Boycott Staples

[Iceweasel]

The POST OFFICE is destroying itself by adhering to an obsolete and cost prohibitive business model.

That's very true. I forget how many billions in the red it runs annually but their system is antiquated and not geared towards efficiency like a competitive company.

I've shipped many boxes to Guam and Hawaii and each box required a form hand filled in with address, contents, etc. etc. 20 boxes takes a looooong time to do. No private company could exist like that these days.

 

[Harry Dresden]

I'll come out and say it.

UPS, et.al could do it better, cheaper and turn a profit.

then why did Amazon just award the PO a billion dollar contract over the other guys?...

and the other guys are allowed to turn a profit.....

Lowest bidder

nope .....there was no bidding....the contract was for a Billion dollars....before i retired they were using all 3 to see who did the job they wanted....they did this for at least a year.....we were told that if we dont deliver Amazon stuff as fast and accurate as possible we would no longer be getting their stuff....im sure the other 2 were being told the same....they went with the PO for a reason....plus it probably helped that the PO was already delivering Fed-X and UPS parcels in the Residential areas....im just glad im out of it....the delivery business is a rat race....

 

[Disir]

Oh? How so?
Instead of being dismissive, bring your argument to the table.

I already did and that's the problem. Hence the reason my reply is dismissive.

You dismissed MY post.
This is YOUR thread. I made an argument. Are you now refusing to respond?
Let's get something straight. How this works is the person who starts the thread is expected to take counterarguments and discuss each point of view. Meanwhile as new people enter the discussion, the OP is required to also discuss with them.
When one starts a thread they are as the same as one who has called a news conference.
They make commentary and take questions.
So, once again, please respond to my comments.
You don't get to dismiss others because you are unwilling to respond to a counterpoint.

It's an argument that I have already dealt with. You are simply ignoring what I have already posted.

 

[Harry Dresden]

I'm forced into having things sent to me by UPS and FedEx. I dislike both of them. I wouldn't send anything through them willingly. They suck that bad.

after being a carrier for 33 years and comparing notes with drivers from Fed-X and UPS and talking to the customers it seems like they are not much different as far as delivery goes.....i was surprised to see that UPS is run a lot like the PO as far as how they treat their routes and employees.....same mentality.....give ya more to do but no more time to do it.....

Again. I'm forced into having items shipped to me by those companies. Further, if you are unaware of the complaints then you haven't been paying attention. Insurance claims, customer service, tracking.

all 3 get complaints all 3 fuck up....and HOW would i not be aware of complaints after what i have been saying here?....

 

[Iceweasel]

Privatization destroys those middle class jobs. Do you not understand this? Are you being intentionally obtuse? Or do you just support privatization? Shoot straight.

Contrary to your juvenile worldview, governments are not created to provide jobs. The money comes from the private sector and the private sector doesn't create business to provide jobs.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Privatization destroys those middle class jobs. Do you not understand this? Are you being intentionally obtuse? Or do you just support privatization? Shoot straight.

Ok...This is a good one.
Would you care to explain in detail how 'privatization destroys the middle class'..
By making the above comment, you now have the duty to defend and explain your position.
I am not letting this go.
You'll either support your claim with facts or I'll bug you so much, you'll have to abandon your own thread or take the easy way out and put me on ignore.
Either way you're trapped.

I already did. The movement of middle class jobs that the Post office provides to the 8 and change jobs at Staples does what? I've already been through this.

No...You stated that privatization destroys the middle class.
That is a general statement. One that implies that only public sector work is acceptable.
Your argument is based on a false premise.
The USPS has stated it will not lat off any current USPS workers in lieu of the Staples deal..
Using Staples stores is ADDING to the capacity of the USPS...
Yours is the typical mentality of a person programmed by unionism.
That irrational belief that for every one job created outside the grasp of a labor collective is one that a labor collective will lose.
Who do union people live in such fear of the world outside the union bubble?
I can tell you this. If Staples employees belonged to a labor collective, this argument would never have been presented.
However since pro union people are anti worker choice, they are throwing a fit.

 

[Disir]

after being a carrier for 33 years and comparing notes with drivers from Fed-X and UPS and talking to the customers it seems like they are not much different as far as delivery goes.....i was surprised to see that UPS is run a lot like the PO as far as how they treat their routes and employees.....same mentality.....give ya more to do but no more time to do it.....

Again. I'm forced into having items shipped to me by those companies. Further, if you are unaware of the complaints then you haven't been paying attention. Insurance claims, customer service, tracking.

all 3 get complaints all 3 fuck up....and HOW would i not be aware of complaints after what i have been saying here?....

The claim is made that they are equal, more efficient and more cost effective. This is not true. Both UPS and FedEX had the same complaints prior to 2006. This is not an area that they have improved on.

 

[Harry Dresden]

They do, for the most part, which is another reason the USPS is floundering.

The USPS' main function is delivering junk mail

a lot of it yea.....but that is one huge market.....thats what a lot of companies want a piece of.....direct mail advertising is supposed to be just about the most effective way to advertise.....

I think bulk mail rates should be eliminated. Let them pay the full rate per ounce just like everyone else.
BTW, so called junk mail which is comprised of ads for stuff most people have no intention of buying is the origin of the phrase "circular file"...
So unless junk mail advertisers are selling their wares to trash cans, they are wasting their money.

your wrong....i have read quit a few articles saying direct mail is the most effective way to advertise,its a multi-billion dollar industry for a reason........and the biggest complaint i ever had on my route was when the Tuesday food ads were either late or someone did not get one...Advo pays the PO in excess of a Billion a year to deliver those things....Penny Saver about the same....you people may not think anyone wants those things....guess again....

 

[SAYIT]

I'm forced into having things sent to me by UPS and FedEx. I dislike both of them. I wouldn't send anything through them willingly. They suck that bad.

after being a carrier for 33 years and comparing notes with drivers from Fed-X and UPS and talking to the customers it seems like they are not much different as far as delivery goes.....i was surprised to see that UPS is run a lot like the PO as far as how they treat their routes and employees.....same mentality.....give ya more to do but no more time to do it.....

Again. I'm forced into having items shipped to me by those companies. Further, if you are unaware of the complaints then you haven't been paying attention. Insurance claims, customer service, tracking.

And as this thread reveals, the PO also has detractors who are "forced into having items shipped" to them by a less-than-perfect deliverer.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Because it's continued destruction of the middle class.

From your article:

the post office announced it would expand the program,

Not staples, the Post office is behind this. It was the post office who authorized the program. The Unions are upset at the wrong people.

This has been happening since stores are allowed to sell stamps anything from a convenient stores to groceries. Many business are allowed to send and accept mail for the post office. You do know UPS accepts USPS mail and charges an arm and a leg, far over the USPS prices, don't you?

Fuck the union...Ya know what?. The fact that the postal workers union is behind the protests is a sure sign that the general public will be offering little in the way of empathy.
Nothing raises the ire of the general public more than when a union's management or workers start bitching about some perceived challenge to their position.

cant argue there....they are protesting the wrong people anyway....i walked right through a line of 4 the other day wearing my postal cap....they were saying what the fuck....and i said to them....protest your employers not these people and walked in and out without incident....im sure they thought i was a dirt bag...oh well....

 

[Disir]

Ok...This is a good one.
Would you care to explain in detail how 'privatization destroys the middle class'..
By making the above comment, you now have the duty to defend and explain your position.
I am not letting this go.
You'll either support your claim with facts or I'll bug you so much, you'll have to abandon your own thread or take the easy way out and put me on ignore.
Either way you're trapped.

I already did. The movement of middle class jobs that the Post office provides to the 8 and change jobs at Staples does what? I've already been through this.

No...You stated that privatization destroys the middle class.
That is a general statement. One that implies that only public sector work is acceptable.
Your argument is based on a false premise.
The USPS has stated it will not lat off any current USPS workers in lieu of the Staples deal..
Using Staples stores is ADDING to the capacity of the USPS...
Yours is the typical mentality of a person programmed by unionism.
That irrational belief that for every one job created outside the grasp of a labor collective is one that a labor collective will lose.
Who do union people live in such fear of the world outside the union bubble?
I can tell you this. If Staples employees belonged to a labor collective, this argument would never have been presented.
However since pro union people are anti worker choice, they are throwing a fit.

Congressman Darrell Issa really is determined to end the United States Postal Service as Americans know it—indeed, as Americans have known it for more than 200 years.

Issa, the powerful chairman of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, has a long history of attacking the postal service. But, now, he has taken advantage of a manufactured crisis to get his committee to vote twenty-two to seventeen in favor of a “Postal Reform Act of 2013” that American Postal Workers Union president Cliff Guffey warns “will lead to the demise of the Postal Service.”

With Wednesday’s committee vote, the full House is now set to consider a plan that would, among other things, phase out door-to-door mail delivery by 2022. Instead of the traditional and highly popular delivery model that now exists, mail would be left in so-called “neighborhood cluster boxes” that would serve multiple residences.

The Issa plan also sets the stage for the elimination of most weekend mail service.

The changes Issa proposes would, according to the National Association of Letter Carriers, lead to “the elimination of more than 100,000 postal jobs and would dramatically cut service.” And in addition to its assault on the character and quality of postal service, the legislation includes classic austerity schemes, such as a prohibition against postal unions and management from negotiating protections against the closure of post offices, stations and branches, the consolidating of plants, the privatization of operations and layoffs.

The cuts, if implemented, would issue as an open invitation for private-delivery services to cash in by offering to fill the void created by those cuts. There are profits to be made by delivering mail to the front doors of Americans who can pay—and who want regular delivery on Saturdays. So it should come as no surprise that one of the first endorsements for Issa’s proposal came from the “Coalition for a 21st Century Postal Service,” a group that counts FedEx as one of its most enthusiastic boosters.

The corporations that want to carve the USPS up and grab their pieces of America’s communications infrastructure are ready to pounce.

That is what is at stake.

Postal Service moving away from at-your-door delivery - Jul. 23, 2013

 

[thereisnospoon]

I already did and that's the problem. Hence the reason my reply is dismissive.

You dismissed MY post.
This is YOUR thread. I made an argument. Are you now refusing to respond?
Let's get something straight. How this works is the person who starts the thread is expected to take counterarguments and discuss each point of view. Meanwhile as new people enter the discussion, the OP is required to also discuss with them.
When one starts a thread they are as the same as one who has called a news conference.
They make commentary and take questions.
So, once again, please respond to my comments.
You don't get to dismiss others because you are unwilling to respond to a counterpoint.

It's an argument that I have already dealt with. You are simply ignoring what I have already posted.

I'm not going to ferret out a response from 14 pages of this thread.
Just respond directly to my post.
Simple.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Issa. It's the continued attempt to destroy the Post Office.

So the post office is destroying itself by opening more branches?

So if a UPS opens more UPS stores all over the country they are destroying themselves?

Issa is trying to destroy the PO.....he is on this "Commission" that is supposed to be trying to help it....everything he comes up with is just negative....the first thing he suggested when they started is fire every worker on Civil Service,which is basically everyone with 25 years or better in.....but he was reminded by another Congress person that around 30% of those would be Vets.....he said..."just a suggestion"....the guys an ass....he aint there to help....

 

[Iceweasel]

The corporations that want to carve the USPS up and grab their pieces of America’s communications infrastructure are ready to pounce.

And that's the way it's supposed to be in the USofA. We shouldn't be paying more for something the private sector can do better and or cheaper. That's what made us number 1 in the world, not socialism.

 

[thereisnospoon]

I already did. The movement of middle class jobs that the Post office provides to the 8 and change jobs at Staples does what? I've already been through this.

No...You stated that privatization destroys the middle class.
That is a general statement. One that implies that only public sector work is acceptable.
Your argument is based on a false premise.
The USPS has stated it will not lat off any current USPS workers in lieu of the Staples deal..
Using Staples stores is ADDING to the capacity of the USPS...
Yours is the typical mentality of a person programmed by unionism.
That irrational belief that for every one job created outside the grasp of a labor collective is one that a labor collective will lose.
Who do union people live in such fear of the world outside the union bubble?
I can tell you this. If Staples employees belonged to a labor collective, this argument would never have been presented.
However since pro union people are anti worker choice, they are throwing a fit.

Congressman Darrell Issa really is determined to end the United States Postal Service as Americans know it—indeed, as Americans have known it for more than 200 years.

Issa, the powerful chairman of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, has a long history of attacking the postal service. But, now, he has taken advantage of a manufactured crisis to get his committee to vote twenty-two to seventeen in favor of a “Postal Reform Act of 2013” that American Postal Workers Union president Cliff Guffey warns “will lead to the demise of the Postal Service.”

With Wednesday’s committee vote, the full House is now set to consider a plan that would, among other things, phase out door-to-door mail delivery by 2022. Instead of the traditional and highly popular delivery model that now exists, mail would be left in so-called “neighborhood cluster boxes” that would serve multiple residences.

The Issa plan also sets the stage for the elimination of most weekend mail service.

The changes Issa proposes would, according to the National Association of Letter Carriers, lead to “the elimination of more than 100,000 postal jobs and would dramatically cut service.” And in addition to its assault on the character and quality of postal service, the legislation includes classic austerity schemes, such as a prohibition against postal unions and management from negotiating protections against the closure of post offices, stations and branches, the consolidating of plants, the privatization of operations and layoffs.

The cuts, if implemented, would issue as an open invitation for private-delivery services to cash in by offering to fill the void created by those cuts. There are profits to be made by delivering mail to the front doors of Americans who can pay—and who want regular delivery on Saturdays. So it should come as no surprise that one of the first endorsements for Issa’s proposal came from the “Coalition for a 21st Century Postal Service,” a group that counts FedEx as one of its most enthusiastic boosters.

The corporations that want to carve the USPS up and grab their pieces of America’s communications infrastructure are ready to pounce.

That is what is at stake.

Postal Service moving away from at-your-door delivery - Jul. 23, 2013

No good. That is someone else's opinion...I asked for YOURS.

 

[Disir]

You dismissed MY post.
This is YOUR thread. I made an argument. Are you now refusing to respond?
Let's get something straight. How this works is the person who starts the thread is expected to take counterarguments and discuss each point of view. Meanwhile as new people enter the discussion, the OP is required to also discuss with them.
When one starts a thread they are as the same as one who has called a news conference.
They make commentary and take questions.
So, once again, please respond to my comments.
You don't get to dismiss others because you are unwilling to respond to a counterpoint.

It's an argument that I have already dealt with. You are simply ignoring what I have already posted.

I'm not going to ferret out a response from 14 pages of this thread.
Just respond directly to my post.
Simple.

That makes it your problem and not mine.

 

[Katzndogz]

a lot of it yea.....but that is one huge market.....thats what a lot of companies want a piece of.....direct mail advertising is supposed to be just about the most effective way to advertise.....

I think bulk mail rates should be eliminated. Let them pay the full rate per ounce just like everyone else.
BTW, so called junk mail which is comprised of ads for stuff most people have no intention of buying is the origin of the phrase "circular file"...
So unless junk mail advertisers are selling their wares to trash cans, they are wasting their money.

your wrong....i have read quit a few articles saying direct mail is the most effective way to advertise,its a multi-billion dollar industry for a reason........and the biggest complaint i ever had on my route was when the Tuesday food ads were either late or someone did not get one...Advo pays the PO in excess of a Billion a year to deliver those things....Penny Saver about the same....you people may not think anyone wants those things....guess again....

Apartment buildings provide a trash can right next to the mail boxes so sale circulars and direct mail advertising can be disposed of immediately. Direct mail is the worst method of advertising, it is done by companies simply as a tax write off.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Issa. It's the continued attempt to destroy the Post Office.

So the post office is destroying itself by opening more branches?

So if a UPS opens more UPS stores all over the country they are destroying themselves?

Issa is trying to destroy the PO.....he is on this "Commission" that is supposed to be trying to help it....everything he comes up with is just negative....the first thing he suggested when they started is fire every worker on Civil Service,which is basically everyone with 25 years or better in.....but he was reminded by another Congress person that around 30% of those would be Vets.....he said..."just a suggestion"....the guys an ass....he aint there to help....

Not agreeing with the terminating of those people at all.
However, I believe the system of Civil Service and the unrealistic protections it offers are archaic and cause labor to cost far more than it should.
I do not think anyone should have guaranteed job security.
Such conditions breed mediocrity and complacency.
If there is one phrase used by those in union represented Civil Service employees it is " I'm putting in my time"....UGH!!!
Excuse me....In other words you are really working? Just putting in time?
I once heard a USPS window clerk speaking to a customer. She said "Well once I get my Christmas tips..."....I thought to myself..Ok first, what makes you think you should be entitled to gratuities in the first place. Second. How dare you be so presumptuous that you expect to be tipped?
I can tell you this...I have never event given a fleeting thought about tipping the USPS window clerk..Never..
Now, my regular carrier in my hometown, Tony, was a really cool guy. My Mom would bake cookies around Christmas and give them to him as a gift.
BTW, we had regular at the door mail delivery. As opposed to rural type delivery where the mail was delivered at the street by a contract carrier.
It is my understanding that most mail delivery is the RFD type using contract carriers who are not USPS employees.

 

[thereisnospoon]

It's an argument that I have already dealt with. You are simply ignoring what I have already posted.

I'm not going to ferret out a response from 14 pages of this thread.
Just respond directly to my post.
Simple.

That makes it your problem and not mine.

No..It's your problem because I made a separate point to which apparently you have no response.
Great.
On that note, you're just whining here.

 

[Harry Dresden]

I do. Donahoe is the Post Master General appointed by Obama to fix the mess the post office is in. He has tried various ways such as closing the PO for one day a week to cut down on costs and was attacked by democrats in congress. Issa supported the idea.

He suggested it and it was shot down and never implemented. He felt it would cut on costs for an organization so far in debt they can't pay their pensions due to a congressional mandate which states pensions need to be prefunded. They have to borrow billions and billions from the US Treasury.

All of which was happening far before Donahoe took office in 2010. The loss of jobs and mail is a result of email and other entities which deliver mail and packages, they may be more expensive but more efficient than USPS.

Under Donahue in 2013, the post office had their first growth in revenue since the year 2006, even though still operating in the red, he must be doing something right considering the drop in mail flowing through the post office.

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/109/hr6407

Under the above, the Post Office was required to pay 75 years in advance all health benefits and retirement. By 2016.

Manufactured crisis.

On top of this was the 40 year old accounting error. The federal Office of Personnel Management has overcharged the post office by as much as $80 billion for payments into the Civil Service Retirement System.

The rise of the Donahoe

Postmaster General: Postal Service 'On Brink of 5.5 Billion Payment Default' - The Five Towns - Far Rockaway - Jewish Community News Service - 5 Times More Value - TheFiveTowns.Info

Issa calls it a scandal and is totally shocked and demands cuts.
Postal Service prodded -- once again -- to do more with less - Oversight - GovExec.com

All of these scandals are nothing more than bread and circuses. Almost forgot, I don't think the PO has used tax dollars since the 1970s.

That argument ran out of steam long ago.
The fadct is the USPS employs too many people who are using archaic methods of getting the work done.
Hand sorting mail for carrier routes? Come on....All mail should be bar coded and sorted by machines.
The USPS is a bloated federal bureaucracy.

were the hell have you been hiding Spoon?....hand sorting?....they have been using bar codes and machines for about 35 years now for letters....and the new ones they are using now for flats are the most Sophisticated on the planet....they put the Magazines like the letters in route order.....when these new ones went on line...we had a group from Japan Post come in to look at it....im sure they ordered one....the Machine is huge and 70-80 yards long....its the reason they dont need many clerks anymore...