What Happened to Church?

[ding]

Summarizing:

1. The universe is beautiful and hostile.
2. You can find out more about God from the moral law than you can the universe.
3. The Being behind the universe is intensely interested in right conduct.
4. If the Being behind the universe is pure impersonal mind, he won't be letting you off the hook for your poor conduct.
5. If there does exist an absolute goodness it must hate most of what we do.
6. If the universe is not governed by an absolute goodness, then all our efforts are in the long run hopeless.
7. Christianity explains how God can be this impersonal mind at the back of the Moral Law and yet also a Person.
8. Comfort is the one thing you cannot get by looking for it.
9. If you seek truth, you may find comfort in the end.
10. If you look for comfort you will not get either comfort or truth — only soft soap and wishful thinking to begin with and, in the end, despair.

Christianity is not for pussies.

 

[Taz]

Why not? Why all the hardship?

Is it really so alien a concept to you that the more worth having something is, the more it is worth working for and investing yourself in?

Well, you're a leftist, so it probably IS alien to you to think of working for something, rather than expecting it to be handed to you.

Naw, god should be effortless and free, sounds like a better idea.

It sounds to me that you want "God Lite." All of the good and none of the less pleasant consequences. You want a God that gives the you emotional comfort of believing in God and none of that messy baggage of being virtuous. You want a tame God. You want a God you can switch on and off when it suits you. All the thrills of religion and none of the cost. Your "God Lite" is the greatest achievement of wishful thinking the world has ever seen.

My idea of god is nicer than your god, does that piss you off?

Not at all. Your idea of God is illogical. Besides I can't imagine a God that could possibly be nicer than one who was born into this world to testify to the truth and suffer an agonizing death for us. Your problem is that you lack complete knowledge in your understanding of God.

I understand that god made everything, including evil, cancer and deformed babies.

 

[Taz]

Why not? Why all the hardship?

Is it really so alien a concept to you that the more worth having something is, the more it is worth working for and investing yourself in?

Well, you're a leftist, so it probably IS alien to you to think of working for something, rather than expecting it to be handed to you.

Naw, god should be effortless and free, sounds like a better idea.

It sounds to me that you want "God Lite." All of the good and none of the less pleasant consequences. You want a God that gives the you emotional comfort of believing in God and none of that messy baggage of being virtuous. You want a tame God. You want a God you can switch on and off when it suits you. All the thrills of religion and none of the cost. Your "God Lite" is the greatest achievement of wishful thinking the world has ever seen.

My idea of god is nicer than your god, does that piss you off?

It does nothing to us except reinforce what has happened to the church. Instead of pushing back against that false teaching, the church has absorbed the desire for an easy religion that doesn't demand anything from the person and tried to become what people want.

Obviously, it's a false teaching and if that's all you want, go find a social group to feel good in that caters to you, but it's not Christianity.

You worship the hide n' seek god whom you have a hard time finding, so you study, you listen to explanations, and you generally just follow what someone else made up. God shouldn't have to be so hard, and it should be free because it doesn't need our money.

 

[ding]

Is it really so alien a concept to you that the more worth having something is, the more it is worth working for and investing yourself in?

Well, you're a leftist, so it probably IS alien to you to think of working for something, rather than expecting it to be handed to you.

Naw, god should be effortless and free, sounds like a better idea.

It sounds to me that you want "God Lite." All of the good and none of the less pleasant consequences. You want a God that gives the you emotional comfort of believing in God and none of that messy baggage of being virtuous. You want a tame God. You want a God you can switch on and off when it suits you. All the thrills of religion and none of the cost. Your "God Lite" is the greatest achievement of wishful thinking the world has ever seen.

My idea of god is nicer than your god, does that piss you off?

Not at all. Your idea of God is illogical. Besides I can't imagine a God that could possibly be nicer than one who was born into this world to testify to the truth and suffer an agonizing death for us. Your problem is that you lack complete knowledge in your understanding of God.

I understand that god made everything, including evil, cancer and deformed babies.

We’ve been over this a dozen times. Evil is not extant. Evil is the absence of good.

 

[ding]

Is it really so alien a concept to you that the more worth having something is, the more it is worth working for and investing yourself in?

Well, you're a leftist, so it probably IS alien to you to think of working for something, rather than expecting it to be handed to you.

Naw, god should be effortless and free, sounds like a better idea.

It sounds to me that you want "God Lite." All of the good and none of the less pleasant consequences. You want a God that gives the you emotional comfort of believing in God and none of that messy baggage of being virtuous. You want a tame God. You want a God you can switch on and off when it suits you. All the thrills of religion and none of the cost. Your "God Lite" is the greatest achievement of wishful thinking the world has ever seen.

My idea of god is nicer than your god, does that piss you off?

It does nothing to us except reinforce what has happened to the church. Instead of pushing back against that false teaching, the church has absorbed the desire for an easy religion that doesn't demand anything from the person and tried to become what people want.

Obviously, it's a false teaching and if that's all you want, go find a social group to feel good in that caters to you, but it's not Christianity.

You worship the hide n' seek god whom you have a hard time finding, so you study, you listen to explanations, and you generally just follow what someone else made up. God shouldn't have to be so hard, and it should be free because it doesn't need our money.

God isn’t hard to find.

 

[Taz]

Naw, god should be effortless and free, sounds like a better idea.

It sounds to me that you want "God Lite." All of the good and none of the less pleasant consequences. You want a God that gives the you emotional comfort of believing in God and none of that messy baggage of being virtuous. You want a tame God. You want a God you can switch on and off when it suits you. All the thrills of religion and none of the cost. Your "God Lite" is the greatest achievement of wishful thinking the world has ever seen.

My idea of god is nicer than your god, does that piss you off?

Not at all. Your idea of God is illogical. Besides I can't imagine a God that could possibly be nicer than one who was born into this world to testify to the truth and suffer an agonizing death for us. Your problem is that you lack complete knowledge in your understanding of God.

I understand that god made everything, including evil, cancer and deformed babies.

We’ve been over this a dozen times. Evil is not extant. Evil is the absence of good.

But didn't god make the universe and the conditions were there at the beginning so that evil would flourish? Or something like that?

 

[Taz]

Naw, god should be effortless and free, sounds like a better idea.

It sounds to me that you want "God Lite." All of the good and none of the less pleasant consequences. You want a God that gives the you emotional comfort of believing in God and none of that messy baggage of being virtuous. You want a tame God. You want a God you can switch on and off when it suits you. All the thrills of religion and none of the cost. Your "God Lite" is the greatest achievement of wishful thinking the world has ever seen.

My idea of god is nicer than your god, does that piss you off?

It does nothing to us except reinforce what has happened to the church. Instead of pushing back against that false teaching, the church has absorbed the desire for an easy religion that doesn't demand anything from the person and tried to become what people want.

Obviously, it's a false teaching and if that's all you want, go find a social group to feel good in that caters to you, but it's not Christianity.

You worship the hide n' seek god whom you have a hard time finding, so you study, you listen to explanations, and you generally just follow what someone else made up. God shouldn't have to be so hard, and it should be free because it doesn't need our money.

God isn’t hard to find.

Then why are so many people not finding your god? (Including all the people who have found a different god).

 

[ding]

It sounds to me that you want "God Lite." All of the good and none of the less pleasant consequences. You want a God that gives the you emotional comfort of believing in God and none of that messy baggage of being virtuous. You want a tame God. You want a God you can switch on and off when it suits you. All the thrills of religion and none of the cost. Your "God Lite" is the greatest achievement of wishful thinking the world has ever seen.

My idea of god is nicer than your god, does that piss you off?

Not at all. Your idea of God is illogical. Besides I can't imagine a God that could possibly be nicer than one who was born into this world to testify to the truth and suffer an agonizing death for us. Your problem is that you lack complete knowledge in your understanding of God.

I understand that god made everything, including evil, cancer and deformed babies.

We’ve been over this a dozen times. Evil is not extant. Evil is the absence of good.

But didn't god make the universe and the conditions were there at the beginning so that evil would flourish? Or something like that?

What part of evil is not extant did you not comprehend?

 

[ding]

It sounds to me that you want "God Lite." All of the good and none of the less pleasant consequences. You want a God that gives the you emotional comfort of believing in God and none of that messy baggage of being virtuous. You want a tame God. You want a God you can switch on and off when it suits you. All the thrills of religion and none of the cost. Your "God Lite" is the greatest achievement of wishful thinking the world has ever seen.

My idea of god is nicer than your god, does that piss you off?

It does nothing to us except reinforce what has happened to the church. Instead of pushing back against that false teaching, the church has absorbed the desire for an easy religion that doesn't demand anything from the person and tried to become what people want.

Obviously, it's a false teaching and if that's all you want, go find a social group to feel good in that caters to you, but it's not Christianity.

You worship the hide n' seek god whom you have a hard time finding, so you study, you listen to explanations, and you generally just follow what someone else made up. God shouldn't have to be so hard, and it should be free because it doesn't need our money.

God isn’t hard to find.

Then why are so many people not finding your god? (Including all the people who have found a different god).

Because like you they have never looked.

 

[Taz]

My idea of god is nicer than your god, does that piss you off?

Not at all. Your idea of God is illogical. Besides I can't imagine a God that could possibly be nicer than one who was born into this world to testify to the truth and suffer an agonizing death for us. Your problem is that you lack complete knowledge in your understanding of God.

I understand that god made everything, including evil, cancer and deformed babies.

We’ve been over this a dozen times. Evil is not extant. Evil is the absence of good.

But didn't god make the universe and the conditions were there at the beginning so that evil would flourish? Or something like that?

What part of evil is not extant did you not comprehend?

Explain it and we'll see, because it appears to simply be one of your stock gibberish answers to questions you can't answer.

 

[Taz]

My idea of god is nicer than your god, does that piss you off?

It does nothing to us except reinforce what has happened to the church. Instead of pushing back against that false teaching, the church has absorbed the desire for an easy religion that doesn't demand anything from the person and tried to become what people want.

Obviously, it's a false teaching and if that's all you want, go find a social group to feel good in that caters to you, but it's not Christianity.

You worship the hide n' seek god whom you have a hard time finding, so you study, you listen to explanations, and you generally just follow what someone else made up. God shouldn't have to be so hard, and it should be free because it doesn't need our money.

God isn’t hard to find.

Then why are so many people not finding your god? (Including all the people who have found a different god).

Because like you they have never looked.

Oh come on, everyone is looking for answers, and some people have found other gods. Actually, your god is in the minority.

 

[ding]

Not at all. Your idea of God is illogical. Besides I can't imagine a God that could possibly be nicer than one who was born into this world to testify to the truth and suffer an agonizing death for us. Your problem is that you lack complete knowledge in your understanding of God.

I understand that god made everything, including evil, cancer and deformed babies.

We’ve been over this a dozen times. Evil is not extant. Evil is the absence of good.

But didn't god make the universe and the conditions were there at the beginning so that evil would flourish? Or something like that?

What part of evil is not extant did you not comprehend?

Explain it and we'll see, because it appears to simply be one of your stock gibberish answers to questions you can't answer.

God’s spirit is within you. When he removes it you will then realize what you lost.

 

[ding]

It does nothing to us except reinforce what has happened to the church. Instead of pushing back against that false teaching, the church has absorbed the desire for an easy religion that doesn't demand anything from the person and tried to become what people want.

Obviously, it's a false teaching and if that's all you want, go find a social group to feel good in that caters to you, but it's not Christianity.

You worship the hide n' seek god whom you have a hard time finding, so you study, you listen to explanations, and you generally just follow what someone else made up. God shouldn't have to be so hard, and it should be free because it doesn't need our money.

God isn’t hard to find.

Then why are so many people not finding your god? (Including all the people who have found a different god).

Because like you they have never looked.

Oh come on, everyone is looking for answers, and some people have found other gods. Actually, your god is in the minority.

And they are better off for that too. There is only one God. It’s not like there’s a smorgasbord of Gods out there. He doesn’t care what name you call him. He answers to many.

 

[Taz]

I understand that god made everything, including evil, cancer and deformed babies.

We’ve been over this a dozen times. Evil is not extant. Evil is the absence of good.

But didn't god make the universe and the conditions were there at the beginning so that evil would flourish? Or something like that?

What part of evil is not extant did you not comprehend?

Explain it and we'll see, because it appears to simply be one of your stock gibberish answers to questions you can't answer.

God’s spirit is within you. When he removes it you will then realize what you lost.

So you can prove that that could happen?

 

[Taz]

You worship the hide n' seek god whom you have a hard time finding, so you study, you listen to explanations, and you generally just follow what someone else made up. God shouldn't have to be so hard, and it should be free because it doesn't need our money.

God isn’t hard to find.

Then why are so many people not finding your god? (Including all the people who have found a different god).

Because like you they have never looked.

Oh come on, everyone is looking for answers, and some people have found other gods. Actually, your god is in the minority.

And they are better off for that too. There is only one God. It’s not like there’s a smorgasbord of Gods out there. He doesn’t care what name you call him. He answers to many.

So your god gives out 72 virgins like Allah does? Does your god tell you to kill Jews and Christians?

 

[Picaro]

I went to a new church for the first time this morning (because I moved to a new city a few months back, and now I need to find a new church home), and I have to say I don't feel even remotely sufficiently churched.

Maybe I'm just really old-fashioned. I grew up in the same two churches throughout my life; in fact, my husband and I were married in one of them. They were both good-sized, but neither was a "mega-church", and it was not only possible to know everyone in the church, it was impossible NOT to. The services took upwards of two hours from start to finish, and they happened three times a week. When the service ended, there were often people still praying at the altars (this church doesn't even HAVE altars), and it took at least another hour for people to get done talking and interacting and head out the doors. The song service was inclusive; the entire congregation worshipping God through music together.

This service was over in an hour; the song service was the "worship team" - basically a music group - giving a performance with lights and videos on screens and a FOG MACHINE, for crying out loud. It was a lot more like going to a concert than anything interactive. Everyone was out the door in about fifteen minutes, the pastors (they apparently have a huge heirarchy of them) were nowhere in sight, and there was no effort made to even identify new attendees, much less meet them and make them feel welcome. The sermon was still on-point in the Word of God, and they don't seem to have edited out the "icky" parts so many churches do - y'know, references to the Crucifixion, blood, death, Hell, all that uncomfortable stuff - but I have to wonder how you're supposed to learn and grow and connect with the Christian community and draw closer to God when an hour a week of listening to other people perform is all the effort you put into it.

I'm agnostic, we only go to services on holidays and special events shows anyway, but our experiences have been that the larger churches can be very impersonal at first, but like attending any large group functions it takes a while to get to know people, and I work with a lot of the charity functions here locally, food banks and the like and meet a lot of people through that, so maybe just stat joining groups, ignore first impressions for a while and then decide.

Some of my best friends are obnoxious asshats in real life, so don't be a snob. Christians aren't required to live like dumpster divers and homeless beggars, and their churches don't have to be held in ruined crappy buildings. I work with churches big and small, and don't find a lot of differences in character of the people attending either, except for the insurance salesmen and the like who are only there to 'network'.

 

[ding]

God isn’t hard to find.

Then why are so many people not finding your god? (Including all the people who have found a different god).

Because like you they have never looked.

Oh come on, everyone is looking for answers, and some people have found other gods. Actually, your god is in the minority.

And they are better off for that too. There is only one God. It’s not like there’s a smorgasbord of Gods out there. He doesn’t care what name you call him. He answers to many.

So your god gives out 72 virgins like Allah does? Does your god tell you to kill Jews and Christians?

Only if you believe man is capable of understanding God, Taz. Is that what you believe?

Or is it possible that they are trying to use man’s understanding to relate to something man is incapable of understanding.

 

[Taz]

Then why are so many people not finding your god? (Including all the people who have found a different god).

Because like you they have never looked.

Oh come on, everyone is looking for answers, and some people have found other gods. Actually, your god is in the minority.

And they are better off for that too. There is only one God. It’s not like there’s a smorgasbord of Gods out there. He doesn’t care what name you call him. He answers to many.

So your god gives out 72 virgins like Allah does? Does your god tell you to kill Jews and Christians?

Only if you believe man is capable of understanding God, Taz. Is that what you believe?

Or is it possible that they are trying to use man’s understanding to relate to something man is incapable of understanding.

^^^^^ MASSIVE MUMBO JUMBO ALERT! (it happens when you're stumped )

 

[Picaro]

Not at all. Your idea of God is illogical. Besides I can't imagine a God that could possibly be nicer than one who was born into this world to testify to the truth and suffer an agonizing death for us. Your problem is that you lack complete knowledge in your understanding of God.

I understand that god made everything, including evil, cancer and deformed babies.

We’ve been over this a dozen times. Evil is not extant. Evil is the absence of good.

But didn't god make the universe and the conditions were there at the beginning so that evil would flourish? Or something like that?

What part of evil is not extant did you not comprehend?

Explain it and we'll see, because it appears to simply be one of your stock gibberish answers to questions you can't answer.

Says the angry deviant who can't post anywhere in this forum on the topic, just obsessively baits and whines like a 4 year old.

 

[Taz]

I understand that god made everything, including evil, cancer and deformed babies.

We’ve been over this a dozen times. Evil is not extant. Evil is the absence of good.

But didn't god make the universe and the conditions were there at the beginning so that evil would flourish? Or something like that?

What part of evil is not extant did you not comprehend?

Explain it and we'll see, because it appears to simply be one of your stock gibberish answers to questions you can't answer.

Says the angry deviant who can't post anywhere in this forum on the topic, just obsessively baits and whines like a 4 year old.

Pot. Kettle. Black.