Why would a God even need a hell?

[Mickiel]

[QUOTE="the_human_being, post: one of the best ways he can deceive the people of earth, is to get at them through Christianity. Because most people trust that.[/QUOTE]

People are often wrong. The majority is usually wrong. Satan is not in a place called Hell. Satan is god of this world and is walking about like a ravenous lion. Satan still has access to Heaven where he goes forth to accuse us. The idea that Satan has already been kicked out of Heaven is yet another error. People tend to believe the most absurd things because they do not study the Scriptures and tend to listen to too many pastors and preachers who teach false doctrine. I agree though, Satan's seat is in the church. He is using the false doctrines spouted by false ministers to lead millions astray.[/QUOTE]

Well in my view, satan was never a citizen of heaven, and he only gets in because God wants to give him an audience. To talk to him, and I think to give him orders, among whateverelse. The devil was never a part of heaven to be kicked out of it anyway. And the devil most certainly uses the church's of this world, false religion may well be the first seal opened in Rev. 6:2 and unleashed on humanity; it would fit history for sure, and the coming future; so that seal, that horse, may well be false religion. The horse is "White", so the world thinks its pure, the rider has a crown, so it has authority on earth, it has a bow, which could be a weapon, and that might just be misuse of the bible. I don't really know, but I suspect.

 

[Mickiel]

Why would a God even need a hell? Religion has tried to get away with teaching that he needs it to punish people;God will punish; he will punish humans, but religion got greedy and exsessive with their interpretation of the punishment and took it too far by saying it will be eternal. They took a common sense thing that God will do and turned it into ignorance and insanity, like humans are prone to do.

This is what religion does, they take reason and pervert it. This is why science rebelled against the church. They tried to take science, own it and pervert it. Science used to be a part of the church, but they grew tired of " Church dictated science", rebelled, and that is what created " The Scientific revolution."

 

[Mickiel]

Why would a God need a hell in eternity, when religion has created a hell on earth now? Why would God want us to live in hell , then die and go to another hell?

 

[Mickiel]

Here is an interesting article on hell being a Christian hoax;

23 Minutes In Hell

 

[BreezeWood]

Here is an interesting article on hell being a Christian hoax;

even so, for all the damage they have inflicted there does seem to be something to their receiving just punishment for that and other hoax's - satan, their worship of J included that if not for eternity then for as long as it takes for them to change their tune - or just keep burning happily everafter .... .

.

 

[MarathonMike]

It seems the most logical explanation for hell is that if you are creating a religion and you want people to adopt it, you need to motivate them. What better way to motivate new followers than the concept of infinite punishment?

 

[Mickiel]

It seems the most logical explanation for hell is that if you are creating a religion and you want people to adopt it, you need to motivate them. What better way to motivate new followers than the concept of infinite punishment?

That's true , its one of the reasons hell was created. In Pagan Rome, where Christianity originated, the early church began to desire more members, and they started pulling in a lot of people with pagan backrounds. Eventually they started absorbing some of the beliefs of these people ,and that' s how I think this hell concept crept in many churches.

 

[IndependantAce]

I have asked myself why a God would need a hell, ( and by hell I mean the Christian version of it). I mean here this great being of life and love , is said to have created a place of eternal misery? And something is just not right with that, because it makes no sense at all.

Makes no sense that there should be punishment for bad behavior?

My view of God, and I don't know God, have never seen him or heard his voice; is a view that I know is already distorted by many things; but I view him as merciful, loving, kind, forgiving, longsuffering, all the things that this Christian hell is not.

How is letting evil go unpunished a "kind" thing? Sounds like a cowardly thing to me.

Why would God make an eternal monument out of evil? For what? Why would such a being of great power of change, co-exist with misery forever? Why? I can't see it. I think something is seriously wrong with this myopic view of hell! The powers that exist which can seduce the consciousness of humanity into believing nonsense, is simply stunning.

As opposed to what nonsense; that right and wrong is meaningless and therefore Hitler is no "worse" than anyone else beyond pure subjectivity?

That's a nonsense far greater than hell.

 

[Mudda]

God needs hell because he can't stand all the assholes he made.

 

[Mickiel]

Jesus must be considered when we try to understand what God will do; in Luke 9:56, Jesus teaching, "For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them." Jesus did not come here to create some kind of hell pit, he came here to convert men. We must consider that he got that from God himself. In 1 John 4:14, " We have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be " The Savior of the World!" God sent Jesus here to save the world, that means everyone, not just believers.

This renders hell obsolete.

 

[Mudda]

Jesus must be considered when we try to understand what God will do; in Luke 9:56, Jesus teaching, "For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them." Jesus did not come here to create some kind of hell pit, he came here to convert men. We must consider that he got that from God himself. In 1 John 4:14, " We have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be " The Savior of the World!" God sent Jesus here to save the world, that means everyone, not just believers.

This renders hell obsolete.

You quote from a book that says that hell exists to say that hell doesn't exist. Brah, get with the plan.

 

[Mickiel]

Jesus must be considered when we try to understand what God will do; in Luke 9:56, Jesus teaching, "For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them." Jesus did not come here to create some kind of hell pit, he came here to convert men. We must consider that he got that from God himself. In 1 John 4:14, " We have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be " The Savior of the World!" God sent Jesus here to save the world, that means everyone, not just believers.

This renders hell obsolete.

You quote from a book that says that hell exists to say that hell doesn't exist. Brah, get with the plan.

Interesting, I think it is you who is uninformed and need to get to the new knowledge coming into play;

How many times is hell mentioned in the Bible?

 

[Mudda]

Jesus must be considered when we try to understand what God will do; in Luke 9:56, Jesus teaching, "For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them." Jesus did not come here to create some kind of hell pit, he came here to convert men. We must consider that he got that from God himself. In 1 John 4:14, " We have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be " The Savior of the World!" God sent Jesus here to save the world, that means everyone, not just believers.

This renders hell obsolete.

You quote from a book that says that hell exists to say that hell doesn't exist. Brah, get with the plan.

Interesting, I think it is you who is uninformed and need to get to the new knowledge coming into play;

How many times is hell mentioned in the Bible?

The concept of hell is well defined in the bible. Plus it IS mentioned. Stop being so dishonest.
What Does the Bible Teach About Hell?

 

[Mickiel]

Jesus must be considered when we try to understand what God will do; in Luke 9:56, Jesus teaching, "For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them." Jesus did not come here to create some kind of hell pit, he came here to convert men. We must consider that he got that from God himself. In 1 John 4:14, " We have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be " The Savior of the World!" God sent Jesus here to save the world, that means everyone, not just believers.

This renders hell obsolete.

You quote from a book that says that hell exists to say that hell doesn't exist. Brah, get with the plan.

Interesting, I think it is you who is uninformed and need to get to the new knowledge coming into play;

How many times is hell mentioned in the Bible?

The concept of hell is well defined in the bible. Plus it IS mentioned. Stop being so dishonest.
What Does the Bible Teach About Hell?

I have a few more websites of my own. The hell in the bible's now is a misleading mistranslation, but you simply are not aware of that. So your using the knowledge that you have, and I understand that. We can only be conscious of, those things we are conscious of;

Bible Reality Check--A Case Against Hell

 

[Mickiel]

Hey, why would a God need a hell, if he had common sense and the power to save?

 

[hadit]

[QUOTE="hadit, post:
Down that road lies the "it doesn't matter how I live my life and if I totally reject all of God's love and mercy" failure.

Well in my view, it really does not matter; our salvation, or human salvation is not based on how we live, its an inheritance; its a gift from God; its really a miracle, but that's just how God really is, he is NOT like religion has portrayed him; he will have us ALL saved, period! Notice Rev. 22:11, " He that is unjust, let him remain that way, he which is filthy, let him be that way still, and he that is righteous, let them remain that way, and those who are holy, let them be holy still." In other words, it does not matter, our salvation is a done deal. The Christian hell is illrelevant.

Since you cited Revelation, I shall as well. From Rev 20:

14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.

And from Rev 21:

7 Those who are victorious will inherit all this, and I will be their God and they will be my children. 8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.

I mean, seriously. Do you really need me to cite all the places where God rejects sinful man?

 

[Mickiel]

[QUOTE="hadit, post: 14324721,
I mean, seriously. Do you really need me to cite all the places where God rejects sinful man?[/QUOTE]


Sure, why not; lets have them. Then I will respond each time with some verses of my own, such as Job 23:13, " But he is of one mind, and who can turn him? What his soul desires, THAT he DOES!" This is speaking about God. He does what he desires. Well, what does he desire? 1 Tim. 2:3-4, " For this is GOOD and ACCEPTABLE in the sight of God our Savior, who Desires that ALL men be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth."

God desires ALL men to be saved, even those who reject him, and those he rejected. And God GETS what he desires. Now the believers in God may not see this as good and they may not accept unbelievers, but salvation is not in their hands.

 

[hadit]

[QUOTE="hadit, post: 14324721,
I mean, seriously. Do you really need me to cite all the places where God rejects sinful man?

Sure, why not; lets have them. Then I will respond each time with some verses of my own, such as Job 23:13, " But he is of one mind, and who can turn him? What his soul desires, THAT he DOES!" This is speaking about God. He does what he desires. Well, what does he desire? 1 Tim. 2:3-4, " For this is GOOD and ACCEPTABLE in the sight of God our Savior, who Desires that ALL men be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth."

God desires ALL men to be saved, even those who reject him, and those he rejected. And God GETS what he desires. Now the believers in God may not see this as good and they may not accept unbelievers, but salvation is not in their hands.

Oh, please do. From Matthew 7:

22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles? 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

From 1 John:

16 For everything in the world—the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life—comes not from the Father but from the world.17 The world and its desires pass away, but whoever does the will of God lives forever.

There would be no reason whatsover to specify "whoever does the will of God" unless those who do not have a different fate. Now, as I said, please do continue trying to convince me that the entire theme of the Bible to have your life changed and to live a certain way is meaningless because in the end God's going to ignore your rebellion against Him. Go ahead.

 

[IsaacNewton]

There is a cartoon where it shows Jesus holding the face of a child and he says "I love you unconditionally my child, if you don't love me back I'll send you to a place to burn in horrific torture every second for a trillion years".

Isn't this exactly the same thing people that keep someone else captive in their basement for two decades tells their prey?

I think the whole "if you don't love me back you will suffer torture forever" thing is not only a 'condition' it is THE condition. It certainly removes the middle ground, either you are in or you are out. This is why most kristians refuse to believe things like evolution and an Earth that is billions of years old. The moment they do they are doomed to horrific torture by the all powerful benevolent deity who loves them unconditionally.

^ Duly dripping with sarcasm

 

[Mickiel]

[QUOTE="hadit, post: 14324721,
I mean, seriously. Do you really need me to cite all the places where God rejects sinful man?

Sure, why not; lets have them. Then I will respond each time with some verses of my own, such as Job 23:13, " But he is of one mind, and who can turn him? What his soul desires, THAT he DOES!" This is speaking about God. He does what he desires. Well, what does he desire? 1 Tim. 2:3-4, " For this is GOOD and ACCEPTABLE in the sight of God our Savior, who Desires that ALL men be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth."

God desires ALL men to be saved, even those who reject him, and those he rejected. And God GETS what he desires. Now the believers in God may not see this as good and they may not accept unbelievers, but salvation is not in their hands.

Oh, please do. From Matthew 7:

22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles? 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

From 1 John:

16 For everything in the world—the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life—comes not from the Father but from the world.17 The world and its desires pass away, but whoever does the will of God lives forever.

There would be no reason whatsover to specify "whoever does the will of God" unless those who do not have a different fate. Now, as I said, please do continue trying to convince me that the entire theme of the Bible to have your life changed and to live a certain way is meaningless because in the end God's going to ignore your rebellion against Him. Go ahead.

Certainly, I'll do so with much pleasure. In Romans 5:18, "Therefore as by the offense of one , judgment came upon ALL men unto condemnation, even so, by the righteousness of one man the FREE GIFT came upon ALL men unto the Justification of Life." All of mankind, good and evil, were condemned because of Adam, just as remarkable, those SAME ALL of humanity are saved by what Jesus did! Its incredible!

All the people that some believers in God are condemning, they are saved as a free token gesture by God himself. Its his gift; and I understand there are a lot of Christians who want to take that free gift away and condemn humans; but its too late, Jesus already paid for their sins. No Christian can use the bible to condemn anyone.

I mean I know they are still going to try to condemn people, because its their thing to do that. But Jesus has done his salvation thing; and its a done deal.