Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

[dblack]

We discussed this.

Yeah. Did you forget what we talked about? Already?

Why don't you quote my whole post?

I'ts been discussed earlier in the thread.

Again. Nobody is cracking up on my travel, or citizen's travel or any of my constitutional rights.
Illegals have no rights to be here, therefore they have no constitutional rights that citizens have.

From where do you get your unalienable Rights from?

I see where your'e heading. No, I haven't said that illegals don't have any rights, they just don't have all constitutional rights and/or protections that citizens have.

The Courts disagree with you on that one. So, I have to ask you again, from where do your Rights come from?

It depends on who is in power. Their values blow with the wind.

 

[Porter Rockwell]

Free men are not equal and equal men are not free.

Your avatar suggests that you are against big government, but the stance you take says otherwise.

"And it says in the Farmer's Almanac: If a man could have half his wishes, he'd just double his trouble." Johnny Cash in the song Farmer's Almanac

Which is more important to you: that something be done legally OR that it be done constitutionally?

Which is more important to you: that something be done legally OR that it be done constitutionally?

Trick question, right? Neither are mutually exclusive.

.

There are plenty of unconstitutional laws on the books. We simply have an uninformed, lazy and apathetic citizenry that don't give two hoots in Hell.

Sure, but that wasn't the premise of your question.

.[/QUOTE

I asked if one prefers that actions be done constitutionally or legally. It is an error to presume the terminology is synonymous.

Actually they are synonymous, a law isn't legal if it's unconstitutional. We just need judges that follow the Constitution.

.

You're still wrong on two counts. Not all laws that are on the books are constitutional; we don't have a legal obligation to obey them AND, secondly, the citizenry has to step up to the plate and own their part in what's going on.

You can't sit back and think the government is going to do what they're supposed to if YOU don't do what you're supposed to do. In addition, it's YOUR duty to hold government accountable. They can't hear you if all you're doing is complaining on discussion boards.

 

[Porter Rockwell]

You can;'t have a society with safety nets, welfare, free medical, and the minimum wage and then turn around allow everyone who wants to to come here from poverty stricken countries. American jobs for Americans.

Which is precisely the reason I oppose safety nets, welfare, free medical, and the minimum wage. But the answer is to reverse those bad decisions - not use them as an excuse to turn our nation into a fascist hellhole. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Enforcing our immigration laws and building a wall will turn this nation into a fascist hell hole? Based on what evidence?

It's not that we're putting citizens into internment camps or something.

These boneheads are actually trying to argue that foreigners have a right to emigrate to the United States.

Where do you get YOUR Rights from?

Some boneheads believe that Liberty is an unalienable Right and citizenship is a privilege. What do you think? Do you think that only some elite group of people were "endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights?

Instead of making allegations, I dare you to answer the questions and quit trying to anticipate where I'm going. If you knew that, you wouldn't have an immigration problem today.

 

[dblack]

I will overlook your ignorance. I'm not a lefty. In the more than thirty years of voting - never missing a single election, I have voted for exactly ONE Democrat (and that was for the PSC.) I've also been an officer in my local Republican Party.

But their ignorance is central to the argument. Trumpsters aren't conservatives. They don't know the difference between left and right. They are authoritarians. They're insecure idiots who long for a daddy figure to protect them from their lurid nightmares.

 

[bripat9643]

You can;'t have a society with safety nets, welfare, free medical, and the minimum wage and then turn around allow everyone who wants to to come here from poverty stricken countries. American jobs for Americans.

Which is precisely the reason I oppose safety nets, welfare, free medical, and the minimum wage. But the answer is to reverse those bad decisions - not use them as an excuse to turn our nation into a fascist hellhole. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Enforcing our immigration laws and building a wall will turn this nation into a fascist hell hole? Based on what evidence?

It's not that we're putting citizens into internment camps or something.

These boneheads are actually trying to argue that foreigners have a right to emigrate to the United States.

Where do you get YOUR Rights from?

Some boneheads believe that Liberty is an unalienable Right and citizenship is a privilege. What do you think? Do you think that only some elite group of people were "endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights?

Instead of making allegations, I dare you to answer the questions and quit trying to anticipate where I'm going. If you knew that, you wouldn't have an immigration problem today.

The bottom line is that foreigners have no right to live in the United States.

End of story.

 

[danielpalos]

Mandatory.
Nationwide.
Federal Law.
Now.

where is the express wall building power in our federal Constitution? We have a general welfare clause not a general warfare clause.

The "general welfare clause" doesn't mean what you think it means.

it doesn't mean what You think it means.

What you think it means is already in place in Venezuela, not here.

FDR gave us our examples. Thank Goodness he was a left winger.

 

[danielpalos]

You can;'t have a society with safety nets, welfare, free medical, and the minimum wage and then turn around allow everyone who wants to to come here from poverty stricken countries. American jobs for Americans.

Which is precisely the reason I oppose safety nets, welfare, free medical, and the minimum wage. But the answer is to reverse those bad decisions - not use them as an excuse to turn our nation into a fascist hellhole. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Enforcing our immigration laws and building a wall will turn this nation into a fascist hell hole? Based on what evidence?

we don't have an immigration clause or express wall building clause.

 

[Porter Rockwell]

I will overlook your ignorance. I'm not a lefty. In the more than thirty years of voting - never missing a single election, I have voted for exactly ONE Democrat (and that was for the PSC.) I've also been an officer in my local Republican Party.

But their ignorance is central to the argument. Trumpsters aren't conservatives. They don't know the difference between left and right. They are authoritarians. They're insecure idiots who long for a daddy figure to protect them from their lurid nightmares.

I think that if they were honest with us and with themselves, they might understand that. It's really frustrating that they cannot divorce themselves from right v. left; conservative v. liberal; Republican v. Democrat and engage in an honest and civil discussion.

 

[danielpalos]

Wall cowards gonna cower. "Protect me! I'm afraid! Of all the scary stories you've been telling me!" You morons are turning our nation toward fascism.

That's funny, you use the exact same reasoning calling for gun confiscation.

Yep. It's exactly the same. Politicians drum up phony fears to get people to give up their freedom.

You demand 100% gun confiscation ...

Uh... nope. You got the wrong guy. I'm opposed to gun control for the same reasons I oppose the wall.

There's nothing "phony" about the problems that illegals cause. They are real and demonstrable.

you think that is Bad; our alleged wars on crime, drugs, and terror create more of those people.

 

[toobfreak]

Wall cowards gonna cower. "Protect me! I'm afraid! Of all the scary stories you've been telling me!" You morons are turning our nation toward fascism.

That's funny, you use the exact same reasoning calling for gun confiscation.

Yep. It's exactly the same. Politicians drum up phony fears to get people to give up their freedom.

You demand 100% gun confiscation ...

Uh... nope. You got the wrong guy. I'm opposed to gun control for the same reasons I oppose the wall.

Fair enough, but you oppose the wall (protecting sovereignty against invasion) for the same reason you oppose gun-confiscation (LOSING sovereignty against invasion)? When they are two opposites? OH YES THEY ARE. Better think about it again.

 

[Ame®icano]

We discussed this.

Yeah. Did you forget what we talked about? Already?

Why don't you quote my whole post?

I'ts been discussed earlier in the thread.

Again. Nobody is cracking up on my travel, or citizen's travel or any of my constitutional rights.
Illegals have no rights to be here, therefore they have no constitutional rights that citizens have.

From where do you get your unalienable Rights from?

I see where your'e heading. No, I haven't said that illegals don't have any rights, they just don't have all constitutional rights and/or protections that citizens have.

The Courts disagree with you on that one. So, I have to ask you again, from where do your Rights come from?

Since you don't want to answer because you realize a very uncomfortable truth, is there any special reason you think you need the government to help you protect yourself from your own actions?

What court disagree with me? Do illegals have rights to be here or not? Do they have right to vote?

Where did you get that I am uncomfortable answering? I told you that I see where you're heading with it and I stay with my statement that illegals don't have all constitutional rights and/or protections that citizens have.

Now, you asked where my rights come from?

To answer that question, can you clarify what you considering that "rights" are?

 

[danielpalos]

Mandatory.
Nationwide.
Federal Law.
Now.

Wall cowards gonna cower. "Protect me! I'm afraid! Of all the scary stories you've been telling me!"

You morons are turning our nation toward fascism.

Why don't you just move to a country that doesn't give a shit about freedom and loves authoritarian government as much as you do?

Tell us something, dumbass: why don't you stick your finger in a light socket? Are you afraid? Are you a light socket coward?

That's exactly how stupid your post sounds.

Why should I care about the freedom of illegal aliens?

Are you able to commit logic?

It's simply immoral to reward people who break our laws. It's simple as that.

.

break what laws? we don't have an immigration clause. we have a naturalization clause.

 

[dblack]

Wall cowards gonna cower. "Protect me! I'm afraid! Of all the scary stories you've been telling me!" You morons are turning our nation toward fascism.

That's funny, you use the exact same reasoning calling for gun confiscation.

Yep. It's exactly the same. Politicians drum up phony fears to get people to give up their freedom.

You demand 100% gun confiscation ...

Uh... nope. You got the wrong guy. I'm opposed to gun control for the same reasons I oppose the wall.

Fair enough, but you oppose the wall (protecting sovereignty against invasion) for the same reason you oppose gun-confiscation (LOSING sovereignty against invasion)? When they are two opposites? OH YES THEY ARE. Better think about it again.

I've thought about it plenty. The wall isn't about protecting sovereignty against invasion. The fact that you call a mob of desperate poor people an "invasion" makes your whole argument laughable. But it's not a joke. The walls, and other authoritarian laws that you're clamoring for, will still be there when the mob dwindles - a testament to fear and stupidity. And they will be used against you.

 

[danielpalos]

You can;'t have a society with safety nets, welfare, free medical, and the minimum wage and then turn around allow everyone who wants to to come here from poverty stricken countries. American jobs for Americans.

Which is precisely the reason I oppose safety nets, welfare, free medical, and the minimum wage. But the answer is to reverse those bad decisions - not use them as an excuse to turn our nation into a fascist hellhole. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Enforcing our immigration laws and building a wall will turn this nation into a fascist hell hole? Based on what evidence?

It's not that we're putting citizens into internment camps or something.

These boneheads are actually trying to argue that foreigners have a right to emigrate to the United States.

natural rights are natural.

 

[OKTexas]

Trick question, right? Neither are mutually exclusive.

.

There are plenty of unconstitutional laws on the books. We simply have an uninformed, lazy and apathetic citizenry that don't give two hoots in Hell.

Sure, but that wasn't the premise of your question.

.[/QUOTE

I asked if one prefers that actions be done constitutionally or legally. It is an error to presume the terminology is synonymous.

Actually they are synonymous, a law isn't legal if it's unconstitutional. We just need judges that follow the Constitution.

.

You're still wrong on two counts. Not all laws that are on the books are constitutional; we don't have a legal obligation to obey them AND, secondly, the citizenry has to step up to the plate and own their part in what's going on.

You can't sit back and think the government is going to do what they're supposed to if YOU don't do what you're supposed to do. In addition, it's YOUR duty to hold government accountable. They can't hear you if all you're doing is complaining on discussion boards.

First, laws already on the books wasn't part of the discussion, but they do verify what I said about judges that need to follow the Constitution and what makes you think all I do is complain on a discussion board? I'm going to be dropping by my congressman's office this afternoon.

.

.

 

[Ame®icano]

Mandatory.
Nationwide.
Federal Law.
Now.

where is the express wall building power in our federal Constitution? We have a general welfare clause not a general warfare clause.

The "general welfare clause" doesn't mean what you think it means.

it doesn't mean what You think it means.

What you think it means is already in place in Venezuela, not here.

FDR gave us our examples. Thank Goodness he was a left winger.

You sure know your idols. If is not a communist, than is a progressive socialist.

 

[danielpalos]

Which is precisely the reason I oppose safety nets, welfare, free medical, and the minimum wage. But the answer is to reverse those bad decisions - not use them as an excuse to turn our nation into a fascist hellhole. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Enforcing our immigration laws and building a wall will turn this nation into a fascist hell hole? Based on what evidence?

It's not that we're putting citizens into internment camps or something.

These boneheads are actually trying to argue that foreigners have a right to emigrate to the United States.

Where do you get YOUR Rights from?

Some boneheads believe that Liberty is an unalienable Right and citizenship is a privilege. What do you think? Do you think that only some elite group of people were "endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights?

Instead of making allegations, I dare you to answer the questions and quit trying to anticipate where I'm going. If you knew that, you wouldn't have an immigration problem today.

The bottom line is that foreigners have no right to live in the United States.

End of story.

we have a naturalization clause not an immigration clause.

Government can't do anything right, remember.

 

[bripat9643]

Wall cowards gonna cower. "Protect me! I'm afraid! Of all the scary stories you've been telling me!" You morons are turning our nation toward fascism.

That's funny, you use the exact same reasoning calling for gun confiscation.

Yep. It's exactly the same. Politicians drum up phony fears to get people to give up their freedom.

You demand 100% gun confiscation ...

Uh... nope. You got the wrong guy. I'm opposed to gun control for the same reasons I oppose the wall.

Fair enough, but you oppose the wall (protecting sovereignty against invasion) for the same reason you oppose gun-confiscation (LOSING sovereignty against invasion)? When they are two opposites? OH YES THEY ARE. Better think about it again.

I've thought about it plenty. The wall isn't about protecting sovereignty against invasion. The fact that you call a mob of desperate poor people an "invasion" makes your whole argument laughable. But it's not a joke. The walls, and other authoritarian laws that you're clamoring for, will still be there when the mob dwindles - a testament to fear and stupidity. And they will be used against you.

There's nothing authoritarian about the wall, moron. When a mob of people say they are going to violate our border, that pretty much defines an invasion. If the wall was in place, then the mob can "dwindle" on the other side of the border.

The bottom line is that we gain nothing by admitting these people into our country, so why should we?

 

[danielpalos]

where is the express wall building power in our federal Constitution? We have a general welfare clause not a general warfare clause.

The "general welfare clause" doesn't mean what you think it means.

it doesn't mean what You think it means.

What you think it means is already in place in Venezuela, not here.

FDR gave us our examples. Thank Goodness he was a left winger.

You sure know your idols. If is not a communist, than is a progressive socialist.

Government solves all problems for the right wing.

 

[OKTexas]

Mandatory.
Nationwide.
Federal Law.
Now.

Wall cowards gonna cower. "Protect me! I'm afraid! Of all the scary stories you've been telling me!"

You morons are turning our nation toward fascism.

Why don't you just move to a country that doesn't give a shit about freedom and loves authoritarian government as much as you do?

Tell us something, dumbass: why don't you stick your finger in a light socket? Are you afraid? Are you a light socket coward?

That's exactly how stupid your post sounds.

Why should I care about the freedom of illegal aliens?

Are you able to commit logic?

It's simply immoral to reward people who break our laws. It's simple as that.

.

break what laws? we don't have an immigration clause. we have a naturalization clause.

I've already proven you're a liar on that one. So run along child.

.