Hitler, Fascism and the right wing

[bripat9643]

[


It's actually a world-wide standard, only the leftwing professors in Europe do everything they can to muddy up the issue by brining in all sorts of irrelevancies like nationalism and racism. American pinko professors do the same thing, but they haven't polluted the waters as much.

And---we're back to lying.

As I have explained in considerable detail - both Nazis, Right-wing German historians and completely all confirm that Hitler was right wing - which is why the meaning of the word has never been disputed and is not disputed now.

Again - this is YOUR prejudice, not that of historians.

you seem to think that just because you and other leftists say they are right wing it makes it so....Sorry but that isn't how reality works.

No...it's not what I say - it's what dictionaries say.

fascism
/ˈfæʃɪzəm/
noun (sometimes capital)
1.
any ideology or movement inspired by Italian Fascism, such as German National Socialism; any right-wing nationalist ideology or movement with an authoritarian and hierarchical structure that is fundamentally opposed to democracy and liberalism
2.
any ideology, movement, programme, tendency, etc, that may be characterized as right-wing, chauvinist, authoritarian, etc
3.
prejudice in relation to the subject specified: body fascism

Fascism Define Fascism at Dictionary.com

THAT is the real world.

Hey dummy I already told you where and how fascism came about and what it means....You decided to ignore it like all progressives and their ideology of hate and death.

Your opinions of history don't matter, try citing some actual historians to substantiate your hair brained theories.

He cited facts rather than some humbug pinko history professor.

 

[Saigon]

Pinochet was not a fascist. Being a dictator doesn't automatically make you a fascist. If it did, then Stalin would be a fascist. Pinochet believe in capitalism and implemented free market policies.

Franco was a classic fascist. In other words, he was a socialist. I don't know enough about the other two to make a determination.

Pinochet was extremely right-wing. You know this. Franco was also extremely right wing. You know this too. I'm certainly happy to prove it if not - there is no shortage of proof there, and it's a much clearer case than with Hitler.

Franco was definitely a fascist, as you say.

Pinochet was a borderline case, but in my opinion he was two steps away from Fascism, in Conservative Militarism.

Either way you cut it - both were right-wing, and that places Fascism firmly, definitely, asolutely on the right wing, without a possible shred of doubt.

The quote IS fascist in tone, because it celebrates channeling wealth towards the aristocracy - as every Fascist leader has done.

 

[bripat9643]

Hitler was anti-capitalist and a socialist. Get over it.

Actually, he banned socialism. Get over it.

Actually not. You simply refuse to admit the facts.

Actually yes - see post #1341:

Political prisoners, such as Communists, Socialists, and trade unionists wore red triangles. Common criminals wore green. Roma (Gypsies) and others the Germans considered "asocial" or "shiftless" wore black triangles. Jehovah's Witnesses wore purple and homosexuals pink. Letters indicated nationality: for example, P stood for Polish, SU for Soviet Union, F for French.

Would you like more evidence, or do you think that's enough?

Sending poltical competitors to concentration camps doesn't prove Hitler was not a socialist. You've been told this 1000 times already.

Well, let's add this in as well...

These Einsatzgruppen were set up before the attack on the USSR to “cleanse” areas near the front of “dangerous elements,” such as communists, partisans, Jews, and Gypsies. Later, the search was extended to POW camps in the depths of the Reich. Executions would take place in the nearest concentration camp.

Auschwitz-Birkenau - Soviet POWs

Again, you've been told that eliminating threats to your rule does not may you a capitalist. Al Capone wiped out Bugs Moran and his gang. Does that make him a police officer?

 

[Saigon]

Ok, so now we can at least wind some of the topics up.

Iceweasel claimed that fascism was left wing, but when provided with the names of SIX right-wing fascist regimes, he refused to discuss the issue and conceded defeat.

So that issue is now settled beyond any reasonable doubt, I think.

You claim they were right wing. You didn't prove it.

I kind of assume this kind of thing is common knowledge really. Probably not for Weasel or Bill, but for the rest of us it should be.

Franco received military support from local fascist, monarchist and right-wing groups, and also from Hitler's Nazi Germany and Mussolini's Fascist Italy. Leaving half a million dead, the war was eventually won by Franco in 1939. He established an autocratic dictatorship, Francoist Spain, which he defined as a totalitarian state,[2] installing himself as head of state (Caudillo de España, a term seen as the equivalent of the fascist terms duce in Italy and führer in German) and government, with one legal political party: a merger of the monarchist party and the fascist party which had helped him, FET y de las JONS.

Francisco Franco - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Shall I go through the others?

So again we see Fascism IS Right Wing.

Those names again: Franco, Antonescu, Stroessner, Hitler, Horthy and Pavelic.

There are actually quite a few more....so many more I can't entirely remember which SIX I meant!!

 

[Iceweasel]

The writings and attitude of Orwell are manipulated by this author to misrepresent his position.

How so?

 

[Saigon]

Sending poltical competitors to concentration camps doesn't prove Hitler was not a socialist. You've been told this 1000 times already.

And I have laughed each time.

Name ONE regime that has ever made its own ideology illegal.

ONE will be fine.

 

[Saigon]

[

He cited facts rather than some humbug pinko history professor.

And its back to lying.

Not one of the 20 sources cited on this thread are in any way 'pinkos' - as you know.

 

[Iceweasel]

I kind of assume this kind of thing is common knowledge really. Probably not for Weasel or Bill, but for the rest of us it should be

So you started a thread on something you assumed everyone knew except two people?

Liar.

 

[Saigon]

I kind of assume this kind of thing is common knowledge really. Probably not for Weasel or Bill, but for the rest of us it should be

So you started a thread on something you assumed everyone knew except two people?

Liar.

Fairly much, yes.

But actually I think there were probably 8 - 10 people on the forum who didn't know about people like Franco and thought Hitler was left-wing, or at least pretended to believe it.

There would be plenty more who did not know about many of the others, and I wouldn't expect them too because they are not often in the news.I can totally understand that Croatia's Ante Pavelic doesn't get a lot of press in Kansas. But I spend a lot of time in Croatia, so of course I get to hear these things. Ditto the other countries.

But now even you know who people like Antonescu and Stroessner were, and that's great. You really have learned something here, though of course you'll deny it.

 

[Iceweasel]

I kind of assume this kind of thing is common knowledge really. Probably not for Weasel or Bill, but for the rest of us it should be

So you started a thread on something you assumed everyone knew except two people?

Liar.

Fairly much, yes.

But actually I think there were probably 8 - 10 people on the forum who didn't know about people like Franco and thought Hitler was left-wing, or at least pretended to believe it.

There would be plenty more who did not know about many of the others, and I wouldn't expect them too because they are not often in the news.I can totally understand that Croatia's Ante Pavelic doesn't get a lot of press in Kansas. But I spend a lot of time in Croatia, so of course I get to hear these things. Ditto the other countries.

But now even you know who people like Antonescu and Stroessner were, and that's great. You really have learned something here, though of course you'll deny it.

What I said in the beginning was left and right wing are relative terms. It would be better to define the terms instead of trying to associate the right wing of the US with socialist/fascist/communist dictators. Which was your true objective, I'm sure.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Pinochet was not a fascist. Being a dictator doesn't automatically make you a fascist. If it did, then Stalin would be a fascist. Pinochet believe in capitalism and implemented free market policies.

Franco was a classic fascist. In other words, he was a socialist. I don't know enough about the other two to make a determination.

Pinochet was extremely right-wing. You know this. Franco was also extremely right wing. You know this too. I'm certainly happy to prove it if not - there is no shortage of proof there, and it's a much clearer case than with Hitler.

Franco was definitely a fascist, as you say.

Pinochet was a borderline case, but in my opinion he was two steps away from Fascism, in Conservative Militarism.

Either way you cut it - both were right-wing, and that places Fascism firmly, definitely, asolutely on the right wing, without a possible shred of doubt.

The quote IS fascist in tone, because it celebrates channeling wealth towards the aristocracy - as every Fascist leader has done.

And by right wing you mean they advocated limited government and individual freedom, right?

 

[Saigon]

What I said in the beginning was left and right wing are relative terms. It would be better to define the terms instead of trying to associate the right wing of the US with socialist/fascist/communist dictators. Which was your true objective, I'm sure.

Absolutely not - I have very little interest in the modern US context, and actually explained this several times in the first few pages of the thread (which you may not have seen, to be fair). My only interest here is in looking at the context fascism actually occured in - which is 1930's Germany.

As a Social Democrat I don't feel embarassed about Stalin because I would never and have never support socialism or communism. It has nothing to do with me.

Conservatives need feel no embarassment with Hitler et al because they didn't and wouldn't have supported him either. Plus it occured 40 years before most were born.

 

[bripat9643]

Sending poltical competitors to concentration camps doesn't prove Hitler was not a socialist. You've been told this 1000 times already.

And I have laughed each time.

Name ONE regime that has ever made its own ideology illegal.

ONE will be fine.

According to you Stalin did. He sent millions of Communists to the Gulag. Several forum members have already used this example to prove your argument is idiotic. When are you going to stop slamming the door on your own dick?

 

[Discombobulated]

I kind of assume this kind of thing is common knowledge really. Probably not for Weasel or Bill, but for the rest of us it should be

So you started a thread on something you assumed everyone knew except two people?

Liar.

Fairly much, yes.

But actually I think there were probably 8 - 10 people on the forum who didn't know about people like Franco and thought Hitler was left-wing, or at least pretended to believe it.

There would be plenty more who did not know about many of the others, and I wouldn't expect them too because they are not often in the news.I can totally understand that Croatia's Ante Pavelic doesn't get a lot of press in Kansas. But I spend a lot of time in Croatia, so of course I get to hear these things. Ditto the other countries.

But now even you know who people like Antonescu and Stroessner were, and that's great. You really have learned something here, though of course you'll deny it.

The dummies on this thread don't know left from right because they are all so much like Nazis, Fascists, and Communists........they want to burn the books so they can rewrite history to suit themselves.

 

[bripat9643]

[

He cited facts rather than some humbug pinko history professor.

And its back to lying.

Not one of the 20 sources cited on this thread are in any way 'pinkos' - as you know.

ROFL. Unless proof to the contrary is presented, you can safely assume a history professor is a pinko. As for the so-called "right-wing" professors you cite, no quotations were presented that indicated the Nazis were right-wing.

 

[Saigon]

According to you Stalin did. He sent millions of Communists to the Gulag. Several forum members have already used this example to prove your argument is idiotic. When are you going to stop slamming the door on your own dick?

Um....no....Stalin never sent anyone to prison BECAUSE THEY WERE SOCIALISTS. Socialism was never a crime in the USSR. Socialism was never banned in the USSR.

Jesus wept, man - there are days you come across as almost a little simple, you know?

 

[bripat9643]

I kind of assume this kind of thing is common knowledge really. Probably not for Weasel or Bill, but for the rest of us it should be

So you started a thread on something you assumed everyone knew except two people?

Liar.

Fairly much, yes.

But actually I think there were probably 8 - 10 people on the forum who didn't know about people like Franco and thought Hitler was left-wing, or at least pretended to believe it.

There would be plenty more who did not know about many of the others, and I wouldn't expect them too because they are not often in the news.I can totally understand that Croatia's Ante Pavelic doesn't get a lot of press in Kansas. But I spend a lot of time in Croatia, so of course I get to hear these things. Ditto the other countries.

But now even you know who people like Antonescu and Stroessner were, and that's great. You really have learned something here, though of course you'll deny it.

The dummies on this thread don't know left from right because they are all so much like Nazis, Fascists, and Communists........they want to burn the books so they can rewrite history to suit themselves.

You don't know left from right because you're a fucking moron, and you demonstrate it with every post.

 

[Saigon]

ROFL. Unless proof to the contrary is presented, you can safely assume a history professor is a pinko. As for the so-called "right-wing" professors you cite, no quotations were presented that indicated the Nazis were right-wing.

Even if they are members of a Conservative Party? Seriously?

Again dude - this is just laugh-out-loud silly.

NOT ONE historian I have cited on this thread is left wing. ALL of them confirm that fascism is right-wing, but you'll have to read the books to understand the whole story.

I recommend Richard Overy's book on the Nazi Economy - linked earlier.

 

[bripat9643]

According to you Stalin did. He sent millions of Communists to the Gulag. Several forum members have already used this example to prove your argument is idiotic. When are you going to stop slamming the door on your own dick?

Um....no....Stalin never sent anyone to prison BECAUSE THEY WERE SOCIALISTS. Socialism was never a crime in the USSR. Socialism was never banned in the USSR.

Jesus wept, man - there are days you come across as almost a little simple, you know?

Just like Hitler, he sent them to the Gulag because they were threats to his power. He sent all the old Bolsheviks to the Gulag and he sent all the Mesheviks to the Gulag. He also sent about 90% of his loyal party members, and then he sent most of their replacements.

There isn't a shred of difference between Stalin's motives and Hitler's motives.

 

[Discombobulated]

According to you Stalin did. He sent millions of Communists to the Gulag. Several forum members have already used this example to prove your argument is idiotic. When are you going to stop slamming the door on your own dick?

Um....no....Stalin never sent anyone to prison BECAUSE THEY WERE SOCIALISTS. Socialism was never a crime in the USSR. Socialism was never banned in the USSR.

Jesus wept, man - there are days you come across as almost a little simple, you know?

The question still stands: Are these dummies ignorant on purpose or by design?