Eight Myths about the Bible

[Coloradomtnman]

Free Markets are a myth

No. Free markets exist for illegal drugs.

What?! Then why don't I get'em for free? This is bullshit! I'm a victim of a drug crime!

 

[Meriweather]

Trivialize it, minimize it, rationalize it all you want. Its all right there in the Bible for all the world to see. Your God either condones or condoned people owning people.

The greatest Commandment is to love God with all one's heart, mind, soul, and being. The second is to love one's fellow man as oneself. The Ten Commandments are founded on these two precepts.

Fast forward to last year in America, when over three hundred thousand babies were aborted. Since 1973, millions of US babies have been aborted, and what do you bet the majority of abortions in this country have been sought by Christians. This fact tell us that there are many Christians who believe God is okay with abortion. After all, our government and economic realities tells us so.

In the same way, when slavery became a reality (because of the government and economic realities of the time) people were okay with believing, "God willed it." We fool ourselves all too easily.

The biggest tragedies in the Bible is every incident that is not based on the love of God or loving one's fellow man as oneself--but when we can point out the number of times people in power convinced armies and nations they spoke for God--and the people didn't weigh these declarations against, "Love Me...Love one another." We the people aren't any better today at doing that, than were the people in those days. The tragedy is that we the people haven't learned enough in six thousand years.

 

[RandomVariable]

Slavery is slavery, whether its like the Africans brought out of Africa or the slaves Jews owned as recorded in the Bible. Owning another human being is morally wrong. Its worse when its legal or religiously condoned.

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46 NLT)

If you buy a Hebrew slave, he is to serve for only six years. Set him free in the seventh year, and he will owe you nothing for his freedom. If he was single when he became your slave and then married afterward, only he will go free in the seventh year. But if he was married before he became a slave, then his wife will be freed with him. If his master gave him a wife while he was a slave, and they had sons or daughters, then the man will be free in the seventh year, but his wife and children will still belong to his master. But the slave may plainly declare, 'I love my master, my wife, and my children. I would rather not go free.' If he does this, his master must present him before God. Then his master must take him to the door and publicly pierce his ear with an awl. After that, the slave will belong to his master forever. (Exodus 21:2-6 NLT)

When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)

From the New Testament:

Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. (Ephesians 6:5 NLT)

That the Bible condones slavery isn't a myth.

[/QUOTE]
A reply to your second post in a minute but first this small observation. I find somewhat amusing that people will claim that the Bible is completely fictional and then use a phrase such as "as recorded in the Bible". Off the top of my head I do not remember if you deny the truth of the Bible or not so this might not directly apply to you.

 

[Coloradomtnman]

Slavery is slavery, whether its like the Africans brought out of Africa or the slaves Jews owned as recorded in the Bible. Owning another human being is morally wrong. Its worse when its legal or religiously condoned.

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46 NLT)

If you buy a Hebrew slave, he is to serve for only six years. Set him free in the seventh year, and he will owe you nothing for his freedom. If he was single when he became your slave and then married afterward, only he will go free in the seventh year. But if he was married before he became a slave, then his wife will be freed with him. If his master gave him a wife while he was a slave, and they had sons or daughters, then the man will be free in the seventh year, but his wife and children will still belong to his master. But the slave may plainly declare, 'I love my master, my wife, and my children. I would rather not go free.' If he does this, his master must present him before God. Then his master must take him to the door and publicly pierce his ear with an awl. After that, the slave will belong to his master forever. (Exodus 21:2-6 NLT)

When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)

From the New Testament:

Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. (Ephesians 6:5 NLT)

That the Bible condones slavery isn't a myth.

A reply to your second post in a minute but first this small observation. I find somewhat amusing that people will claim that the Bible is completely fictional and then use a phrase such as "as recorded in the Bible". Off the top of my head I do not remember if you deny the truth of the Bible or not so this might not directly apply to you.

I don't believe in the message of the Bible, but that doesn't mean it is devoid of accurate historical accounts.

 

[RandomVariable]

Slavery is slavery, whether its like the Africans brought out of Africa or the slaves Jews owned as recorded in the Bible. Owning another human being is morally wrong. Its worse when its legal or religiously condoned.

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46 NLT)

If you buy a Hebrew slave, he is to serve for only six years. Set him free in the seventh year, and he will owe you nothing for his freedom. If he was single when he became your slave and then married afterward, only he will go free in the seventh year. But if he was married before he became a slave, then his wife will be freed with him. If his master gave him a wife while he was a slave, and they had sons or daughters, then the man will be free in the seventh year, but his wife and children will still belong to his master. But the slave may plainly declare, 'I love my master, my wife, and my children. I would rather not go free.' If he does this, his master must present him before God. Then his master must take him to the door and publicly pierce his ear with an awl. After that, the slave will belong to his master forever. (Exodus 21:2-6 NLT)

When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)

From the New Testament:

Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. (Ephesians 6:5 NLT)

That the Bible condones slavery isn't a myth.

A reply to your second post in a minute but first this small observation. I find somewhat amusing that people will claim that the Bible is completely fictional and then use a phrase such as "as recorded in the Bible". Off the top of my head I do not remember if you deny the truth of the Bible or not so this might not directly apply to you.

I don't believe in the message of the Bible, but that doesn't mean it is devoid of accurate historical accounts.

Slavery is slavery, whether its like the Africans brought out of Africa or the slaves Jews owned as recorded in the Bible. Owning another human being is morally wrong. Its worse when its legal or religiously condoned.

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46 NLT)

If you buy a Hebrew slave, he is to serve for only six years. Set him free in the seventh year, and he will owe you nothing for his freedom. If he was single when he became your slave and then married afterward, only he will go free in the seventh year. But if he was married before he became a slave, then his wife will be freed with him. If his master gave him a wife while he was a slave, and they had sons or daughters, then the man will be free in the seventh year, but his wife and children will still belong to his master. But the slave may plainly declare, 'I love my master, my wife, and my children. I would rather not go free.' If he does this, his master must present him before God. Then his master must take him to the door and publicly pierce his ear with an awl. After that, the slave will belong to his master forever. (Exodus 21:2-6 NLT)

When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)

From the New Testament:

Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. (Ephesians 6:5 NLT)

That the Bible condones slavery isn't a myth.

Don't you just love it when people pick and choose parts of the Bible which best suit their purposes?
Leviticus (KJV)

47And if a sojourner or stranger wax rich by thee, and thy brother that dwelleth by him wax poor, and sell himself unto the stranger or sojourner by thee, or to the stock of the stranger's family: 48After that he is sold he may be redeemed again; one of his brethren may redeem him: 49Either his uncle, or his uncle's son, may redeem him, or any that is nigh of kin unto him of his family may redeem him; or if he be able, he may redeem himself. 50And he shall reckon with him that bought him from the year that he was sold to him unto the year of jubile: and the price of his sale shall be according unto the number of years, according to the time of an hired servant shall it be with him. 51If there be yet many years behind, according unto them he shall give again the price of his redemption out of the money that he was bought for. 52And if there remain but few years unto the year of jubile, then he shall count with him, and according unto his years shall he give him again the price of his redemption. 53And as a yearly hired servant shall he be with him: and the other shall not rule with rigour over him in thy sight. 54And if he be not redeemed in these years, then he shall go out in the year of jubile, both he, and his children with him. 55For unto me the children of Israel are servants; they are my servants whom I brought forth out of the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.
(Bolding mine.)​

Are you not attempting to do what you have just accused me of doing - picking from the Bible those passages which suit your agenda?

Only where I succeeded, you failed. Voluntary slavery is still slavery.

Your post not only fails to refute my point, it supports it. The Hebrews bought and sold human beings, and had religious rules that dictated exactly how those slaves were to be purchased, sold, and kept - depending on the heritage of the slave in particular.

If I picked Bible passages out of context, or paraphrased, or parsed the passages to best suit my purposes, you might gave a point. But those passages are right there, in context, un-edited. On top of these passages, no where in the Bible are there any which condemn slavery as a practice, including the New Testament.

Trivialize it, minimize it, rationalize it all you want. Its all right there in the Bible for all the world to see. Your God either condones or condoned people owning people.

I will admit I basically did what you did and I neither refuted your point nor made a actually made a point of my own. Some subjects in the bible take a bit of greater understanding to convey and that means a lot of explaining to communicate. Perhaps at I will get around to explaining that aspect of the bible but for the time being I will just say read the whole thing six times and then you still will have no idea what the bible says about anything but you will have a much greater understanding of God.

 

[BluePhantom]

This is my understanding of the term/name YWHW from what I have heard. I do not know Hebrew so I am only repeating things I have heard. In the Bible when Moses as God who he should say sent him what is written down is:

(may not be the correct original language.)

This is not actually a word and does not really have a pronunciation. It has been interpreted as the name of God although that may be completely inaccurate. It is written in the KJV Bible as I AM THAT I AM. Written in Hebrew I think it looks like two doors with a post in the middle and a little marker at the top corner of the right door. In other words, make a choice, either one, but it had better be this one.

Well kind of yes and kind of no. YHWH is how it is written in Hebrew. It's not a word no much as an anagram. In Exodus 3 God tells Moses to go to Pharaoh and demand the release of the Hebrews. Moses asks who he should say is commanding this and by who's authority he makes this command...which in a polytheistic society is a pretty good idea. Is it Marduk making this command? Osiris? Elohim? You know...what god are we talking about here? God answers "I am who I am"...it also means "I will be who I will be" and it could also mean "I blow (or will blow) what I blow (or will blow)". This is because the Hebrew words for "to be" and "blow" are the same and because Hebrew does not distinguish between present and future tenses, but it seems unlikely that God would identify himself as "he who blows" (although there is some association with winds in Genesis but that's a whole other discussion), so it's probably "I am who I am".

Ancient Hebrew is a bit tough for westerners to read because it is written from right to left instead of left to right and there are no spaces, no vowels, no punctuation, no paragraphs. It's just one long string of letters. Consider if we ran across DRP in a string of letters. Well we would have to reverse that to PRD which could mean prod, poured, pride, proud, paired...the list goes on. It can be really confusing and still today scholars find things that are commonly translated in the Bible as one thing and through modern scholarship realize that it means something else entirely.

As an interesting side note, there are some great early Greek manuscripts that misunderstood the Hebrew. Greek is read from left to right as English is and when they saw YHWH they noted that it kind of sort of looks like pi-iota-i-iota which spells PiPi (pronounced "pee-pee") which means "chicken" in ancient Egyptian and so those ancient Greeks concluded that the Hebrews were worshiping a chicken god named PiPi.

To further confuse things, the name of God was so powerful that it was not to be spoken by penalty of death and so the ancient Hebrew priests referred to God as "Adonai" (pronounced "A-doh-ni" [A as in cat as the stressed syllable and a long i at the end as in night]. It gets a little complicated because you have to now translate everything into German but when you do that and use the YHWH as it is written, and the vowels from Adonai as it was spoken, put them all together and say it in German, you get "Jehovah". Even Adonai was sometimes considered too powerful and instead God was simply referred to as "ha-Shem" or "the name".

And to confuse things even more, the name of God was also knows as Elohim in different sources and those sources were spliced together which is why in the pentateuch it sometimes refers to God as Elohim and sometimes as YHWH.

So there you go. Hope that adds clarity instead of confusion. LOL

 

[DriftingSand]

This is my understanding of the term/name YWHW from what I have heard. I do not know Hebrew so I am only repeating things I have heard. In the Bible when Moses as God who he should say sent him what is written down is:

(may not be the correct original language.)

This is not actually a word and does not really have a pronunciation. It has been interpreted as the name of God although that may be completely inaccurate. It is written in the KJV Bible as I AM THAT I AM. Written in Hebrew I think it looks like two doors with a post in the middle and a little marker at the top corner of the right door. In other words, make a choice, either one, but it had better be this one.

Well kind of yes and kind of no. YHWH is how it is written in Hebrew. It's not a word no much as an anagram. In Exodus 3 God tells Moses to go to Pharaoh and demand the release of the Hebrews. Moses asks who he should say is commanding this and by who's authority he makes this command...which in a polytheistic society is a pretty good idea. Is it Marduk making this command? Osiris? Elohim? You know...what god are we talking about here? God answers "I am who I am"...it also means "I will be who I will be" and it could also mean "I blow (or will blow) what I blow (or will blow)". This is because the Hebrew words for "to be" and "blow" are the same and because Hebrew does not distinguish between present and future tenses, but it seems unlikely that God would identify himself as "he who blows" (although there is some association with winds in Genesis but that's a whole other discussion), so it's probably "I am who I am".

Ancient Hebrew is a bit tough for westerners to read because it is written from right to left instead of left to right and there are no spaces, no vowels, no punctuation, no paragraphs. It's just one long string of letters. Consider if we ran across DRP in a string of letters. Well we would have to reverse that to PRD which could mean prod, poured, pride, proud, paired...the list goes on. It can be really confusing and still today scholars find things that are commonly translated in the Bible as one thing and through modern scholarship realize that it means something else entirely.

As an interesting side note, there are some great early Greek manuscripts that misunderstood the Hebrew. Greek is read from left to right as English is and when they saw YHWH they noted that it kind of sort of looks like pi-iota-i-iota which spells PiPi (pronounced "pee-pee") which means "chicken" in ancient Egyptian and so those ancient Greeks concluded that the Hebrews were worshiping a chicken god named PiPi.

To further confuse things, the name of God was so powerful that it was not to be spoken by penalty of death and so the ancient Hebrew priests referred to God as "Adonai" (pronounced "A-doh-ni" [A as in cat as the stressed syllable and a long i at the end as in night]. It gets a little complicated because you have to now translate everything into German but when you do that and use the YHWH as it is written, and the vowels from Adonai as it was spoken, put them all together and say it in German, you get "Jehovah". Even Adonai was sometimes considered too powerful and instead God was simply referred to as "ha-Shem" or "the name".

And to confuse things even more, the name of God was also knows as Elohim in different sources and those sources were spliced together which is why in the pentateuch it sometimes refers to God as Elohim and sometimes as YHWH.

So there you go. Hope that adds clarity instead of confusion. LOL

Regardless of the name used to identify God, He is Who He is and changes not. I believe that He knows the heart and soul of man so He knows when a human sincerely seeks Him regardless of the name used. In other words, I don't believe that someone who says Jehovah instead of Yaweh will be penalized in some way, shape, or manner. I believe that when I say "Jesus Christ" He knows that I'm referring to Him and nobody else.

 

[Hollie]

This is my understanding of the term/name YWHW from what I have heard. I do not know Hebrew so I am only repeating things I have heard. In the Bible when Moses as God who he should say sent him what is written down is:

(may not be the correct original language.)

This is not actually a word and does not really have a pronunciation. It has been interpreted as the name of God although that may be completely inaccurate. It is written in the KJV Bible as I AM THAT I AM. Written in Hebrew I think it looks like two doors with a post in the middle and a little marker at the top corner of the right door. In other words, make a choice, either one, but it had better be this one.

Well kind of yes and kind of no. YHWH is how it is written in Hebrew. It's not a word no much as an anagram. In Exodus 3 God tells Moses to go to Pharaoh and demand the release of the Hebrews. Moses asks who he should say is commanding this and by who's authority he makes this command...which in a polytheistic society is a pretty good idea. Is it Marduk making this command? Osiris? Elohim? You know...what god are we talking about here? God answers "I am who I am"...it also means "I will be who I will be" and it could also mean "I blow (or will blow) what I blow (or will blow)". This is because the Hebrew words for "to be" and "blow" are the same and because Hebrew does not distinguish between present and future tenses, but it seems unlikely that God would identify himself as "he who blows" (although there is some association with winds in Genesis but that's a whole other discussion), so it's probably "I am who I am".

Ancient Hebrew is a bit tough for westerners to read because it is written from right to left instead of left to right and there are no spaces, no vowels, no punctuation, no paragraphs. It's just one long string of letters. Consider if we ran across DRP in a string of letters. Well we would have to reverse that to PRD which could mean prod, poured, pride, proud, paired...the list goes on. It can be really confusing and still today scholars find things that are commonly translated in the Bible as one thing and through modern scholarship realize that it means something else entirely.

As an interesting side note, there are some great early Greek manuscripts that misunderstood the Hebrew. Greek is read from left to right as English is and when they saw YHWH they noted that it kind of sort of looks like pi-iota-i-iota which spells PiPi (pronounced "pee-pee") which means "chicken" in ancient Egyptian and so those ancient Greeks concluded that the Hebrews were worshiping a chicken god named PiPi.

To further confuse things, the name of God was so powerful that it was not to be spoken by penalty of death and so the ancient Hebrew priests referred to God as "Adonai" (pronounced "A-doh-ni" [A as in cat as the stressed syllable and a long i at the end as in night]. It gets a little complicated because you have to now translate everything into German but when you do that and use the YHWH as it is written, and the vowels from Adonai as it was spoken, put them all together and say it in German, you get "Jehovah". Even Adonai was sometimes considered too powerful and instead God was simply referred to as "ha-Shem" or "the name".

And to confuse things even more, the name of God was also knows as Elohim in different sources and those sources were spliced together which is why in the pentateuch it sometimes refers to God as Elohim and sometimes as YHWH.

So there you go. Hope that adds clarity instead of confusion. LOL

Regardless of the name used to identify God, He is Who He is and changes not. I believe that He knows the heart and soul of man so He knows when a human sincerely seeks Him regardless of the name used. In other words, I don't believe that someone who says Jehovah instead of Yaweh will be penalized in some way, shape, or manner. I believe that when I say "Jesus Christ" He knows that I'm referring to Him and nobody else.

Jehovah, Yahweh (the gawds will be upset if you can't spell their respective names correctly), Odin, Zeuss, etc.

Jeebus schmeebus. Just pick any of the three gawds that are prominent in your geographic location and go with them.

 

[RandomVariable]

This is my understanding of the term/name YWHW from what I have heard. I do not know Hebrew so I am only repeating things I have heard. In the Bible when Moses as God who he should say sent him what is written down is:

(may not be the correct original language.)

This is not actually a word and does not really have a pronunciation. It has been interpreted as the name of God although that may be completely inaccurate. It is written in the KJV Bible as I AM THAT I AM. Written in Hebrew I think it looks like two doors with a post in the middle and a little marker at the top corner of the right door. In other words, make a choice, either one, but it had better be this one.

Well kind of yes and kind of no. YHWH is how it is written in Hebrew. It's not a word no much as an anagram. In Exodus 3 God tells Moses to go to Pharaoh and demand the release of the Hebrews. Moses asks who he should say is commanding this and by who's authority he makes this command...which in a polytheistic society is a pretty good idea. Is it Marduk making this command? Osiris? Elohim? You know...what god are we talking about here? God answers "I am who I am"...it also means "I will be who I will be" and it could also mean "I blow (or will blow) what I blow (or will blow)". This is because the Hebrew words for "to be" and "blow" are the same and because Hebrew does not distinguish between present and future tenses, but it seems unlikely that God would identify himself as "he who blows" (although there is some association with winds in Genesis but that's a whole other discussion), so it's probably "I am who I am".

Ancient Hebrew is a bit tough for westerners to read because it is written from right to left instead of left to right and there are no spaces, no vowels, no punctuation, no paragraphs. It's just one long string of letters. Consider if we ran across DRP in a string of letters. Well we would have to reverse that to PRD which could mean prod, poured, pride, proud, paired...the list goes on. It can be really confusing and still today scholars find things that are commonly translated in the Bible as one thing and through modern scholarship realize that it means something else entirely.

As an interesting side note, there are some great early Greek manuscripts that misunderstood the Hebrew. Greek is read from left to right as English is and when they saw YHWH they noted that it kind of sort of looks like pi-iota-i-iota which spells PiPi (pronounced "pee-pee") which means "chicken" in ancient Egyptian and so those ancient Greeks concluded that the Hebrews were worshiping a chicken god named PiPi.

To further confuse things, the name of God was so powerful that it was not to be spoken by penalty of death and so the ancient Hebrew priests referred to God as "Adonai" (pronounced "A-doh-ni" [A as in cat as the stressed syllable and a long i at the end as in night]. It gets a little complicated because you have to now translate everything into German but when you do that and use the YHWH as it is written, and the vowels from Adonai as it was spoken, put them all together and say it in German, you get "Jehovah". Even Adonai was sometimes considered too powerful and instead God was simply referred to as "ha-Shem" or "the name".

And to confuse things even more, the name of God was also knows as Elohim in different sources and those sources were spliced together which is why in the pentateuch it sometimes refers to God as Elohim and sometimes as YHWH.

So there you go. Hope that adds clarity instead of confusion. LOL

I was just referring to the anagram. As far as actually referring to God God and Yahweh are acceptable. Do not use Elohim, or any variation of that. The word Jehovah is something different altogether.

 

[Steven_R]

...because YHWH is a Master of Creation and a Master of Destruction
​

Master of Creation? Unquestionably!

Master of Destruction? When necessary and only when evil is present. "All iniquity and all things that offend" will be destroyed -- ultimately.

So it was necessary to kill Job's whole family just to prove a point? What evil is present and needs destroying when God lets a child get terminal cancer?

 

[Meriweather]

So it was necessary to kill Job's whole family just to prove a point? What evil is present and needs destroying when God lets a child get terminal cancer?

The point of the Book of Job is to emphasize we cannot see life from God's perspective. Job is a prototype of good men who try to understand God and how God views life and the world we live in. How does God want us to relate to Him?

 

[Steven_R]

I would hope God would want us to relate to Him as a loving creator and not as some capricious overlord that swats as the mere flies we are for little to no reason at all.

I'm still waiting to know what evil God smotes from the Earth when he gives kids terminal diseases.

 

[DriftingSand]

This is my understanding of the term/name YWHW from what I have heard. I do not know Hebrew so I am only repeating things I have heard. In the Bible when Moses as God who he should say sent him what is written down is:

(may not be the correct original language.)

This is not actually a word and does not really have a pronunciation. It has been interpreted as the name of God although that may be completely inaccurate. It is written in the KJV Bible as I AM THAT I AM. Written in Hebrew I think it looks like two doors with a post in the middle and a little marker at the top corner of the right door. In other words, make a choice, either one, but it had better be this one.

Well kind of yes and kind of no. YHWH is how it is written in Hebrew. It's not a word no much as an anagram. In Exodus 3 God tells Moses to go to Pharaoh and demand the release of the Hebrews. Moses asks who he should say is commanding this and by who's authority he makes this command...which in a polytheistic society is a pretty good idea. Is it Marduk making this command? Osiris? Elohim? You know...what god are we talking about here? God answers "I am who I am"...it also means "I will be who I will be" and it could also mean "I blow (or will blow) what I blow (or will blow)". This is because the Hebrew words for "to be" and "blow" are the same and because Hebrew does not distinguish between present and future tenses, but it seems unlikely that God would identify himself as "he who blows" (although there is some association with winds in Genesis but that's a whole other discussion), so it's probably "I am who I am".

Ancient Hebrew is a bit tough for westerners to read because it is written from right to left instead of left to right and there are no spaces, no vowels, no punctuation, no paragraphs. It's just one long string of letters. Consider if we ran across DRP in a string of letters. Well we would have to reverse that to PRD which could mean prod, poured, pride, proud, paired...the list goes on. It can be really confusing and still today scholars find things that are commonly translated in the Bible as one thing and through modern scholarship realize that it means something else entirely.

As an interesting side note, there are some great early Greek manuscripts that misunderstood the Hebrew. Greek is read from left to right as English is and when they saw YHWH they noted that it kind of sort of looks like pi-iota-i-iota which spells PiPi (pronounced "pee-pee") which means "chicken" in ancient Egyptian and so those ancient Greeks concluded that the Hebrews were worshiping a chicken god named PiPi.

To further confuse things, the name of God was so powerful that it was not to be spoken by penalty of death and so the ancient Hebrew priests referred to God as "Adonai" (pronounced "A-doh-ni" [A as in cat as the stressed syllable and a long i at the end as in night]. It gets a little complicated because you have to now translate everything into German but when you do that and use the YHWH as it is written, and the vowels from Adonai as it was spoken, put them all together and say it in German, you get "Jehovah". Even Adonai was sometimes considered too powerful and instead God was simply referred to as "ha-Shem" or "the name".

And to confuse things even more, the name of God was also knows as Elohim in different sources and those sources were spliced together which is why in the pentateuch it sometimes refers to God as Elohim and sometimes as YHWH.

So there you go. Hope that adds clarity instead of confusion. LOL

Regardless of the name used to identify God, He is Who He is and changes not. I believe that He knows the heart and soul of man so He knows when a human sincerely seeks Him regardless of the name used. In other words, I don't believe that someone who says Jehovah instead of Yaweh will be penalized in some way, shape, or manner. I believe that when I say "Jesus Christ" He knows that I'm referring to Him and nobody else.

Jehovah, Yahweh (the gawds will be upset if you can't spell their respective names correctly), Odin, Zeuss, etc.

Jeebus schmeebus. Just pick any of the three gawds that are prominent in your geographic location and go with them.

Hi troll. Long time no see.

 

[RandomVariable]

...because YHWH is a Master of Creation and a Master of Destruction
​

Master of Creation? Unquestionably!

Master of Destruction? When necessary and only when evil is present. "All iniquity and all things that offend" will be destroyed -- ultimately.

So it was necessary to kill Job's whole family just to prove a point? What evil is present and needs destroying when God lets a child get terminal cancer?

One, he left his wife (I bite my tongue here ) and two, it does not specifically say he killed the three daughters. Also there is a possible rational for the killing of the sons which requires looking at some of the pieces of the story at a different angle but I will not go into that here.

As far as a child who dies of cancer at the age of three, is God suppose to save everyone's life? Where does he draw the line? What if the cancer was caused by a company dumping chemicals into the river by the child's house. Should God fix that too? No one wants to believe in God but everyone wants him to fix their problems. And they don't believe in him because he doesn't.

 

[RandomVariable]

So it was necessary to kill Job's whole family just to prove a point? What evil is present and needs destroying when God lets a child get terminal cancer?

The point of the Book of Job is to emphasize we cannot see life from God's perspective. Job is a prototype of good men who try to understand God and how God views life and the world we live in. How does God want us to relate to Him?

Actually that is a completely wrong interpretation of Job.

 

[Hollie]

This is my understanding of the term/name YWHW from what I have heard. I do not know Hebrew so I am only repeating things I have heard. In the Bible when Moses as God who he should say sent him what is written down is:

(may not be the correct original language.)

This is not actually a word and does not really have a pronunciation. It has been interpreted as the name of God although that may be completely inaccurate. It is written in the KJV Bible as I AM THAT I AM. Written in Hebrew I think it looks like two doors with a post in the middle and a little marker at the top corner of the right door. In other words, make a choice, either one, but it had better be this one.

Well kind of yes and kind of no. YHWH is how it is written in Hebrew. It's not a word no much as an anagram. In Exodus 3 God tells Moses to go to Pharaoh and demand the release of the Hebrews. Moses asks who he should say is commanding this and by who's authority he makes this command...which in a polytheistic society is a pretty good idea. Is it Marduk making this command? Osiris? Elohim? You know...what god are we talking about here? God answers "I am who I am"...it also means "I will be who I will be" and it could also mean "I blow (or will blow) what I blow (or will blow)". This is because the Hebrew words for "to be" and "blow" are the same and because Hebrew does not distinguish between present and future tenses, but it seems unlikely that God would identify himself as "he who blows" (although there is some association with winds in Genesis but that's a whole other discussion), so it's probably "I am who I am".

Ancient Hebrew is a bit tough for westerners to read because it is written from right to left instead of left to right and there are no spaces, no vowels, no punctuation, no paragraphs. It's just one long string of letters. Consider if we ran across DRP in a string of letters. Well we would have to reverse that to PRD which could mean prod, poured, pride, proud, paired...the list goes on. It can be really confusing and still today scholars find things that are commonly translated in the Bible as one thing and through modern scholarship realize that it means something else entirely.

As an interesting side note, there are some great early Greek manuscripts that misunderstood the Hebrew. Greek is read from left to right as English is and when they saw YHWH they noted that it kind of sort of looks like pi-iota-i-iota which spells PiPi (pronounced "pee-pee") which means "chicken" in ancient Egyptian and so those ancient Greeks concluded that the Hebrews were worshiping a chicken god named PiPi.

To further confuse things, the name of God was so powerful that it was not to be spoken by penalty of death and so the ancient Hebrew priests referred to God as "Adonai" (pronounced "A-doh-ni" [A as in cat as the stressed syllable and a long i at the end as in night]. It gets a little complicated because you have to now translate everything into German but when you do that and use the YHWH as it is written, and the vowels from Adonai as it was spoken, put them all together and say it in German, you get "Jehovah". Even Adonai was sometimes considered too powerful and instead God was simply referred to as "ha-Shem" or "the name".

And to confuse things even more, the name of God was also knows as Elohim in different sources and those sources were spliced together which is why in the pentateuch it sometimes refers to God as Elohim and sometimes as YHWH.

So there you go. Hope that adds clarity instead of confusion. LOL

Regardless of the name used to identify God, He is Who He is and changes not. I believe that He knows the heart and soul of man so He knows when a human sincerely seeks Him regardless of the name used. In other words, I don't believe that someone who says Jehovah instead of Yaweh will be penalized in some way, shape, or manner. I believe that when I say "Jesus Christ" He knows that I'm referring to Him and nobody else.

Jehovah, Yahweh (the gawds will be upset if you can't spell their respective names correctly), Odin, Zeuss, etc.

Jeebus schmeebus. Just pick any of the three gawds that are prominent in your geographic location and go with them.

Hi troll. Long time no see.

Still dodging and sidestepping, I see.

 

[September]

So it was necessary to kill Job's whole family just to prove a point? What evil is present and needs destroying when God lets a child get terminal cancer?

The point of the Book of Job is to emphasize we cannot see life from God's perspective. Job is a prototype of good men who try to understand God and how God views life and the world we live in. How does God want us to relate to Him?

Actually that is a completely wrong interpretation of Job.

Actually...

Many passages in the Bible are meant to be interpreted in a way that is most relevant to us. That is part of what makes the Bible so powerful a Book.

My interpretation of Job, is that God was teaching Satan something profound, as a father would teach his son, and for many of the same reasons.

​

 

[Meriweather]

I would hope God would want us to relate to Him as a loving creator and not as some capricious overlord that swats as the mere flies we are for little to no reason at all.

I'm still waiting to know what evil God smotes from the Earth when he gives kids terminal diseases.

Cancer looms large in the eyes of man. I wonder how large it appears in God's eyes? Is cancer the greatest defeat a man can face?

 

[Meriweather]

Actually that is a completely wrong interpretation of Job.

I will grant you it is different, but it is one of the lessons the Book of Job teaches.

 

[RandomVariable]

So it was necessary to kill Job's whole family just to prove a point? What evil is present and needs destroying when God lets a child get terminal cancer?

The point of the Book of Job is to emphasize we cannot see life from God's perspective. Job is a prototype of good men who try to understand God and how God views life and the world we live in. How does God want us to relate to Him?

Actually that is a completely wrong interpretation of Job.

Actually...

Many passages in the Bible are meant to be interpreted in a way that is most relevant to us. That is part of what makes the Bible so powerful a Book.

My interpretation of Job, is that God was teaching Satan something profound, as a father would teach his son, and for many of the same reasons.

​

Elihu was the voice of Satan for the reason Satan and God do not get alone very well.