A few questions for the fundies

[Cecilie1200]

Nope. Couple of reasons. First of all, I would challenge your assertion that morals "predate" the Bible. They may predate the writing and compilation of the Bible, but that doesn't mean they predate the events contained in the Bible.

Second, there's a big difference between killing people for certain behaviors and the system of morality laid out in the Bible, just as there is a difference between a mob lynching a man accused of murder and a court convicting and sentencing a man accused of murder.

So where does god drowning all those people and animals in the Flood stand? Moral act? Or immoral act?

Are you seriously asking me to judge the Almighty Creator of the Universe to human standards? That is a level of hubris I wouldn't even begin to contemplate.

So your invisible buddy gets a pass on mass murder. How very moral of you both.

Do you also spend a lot of time raging at Mother Nature for being "immoral"?

So god has no control over himself?

God is not a human being. He does not have the same imperatives, limitations, goals, or motivations on Him that humans do. To expect Him to behave as a human does is to expect Mother Nature to do so.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

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What a load of bullshit. Nobody is forcing them to bake a cake. Fucking stupid.

 

[Taz]

So where does god drowning all those people and animals in the Flood stand? Moral act? Or immoral act?

Are you seriously asking me to judge the Almighty Creator of the Universe to human standards? That is a level of hubris I wouldn't even begin to contemplate.

So your invisible buddy gets a pass on mass murder. How very moral of you both.

Do you also spend a lot of time raging at Mother Nature for being "immoral"?

So god has no control over himself?

God is not a human being. He does not have the same imperatives, limitations, goals, or motivations on Him that humans do. To expect Him to behave as a human does is to expect Mother Nature to do so.

So god can kill and it’s all good. And you claim the moral high ground? That’s laughable. Seriously.

 

[hadit]

Nope. Couple of reasons. First of all, I would challenge your assertion that morals "predate" the Bible. They may predate the writing and compilation of the Bible, but that doesn't mean they predate the events contained in the Bible.

Second, there's a big difference between killing people for certain behaviors and the system of morality laid out in the Bible, just as there is a difference between a mob lynching a man accused of murder and a court convicting and sentencing a man accused of murder.

So where does god drowning all those people and animals in the Flood stand? Moral act? Or immoral act?

Are you seriously asking me to judge the Almighty Creator of the Universe to human standards? That is a level of hubris I wouldn't even begin to contemplate.

So your invisible buddy gets a pass on mass murder. How very moral of you both.

When you see your neighbor kill his wife, and you grab him, shackle him in chains and confine him in your basement for a while before you kill him, you are charged with a crime, yes?

Yet when the police do it, they are fulfilling their legal responsibility.

You are not God. He has authority you do not.

The police don’t have the authority to do a mass killing. EPIC FAIL.

Waco.

 

[zaangalewa]

So where does god drowning all those people and animals in the Flood stand? Moral act? Or immoral act?

Are you seriously asking me to judge the Almighty Creator of the Universe to human standards? That is a level of hubris I wouldn't even begin to contemplate.

So your invisible buddy gets a pass on mass murder. How very moral of you both.

Do you also spend a lot of time raging at Mother Nature for being "immoral"?

So god has no control over himself?

God is not a human being. ...

Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the catholic faith. Which faith except every one do keep whole and undefiled; without doubt he shall perish everlastingly. And the catholic faith is this: That we worship one God in Trinity, and Trinity in Unity; Neither confounding the Persons; nor dividing the Essence. For there is one Person of the Father; another of the Son; and another of the Holy Ghost. But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, is all one; the Glory equal, the Majesty coeternal. Such as the Father is; such is the Son; and such is the Holy Ghost. The Father uncreated; the Son uncreated; and the Holy Ghost uncreated. The Father unlimited; the Son unlimited; and the Holy Ghost unlimited. The Father eternal; the Son eternal; and the Holy Ghost eternal. And yet they are not three eternals; but one eternal. As also there are not three uncreated; nor three infinites, but one uncreated; and one infinite. So likewise the Father is Almighty; the Son Almighty; and the Holy Ghost Almighty. And yet they are not three Almighties; but one Almighty. So the Father is God; the Son is God; and the Holy Ghost is God. And yet they are not three Gods; but one God. So likewise the Father is Lord; the Son Lord; and the Holy Ghost Lord. And yet not three Lords; but one Lord. For like as we are compelled by the Christian verity; to acknowledge every Person by himself to be God and Lord; So are we forbidden by the catholic religion; to say, There are three Gods, or three Lords. The Father is made of none; neither created, nor begotten. The Son is of the Father alone; not made, nor created; but begotten. The Holy Ghost is of the Father and of the Son; neither made, nor created, nor begotten; but proceeding. So there is one Father, not three Fathers; one Son, not three Sons; one Holy Ghost, not three Holy Ghosts. And in this Trinity none is before, or after another; none is greater, or less than another. But the whole three Persons are coeternal, and coequal. So that in all things, as aforesaid; the Unity in Trinity, and the Trinity in Unity, is to be worshipped. He therefore that will be saved, let him thus think of the Trinity.

Furthermore, it is necessary to everlasting salvation; that he also believe faithfully the Incarnation of our Lord Jesus Christ. For the right Faith is, that we believe and confess; that our Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is God and Man; God, of the Substance of the Father; begotten before the worlds; and Man, of the Substance of his Mother, born in the world. Perfect God; and perfect Man, of a reasonable soul and human flesh subsisting. Equal to the Father, as touching his Godhead; and inferior to the Father as touching his Manhood. Who although he is God and Man; yet he is not two, but one Christ. One; not by conversion of the Godhead into flesh; but by assumption of the Manhood into God. One altogether; not by confusion of Substance; but by unity of Person. For as the reasonable soul and flesh is one man; so God and Man is one Christ; Who suffered for our salvation; descended into hell; rose again the third day from the dead. He ascended into heaven, he sitteth on the right hand of God the Father Almighty, from whence he will come to judge the living and the dead. At whose coming all men will rise again with their bodies; And shall give account for their own works. And they that have done good shall go into life everlasting; and they that have done evil, into everlasting fire. This is the catholic faith; which except a man believe truly and firmly, he cannot be saved.

The Athanasian Creed

My Summary: "Make it like god: become human!" And my counsel: Stop it to be an idiot who speaks out what Nazis like to hear. He's totally unqualified to say anything about the bible nor about the Christian religion.

 

[zaangalewa]

... Second, you can assume that, since the author of the book of Genesis was a fairly primitive and uneducated man by our standards ...

You overestimate the standards of your world and you underestimate the standards of Noah. The story of Noah is understandable for every child. This makes the story not stupid - it's exactly in the opposite. Noah fought for all life and wan. Everyone else was able to win with him. But this was not what the people in his time and place of history decided to do. And the "more human", "more experienced", "more ..." world today? When did we start to fight for all and every life of our planet? Tomorrow? What about if tomorrow is a flood and no one learned to swim? How to reach Noahs arch?

 

[zaangalewa]

... I dont subscribe to your fucked up brainwashing cult that teaches that humans are innately bad and sinful.

What a luck that you are the good fucked up brainwashing guy and not the bad one. What is the name of the bad and sinful Christians who lets you suffer a lot? Nobody? Never any Christian did you something bad in your whole life? Sure - that's a good reason to hate Christians.

 

[zaangalewa]

7

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What a load of bullshit. Nobody is forcing them to bake a cake. Fucking stupid.

As far as I know Charlie Craig und Dave Mullins forced Jack Phillips to bake them a cake. I read also from an older lady who did not like to give flowers to a gay marriage in the USA. The situation seems to be that she, her children and the grandchildren are able to lose the family company because of claims of damages. Some people work for decades what others take in moments. Looks like Christians have to give up every business in the USA which could have to do with marriages, where a man "marries" another man.

 

[G.T.]

... I dont subscribe to your fucked up brainwashing cult that teaches that humans are innately bad and sinful.

What a luck that you are the good fucked up brainwashing guy and not the bad one. What is the name of the bad and sinful Christians who lets you suffer a lot? Nobody? Never any Christian did you something bad in your whole life? Sure - that's a good reason to hate Christians.

My reasoning has led me away from man-made Religions, not spite, harm or hatred.

 

[Taz]

So where does god drowning all those people and animals in the Flood stand? Moral act? Or immoral act?

Are you seriously asking me to judge the Almighty Creator of the Universe to human standards? That is a level of hubris I wouldn't even begin to contemplate.

So your invisible buddy gets a pass on mass murder. How very moral of you both.

When you see your neighbor kill his wife, and you grab him, shackle him in chains and confine him in your basement for a while before you kill him, you are charged with a crime, yes?

Yet when the police do it, they are fulfilling their legal responsibility.

You are not God. He has authority you do not.

The police don’t have the authority to do a mass killing. EPIC FAIL.

Waco.

They weren't even trying to kill them, they were just incompetent. Anyways, the police who did the killing weren't the ones who had the authority to kill people in such a manner. Still an EPIC FAIL.

 

[Taz]

So your invisible buddy gets a pass on mass murder. How very moral of you both.

Do you also spend a lot of time raging at Mother Nature for being "immoral"?

So god has no control over himself?

God is not a human being. He does not have the same imperatives, limitations, goals, or motivations on Him that humans do. To expect Him to behave as a human does is to expect Mother Nature to do so.

So god can kill and it’s all good. And you claim the moral high ground? That’s laughable. Seriously.

Not only god can kill - I can kill too, Nazi. I don't see a joke in this what you said here to me.

Not even talking to you, Adolf.

 

[Cecilie1200]

View attachment 170362

What a load of bullshit. Nobody is forcing them to bake a cake. Fucking stupid.

Excuse me? They've been dragged through the courts all the way to the Supreme Court, and no one's forcing them?

 

[Cecilie1200]

Are you seriously asking me to judge the Almighty Creator of the Universe to human standards? That is a level of hubris I wouldn't even begin to contemplate.

So your invisible buddy gets a pass on mass murder. How very moral of you both.

Do you also spend a lot of time raging at Mother Nature for being "immoral"?

So god has no control over himself?

God is not a human being. He does not have the same imperatives, limitations, goals, or motivations on Him that humans do. To expect Him to behave as a human does is to expect Mother Nature to do so.

So god can kill and it’s all good. And you claim the moral high ground? That’s laughable. Seriously.

No, what's laughable is that you keep equating God with humans, rather than the force of nature - the force BEHIND nature - that He is.

 

[hadit]

Are you seriously asking me to judge the Almighty Creator of the Universe to human standards? That is a level of hubris I wouldn't even begin to contemplate.

So your invisible buddy gets a pass on mass murder. How very moral of you both.

When you see your neighbor kill his wife, and you grab him, shackle him in chains and confine him in your basement for a while before you kill him, you are charged with a crime, yes?

Yet when the police do it, they are fulfilling their legal responsibility.

You are not God. He has authority you do not.

The police don’t have the authority to do a mass killing. EPIC FAIL.

Waco.

They weren't even trying to kill them, they were just incompetent. Anyways, the police who did the killing weren't the ones who had the authority to kill people in such a manner. Still an EPIC FAIL.

The military.

So you can pretend you're not seeing it, but there are people under certain circumstances who are authorized to kill. God has authority you don't.

 

[Cecilie1200]

... Second, you can assume that, since the author of the book of Genesis was a fairly primitive and uneducated man by our standards ...

You overestimate the standards of your world and you underestimate the standards of Noah. The story of Noah is understandable for every child. This makes the story not stupid - it's exactly in the opposite. Noah fought for all life and wan. Everyone else was able to win with him. But this was not what the people in his time and place of history decided to do. And the "more human", "more experienced", "more ..." world today? When did we start to fight for all and every life of our planet? Tomorrow? What about if tomorrow is a flood and no one learned to swim? How to reach Noahs arch?

Back the hell up there, Kneejerk. I'm not overestimating or underestimating anything. I didn't say I thought that was the explanation, so cool your damned jets. I said that was one of several possible theories that have been floated on the subject. Take a pill and calm down.

 

[Cecilie1200]

... I dont subscribe to your fucked up brainwashing cult that teaches that humans are innately bad and sinful.

What a luck that you are the good fucked up brainwashing guy and not the bad one. What is the name of the bad and sinful Christians who lets you suffer a lot? Nobody? Never any Christian did you something bad in your whole life? Sure - that's a good reason to hate Christians.

My reasoning has led me away from man-made Religions, not spite, harm or hatred.

Yeah, you keep telling yourself that.

 

[Correll]

I know why you are afraid to tell the truth.


I know what the answer is.


And you know that it makes a mockery of your pretense of being self contained.

Like GT said, the morals found in the bible weren't even original. Too funny.

GT's response is not yours.


HIs argument is a whole other path of discussion.

Ya, but still funny because you two were trying to say that Western civilization's morals were taken from the bible, which didn't invent those morals, so basically, your whole argument is an EPIC FAIL!

A source doesn't have to be the original or even the sole source to still be a source.


I just picked up some groceries from the store. There are other stores, and the food was not grown AT the store, but the store was still my source of groceries.

You are really flailing around here.

So you’re comparing the Bible to a grocery store, where you go in a pick and choose stuff that you can get anywhere. Ok, if you say so.

YOu just pretended to be exposed to that concept of an analogy for the first time.


Think about how you know you have to be constantly dishonest in this thread, to maintain your position.


What does that tell you?

 

[Taz]

So your invisible buddy gets a pass on mass murder. How very moral of you both.

Do you also spend a lot of time raging at Mother Nature for being "immoral"?

So god has no control over himself?

God is not a human being. He does not have the same imperatives, limitations, goals, or motivations on Him that humans do. To expect Him to behave as a human does is to expect Mother Nature to do so.

So god can kill and it’s all good. And you claim the moral high ground? That’s laughable. Seriously.

No, what's laughable is that you keep equating God with humans, rather than the force of nature - the force BEHIND nature - that He is.

Weren't we supposedly made in god's image? War, rape, murder, look at the animals, it's all part of nature.

 

[Taz]

So your invisible buddy gets a pass on mass murder. How very moral of you both.

When you see your neighbor kill his wife, and you grab him, shackle him in chains and confine him in your basement for a while before you kill him, you are charged with a crime, yes?

Yet when the police do it, they are fulfilling their legal responsibility.

You are not God. He has authority you do not.

The police don’t have the authority to do a mass killing. EPIC FAIL.

Waco.

They weren't even trying to kill them, they were just incompetent. Anyways, the police who did the killing weren't the ones who had the authority to kill people in such a manner. Still an EPIC FAIL.

The military.

So you can pretend you're not seeing it, but there are people under certain circumstances who are authorized to kill. God has authority you don't.

The military personnel aren't authorized to kill anyone they want, and on a mass scale. They need orders from their superiors.

 

[Taz]

Like GT said, the morals found in the bible weren't even original. Too funny.

GT's response is not yours.


HIs argument is a whole other path of discussion.

Ya, but still funny because you two were trying to say that Western civilization's morals were taken from the bible, which didn't invent those morals, so basically, your whole argument is an EPIC FAIL!

A source doesn't have to be the original or even the sole source to still be a source.


I just picked up some groceries from the store. There are other stores, and the food was not grown AT the store, but the store was still my source of groceries.

You are really flailing around here.

So you’re comparing the Bible to a grocery store, where you go in a pick and choose stuff that you can get anywhere. Ok, if you say so.

YOu just pretended to be exposed to that concept of an analogy for the first time.


Think about how you know you have to be constantly dishonest in this thread, to maintain your position.


What does that tell you?

I won!