but instead only fully booked, with the exact number of passengers as seats available, United Airlines had no legal right to force any passengers to give up their seats to prioritize others. What United did was give preference to their employees over people who had reserved confirmed seats, in violation of 14 CFR 250.2a. Since Dr. Dao was already seated, it was clear that his seat had already been "reserved" and "confirmed" to accommodate him specifically.

A United Airlines spokesperson said that since Dr. Dao refused to give up his seat and leave the plane voluntarily, airline employees "had to" call upon airport security to force him to comply. However, since the flight was not overbooked, United Airlines had no legal right to give his seat to another passenger. In United Airline's Contract of Service, they list the reasons that a passenger may be refused service, many of which are reasonable, such as "failure to pay" or lacking "proof of identity." Nowhere in the terms of service does United Airlines claim to have unilateral authority to refuse service to anyone, for any reason (which would be illegal anyway)."

 

[rightwinger]

United has been incompetent for years, I'll never fly them again.

I'm back home for my mother's funeral and unfortunately have to fly them back to my home...but that will be the last time for me and mine.

Sorry about your mom but it's a free country. Drive, ride the bus, walk, ride a horse. Your choice. However, if you buy an airline ticket, you are agreeing to the carriage contract.

Again, Dr. Dao had every right to refuse the request to disembark the plane. He was not in violation of the contract of carriage. There are numerous reasons that the airlines can remove a passenger once they are seated. To make room for their employees IS NOT one of them. Nor does the contract of carriage require a passenger to follow EVERY order of the flight crew. Unless Dr. Dao was endangering the flight crew or other passengers, or significantly hindering the flight crews ability to perform their duties, he was not required to leave the plane. I am willing to bet that Dr. Dao's lawyer had already informed him of that reality before the confrontation.

But just deal with the facts on the ground. No charges have been filed against Dr. Dao. United Airlines has apologized immensely. The security officers involved have been suspended from duty. United Airlines offered all passengers on the plane refunds and compensation, provided they agreed not to sue. Nothing, and I mean nothing, that has happened since the incident would indicate that Dr. Dao either broke a single law, or violated the contract of carriage.

Disagreed, but we'll see what the Feds think over the next few weeks.

In the meantime, I hope all the Liberals on this forum tell flight crews to go fuck themselves.

It will be interesting to see how United passengers respond in the future when flight crews ask for "volunteers"

What....are you going to beat me if I don't take it?

 

[paperview]

This is something I hadn't heard earlier:

"After dragging the man off, the four employees of the partner airline boarded. “People on the plane were letting them have it,” Bridges said.

A few minutes later, the man who was removed from the plane returned, looking dazed and saying he had to get home, Bridges said.

Officers followed him to the back of the plane. Another man traveling with high school students stood up at that point and said they were getting off, Bridges said. About half of the passengers followed before United told everyone to get off, he said.

The man who was originally dragged down the aisle was removed from the plane again, and United employees made an announcement saying they had to “tidy up” the aircraft, Bridges said.

Aviation industry expert Robert W. Mann Jr. watched the video and said he had never seen anything like it.

“I’ve never seen a passenger forcibly removed unless it involved an unruly passenger of some sort,” he said.

Officer involved in dragging man off United flight put on leave

 

[rightwinger]

& this:

United Airlines Did Not Have the Legal Right to Refuse Service to the Doctor Dragged Off Its Plane

<snip>

The fact that the flight was not overbooked may seem trivial, or pedantic, but there is very important legal distinction to be made. There may not be a difference in how an airline (typically) responds when it needs additional seats, such as asking for volunteers who wish to give up their seat for a voucher or cash. But there is a legal difference between bumping a passenger in the instance of overselling a flight versus bumping a passenger to give priority to another passenger. Any thoughtful person can see the problem that arises if an airline were allowed to legally remove one fare-paying passenger to allow for another passenger it prefers.

Since the flight was not actually overbooked, but instead only fully booked, with the exact number of passengers as seats available, United Airlines had no legal right to force any passengers to give up their seats to prioritize others. What United did was give preference to their employees over people who had reserved confirmed seats, in violation of 14 CFR 250.2a. Since Dr. Dao was already seated, it was clear that his seat had already been "reserved" and "confirmed" to accommodate him specifically.

A United Airlines spokesperson said that since Dr. Dao refused to give up his seat and leave the plane voluntarily, airline employees "had to" call upon airport security to force him to comply. However, since the flight was not overbooked, United Airlines had no legal right to give his seat to another passenger. In United Airline's Contract of Service, they list the reasons that a passenger may be refused service, many of which are reasonable, such as "failure to pay" or lacking "proof of identity." Nowhere in the terms of service does United Airlines claim to have unilateral authority to refuse service to anyone, for any reason (which would be illegal anyway)."

That raises an interesting point

What if Dr Dao paid $200 for his seat and there was a passenger at the gate willing to pay $800? Under the Contract of Service, United is free to remove a low paying customer and replace him with a high paying customer

 

[Divine Wind]

His wife was on the plane, in a back row seat when it all happened (unlike what the Div Wad said earlier - that the wife got off the plane and Dao was going to "abandon" her in Chicago) - and was visibly shaken by it all according to passengers. She followed him off the plane, and came back to get their carry ons.

Thanks for both the juvenile name-calling and the possible correction.

Just another reason why the Chicago police should have deplaned everyone else first before focusing on Dao.

United should have backed off once nobody accepted their offer of compensation (or else raised the ante)

Demanding paying passengers leave a flight when they were already seated was obviously going to create a scene

The scene wasn't created until the altercation between the third police officer and Dao.

For the 8th or 9th time, a better way to have handled it would be to have deplaned everyone. If Dao didn't leave then, at least there'd be no witnesses.

Additionally, the crew members, all or some, probably would have walked rather than be trapped onboard with a belligerent passenger.

 

[Divine Wind]

This is something I hadn't heard earlier:

"After dragging the man off, the four employees of the partner airline boarded. “People on the plane were letting them have it,” Bridges said.

A few minutes later, the man who was removed from the plane returned, looking dazed and saying he had to get home, Bridges said.

Officers followed him to the back of the plane. Another man traveling with high school students stood up at that point and said they were getting off, Bridges said. About half of the passengers followed before United told everyone to get off, he said.

The man who was originally dragged down the aisle was removed from the plane again, and United employees made an announcement saying they had to “tidy up” the aircraft, Bridges said.

Aviation industry expert Robert W. Mann Jr. watched the video and said he had never seen anything like it.

“I’ve never seen a passenger forcibly removed unless it involved an unruly passenger of some sort,” he said.

Officer involved in dragging man off United flight put on leave

Just another reason to have cancelled the flight, refunded the $16K in ticket fees, then ferried both the plane and the spare crew to Louisville.

Expect this to happen more often this summer. Great time of year to take Amtrak!

 

[bodecea]

United has been incompetent for years, I'll never fly them again.

I'm back home for my mother's funeral and unfortunately have to fly them back to my home...but that will be the last time for me and mine.

Sorry about your mom but it's a free country. Drive, ride the bus, walk, ride a horse. Your choice. However, if you buy an airline ticket, you are agreeing to the carriage contract.

Again, Dr. Dao had every right to refuse the request to disembark the plane. He was not in violation of the contract of carriage. There are numerous reasons that the airlines can remove a passenger once they are seated. To make room for their employees IS NOT one of them. Nor does the contract of carriage require a passenger to follow EVERY order of the flight crew. Unless Dr. Dao was endangering the flight crew or other passengers, or significantly hindering the flight crews ability to perform their duties, he was not required to leave the plane. I am willing to bet that Dr. Dao's lawyer had already informed him of that reality before the confrontation.

But just deal with the facts on the ground. No charges have been filed against Dr. Dao. United Airlines has apologized immensely. The security officers involved have been suspended from duty. United Airlines offered all passengers on the plane refunds and compensation, provided they agreed not to sue. Nothing, and I mean nothing, that has happened since the incident would indicate that Dr. Dao either broke a single law, or violated the contract of carriage.

The only issue for those in this thread is that he didn't immediately and quietly OBEY their jackbooted authority.

 

[bodecea]

His wife was on the plane, in a back row seat when it all happened (unlike what the Div Wad said earlier - that the wife got off the plane and Dao was going to "abandon" her in Chicago) - and was visibly shaken by it all according to passengers. She followed him off the plane, and came back to get their carry ons.

Thanks for both the juvenile name-calling and the possible correction.

Just another reason why the Chicago police should have deplaned everyone else first before focusing on Dao.

United should have backed off once nobody accepted their offer of compensation (or else raised the ante)

Demanding paying passengers leave a flight when they were already seated was obviously going to create a scene

The scene wasn't created until the altercation between the third police officer and Dao.

For the 8th or 9th time, a better way to have handled it would be to have deplaned everyone. If Dao didn't leave then, at least there'd be no witnesses.

Additionally, the crew members, all or some, probably would have walked rather than be trapped onboard with a belligerent passenger.

"belligerent passenger"....alternative fact.

 

[rightwinger]

His wife was on the plane, in a back row seat when it all happened (unlike what the Div Wad said earlier - that the wife got off the plane and Dao was going to "abandon" her in Chicago) - and was visibly shaken by it all according to passengers. She followed him off the plane, and came back to get their carry ons.

Thanks for both the juvenile name-calling and the possible correction.

Just another reason why the Chicago police should have deplaned everyone else first before focusing on Dao.

United should have backed off once nobody accepted their offer of compensation (or else raised the ante)

Demanding paying passengers leave a flight when they were already seated was obviously going to create a scene

The scene wasn't created until the altercation between the third police officer and Dao.

For the 8th or 9th time, a better way to have handled it would be to have deplaned everyone. If Dao didn't leave then, at least there'd be no witnesses.

Additionally, the crew members, all or some, probably would have walked rather than be trapped onboard with a belligerent passenger.

No, a better solution is for United to back down
It would have saved a lot of grief all around

You don't kick off seated passengers

 

[Divine Wind]

His wife was on the plane, in a back row seat when it all happened (unlike what the Div Wad said earlier - that the wife got off the plane and Dao was going to "abandon" her in Chicago) - and was visibly shaken by it all according to passengers. She followed him off the plane, and came back to get their carry ons.

Thanks for both the juvenile name-calling and the possible correction.

Just another reason why the Chicago police should have deplaned everyone else first before focusing on Dao.

United should have backed off once nobody accepted their offer of compensation (or else raised the ante)

Demanding paying passengers leave a flight when they were already seated was obviously going to create a scene

The scene wasn't created until the altercation between the third police officer and Dao.

For the 8th or 9th time, a better way to have handled it would be to have deplaned everyone. If Dao didn't leave then, at least there'd be no witnesses.

Additionally, the crew members, all or some, probably would have walked rather than be trapped onboard with a belligerent passenger.

"belligerent passenger"....alternative fact.

Will you be flying this summer? If so, looking forward to your testimony of "standing up to the man!" by telling a flight attendant "Go fuck yourself, I'm busy texting!"

As it is, I doubt you will.

 

[rightwinger]

This is something I hadn't heard earlier:

"After dragging the man off, the four employees of the partner airline boarded. “People on the plane were letting them have it,” Bridges said.

A few minutes later, the man who was removed from the plane returned, looking dazed and saying he had to get home, Bridges said.

Officers followed him to the back of the plane. Another man traveling with high school students stood up at that point and said they were getting off, Bridges said. About half of the passengers followed before United told everyone to get off, he said.

The man who was originally dragged down the aisle was removed from the plane again, and United employees made an announcement saying they had to “tidy up” the aircraft, Bridges said.

Aviation industry expert Robert W. Mann Jr. watched the video and said he had never seen anything like it.

“I’ve never seen a passenger forcibly removed unless it involved an unruly passenger of some sort,” he said.

Officer involved in dragging man off United flight put on leave

Just another reason to have cancelled the flight, refunded the $16K in ticket fees, then ferried both the plane and the spare crew to Louisville.

Expect this to happen more often this summer. Great time of year to take Amtrak!

An excellent example of why you will never run an airline

 

[Divine Wind]

His wife was on the plane, in a back row seat when it all happened (unlike what the Div Wad said earlier - that the wife got off the plane and Dao was going to "abandon" her in Chicago) - and was visibly shaken by it all according to passengers. She followed him off the plane, and came back to get their carry ons.

Thanks for both the juvenile name-calling and the possible correction.

Just another reason why the Chicago police should have deplaned everyone else first before focusing on Dao.

United should have backed off once nobody accepted their offer of compensation (or else raised the ante)

Demanding paying passengers leave a flight when they were already seated was obviously going to create a scene

The scene wasn't created until the altercation between the third police officer and Dao.

For the 8th or 9th time, a better way to have handled it would be to have deplaned everyone. If Dao didn't leave then, at least there'd be no witnesses.

Additionally, the crew members, all or some, probably would have walked rather than be trapped onboard with a belligerent passenger.

No, a better solution is for United to back down
It would have saved a lot of grief all around

You don't kick off seated passengers

They won't admit it, but that's what's going to happen.

Good luck proving different.
You: "Why's the flight cancelled?"
Agent: "The captain reported a mechanical problem".
You: "Where's my compensation?"
Agent: "I can either rebook you on a flight tomorrow or refund your ticket. Which do you prefer, sir?"