Bullying does not lead to suicide

[Vox]

I have said this before, and will say it again, the problem is not that teens are bullies, the problem is that some of them need help they are not getting.



Bullying is not on the rise and it does not lead to suicide | Poynter.

Suicide is a mental and emotional problem which is not caused by bullying, IMO. There are many factors involved in the suicidal person

Yes, this is true. But a person already overwhelmed and troubled would be a higher risk for suicide. Now that I think of it, I don't know of any assessment for a person having been bullied in a psych eval. We assess for abuse, which systematic bullying certainly is. We ask about history of abuse, and I have never had a patient mention that he/she was bullied in school.

There are numerous studies and some of them accounted the psychiatric background as a risk factor - and it did not play a role in the suicide ideation prevalence and suicide attempts prevalence in bullied teenagers. There were gender related differences( gender plays a role), but the psychiatric picture did not.

this one is the last one ( by time frame ) and has the largest samples :

Victims of bullying behavior were more likely to express suicidal ideation. This association was particularly strong for those who were bullied on a weekly basis and
it was independent of the presence of psychiatric morbidity( sic!!!!!) (Odds Ratio: 7.78; 95% Confidence Interval: 3.05 - 19.90). In contrast, being a perpetrator ("bullying others") was not associated with this type of ideation after adjustment. These findings were similar in both boys and girls, although the population impact of victimization in the prevalence of suicidal ideation was potentially higher for boys.
Conclusions

The strong cross-sectional association between frequent victimization and suicidal ideation in late adolescence offers an opportunity for identifying pupils in the school setting that are in a higher risk for exhibiting suicidal ideation.

http://www.biomedcentral.com/1471-244X/11/22

STRONG ASSOCIATION - for anybody who is competent enough to understand scientific language it is equal to the media phrase of "has been proven without a doubt".

 

[Pennywise]

I went to Junior High and High School with a girl who made Carrie White look like Most Popular girl. I mean this girl was tortured relentlessly, from many people. Verbally assaulted, had her books "dumped" routinely, just the veritable urinal of all the vitriol of high school life. She wrote an Op Ed senior year for the HS paper, after which she received even more abuse. Her bio article was actually very well written and sad, it was named after the WHO song, Behind Blue Eyes. Looking back and knowing what we now know regarding learning and emotional issues, I would bet my bottom dollar she had a severe case of Aspergers.

Anyway, this girl never killed herself no matter how much vile shit was thrown at her, so suicide by bullying is too simple an answer. But people like simple answers, 1,2,3 solutions so they can sleep better, but life is not that way.

 

[Vox]

I went to Junior High and High School with a girl who made Carrie White look like Most Popular girl. I mean this girl was tortured relentlessly, from many people. Verbally assaulted, had her books "dumped" routinely, just the veritable urinal of all the vitriol of high school life. She wrote an Op Ed senior year for the HS paper, after which she received even more abuse. Her bio article was actually very well written and sad, it was named after the WHO song, Behind Blue Eyes. Looking back and knowing what we now know regarding learning and emotional issues, I would bet my bottom dollar she had a severe case of Aspergers.

Anyway, this girl never killed herself no matter how much vile shit was thrown at her, so suicide by bullying is too simple an answer. But people like simple answers, 1,2,3 solutions so they can sleep better, but life is not that way.

you post is a glaring example of scientific ignorance.
You do understand what prevalence and increased risk means, do you?
And you also should realize that if bullying would lead to suicide 100% we would be extinct by today or mocking somebody would be a capital offense.

smoking is not causing cancer 100% as well, yet we do consider it an increased risk factor for lung cancer( and several others), do we?

 

[Uncensored2008]

I have said this before, and will say it again, the problem is not that teens are bullies, the problem is that some of them need help they are not getting.

All suicides are tragic and complicated. And teen suicides are particularly devastating because as adults we recognize all that lost potential.
Yet, in perpetuating these stories, which are often little more than emotional linkbait, journalists are complicit in a gross oversimplification of a complicated phenomenon. In short, we’re getting the facts wrong.
The common narrative goes like this: Mean kids, usually the most popular and powerful, single out and relentlessly bully a socially weaker classmate in a systemic and calculated way, which then drives the victim into a darkness where he or she sees no alternative other than committing suicide.
And yet experts – those who study suicide, teen behavior and the dynamics of cyber interactions of teens – all say that the facts are rarely that simple. And by repeating this inaccurate story over and over, journalists are harming the public’s ability to understand the dynamics of both bullying and suicide.

Bullying is not on the rise and it does not lead to suicide | Poynter.

Suicide or not, bullies make the lives of others miserable. AND they were the reason that Columbine happened. We make excuses for bullies and cover for them all too often.

 

[Luissa]

I have said this before, and will say it again, the problem is not that teens are bullies, the problem is that some of them need help they are not getting.

All suicides are tragic and complicated. And teen suicides are particularly devastating because as adults we recognize all that lost potential.
Yet, in perpetuating these stories, which are often little more than emotional linkbait, journalists are complicit in a gross oversimplification of a complicated phenomenon. In short, we’re getting the facts wrong.
The common narrative goes like this: Mean kids, usually the most popular and powerful, single out and relentlessly bully a socially weaker classmate in a systemic and calculated way, which then drives the victim into a darkness where he or she sees no alternative other than committing suicide.
And yet experts – those who study suicide, teen behavior and the dynamics of cyber interactions of teens – all say that the facts are rarely that simple. And by repeating this inaccurate story over and over, journalists are harming the public’s ability to understand the dynamics of both bullying and suicide.

http://www.poynter.org/latest-news/...-on-the-rise-and-it-does-not-lead-to-suicide/

I agree with you.. I know shocker.
I don't think kids should bully others but it has been going on for years. I also don't think we need some national campaign.
Our children are becoming sissies who can't deal with normal problems.
I developed early so boys loved to tease me and "bully" me, I never once thought about suicide.

 

[Pennywise]

I went to Junior High and High School with a girl who made Carrie White look like Most Popular girl. I mean this girl was tortured relentlessly, from many people. Verbally assaulted, had her books "dumped" routinely, just the veritable urinal of all the vitriol of high school life. She wrote an Op Ed senior year for the HS paper, after which she received even more abuse. Her bio article was actually very well written and sad, it was named after the WHO song, Behind Blue Eyes. Looking back and knowing what we now know regarding learning and emotional issues, I would bet my bottom dollar she had a severe case of Aspergers.

Anyway, this girl never killed herself no matter how much vile shit was thrown at her, so suicide by bullying is too simple an answer. But people like simple answers, 1,2,3 solutions so they can sleep better, but life is not that way.

you post is a glaring example of scientific ignorance.
You do understand what prevalence and increased risk means, do you?
And you also should realize that if bullying would lead to suicide 100% we would be extinct by today or mocking somebody would be a capital offense.

smoking is not causing cancer 100% as well, yet we do consider it an increased risk factor for lung cancer( and several others), do we?

I don't believe we are on different planes here. You are correct that certain behaviors either self or outwardly directed, can have a severely negative effect on the health of an individual, but lots of people get lung cancer who never smoked, and lots of people kill themselves who have never been bullied.

If we can simply point though to "bullies" as the reason this or that person killed themselves, it wraps it up neatly 1,2,3, and we can go on pretending that nothing we did contributed, or that perhaps this person would have done this regardless of bullying.

 

[Sunshine]

I have said this before, and will say it again, the problem is not that teens are bullies, the problem is that some of them need help they are not getting.

All suicides are tragic and complicated. And teen suicides are particularly devastating because as adults we recognize all that lost potential.
Yet, in perpetuating these stories, which are often little more than emotional linkbait, journalists are complicit in a gross oversimplification of a complicated phenomenon. In short, we’re getting the facts wrong.
The common narrative goes like this: Mean kids, usually the most popular and powerful, single out and relentlessly bully a socially weaker classmate in a systemic and calculated way, which then drives the victim into a darkness where he or she sees no alternative other than committing suicide.
And yet experts – those who study suicide, teen behavior and the dynamics of cyber interactions of teens – all say that the facts are rarely that simple. And by repeating this inaccurate story over and over, journalists are harming the public’s ability to understand the dynamics of both bullying and suicide.

Bullying is not on the rise and it does not lead to suicide | Poynter.

Suicide or not, bullies make the lives of others miserable. AND they were the reason that Columbine happened. We make excuses for bullies and cover for them all too often.

It is never the bullies who get in trouble. Have you noticed that? If a child brings a weapon to school and says he brought it because other pupils have threatened him or there is someone he is afraid of, that never gets investigated. The kid who is in daily fear of his life is the one who gets punished. I think schools are scraping the bottom of the barrel for teachers and administrators. But then they have been for more than half a century. Anyone with enough sense to be a teacher has enough sense to be something else.

 

[Sunshine]

I have said this before, and will say it again, the problem is not that teens are bullies, the problem is that some of them need help they are not getting.

All suicides are tragic and complicated. And teen suicides are particularly devastating because as adults we recognize all that lost potential.
Yet, in perpetuating these stories, which are often little more than emotional linkbait, journalists are complicit in a gross oversimplification of a complicated phenomenon. In short, we’re getting the facts wrong.
The common narrative goes like this: Mean kids, usually the most popular and powerful, single out and relentlessly bully a socially weaker classmate in a systemic and calculated way, which then drives the victim into a darkness where he or she sees no alternative other than committing suicide.
And yet experts – those who study suicide, teen behavior and the dynamics of cyber interactions of teens – all say that the facts are rarely that simple. And by repeating this inaccurate story over and over, journalists are harming the public’s ability to understand the dynamics of both bullying and suicide.

http://www.poynter.org/latest-news/...-on-the-rise-and-it-does-not-lead-to-suicide/

I agree with you.. I know shocker.
I don't think kids should bully others but it has been going on for years. I also don't think we need some national campaign.
Our children are becoming sissies who can't deal with normal problems.
I developed early so boys loved to tease me and "bully" me, I never once thought about suicide.

The forum expert on nothing just weighed in with, well, nothing.

 

[Vox]

I went to Junior High and High School with a girl who made Carrie White look like Most Popular girl. I mean this girl was tortured relentlessly, from many people. Verbally assaulted, had her books "dumped" routinely, just the veritable urinal of all the vitriol of high school life. She wrote an Op Ed senior year for the HS paper, after which she received even more abuse. Her bio article was actually very well written and sad, it was named after the WHO song, Behind Blue Eyes. Looking back and knowing what we now know regarding learning and emotional issues, I would bet my bottom dollar she had a severe case of Aspergers.

Anyway, this girl never killed herself no matter how much vile shit was thrown at her, so suicide by bullying is too simple an answer. But people like simple answers, 1,2,3 solutions so they can sleep better, but life is not that way.

you post is a glaring example of scientific ignorance.
You do understand what prevalence and increased risk means, do you?
And you also should realize that if bullying would lead to suicide 100% we would be extinct by today or mocking somebody would be a capital offense.

smoking is not causing cancer 100% as well, yet we do consider it an increased risk factor for lung cancer( and several others), do we?

I don't believe we are on different planes here. You are correct that certain behaviors either self or outwardly directed, can have a severely negative effect on the health of an individual, but lots of people get lung cancer who never smoked, and lots of people kill themselves who have never been bullied.

If we can simply point though to "bullies" as the reason this or that person killed themselves, it wraps it up neatly 1,2,3, and we can go on pretending that nothing we did contributed, or that perhaps this person would have done this regardless of bullying.

No, we can actually say that in a lot of cases of teen suicide if the person won't be bullied, she/he won't commit suicide. The two most recent ones are the 15 y.o. boy in Alabama ( yes, bullying can be done not only by peers but by school administrators as well - and that is much more malignant) and the girl in Florida.

teen suicide is a different matter than adults and since it is the THIRD leading cause of death in the teen-young adults group, the issue warrants taking closer look at it.

Lung cancer is almost 100% caused by exposure to toxins - smoking( even a second hand smoke) is a cause in about 80% of the cases. Transitional cell carcinoma of the bladder is caused almost 100% by smoking ( there are some other chemicals exposure to which is an offense, but they are very rare) - so yes, some ailments are cause by a single factor.
And those factors if possible should be eliminated.

 

[Uncensored2008]

It is never the bullies who get in trouble. Have you noticed that? If a child brings a weapon to school and says he brought it because other pupils have threatened him or there is someone he is afraid of, that never gets investigated. The kid who is in daily fear of his life is the one who gets punished. I think schools are scraping the bottom of the barrel for teachers and administrators. But then they have been for more than half a century. Anyone with enough sense to be a teacher has enough sense to be something else.

I will admit that I was a bit of a bully in high school (I know, a real shocker.)

I really wasn't that bad, and tended to bully more on peer pressure than because it was my natural way. but I did bully kids. Most kids in high school were smaller and weaker than I. And I was an athlete. The Wrestling Team was especially bad, we did pick on others - I honestly wasn't the instigator, but I went along with it.

I never really thought about it much until much later in life, when my youngest daughter confided in my that she contemplated suicide because she was bullied so much in high school. THEN I finally pondered my own behavior back in the day - and wasn't very proud of it.

 

[Vox]

I have said this before, and will say it again, the problem is not that teens are bullies, the problem is that some of them need help they are not getting.



Bullying is not on the rise and it does not lead to suicide | Poynter.

Suicide or not, bullies make the lives of others miserable. AND they were the reason that Columbine happened. We make excuses for bullies and cover for them all too often.

It is never the bullies who get in trouble. Have you noticed that? If a child brings a weapon to school and says he brought it because other pupils have threatened him or there is someone he is afraid of, that never gets investigated. The kid who is in daily fear of his life is the one who gets punished. I think schools are scraping the bottom of the barrel for teachers and administrators. But then they have been for more than half a century. Anyone with enough sense to be a teacher has enough sense to be something else.

and it looks like it has changed dramatically - in the aftermath of the Columbine the correct cause was identified and started to be addressed. But somehow in the last 4-5 years it degraded to this idiocy of "zero tolerance" against perceived guns.
But we both know why it happened, don't we?

 

[JakeStarkey]

Respectfully, you are wrong.
I was severely bullied in school and I was seeing a counselor after I tried to commit suicide by overdosing on pills. During the time I was being counseled, twice a week, as well as being on a strong dose of anti-depressants, I was still being bullied, and I tried to commit suicide twice more.

I was getting the help I needed, but sometimes, its not enough.

I don't speak for everyone, but I can say that it doesn't just come down to a person not getting the help they need - oftentimes, its the bullies who are directly responsible.

You also have severe mental problems. If you didn't, you wouldn't have tried to kill yourself.

At least 25% of kids are bullied, yet less than 1% of teens commit suicide. Divorce is actually a more common indicator of suicide than bullying, yet no one ever argues that divorce causes suicide.

I am not trying to belittle your personal story, just pointing out that, if we actually look, it is absurd to claim that bullying leads to suicide. We need to deal with the reality as it is, not delve into a fantasy realm where we wave a magic wand, end bullying, and expect teens to stop killing themselves.

This is probably one of the single most evil replies I have ever read on a message board. Sallows comment to Sunshine about not dying fast enough is another. I would advise anyone who has been the victim of bullying to not read your posts. Sociopaths are very dangerous people and should be avoided at all costs. ( Bullies )

Let me close this reply with the truth. Noomi does not have any mental disorders. She is a very bright, intelligent, compassionate individual who has overcome all odds to be here today with us and I for one celebrate the fact that she is still here. I would advise Noomi and the others here to not listen to a single word you say. You obviously do not have a teachable spirit and refuse to humble yourself when proven wrong. The numerous videos, judgments in favor of the Victims from courts, settlements out of court from schools districts, testimonies of parents, victims, youtube videos, website bullyonline that identifies people such as yourself - are all availabe material you could have used to admit you were wrong. Instead you blame a victim who has already survived & recovered from the nightmare of bullying.
Repent. ( Ezekiel 3: 18 )

- Jeri

QWB is literally possessed by a destructive spirit. We can call him Demon Bag.

 

[Pennywise]

you post is a glaring example of scientific ignorance.
You do understand what prevalence and increased risk means, do you?
And you also should realize that if bullying would lead to suicide 100% we would be extinct by today or mocking somebody would be a capital offense.

smoking is not causing cancer 100% as well, yet we do consider it an increased risk factor for lung cancer( and several others), do we?

I don't believe we are on different planes here. You are correct that certain behaviors either self or outwardly directed, can have a severely negative effect on the health of an individual, but lots of people get lung cancer who never smoked, and lots of people kill themselves who have never been bullied.

If we can simply point though to "bullies" as the reason this or that person killed themselves, it wraps it up neatly 1,2,3, and we can go on pretending that nothing we did contributed, or that perhaps this person would have done this regardless of bullying.

No, we can actually say that in a lot of cases of teen suicide if the person won't be bullied, she/he won't commit suicide. The two most recent ones are the 15 y.o. boy in Alabama ( yes, bullying can be done not only by peers but by school administrators as well - and that is much more malignant) and the girl in Florida.

teen suicide is a different matter than adults and since it is the THIRD leading cause of death in the teen-young adults group, the issue warrants taking closer look at it.

Lung cancer is almost 100% caused by exposure to toxins - smoking( even a second hand smoke) is a cause in about 80% of the cases. Transitional cell carcinoma of the bladder is caused almost 100% by smoking ( there are some other chemicals exposure to which is an offense, but they are very rare) - so yes, some ailments are cause by a single factor.
And those factors if possible should be eliminated.

How do you propose we "eliminate" bullying? And please define for us the parameters on what exactly bullying is. I'm not being flippant, but trying to stop people being picked on is like trying to stop teenage boys from getting erections every five minutes. And I'm not talking about cases of clear abuse by kids, but a certain degree of jousting is necessary for a person to learn to stand up for themselves.

And no, there is no way bullying in and of itself is the cause for suicide. If these kids had a solid enough home life and felt loved and nurtured as they deserve to be, the chances of suicide are nil, unless they have some underlying emotional issues to being with.

You can't legislate that people be nice to each other. All of us have run into bullies at some point though and you can't live life without that experience; it's part of the human condition.

 

[Vox]

It is never the bullies who get in trouble. Have you noticed that? If a child brings a weapon to school and says he brought it because other pupils have threatened him or there is someone he is afraid of, that never gets investigated. The kid who is in daily fear of his life is the one who gets punished. I think schools are scraping the bottom of the barrel for teachers and administrators. But then they have been for more than half a century. Anyone with enough sense to be a teacher has enough sense to be something else.

I will admit that I was a bit of a bully in high school (I know, a real shocker.)

I really wasn't that bad, and tended to bully more on peer pressure than because it was my natural way. but I did bully kids. Most kids in high school were smaller and weaker than I. And I was an athlete. The Wrestling Team was especially bad, we did pick on others - I honestly wasn't the instigator, but I went along with it.

I never really thought about it much until much later in life, when my youngest daughter confided in my that she contemplated suicide because she was bullied so much in high school. THEN I finally pondered my own behavior back in the day - and wasn't very proud of it.

There is bullying and bullying.
It is bad no matter what but there are examples like the ones which lead that girl in Florida to commit suicide and the bully kept posting on facebook that she is happy she did it! This is just SICK.
Mocking somebody for not having "cool" clothes is poisonous, but, probably, won't push anybody to commit suicide. Threatening a teenager that he will get a label of sex offender for life because somebody "got offended" by a stupid prank - is malignant abuse of power by an adult and should be prosecuted.

 

[Vox]

I don't believe we are on different planes here. You are correct that certain behaviors either self or outwardly directed, can have a severely negative effect on the health of an individual, but lots of people get lung cancer who never smoked, and lots of people kill themselves who have never been bullied.

If we can simply point though to "bullies" as the reason this or that person killed themselves, it wraps it up neatly 1,2,3, and we can go on pretending that nothing we did contributed, or that perhaps this person would have done this regardless of bullying.

No, we can actually say that in a lot of cases of teen suicide if the person won't be bullied, she/he won't commit suicide. The two most recent ones are the 15 y.o. boy in Alabama ( yes, bullying can be done not only by peers but by school administrators as well - and that is much more malignant) and the girl in Florida.

teen suicide is a different matter than adults and since it is the THIRD leading cause of death in the teen-young adults group, the issue warrants taking closer look at it.

Lung cancer is almost 100% caused by exposure to toxins - smoking( even a second hand smoke) is a cause in about 80% of the cases. Transitional cell carcinoma of the bladder is caused almost 100% by smoking ( there are some other chemicals exposure to which is an offense, but they are very rare) - so yes, some ailments are cause by a single factor.
And those factors if possible should be eliminated.

How do you propose we "eliminate" bullying? And please define for us the parameters on what exactly bullying is. I'm not being flippant, but trying to stop people being picked on is like trying to stop teenage boys from getting erections every five minutes. And I'm not talking about cases of clear abuse by kids, but a certain degree of jousting is necessary for a person to learn to stand up for themselves.

And no, there is no way bullying in and of itself is the cause for suicide. If these kids had a solid enough home life and felt loved and nurtured as they deserve to be, the chances of suicide are nil, unless they have some underlying emotional issues to being with.

You can't legislate that people be nice to each other. All of us have run into bullies at some point though and you can't live life without that experience; it's part of the human condition.

as I have said in my previous post - there are various levels of bullying. As any human activity it varies. even the same crime can have different circumstances which lead to different levels of punishment.
So can be done here.

 

[Uncensored2008]

There is bullying and bullying.
It is bad no matter what but there are examples like the ones which lead that girl in Florida to commit suicide and the bully kept posting on facebook that she is happy she did it! This is just SICK.
Mocking somebody for not having "cool" clothes is poisonous, but, probably, won't push anybody to commit suicide. Threatening a teenager that he will get a label of sex offender for life because somebody "got offended" by a stupid prank - is malignant abuse of power by an adult and should be prosecuted.

It was the 70's

We beat people up. Our team captain would tell the selected victim that we would catch them after school - usually tell them all day - then we would.

We did get ours once, we beat up the brother of a football player, and the varsity team kicked the shit out of all of us. They had a much bigger team than ours, to the point that there were 10 of them to 1 of us.

 

[Pennywise]

No, we can actually say that in a lot of cases of teen suicide if the person won't be bullied, she/he won't commit suicide. The two most recent ones are the 15 y.o. boy in Alabama ( yes, bullying can be done not only by peers but by school administrators as well - and that is much more malignant) and the girl in Florida.

teen suicide is a different matter than adults and since it is the THIRD leading cause of death in the teen-young adults group, the issue warrants taking closer look at it.

Lung cancer is almost 100% caused by exposure to toxins - smoking( even a second hand smoke) is a cause in about 80% of the cases. Transitional cell carcinoma of the bladder is caused almost 100% by smoking ( there are some other chemicals exposure to which is an offense, but they are very rare) - so yes, some ailments are cause by a single factor.
And those factors if possible should be eliminated.

How do you propose we "eliminate" bullying? And please define for us the parameters on what exactly bullying is. I'm not being flippant, but trying to stop people being picked on is like trying to stop teenage boys from getting erections every five minutes. And I'm not talking about cases of clear abuse by kids, but a certain degree of jousting is necessary for a person to learn to stand up for themselves.

And no, there is no way bullying in and of itself is the cause for suicide. If these kids had a solid enough home life and felt loved and nurtured as they deserve to be, the chances of suicide are nil, unless they have some underlying emotional issues to being with.

You can't legislate that people be nice to each other. All of us have run into bullies at some point though and you can't live life without that experience; it's part of the human condition.

as I have said in my previous post - there are various levels of bullying. As any human activity it varies. even the same crime can have different circumstances which lead to different levels of punishment.
So can be done here.

If we start prosecuting people for being assholes to someone who goes on to commit suicide, that is not justice. Unless the girls who tormented the other girl who killed herself, were themselves mentally deranged, they will one day understand what they did and will regret it. Putting them in prison for what the other girl did to herself, is unfathomable and will lead to further miscarriages of justice. If they broke laws, prosecute them, but as far as I know, calling people names and telling them you hate them is not against the law, nor should it be, no matter how repugnant those behaviors are.

 

[Vox]

There is bullying and bullying.
It is bad no matter what but there are examples like the ones which lead that girl in Florida to commit suicide and the bully kept posting on facebook that she is happy she did it! This is just SICK.
Mocking somebody for not having "cool" clothes is poisonous, but, probably, won't push anybody to commit suicide. Threatening a teenager that he will get a label of sex offender for life because somebody "got offended" by a stupid prank - is malignant abuse of power by an adult and should be prosecuted.

It was the 70's

We beat people up. Our team captain would tell the selected victim that we would catch them after school - usually tell them all day - then we would.

We did get ours once, we beat up the brother of a football player, and the varsity team kicked the shit out of all of us. They had a much bigger team than ours, to the point that there were 10 of them to 1 of us.

yeah, it seems it got much worse nowadays.
Beating up was standard, no matter what latitude and longitude
there were ways to stand up to that, though. You had a chance to beat the others as well - eventually.
It looks like there are almost no ways in cyber bullying for retaliation.
Except ignoring it.
Which is not exactly always possible.

 

[Vox]

How do you propose we "eliminate" bullying? And please define for us the parameters on what exactly bullying is. I'm not being flippant, but trying to stop people being picked on is like trying to stop teenage boys from getting erections every five minutes. And I'm not talking about cases of clear abuse by kids, but a certain degree of jousting is necessary for a person to learn to stand up for themselves.

And no, there is no way bullying in and of itself is the cause for suicide. If these kids had a solid enough home life and felt loved and nurtured as they deserve to be, the chances of suicide are nil, unless they have some underlying emotional issues to being with.

You can't legislate that people be nice to each other. All of us have run into bullies at some point though and you can't live life without that experience; it's part of the human condition.

as I have said in my previous post - there are various levels of bullying. As any human activity it varies. even the same crime can have different circumstances which lead to different levels of punishment.
So can be done here.

If we start prosecuting people for being assholes to someone who goes on to commit suicide, that is not justice. Unless the girls who tormented the other girl who killed herself, were themselves mentally deranged, they will one day understand what they did and will regret it. Putting them in prison for what the other girl did to herself, is unfathomable and will lead to further miscarriages of justice. If they broke laws, prosecute them, but as far as I know, calling people names and telling them you hate them is not against the law, nor should it be, no matter how repugnant those behaviors are.

we do prosecute people for being assholes and we should.

Bullying is a direct cause of suicide in a teenage group and since suicide in this group is the third most prevalent cause of mortality it should be addressed.

Including criminal prosecution.

 

[Pennywise]

as I have said in my previous post - there are various levels of bullying. As any human activity it varies. even the same crime can have different circumstances which lead to different levels of punishment.
So can be done here.

If we start prosecuting people for being assholes to someone who goes on to commit suicide, that is not justice. Unless the girls who tormented the other girl who killed herself, were themselves mentally deranged, they will one day understand what they did and will regret it. Putting them in prison for what the other girl did to herself, is unfathomable and will lead to further miscarriages of justice. If they broke laws, prosecute them, but as far as I know, calling people names and telling them you hate them is not against the law, nor should it be, no matter how repugnant those behaviors are.

we do prosecute people for being assholes and we should.

Bullying is a direct cause of suicide in a teenage group and since suicide in this group is the third most prevalent cause of mortality it should be addressed.

Including criminal prosecution.

No, we don't, we prosecute people for breaking the law.

Be careful what you wish for. If you seek justice by way of emotional reasoning you wind up with laws that are abusive to the concept of liberty, and the same laws that were enacted to "help" will become onerous to the vast majority. Are you going to start demanding "civility" laws? Laws where free exercise of thought is punished? They have that now in Canada and many European and South American countries. That's the eventual consequence.