A challenge to ALL of you whining about P. Dean's firing

[kwc57]

Kevin, I normally agree with you. In this instance however, finding out that a 67 year old woman raised in the deep south once uttered the word ****** privately some 30 years ago about a bank robber waving a gun in people's faces is like finding out that water is wet. Look, I'm not even a Paula Deen fan. I always found her grating and a little went a long way. I agree that FN has the right to fire her. I simply think they were douches for doing it as it doesn't amount to a hill of beans and you'll never convince me that it would affect their bottom line. There are far too many other entertainers out there in all sorts of venues who are repeat offenders who get passes. Has Capital One fired Alec Baldwin yet? Do they court controversy for their product?

Again, KWC, not all entertainers are judged equally. A “bad boy” movie star can do and say things (and still get paid) that Paula Deen would not be able to get away with. Her product – what she built her career on – is something that can be categorized as clean and wholesome (ie a down to earth country lady cooking food). By admitting she called a black person a n**ger, in any context, her "wholesomeness" is going to take a hit. This is not shocking to me in the least.

Paula – whether or not she was the victim of a hypocritical witch hunt by the media – had her wholesome reputation tainted, and ultimately became a liability for the network.

And because the Food Network doesn't exist for the sole purpose of making sure Paula has a job and is cooking on TV, they weighed their options and decided it was best to dump her and not face a potential "jump ship" domino effect from their advertising partners. Maybe it would have all blown over, but when you have someone who is replaceable like Paula, and potentially tens of millions of dollars at stake - why take the risk? I mean, are you nuts?

If I was a shareholder of the network - and had significant dollars of MY money on the line - I would much rather choose the route that ensures overall network health vs. the route that puts everything on the line just to save Paula's ass. The latter would be an completely irresponsible management decision.

I don't think calling them "douches" for safeguarding the network is fair.

.

.

I understand your point. However, most Americans are pretty fair minded individuals who have all done or said something stupid in their younger days. As long as it isn't murder, rape or child molestation, we are pretty forgiving of something someone did 25 to 30 years ago.......especially considering their current record of good over the past 10 years or so. While FN has the right to hire and fire who they will, I think your statements of potential financial hard to FN are blown out of proportion. 10's of millions of dollars at stake if they kept her show? Really? A week from now it would be forgotten. I will say from the reaction I've seen online, there are far more people pissed that they let her go than there are people who would be pissed for letting her stay. Time will tell what the financial impact will be one way or the other. I think it was a knee jerk reaction on their part over an ancient indescretion on her part.

http://wtkr.com/2013/06/25/orders-for-paula-deen-cookbook-surge/

Advance orders for Paula Deen’s new cookbook have surged since the Food Network and Smithfield Foods axed her for using a racial slur.

Orders for “Paula Deen’s New Testament: 250 Favorite Recipes, All Lightened Up” surged on Amazon by nearly 1,300% in the last 24 hours.

The cookbook was ranked 115th on Tuesday, compared to a ranking of 1,592nd on Monday......................

 

[Cuyo]

Bill Mahr called Palin a slut and we all, including me, bitched about it being over the top.

I'm pretty sure the term ****** is just as bad.

How bout we STOP being hypocrites eh?

Actually he called her a bimbo.

I concur.

 

[Pogo]

Whatever the reason, there is no derogatory word I can think of (describing a white) on par with n**ger describing a black. It's in a class of its own in America; "cracker", "honky", etc do not carry the same historical baggage and therefore is much, MUCH less significant (and problematic when used) as a slur.

You are fully aware of this, I'm sure.

Don't play dumb.

.

Again, If the word is as bad as you say than blacks would not be using it.
Until blacks stop using the word themselves they have nothing to stand on when complaining about others using the word.

Might it be a sentiment of being the only thing they can own that's truly and solely "theirs" -- perverse as it is? Ya think?

Why? When Black use the terms redneck, cracker, honky, they are clearly meant as derogatory. So why are you giving them a pass on this?

I'll ask you the same thing

Does it hurt your feelings when a black calls you redneck, cracker or honky? Doesn't phase me in the least

Not in the least, but that does not excuse the their attempt at being derogatory.

They don't have nearly the same power for the reason that they don't have four hundred years of physical domination as a reference. They can only be reactionary, which pales in comparison.

It's still something that has to be moved past by all but let's at least grok where it's coming from.

Philosopher Richard Pryor recalling a trip to Africa:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AltWj4iAmno]The "N" Word - YouTube[/ame]

 

[kwc57]

She said in in private not on HBO which makes the whole matter worse , since we are now punishing people for what they said in private. Now that is a very scary cliff we are headed for.

The problem was that she publicly confessed to calling a black person a n**ger in a derogatory way. This damaged the product that she built up over the years (ie a nice wholesome old lady).

As a result, she became a liability and the network chose to ditch her rather than risk the overall network health by keeping letting her stay.

It's just business and pretty straightforward in my view.

.

People will say the darndest things under oath.

 

[kwc57]

Its a funny thing. We teach children that there are good words and bad words and that they should never use bad words.

Right... and if a word is bad, than it is bad for all races.
Otherwise it is just hypocritical bs

Again, a childish view

Blacks are allowed to use the term ****** and whites aren't

Bullshit! Anyone is "allowed" to use any word they want. Being black doesn't give you a pass on whether or not using the word ****** is offensive. It either is or it isn't.

 

[kwc57]

Again, a childish view

Blacks are allowed to use the term ****** and whites aren't

then you would agree that blacks are not allowed to use terms such as redneck, cracker, honky etc.

Correct?

Chris Rock explained it best

Two fat girls are allowed to call eachother fat.....but if a skinny girl does it, its just plain mean

Two poor people are allowed to joke about how poor they are.....but if a rich person does it, its just plain mean

Get it?

And you call other people's views childish?

 

[kwc57]

****** is different

Why? When Black use the terms redneck, cracker, honky, they are clearly meant as derogatory. So why are you giving them a pass on this?

Sorry Desperado, maybe it's because whites weren't slaves in America, or maybe it's because whites never where we're never shamed/disgraced by the Jim Crow laws, or maybe it's because whites usually don't have to worry about their skin color when interviewing, etc...

Whatever the reason, there is no derogatory word I can think of (describing a white) on par with n**ger describing a black. It's in a class of its own in America; "cracker", "honky", etc do not carry the same historical baggage and therefore is much, MUCH less significant (and problematic when used) as a slur.

You are fully aware of this, I'm sure.

Don't play dumb.

.

It's 2013, not 1865. You need to get with the times.

 

[bendog]

imo, it's a high tech lynching. I don't use her recipes though, because I'd like to continue living.

 

[Desperado]

And what is the lesson that Tarentino is trying to promote?

 

[Zona]

Why? When Black use the terms redneck, cracker, honky, they are clearly meant as derogatory. So why are you giving them a pass on this?

Sorry Desperado, maybe it's because whites weren't slaves in America, or maybe it's because whites never where we're never shamed/disgraced by the Jim Crow laws, or maybe it's because whites usually don't have to worry about their skin color when interviewing, etc...

Whatever the reason, there is no derogatory word I can think of (describing a white) on par with n**ger describing a black. It's in a class of its own in America; "cracker", "honky", etc do not carry the same historical baggage and therefore is much, MUCH less (and problematic when used) as a slur.

You are fully aware of this, I'm sure.

Don't play dumb.

.

It's 2013, not 1865. You need to get with the times.

1865?
In the 60's blacks couldn't vote, sit in certain areas to eat, had to degrade themselves by giving up a seat to whites etc etc.....perhaps you heard of the civil rights fight...that was a byproduct of this country having fucking slaves....HERE. yes things are better buy don't say its something from the 1800's. Luckily old bigots ate dying off and I pray for the future here but there are plenty of racist people who were taught how to be racist by their parents who remember the good ol days.

 

[KevinWestern]

Why? When Black use the terms redneck, cracker, honky, they are clearly meant as derogatory. So why are you giving them a pass on this?

Sorry Desperado, maybe it's because whites weren't slaves in America, or maybe it's because whites never where we're never shamed/disgraced by the Jim Crow laws, or maybe it's because whites usually don't have to worry about their skin color when interviewing, etc...

Whatever the reason, there is no derogatory word I can think of (describing a white) on par with n**ger describing a black. It's in a class of its own in America; "cracker", "honky", etc do not carry the same historical baggage and therefore is much, MUCH less significant (and problematic when used) as a slur.

You are fully aware of this, I'm sure.

Don't play dumb.

.

It's 2013, not 1865. You need to get with the times.

Not understanding your point.

Racism is still alive and well in 2013.

 

[KevinWestern]

And what is the lesson that Tarentino is trying to promote?

Who ever said Tarantino is America's moral compass, or that Americans weren't hypocritical?

.

 

[Zona]

And what is the lesson that Tarentino is trying to promote?

Did he have segregated bathrooms? Did he jave anything to do.with slave style weddings?

You see, directing a movie and being a racist in real life are two different things it seems.

 

[KevinWestern]

Kevin, I normally agree with you. In this instance however, finding out that a 67 year old woman raised in the deep south once uttered the word ****** privately some 30 years ago about a bank robber waving a gun in people's faces is like finding out that water is wet. Look, I'm not even a Paula Deen fan. I always found her grating and a little went a long way. I agree that FN has the right to fire her. I simply think they were douches for doing it as it doesn't amount to a hill of beans and you'll never convince me that it would affect their bottom line. There are far too many other entertainers out there in all sorts of venues who are repeat offenders who get passes. Has Capital One fired Alec Baldwin yet? Do they court controversy for their product?

Again, KWC, not all entertainers are judged equally. A “bad boy” movie star can do and say things (and still get paid) that Paula Deen would not be able to get away with. Her product – what she built her career on – is something that can be categorized as clean and wholesome (ie a down to earth country lady cooking food). By admitting she called a black person a n**ger, in any context, her "wholesomeness" is going to take a hit. This is not shocking to me in the least.

Paula – whether or not she was the victim of a hypocritical witch hunt by the media – had her wholesome reputation tainted, and ultimately became a liability for the network.

And because the Food Network doesn't exist for the sole purpose of making sure Paula has a job and is cooking on TV, they weighed their options and decided it was best to dump her and not face a potential "jump ship" domino effect from their advertising partners. Maybe it would have all blown over, but when you have someone who is replaceable like Paula, and potentially tens of millions of dollars at stake - why take the risk? I mean, are you nuts?

If I was a shareholder of the network - and had significant dollars of MY money on the line - I would much rather choose the route that ensures overall network health vs. the route that puts everything on the line just to save Paula's ass. The latter would be an completely irresponsible management decision.

I don't think calling them "douches" for safeguarding the network is fair.

.

.

I understand your point. However, most Americans are pretty fair minded individuals who have all done or said something stupid in their younger days. As long as it isn't murder, rape or child molestation, we are pretty forgiving of something someone did 25 to 30 years ago.......especially considering their current record of good over the past 10 years or so. While FN has the right to hire and fire who they will, I think your statements of potential financial hard to FN are blown out of proportion. 10's of millions of dollars at stake if they kept her show? Really? A week from now it would be forgotten. I will say from the reaction I've seen online, there are far more people pissed that they let her go than there are people who would be pissed for letting her stay. Time will tell what the financial impact will be one way or the other. I think it was a knee jerk reaction on their part over an ancient indescretion on her part.

http://wtkr.com/2013/06/25/orders-for-paula-deen-cookbook-surge/

Advance orders for Paula Deen’s new cookbook have surged since the Food Network and Smithfield Foods axed her for using a racial slur.

Orders for “Paula Deen’s New Testament: 250 Favorite Recipes, All Lightened Up” surged on Amazon by nearly 1,300% in the last 24 hours.

The cookbook was ranked 115th on Tuesday, compared to a ranking of 1,592nd on Monday......................

On phone so I'll make it short, but just wanted to add that I heard Paula's show was on shaky standings with the FN before the scandal. Things weren't going strong to begin with, so the scandal just made the decision a no brainer.

Anyways...

.

 

[bendog]

Dean said she'd like to throw a wedding party to mime a traditional southern wedding, where the servers were african american men in tuxes and (I presume) white gloves. I'm not sure that in itself is racist. It certainly outs her for what she is. She's a 71 year old white deep south woman. A product of her times. Reagan himslef used the N word.

20 years ago I went to a "real" Xmas party with the same dressed servers, who literally were retainers of a very old and at the time wealthy family. I was very uncomfortable, being a white male. It was a trip, but not a world I'd enjoy. I'm not sure how the african american males felt, because it was reality for them. But, I can see a african american male willing to play the part to reinact history.

Now if she hired, fired, promoted for racial reasons ... that would be very wrong.

 

[rightwinger]

Right... and if a word is bad, than it is bad for all races.
Otherwise it is just hypocritical bs

Again, a childish view

Blacks are allowed to use the term ****** and whites aren't

Bullshit! Anyone is "allowed" to use any word they want. Being black doesn't give you a pass on whether or not using the word ****** is offensive. It either is or it isn't.

When you deal with children you teach them that there are good words and there are bad words. Children are taught that they should not use bad words. It makes things easier

With adults, we expect them to learn the social nuances of speech and that some words are acceptable in some circumstances and unacceptable in others

Blacks are allowed to use the "N-word" whites are not

 

[Uncensored2008]

I'm new to this horseshit spectacle, first thread but I suspect she's no Democrat..

In fact... it looks like just another Democrat, "Throw the Senior Citizen off the Cliff, so we can legally steal their money" thing.

She's a democrat, an Obama supporter, and one of the celebrity props for the Obama's - having Michelle on her cooking show.

 

[rightwinger]

then you would agree that blacks are not allowed to use terms such as redneck, cracker, honky etc.

Correct?

Chris Rock explained it best

Two fat girls are allowed to call eachother fat.....but if a skinny girl does it, its just plain mean

Two poor people are allowed to joke about how poor they are.....but if a rich person does it, its just plain mean

Get it?

And you call other people's views childish?

The key issue is power. The words of those in a position of power have more impact

 

[KevinWestern]

The scandal might be horseshit, petty, unsubstantiated, and unnecessary.

But there does exist a scandal, remember that. And that (in it of itself) is enough grounds for the FN to fire Paula to avoid heart ache down the road.

Life isn't fair, and sometimes silly and insignificant missteps from our past come back to haunt us.

.

 

[Desperado]

Blacks are allowed to use the "N-word" whites are not

Which in itself is being racist.