Whatever ever happened to the little sign ‘We have a right to refuse service’?

[Iceweasel]

There are those who prefer morality to profits. I will not condemn them and neither should you.

It's not just about morality, though that's certainly part of it. Doing obscene cakes may not good be for business with their other customers. I own a graphic design firm, we're clear we don't do sexually explicit content. I doubt that bakery would have done a penis cake for a straight wedding either. They have every right to make their own choices. And plenty of other bakeries would do it, it's stupid to force someone to do what they don't want to do. Free markets provide endless alternatives.

I used to be in that biz and turned down a pro-abortion bumper sticker job for Planned Parenthood on principle. I guess I'm lucky they didn't sue me for sexism.

 

[Kondor3]

The far right are the spiritual heirs of Hitler (since Freewill brought up the original Nazi photo).

Both the Far Right AND the Far Left manifest various similarities with the political or moral inheritance of Hitler and his followers.

Fortunately for the Republic, there are very few on EITHER extreme.

Although the Far Left has a bit more political power at-present than the country at-large is now comfortable with.

 

[Kondor3]

...THEN and ONLY then is Godwin's law applicable....

I see that you interpreted the sequence correctly.

 

[The T]

The far right are the spiritual heirs of Hitler (since Freewill brought up the original Nazi photo).

Fakey Starkey talking out of his sphincter again. ^^

 

[kaz]

There are those who prefer morality to profits. I will not condemn them and neither should you.

It's not just about morality, though that's certainly part of it. Doing obscene cakes may not good be for business with their other customers. I own a graphic design firm, we're clear we don't do sexually explicit content. I doubt that bakery would have done a penis cake for a straight wedding either. They have every right to make their own choices. And plenty of other bakeries would do it, it's stupid to force someone to do what they don't want to do. Free markets provide endless alternatives.

I used to be in that biz and turned down a pro-abortion bumper sticker job for Planned Parenthood on principle. I guess I'm lucky they didn't sue me for sexism.

We do work for Planned Parenthood. We also do lots of work for Democrats. I won't do the sexually explicit but at work I'm about business, not politics.

 

[AvgGuyIA]

The gay community and the liberals have lost their little Nazi minds. A privately owned business has the right to refuse to conduct business with anybody they want. Period. It's not even open for debate.

Further still, the 1st Amendment affords you the right to practice your religious belief. And the little liberal/gay Nazi community is working so hard to trample on that right as well.

All I can say is that I hope these companies deliver the most dreadful products and services when they are unconstitutionally forced to by the liberal Nazi's. If you're a bakery and you're forced to bake a cake for a gay wedding, I hope you put 70lbs of salt in the cake and make the frosting primarily out of vinegar so that they vomit when they eat it. Then maybe word will spread in their little gay circles that your bakery isn't any good and you can be left the hell alone to conduct your private business as you see fit.

*Note - desperate Nazi liberals will try to spin this as "homophobia" because they need to justify their anti-constitutional Nazi beliefs. However, it is not. I couldn't care less if someone is gay. What I do care about however is when they unconstitutionally force someone to do their bidding because they think being gay makes them special and entitled.

It's an agenda of reeducation

It amazes me how stupid you are... the law says and this is nothing new you can refuse to serve some one if they are causing trouble in your business thats it ... being gay isn't causing trouble in your business ... being black isn't causing you trouble in your business ... being mexican isn't causing trouble in your business ... if you choose to refuse service to any of these reason then you are violating the law and you can be held responsible for your actions... the fact that you don't like gays people, or black people, or mexicans, doesn't give you the right to refuse service to them period ... being liberal has nothing to do with these rights ... being and american has everything to do with these rights ... I live in colorado and this guy should have been nailed to the cross for violating their rights to be served and now its going to cost him a lot of money I hope it cost him so much money that it causes him to close shop ... we don't need people like this in the UNited States of America doing business

P.S.
Nazi would not allow Gays to exist in their country ... the fact that you're soooooooo stupid to say "Nazi liberal" makes me laugh at your stupidity in these matters... after all being Nazi are conservative you know ... hitler supported the conservative way of thinking you moron

You are misinformed and spreading the BIG LIE. Nazis are leftwing Socialists who are in favor of a controlling government. There are no rightwing Socialists since the ultimate extreme of our wing would be anarchy - no government at all.

 

[BluesMistress]

There is a big difference when some one comes into a store wanting to purchase a cake/any item from the case and ordering a custom made anything.
The 1st one is generic ready for purchase...No problem...
It get's much trickier when some one is asking for custom made as cake making is an Art.

As an artist my work is MY Work and I should have a say as to where it goes and who it goes to. Who will see it and where my name is attached to that piece of work.
I sell stuff that I've got in stock to anyone who has the money to pay me for my craft. No questions asked. Just pay me and it's yours. There is no attachment to those pieces. They were made with no one in mind just for making money. I enjoy the work but....

If you come to me and want custom work done, I should/Do have a choice as to if I want to do business with you. Do I have to use the materials or a design you want even if it's not my talent or even my desire to do work with you? I don't work for You. I have a gift and I share it with those I chose to. I'm not obligated to share my artwork with You or anyone that wants me to do something I don't believe I can do my very BEST at.
Why would anyone want ART work that the artist does not have a real passion for. My custom work is made from the heart. Each part of the process is a thing of love. It's a part of me and no one can ever own that part of me. I share it. It's my Art & I own it.

I'm not a cake maker..but it is hand made. What they are wanting to order is a custom hand made cake from a professional cake maker. They are not there to buy a cake they are there to negotiate the making of a custom made cake. There is no set price and the cake will be decorated by hand with a design that the maker should have the choice as to if they want to take on the order or not. He may be busy, she may not have the juju needed for a design that day. It's all up to the artist if they want to do custom work. Always should be the choice of the artist as it Their Art. They own it.

It's the artwark they are buying otherwise they would just go to Costco and get a cake. You can get the same exact design at any Costco. They'll customize with a name or congratulations across the top in several color choices

For me it's if you want a cake then buy one. There are all kinds of cakes already made in the case. Take your pick....But the cake maker/artist should never be obligated to do custom work they are not comfortable doing for any reason.

The first question is whether or not your business is a public accommodation. The question must be that simple. Consider the chaos that would ensue if everyone could declare themselves an artist or a religion. Why is Hooters not performance art? What about stadium seating to view performance art on ice?

The second question is whether or not the group in question is a protected class.
Protected class - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. The Federal Goverment has specified certain protected classes. States may expand the list.
Example 1: New Mexico and Colorado include sexual orientation. Arizona does not.
Example 2: California's Unruh act includes many groups as protected classes. Some bizarre cases have occurred as a result.
Unruh Civil Rights Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The SCOTUS has not interfered with the rights of states to define additional protected classes.

Hooters employees choose to work there. If they don't like it they can quit. No one is making them perform anything they are not willingly doing. And they are making tips performing their art. Hooter chicks are employees. Cake maker is Owner. Hootors chicks do no hand made art unless under the table. Cake maker is making a custom made item otherwise buy a freakin' cake that's already made. Asking for custom made is much different than in the case. Same cake mix..Same frosting mix..What is customer asking for that different. They want hand made custom artwork made from frosting on a cake. That's the difference. They can get a cake anywhere...What they are negociating is the cake makers Artwork on top of a specialty item. If there's a wedding cake in the case already made i see no reason it would not be sold to anyone willing to pay the price. There is nothing there that is personal it's just another cake. When it comes to custom Artwork the Artist owns all rights until sold for usually a much higher price than the generic cake in the case.

 

[Bfgrn]

Opposition to homosexuality comes from all quarters, not just the Conservatives...

No, pretty much just you right wingers.

Survey: Americans turn sharply favorable on gay issues | Religion News Service

Stand proud with your brethren...

The Global Divide on Homosexuality | Pew Research Center's Global Attitudes Project

 

[P@triot]

There is a difference in the eyes of the law

A person cannot help being black or gay. They are born that way. But Redneck Conservatives are that way by CHOICE. So "No Shirt, no Shoes, no Service" signs are a legal and effective way of keeping them out of your establishment
Besides, paying customers find it objectionable being forced to dine with them. You know how they are

Dude, what are you talking about?!? There are tons of children out there who can't afford shoes. They can't help that. But you think they should be denied food and die in the streets?

You keep contradicting yourself. I feel sorry for you (when I'm not laughing at you )

No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service........is just a subtle way to keep Redneck Conservative trash out of respectable Buisiness establishments. You have to appreciate that most people do not want their children subjected such people

Employees must wash hands is another little sign to dissuade Conservative rednecks from working for you

RW desperately trying to get a rise out of someone....

 

[Kondor3]

Opposition to homosexuality comes from all quarters, not just the Conservatives...

No, pretty much just you right wingers...

You go right on believing those slanted polls... it won't affect the next round of legal challenges, after January 20, 2017...

"Change... yes we can"

 

[NYcarbineer]

Your religion is not a special privilege that exempts you from obeying the law.

Like everything else in life, you have it completely backwards...

The law does not get to impede on my religion. You would know that if you ever actually read the U.S. Constitution.

Then I guess Sharia Law can be put in place where Muslims have the votes for it.

 

[Kondor3]

Your religion is not a special privilege that exempts you from obeying the law.

Like everything else in life, you have it completely backwards...

The law does not get to impede on my religion. You would know that if you ever actually read the U.S. Constitution.

Then I guess Sharia Law can be put in place where Muslims have the votes for it.

In the final analysis, the Constitution says what We The People say that it says.

 

[The T]

Opposition to homosexuality comes from all quarters, not just the Conservatives...

No, pretty much just you right wingers.

Survey: Americans turn sharply favorable on gay issues | Religion News Service

Stand proud with your brethren...

The Global Divide on Homosexuality | Pew Research Center's Global Attitudes Project

Oh Lookie! Another worthless Graph from BuFu...

 

[Mac1958]

Opposition to homosexuality comes from all quarters, not just the Conservatives...

No, pretty much just you right wingers.

Survey: Americans turn sharply favorable on gay issues | Religion News Service

Stand proud with your brethren...

The Global Divide on Homosexuality | Pew Research Center's Global Attitudes Project

Oh Lookie! Another worthless Graph from BuFu...

They continue to purposely conflate voluntary acceptance with forced conformity.

If they were to admit that they're forcing conformity, they would have to admit how far they have strayed from the time that liberals were strongly for individual thought and freedom of expression.

They know what they're doing, they know how far they have strayed, but they sure as hell won't admit it.

.

 

[Fishlore]

The gay community and the liberals have lost their little Nazi minds. A privately owned business has the right to refuse to conduct business with anybody they want. Period. It's not even open for debate.

This has got to be one of the silliest OP in the history of USMB. Neither liberals nor gays, had much of a friendly relationship with DSAP. Gay liberal Nazis are hard to find.

The legal basis for banning discrimination in places of public accommodation is well understood by those with even a smattering of legal education. The anarchists and libertarians who dismiss this constitutional law do so from their personal a priori assumption that the US Constitution means you can do whatever the hell you want. Such solipsism is pathologically stupid.

 

[PaintMyHouse]

Or you could grow the fuck up and go to a baker who wants to bake the cake you want to buy instead of running to government to use guns to force people to do your bidding.

You must have been the prized student, at your Drama Queen school.

Now that's funny, I repeated your post back to you and you saw it in the mirror but didn't recognize it was your own reflection.

Liberals, no one could make you people up. LOL.

What I saw was your stupidity, and inability to grow up, like these cake bakers.

 

[kaz]

You must have been the prized student, at your Drama Queen school.

Now that's funny, I repeated your post back to you and you saw it in the mirror but didn't recognize it was your own reflection.

Liberals, no one could make you people up. LOL.

What I saw was your stupidity, and inability to grow up, like these cake bakers.

Yes, you saw me repeat back to you what you said and you saw yourself as a Drama Queen, stupid and with an inability to grow up.

I used your words BECAUSE it was stupid Drama Queen. And even with your own words in the same quote, you didn't see yourself, and when I told you it was you you still don't. How stupid are you exactly?

 

[PaintMyHouse]

Now that's funny, I repeated your post back to you and you saw it in the mirror but didn't recognize it was your own reflection.

Liberals, no one could make you people up. LOL.

What I saw was your stupidity, and inability to grow up, like these cake bakers.

Yes, you saw me repeat back to you what you said and you saw yourself as a Drama Queen, stupid and with an inability to grow up.

I used your words BECAUSE it was stupid Drama Queen. And even with your own words in the same quote, you didn't see yourself, and when I told you it was you you still don't. How stupid are you exactly?

I have no drama about this, that's you guys. It's a cake, it's business, bake it. My crisis pregnancy center client doesn't care about my politics nor do I care about theirs. They care that I do my job and I care that their checks clear. That's all that matters, it's business. Grownups know this which is why you don't.

 

[Zombie_Pundit]

There is a big difference when some one comes into a store wanting to purchase a cake/any item from the case and ordering a custom made anything.
The 1st one is generic ready for purchase...No problem...
It get's much trickier when some one is asking for custom made as cake making is an Art.

As an artist my work is MY Work and I should have a say as to where it goes and who it goes to. Who will see it and where my name is attached to that piece of work.
I sell stuff that I've got in stock to anyone who has the money to pay me for my craft. No questions asked. Just pay me and it's yours. There is no attachment to those pieces. They were made with no one in mind just for making money. I enjoy the work but....

If you come to me and want custom work done, I should/Do have a choice as to if I want to do business with you. Do I have to use the materials or a design you want even if it's not my talent or even my desire to do work with you? I don't work for You. I have a gift and I share it with those I chose to. I'm not obligated to share my artwork with You or anyone that wants me to do something I don't believe I can do my very BEST at.
Why would anyone want ART work that the artist does not have a real passion for. My custom work is made from the heart. Each part of the process is a thing of love. It's a part of me and no one can ever own that part of me. I share it. It's my Art & I own it.

I'm not a cake maker..but it is hand made. What they are wanting to order is a custom hand made cake from a professional cake maker. They are not there to buy a cake they are there to negotiate the making of a custom made cake. There is no set price and the cake will be decorated by hand with a design that the maker should have the choice as to if they want to take on the order or not. He may be busy, she may not have the juju needed for a design that day. It's all up to the artist if they want to do custom work. Always should be the choice of the artist as it Their Art. They own it.

It's the artwark they are buying otherwise they would just go to Costco and get a cake. You can get the same exact design at any Costco. They'll customize with a name or congratulations across the top in several color choices

For me it's if you want a cake then buy one. There are all kinds of cakes already made in the case. Take your pick....But the cake maker/artist should never be obligated to do custom work they are not comfortable doing for any reason.

The first question is whether or not your business is a public accommodation. The question must be that simple. Consider the chaos that would ensue if everyone could declare themselves an artist or a religion. Why is Hooters not performance art? What about stadium seating to view performance art on ice?

The second question is whether or not the group in question is a protected class.
Protected class - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. The Federal Goverment has specified certain protected classes. States may expand the list.
Example 1: New Mexico and Colorado include sexual orientation. Arizona does not.
Example 2: California's Unruh act includes many groups as protected classes. Some bizarre cases have occurred as a result.
Unruh Civil Rights Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The SCOTUS has not interfered with the rights of states to define additional protected classes.

Hooters employees choose to work there. If they don't like it they can quit. No one is making them perform anything they are not willingly doing. And they are making tips performing their art. Hooter chicks are employees. Cake maker is Owner. Hootors chicks do no hand made art unless under the table. Cake maker is making a custom made item otherwise buy a freakin' cake that's already made. Asking for custom made is much different than in the case. Same cake mix..Same frosting mix..What is customer asking for that different. They want hand made custom artwork made from frosting on a cake. That's the difference. They can get a cake anywhere...What they are negociating is the cake makers Artwork on top of a specialty item. If there's a wedding cake in the case already made i see no reason it would not be sold to anyone willing to pay the price. There is nothing there that is personal it's just another cake. When it comes to custom Artwork the Artist owns all rights until sold for usually a much higher price than the generic cake in the case.

If the proprietors of Hooters decided to start discriminating against serving veterans (a federally protected class), not that Hooters would, then as a public accommodation they would be in violation of the law. That you think the proprietors of Hooters are not creating art and hiring people to fill roles in their performance artwork is your opinion. The proprietors of Hooters are free to say you are wrong and that they work with and choreograph their employees to make pleasing performance art and that this artistic status precludes them from public accommodation laws. And while free to claim that, they would be wrong.
It is evident that wedding cakes are considered public accommodation in Colorado. SCOTUS has already denied certiorari to the New Mexico Photographer
Elane Photography, LLC v. Willock : SCOTUSblog
I don't see them taking up the case of the Colorado baker.

 

[AvgGuyIA]

What I saw was your stupidity, and inability to grow up, like these cake bakers.

Yes, you saw me repeat back to you what you said and you saw yourself as a Drama Queen, stupid and with an inability to grow up.

I used your words BECAUSE it was stupid Drama Queen. And even with your own words in the same quote, you didn't see yourself, and when I told you it was you you still don't. How stupid are you exactly?

I have no drama about this, that's you guys. It's a cake, it's business, bake it. My crisis pregnancy center client doesn't care about my politics nor do I care about theirs. They care that I do my job and I care that their checks clear. That's all that matters, it's business. Grownups know this which is why you don't.

You kill babies for a living?