Communist California to require Solar Panels on all new homes

[Frankeneinstein]

Repubtards forced seat-belts to restrain US

OK, why not tell bodeca then?

 

[HappyJoy]

Will they also require the batteries to store the electricity? Without those, you're only off grid during daylight hours. You know, when everyone is at work or school...

Daylight hours is when air conditioning is running!

Yep, it's my most expensive appliance and I pay nothing for mine.

 

[Flopper]

As far as budget effects it doesn't matter who merged with what. What matters is how much was paid into the program and how much was paid out.

you just don't get it. SS was set up as a forced retirement fund for American workers. What we paid in was supposed to be put away for our retirement years. Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired. The democrats under LBJ changed it and merged the SS fund with the general fund and then spent it. The classic Ponzi scheme.

Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired.

Currently there is about $2.8 trillion in the SS Trust Fund.

$2.8 trillion of worthless I.O.U.s

Worthless? Like US Treasuries?

U.S. treasuries are an obligation to the taxpayer, and so are the I.O.U.s in the socalled SS trust fund.

Agreed, but like other US treasuries they are far from being worthless.

 

[bripat9643]

you just don't get it. SS was set up as a forced retirement fund for American workers. What we paid in was supposed to be put away for our retirement years. Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired. The democrats under LBJ changed it and merged the SS fund with the general fund and then spent it. The classic Ponzi scheme.

Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired.

Currently there is about $2.8 trillion in the SS Trust Fund.

$2.8 trillion of worthless I.O.U.s

Worthless? Like US Treasuries?

U.S. treasuries are an obligation to the taxpayer, and so are the I.O.U.s in the socalled SS trust fund.

We agree. Rock solid securities. The opposite of worthless.

They are obligations to the taxpayers. Do you understand what that means?

 

[bripat9643]

you just don't get it. SS was set up as a forced retirement fund for American workers. What we paid in was supposed to be put away for our retirement years. Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired. The democrats under LBJ changed it and merged the SS fund with the general fund and then spent it. The classic Ponzi scheme.

Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired.

Currently there is about $2.8 trillion in the SS Trust Fund.

$2.8 trillion of worthless I.O.U.s

Worthless? Like US Treasuries?

U.S. treasuries are an obligation to the taxpayer, and so are the I.O.U.s in the socalled SS trust fund.

Agreed, but like other US treasuries they are far from being worthless.

Wrong. All government securities are obligations to the taxpayers. They are debts, not assets.

 

[bripat9643]

that would be true if the dems in congress had not merged SS funds with the general fund under LBJ. Now, those working pay for those who are retired. There is no "fund" that was made up from our SS (FICA) deductions.

As far as budget effects it doesn't matter who merged with what. What matters is how much was paid into the program and how much was paid out.

you just don't get it. SS was set up as a forced retirement fund for American workers. What we paid in was supposed to be put away for our retirement years. Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired. The democrats under LBJ changed it and merged the SS fund with the general fund and then spent it. The classic Ponzi scheme.

Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired.

Currently there is about $2.8 trillion in the SS Trust Fund.

$2.8 trillion of worthless I.O.U.s

The securities in the Social Security Trust Fund are guaranteed as to both principal and interest by the Federal government which is exactly the same guarantee that holders of over 20 trillion dollars of US debt have.

The only way the government can make good on its "guarantee" is by taking it out of your hide. You and me owe the $20 trillion, dumbass.

 

[bripat9643]

Nobody questions that the climate changes. We have had ice ages, and tropical periods. The question is whether Man is affecting climate, and if there is any man made "fix". All the solutions are more taxes, and fees on energy, and anything that uses energy. It is a government money grab.

The most compelling evidence that climate change we see happening is not natural is the time factor of change and the concurrence of different scientific disciplines.

Natural global changes in climate takes time and lots of it. This's why the changes we are seeing today are so disturbing. The polar ice caps have melted faster in last 20 years than in the last 10,000 years. CO2 levels have been relatively constant for millions of years until the 20th century. In less than a century they have risen to the highest level in 15 million years. Ocean temperatures are rising faster than anytime in last 10,000 years. Changes occurring this fast are not natural and point strongly to human activity.

Discoveries by biologists, paleontologists, geologists, and oceanologists, have confirmed the work of climatologist. When we see evidence of global warming we should have confirmation which is exactly what the science community has given us.

The polar ice caps have melted faster in last 20 years than in the last 10,000 years.

Prove it.

Show how fast they melted in each of the previous 20 year periods.

Polar ice sheets melting faster than ever | DW | 04.02.2013
Warming Seas, Melting Ice Sheets

Retirement is going to be much warmer and wetter than people had once thought. Even if we are able to turn this around and I have serious doubts at this point we are going to see more adverse affects in the coming years.

But hey, how many generations get to witness the extinction of their species?

My grand kids in Washington State are looking forward to the warm sunny days in winter.

Washington state? Doesn't it rain like 200 days out of the year there?

 

[HappyJoy]

The most compelling evidence that climate change we see happening is not natural is the time factor of change and the concurrence of different scientific disciplines.

Natural global changes in climate takes time and lots of it. This's why the changes we are seeing today are so disturbing. The polar ice caps have melted faster in last 20 years than in the last 10,000 years. CO2 levels have been relatively constant for millions of years until the 20th century. In less than a century they have risen to the highest level in 15 million years. Ocean temperatures are rising faster than anytime in last 10,000 years. Changes occurring this fast are not natural and point strongly to human activity.

Discoveries by biologists, paleontologists, geologists, and oceanologists, have confirmed the work of climatologist. When we see evidence of global warming we should have confirmation which is exactly what the science community has given us.

The polar ice caps have melted faster in last 20 years than in the last 10,000 years.

Prove it.

Show how fast they melted in each of the previous 20 year periods.

Polar ice sheets melting faster than ever | DW | 04.02.2013
Warming Seas, Melting Ice Sheets

Retirement is going to be much warmer and wetter than people had once thought. Even if we are able to turn this around and I have serious doubts at this point we are going to see more adverse affects in the coming years.

But hey, how many generations get to witness the extinction of their species?

My grand kids in Washington State are looking forward to the warm sunny days in winter.

Washington state? Doesn't it rain like 200 days out of the year there?

WOW are you dense.

 

[bripat9643]

The polar ice caps have melted faster in last 20 years than in the last 10,000 years.

Prove it.

Show how fast they melted in each of the previous 20 year periods.

Polar ice sheets melting faster than ever | DW | 04.02.2013
Warming Seas, Melting Ice Sheets

Retirement is going to be much warmer and wetter than people had once thought. Even if we are able to turn this around and I have serious doubts at this point we are going to see more adverse affects in the coming years.

But hey, how many generations get to witness the extinction of their species?

My grand kids in Washington State are looking forward to the warm sunny days in winter.

Washington state? Doesn't it rain like 200 days out of the year there?

WOW are you dense.

Installing solar panels where it rains 200 days a year defines "dense."

 

[HappyJoy]

Polar ice sheets melting faster than ever | DW | 04.02.2013
Warming Seas, Melting Ice Sheets

Retirement is going to be much warmer and wetter than people had once thought. Even if we are able to turn this around and I have serious doubts at this point we are going to see more adverse affects in the coming years.

But hey, how many generations get to witness the extinction of their species?

My grand kids in Washington State are looking forward to the warm sunny days in winter.

Washington state? Doesn't it rain like 200 days out of the year there?

WOW are you dense.

Installing solar panels where it rains 200 days a year defines "dense."

For starters you clearly misunderstood the post and you doubled down on that fact.

But since you brought it up, yes solar does work in Seattle, obviously you didn't look into that either before posting did you?

 

[Markle]

Is that not the answer to all conservatives answer to having an unsatisfactory job?

Just get a new one?

You have the “freedom” of choice?

Yes, you "just get a new one".

If the unemployment rate in your area is low, you let your fingers do the walking through the internet and you find an area which is starved for your abilities. Then you pack up and move.

Next question.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired.

Currently there is about $2.8 trillion in the SS Trust Fund.

$2.8 trillion of worthless I.O.U.s

Worthless? Like US Treasuries?

U.S. treasuries are an obligation to the taxpayer, and so are the I.O.U.s in the socalled SS trust fund.

We agree. Rock solid securities. The opposite of worthless.

They are obligations to the taxpayers. Do you understand what that means?

That means I don't have to worry that my T-Notes will fail to pay my interest or return my principal.

 

[Flopper]

Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired.

Currently there is about $2.8 trillion in the SS Trust Fund.

$2.8 trillion of worthless I.O.U.s

Worthless? Like US Treasuries?

U.S. treasuries are an obligation to the taxpayer, and so are the I.O.U.s in the socalled SS trust fund.

Agreed, but like other US treasuries they are far from being worthless.

Wrong. All government securities are obligations to the taxpayers. They are debts, not assets.

To be worthless means the treasury bills have no value. They certainly have value to the trust and thus value to all beneficiaries and are considered assets of trust. These treasury bills are federal debt and that does mean they are a taxpayer debt if that debt were ever actually transferred to them. However, my main point is beneficiaries of the trust fund are not synonymous with taxpayers. Some taxpayers are never beneficiaries and some beneficiaries are never burdened with taxes. They are two separate entities. The treasury bills are assets of the beneficiaries and a taxpayer liability.

 

[Markle]

Will they also require the batteries to store the electricity? Without those, you're only off grid during daylight hours. You know, when everyone is at work or school...

There are no batteries. The solar panels feed right into the grid and you get your electricity the same way you always did. The difference is how the electricity is metered.

That's not exactly correct. I mean other than you're wrong about the batteries, it's an option.

The electricity you get from solar goes to you as you are using it. What you don't use goes to the utility. You are not sending/selling all your energy directly to your utility only to buy/consume energy from the utility. What you sell is not worth as much as what you buy from your utility company. Think of it as the energy you send to the utility as being wholesale and what you buy above and beyond what you are generating is retail.

Here is a chart it sort of explains it.

No no, I get all that. My mindset is to be off the grid completely, screw the utility companies.

Plenty of places for you to move to do just that. Just pack up and head out.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired.

Currently there is about $2.8 trillion in the SS Trust Fund.

$2.8 trillion of worthless I.O.U.s

Worthless? Like US Treasuries?

U.S. treasuries are an obligation to the taxpayer, and so are the I.O.U.s in the socalled SS trust fund.

Agreed, but like other US treasuries they are far from being worthless.

Wrong. All government securities are obligations to the taxpayers. They are debts, not assets.

All government securities are obligations to the taxpayers.

Yup.

They are debts, not assets.

They're debts and assets.

 

[Markle]

Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired.

Currently there is about $2.8 trillion in the SS Trust Fund.

True, there is about $2.8 Trillion in the account of Social Security but there is no trust fund.

We have a massive unfunded liability.

U.S. National Debt Clock : Real Time

 

[bripat9643]

$2.8 trillion of worthless I.O.U.s

Worthless? Like US Treasuries?

U.S. treasuries are an obligation to the taxpayer, and so are the I.O.U.s in the socalled SS trust fund.

We agree. Rock solid securities. The opposite of worthless.

They are obligations to the taxpayers. Do you understand what that means?

That means I don't have to worry that my T-Notes will fail to pay my interest or return my principal.

Are you playing stupid?

If you wrote an IOU to yourself and stuck it in your pocket, how much money could you get from what you have in your pocket?

 

[bripat9643]

$2.8 trillion of worthless I.O.U.s

Worthless? Like US Treasuries?

U.S. treasuries are an obligation to the taxpayer, and so are the I.O.U.s in the socalled SS trust fund.

Agreed, but like other US treasuries they are far from being worthless.

Wrong. All government securities are obligations to the taxpayers. They are debts, not assets.

All government securities are obligations to the taxpayers.

Yup.

They are debts, not assets.

They're debts and assets.

When the government issues a security to itself, how much has it increased the assets of the government?

 

[bripat9643]

$2.8 trillion of worthless I.O.U.s

Worthless? Like US Treasuries?

U.S. treasuries are an obligation to the taxpayer, and so are the I.O.U.s in the socalled SS trust fund.

Agreed, but like other US treasuries they are far from being worthless.

Wrong. All government securities are obligations to the taxpayers. They are debts, not assets.

To be worthless means the treasury bills have no value. They certainly have value to the trust and thus value to all beneficiaries and are considered assets of trust. These treasury bills are federal debt and that does mean they are a taxpayer debt if that debt were ever actually transferred to them. However, my main point is beneficiaries of the trust fund are not synonymous with taxpayers. Some taxpayers are never beneficiaries and some beneficiaries are never burdened with taxes. They are two separate entities. The treasury bills are assets of the beneficiaries and a taxpayer liability.

All you're saying is that some people never collect Social Security. The bottom line is that the securities in the soc-alled Trust Fund can only be paid off by extracting the money from taxpayers. They are claims on taxpayers. They are therefor of no value to taxpayers. They are obligations. So why should the taxpyers vote to support this Ponzi scheme?

Your claim that taxpayers and beneficiaries are two separate groups is false. They are the same exact people.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Currently there is zero in the SS fund and those working are paying those who are retired.

Currently there is about $2.8 trillion in the SS Trust Fund.

True, there is about $2.8 Trillion in the account of Social Security but there is no trust fund.

We have a massive unfunded liability.

U.S. National Debt Clock : Real Time

True, there is about $2.8 Trillion in the account of Social Security but there is no trust fund.

So where is the $2.8 trillion?