How To Negotiate With Terrorists: Figure Out Clearly What It Is They Want

[Silhouette]

According to ISIL propaganda, they want to establish a caliphate in the ME, and then convert the rest of the world to Islam.

No, I don't think that you can negotiate with terms like those.

But, why are they attracting people to fight for them that had no interest in Islam earlier?

I'll tell you exactly why. Because fear is a powerful motivator.

Yes, fear. Because any psychologist will tell you that you show them a VERY angry and disturbed young man, you are showing them a young man who is beside himself with fear. I used to watch packs of young men when I was high school. I did a lot of observing as a kid. At the time they had just started desegregating schools. There were riots all the time. Our school was neatly divided on the quad into to the blacks, the whites and the mexicans. Later came the asians, though at the time they were such a small minority that nobody was afraid of them. Anyway, as a group of young males walked about and they approached another group unknown and quite foreign to them, they became fearful. So their reaction? To become more violent and more posturing with aggression and outbursts. It's a very well known strategic defensive movement among primates. Welcome to the jungle.

What's happened is on a world scale, the big "high school quad" if you will, is that our two cultures have become so completely divergent...theirs embracing modesty to the point of extreme and ours discarding it to the point of extreme, that they have quite properly become afraid of the West. And given the outreach of our media and influence over the world...over Europe (hello) and other allies, they are quite literally and most certainly afraid at their core of annihilation of their culture. Hence the extremes...the suicide bombs. They may literally feel as if they are fighting not just for their own existence, but for the existence of their culture as a whole. So this emboldens them. And it's easier for them to get recruits worldwide because the shock at our media isn't limited just to people living in arab cultures. Even our own Christians here are in stunned shock at the advancement of the perverse and unrestrained here at home.

So, I think we can get where they're coming from, what they're fighting for in a broad and general sense, and how they get recruits. I'm thinking of coining it "The Bruce/Caitlyn Jenner syndrome". Can you for a minute put yourselves in their shoes and say, "what if we were them and we saw their influence heading our way without a single thing we could do to stop it?" Do I agree with all facets of their culture? Certainly not. But if they were left alone and didn't fear the perversions of the West intruding upon them so much, they might not be clamping down so hard even on their own people to not show a single diversion from the most radical of puritan ideas their religion espouses.

I know I'm going to get all sorts of flack for saying these things "American Freedoms!" "Liberty!!"...blah blah blah. But what's important to take away here is first you must understand your enemies before you sit down at a table with them and talk about things. What was the old saying anyway? Before you condemn your enemy for the splinter in his eye, be sure to remove the log from your own first..?

 

[Tom Horn]

No no no...not beat the crap out of them some more. Annihilate them as in decimate them as in totally destroy thousands upon thousands of them in a short period of time. Annihilate them so badly that their will to fight will be gone and the 'few' who remain will be terrified to even join the cause.

And fight in a way that brings THEM terror....start by finding Baghdadi and hang him on a cross with pig guts around his neck and shoulders.....that'd get some attention alright.

 

[Contumacious]

According to ISIL propaganda, they want to establish a caliphate in the ME, and then convert the rest of the world to Islam.

No, I don't think that you can negotiate with terms like those.

The only negotiation should be how quickly the world powers want to destroy these fuckers.
Do they want to drag it out and give a half assed effort like we are doing now
or do they really want to end this....

There is no negotiation...Kill them before they kill us.
Anyone who loads up bombs with nails to improve the kill ratio needs to be ended.
All this because their little Muslim feelings were hurt?....

Enough...
How many more of these should the world put up with.
Enough with our politicians giving these speeches over and over again....
"Our support and prayers go to the families of those killed today"....

How about doing something more then what's being done?

Yo fucktard


How many Muslims can the Judeo-American Axis of evil kill before the Muslims can consider their "Muslim feelings hurt?


.

 

[westwall]

That's a pessimistic outlook. We haven't begun talking to them yet..

It's a realistic view. They simply don't care what you have to say other than "I submit to your will".

 

[eagle1462010]

History repeats itself. Google the history of the Caliphates and you will see since the time of Mohamed there has been Caliphate after Caliphate after Caliphate.

Learn from History. The only way throughout history to end these Caliphates is via War.......Fought like a War..........and it isn't pretty. History will repeat again...........It only the number that must die before the world sees no other choice but to kick their asses..............It would be better to do so before it gets to that point and before they have the Nukes.............as they don't care if they die for Allah.............The MAD principle of Nuclear Weapons doesn't apply if these terror groups get the bomb.

 

[RandallFlagg]

Indeed. I don't give a shit "what they want". Unlike liberals - I couldn't care less. Root them out and kill them all. if it takes a generation, I don't care. Where the hell is Georgie Patton when we need him?

Well you'd care if they blew up a terminal you were waiting in line at...randomly...with there being no way of you predicting what, where or when they'd strike next as they ESCALATE their appeal to each new successive generation of widely-distributed, testosterone infused aimless recruits.

So, again, ask them what they want. Get them to enunciate it. Directly and comprehensively from the Koran. I mean, do I have to spell this out?

Ask them what they want!?!? Dumbass - they want us dead! They tell us that daily - or do you not listen? We either kill them or they kill us.

So - what's it gonna be Sonny? I've already served this country in war. Are you ready? Are you willing to do what must be done - or are you going to "puss out"? And stand by and let someone else do the dirty work?

 

[cereal_killer]

It's clear what they want. They've been saying it for years: stay out of their country and quit bombing them. Now its too late, our shitty foreign policy created this whole mess.

It's now a conundrum. The more we bomb and attack them, the more it only serves as a recruitment tool. It reflects exactly what they are being told. There's a war against Islam. Every time a bomb drops they need only to say "See?" Doing nothing at this point won't solve it either. They are hell bent on taking over the world.

It's a giant mess and the US doesn't have the stomach to do what needs to be done to beat them into submission. We cannot win this war by waging war the way we do. This is a fact.

You're funny. On the one hand you accurately identify the root of the problem: That the US's foreign blood-for-oil Cheney bullshit is what got us to where we are today. So in saying that, you are identifying the angry arabs as the victims of US bullshit.

Then, in the very next breath you say "what needs to be done is beat them into submission!". That's like saying "yeah, we gave the Sioux smallpox infected blankets and now they're lashing back and scalping the pioneers trying to make it out to Oregon...sneaking in the night with the advantage of invisibility and surprise...then your "solution" for that would be "to beat the crap out of the Sioux some more".

People just need to realize what logic is. People need to pay attention to what logic is.

No no no...not beat the crap out of them some more. Annihilate them as in decimate them as in totally destroy thousands upon thousands of them in a short period of time. Annihilate them so badly that their will to fight will be gone and the 'few' who remain will be terrified to even join the cause.

How?

Do you think we should do as someone else suggested- just nuke the entire Middle East?

Carpet bomb all of Syria and Iraq?

Carpet bomb anywhere an ISIS member has been sighted- from Somalia to Afghanistan?

Carpet bomb Brussels?

Here's how.
1. Fire the current Admirals/Generals
2. Replace them with actual war fighters
3. Get the bureaucrats completely out of the way
4. Remove all ROE and let Military decide if there will be ROE
5. Give Military any and all requested equipment (including troops)
6. Let the military wage war on THEIR OWN terms.

To sum it all up, unleash the dogs of war and let the war fighters do their job however they see fit. No more bureaucrats getting in the way of how the military wages war. It will be ugly, it will be barbaric and the atrocities will be horrific, but that's war. Time to instill fear in the enemy. So much fear that they lose their will to fight completely. Massive loss of life in a short period of time tends to do that to troops. That's how you win. They take one, we take 1,500

 

[Silhouette]

That's a pessimistic outlook. We haven't begun talking to them yet..

It's a realistic view. They simply don't care what you have to say other than "I submit to your will".

You don't get the point of the exercise. The conversation would be a vehicle to a solution. But not by the usual means of regarding the superficial nature of conversations..

Look, it's clear there are going to be two types of posters, maybe three, who respond to this thread:

1. The KILL "EM ALL! types.

2. The more forgiving types and..

3. The posters who say "....ahh....OK...I get it..."

 

[RandallFlagg]

It's clear what they want. They've been saying it for years: stay out of their country and quit bombing them. Now its too late, our shitty foreign policy created this whole mess.

It's now a conundrum. The more we bomb and attack them, the more it only serves as a recruitment tool. It reflects exactly what they are being told. There's a war against Islam. Every time a bomb drops they need only to say "See?" Doing nothing at this point won't solve it either. They are hell bent on taking over the world.

It's a giant mess and the US doesn't have the stomach to do what needs to be done to beat them into submission. We cannot win this war by waging war the way we do. This is a fact.

You're funny. On the one hand you accurately identify the root of the problem: That the US's foreign blood-for-oil Cheney bullshit is what got us to where we are today. So in saying that, you are identifying the angry arabs as the victims of US bullshit.

Then, in the very next breath you say "what needs to be done is beat them into submission!". That's like saying "yeah, we gave the Sioux smallpox infected blankets and now they're lashing back and scalping the pioneers trying to make it out to Oregon...sneaking in the night with the advantage of invisibility and surprise...then your "solution" for that would be "to beat the crap out of the Sioux some more".

People just need to realize what logic is. People need to pay attention to what logic is.

No no no...not beat the crap out of them some more. Annihilate them as in decimate them as in totally destroy thousands upon thousands of them in a short period of time. Annihilate them so badly that their will to fight will be gone and the 'few' who remain will be terrified to even join the cause.

How?

Do you think we should do as someone else suggested- just nuke the entire Middle East?

Carpet bomb all of Syria and Iraq?

Carpet bomb anywhere an ISIS member has been sighted- from Somalia to Afghanistan?

Carpet bomb Brussels?

Here's how.
1. Fire the current Admirals/Generals
2. Replace them with actual war fighters
3. Get the bureaucrats completely out of the way
4. Remove all ROE and let Military decide if there will be ROE
5. Give Military any and all requested equipment (including troops)
6. Let the military wage war on THEIR OWN terms.

To sum it all up, unleash the dogs of war and let the war fighters do their job however they see fit. No more bureaucrats getting in the way of how the military wages war. It will be ugly, it will be barbaric and the atrocities will be horrific, but that's war. Time to instill fear in the enemy. So much fear that they lose their will to fight completely. Massive loss of life in a short period of time tends to do that to troops. That's how you win. They take one, we take 1,500

Sounds good - and I agree COMPLETELY with your assessment. One problem - Politicians have been running wars since Korea. I fought in a war that was controlled by politicians - we lost ( we did NOT lose - but we lost). Politicians will NEVER allow us to "cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war". It isn't "politically correct".

The left would never stand for it.

Were it up to me - I would send a flight of 15 B-52s (or B2s) to Racca, Syria. When they were finished, there would not be one living soul left alive. Let's get one thing straight. There are NO civilians in Racca. Any human being alive there is in full support of ISIS.

Whatever was left of CAC for ISIS would understand the implications of continuing. Then, I would insert the 82nd Airborne in the area with a clear understanding that ANYONE with a rifle, RPG, RPK, or a pistol dies on sight - be they man, woman or child.

Next, I would pick a 30-40 man team to hunt terrorists down around the world. (Something like SF or perhaps DIA second special operations) and conduct raids on terrorists wherever they be in the world, cross borders and kill them with impunity. Israel does this - and the world never hears about it.

Until we begin to become as ruthless as our enemy - and show them the same "respect" they show us - this will only fester and get worse. We MUST tell liberals to sit the hell down, shut the fuck up and let MEN handle the situation.

 

[Oldstyle]

It's clear what they want. They've been saying it for years: stay out of their country and quit bombing them. Now its too late, our shitty foreign policy created this whole mess.

It's now a conundrum. The more we bomb and attack them, the more it only serves as a recruitment tool. It reflects exactly what they are being told. There's a war against Islam. Every time a bomb drops they need only to say "See?" Doing nothing at this point won't solve it either. They are hell bent on taking over the world.

It's a giant mess and the US doesn't have the stomach to do what needs to be done to beat them into submission. We cannot win this war by waging war the way we do. This is a fact.

Dude, ISIS has killed other Muslims as well as Christians...did those Muslims bomb them? ISIS grew to power BECAUSE we allowed them to be seen as "winning" a war against the West...THAT is what they used a recruiting tool not that we bombed them!

 

[Silhouette]

Were it up to me - I would send a flight of 15 B-52s (or B2s) to Racca, Syria. When they were finished, there would not be one living soul left alive. Let's get one thing straight. There are NO civilians in Racca. Any human being alive there is in full support of ISIS....Whatever was left of CAC for ISIS would understand the implications of continuing. Then, I would insert the 82nd Airborne in the area with a clear understanding that ANYONE with a rifle, RPG, RPK, or a pistol dies on sight - be they man, woman or child....Next, I would pick a 30-40 man team to hunt terrorists down around the world. (Something like SF or perhaps DIA second special operations) and conduct raids on terrorists wherever they be in the world, cross borders and kill them with impunity. Israel does this - and the world never hears about it....Until we begin to become as ruthless as our enemy - and show them the same "respect" they show us - this will only fester and get worse. We MUST tell liberals to sit the hell down, shut the fuck up and let MEN handle the situation.

Yes, because "letting the MEN handle the situation" has always worked out well, especially in nuanced troubles where flexibility, restraint and well timed action (or inaction), vacillating between the two as called for is concerned..

Your solution on its face is utterly logical otherwise. Except you forgot one thing: you're not fighting men per se, you are fighting an entity that is larger than its components. That entity is FEAR expressed as PROTECTIVE EXTREME ANGER in primate young males. And the fear I see coming from them that is larger and more amorphous than any clean target you could send your special forces after, comes from their collective and growing fear that the West's depravity is like a disease spreading even within the ranks of their own culture.

Plug it in. It fits. That's why they're clamping down on their own so hard too. What seems like random senseless violence outward and inward from these radicals is actually an expression of fear of preservation of a larger ideal: their culture they see as being annihilated by the West. And, to make matters worse, they are correct, because that's exactly what's happening.

What also fits like a glove is that they are promising to infiltrate and overturn our Western perversions with their own extreme form of being prude. Yes they're hypocrites too...but men caught up in the fury of their righteous indignation and fear/anger response seldom pause to examine their own hypocrisy or skewed rationalizations. And hence the reason why I offered the solutions I have. I think the West should rein itself in as a capitulation to the extreme fear it has been causing in the Islamic ranks. Perhaps the West should offer up some real tangible sacrifice of its depravity in exchange for a "chill period" where everyone takes stock of what happened and reflects on themselves.

They are killing Christians because to them, "Christians" = American Christians who are all sitting on ass while the culture they live in and are losing (or willingly forfeiting) their grasp over spirals into the spiritual septic tank, overflowing everywhere in the world through social and regular media.

The one thing escalation hates the most is a moment of quiet repose and self-reflection. Think about it. Oh, wait, that's one thing MEN never do is stop themselves when engaged in raw fury and rational objectives and THINK ABOUT IT first...

We should at rock bottom minimum ask them what their angst is. We should ask them to present a list of grievances and we should listen to them. Every single wise leader throughout ancient history to present time, when confronted with an escalating problems from the populace, has done exactly this: made capitulations to the grievances (yes, actually and humbly made personal sacrifices to those he ordinarily wouldn't from his usual habit and privilege of unchecked power) in exchange for peace in the land.

 

[amrchaos]

However, we know what ISIS wants

1.An Islamic state that enshrines their version of Islam

2. The conversion, suppression, enslavement or death of those that disagree with their version of Islam

3 Converts that are willing to die for ISIS

So, that leaves the wack a mole game to play with ISIS

 

[Silhouette]

However, we know what ISIS wants

1.An Islamic state that enshrines their version of Islam

2. The conversion, suppression, enslavement or death of those that disagree with their version of Islam

3 Converts that are willing to die for ISIS

So, that leaves the wack a mole game to play with ISIS

Look at the post just above yours for exactly why they have become extremists. IT IS BECAUSE WE BECAME EXTREMISTS FIRST and they fear cultural annihilation. Do you know how I know that? It's because I stopped myself and thought about it from their perspective; and I know a little bit about primate behaviors. That's why they're reacting in such extreme behaviors you just listed. It's a deep, primal force in young male primates when they feel threatened down to their very core of existence, they lash out in extreme anger as a mask for their extreme fear of annihilation..

Just go to a monkey cage at a zoo and watch the dynamics between the adolescent and young adult males. We may have opposable thumbs but we're still in the jungle when it comes to fights.. Some young less dominant males will even fight for their silverbacks knowing they'll likely die in order to preserve the troop's continuity as a whole..

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The terrorists demands are simple and straightforward, even a Liberal can recognize, but not fully understand them. It's: worship Islam or die

 

[Silhouette]

The terrorists demands are simple and straightforward, even a Liberal can recognize, but not fully understand them. It's: worship Islam or die

But it wasn't always this way in modern times. So the question begs: Why now? (refer to post #91 for details). Could it be...just maybe...just an outside chance perhaps that in recent years coinciding exactly with the rise in radical Islam is our own version of cultural radicalism?... Perchance? Possibly?

For instance, you realize that normal, non-radical Islam cannot even exist in the same universe as Caitlyn Jenner and gay marriage, right? So what came first, the chicken or the egg?..

 

[amrchaos]

However, we know what ISIS wants

1.An Islamic state that enshrines their version of Islam

2. The conversion, suppression, enslavement or death of those that disagree with their version of Islam

3 Converts that are willing to die for ISIS

So, that leaves the wack a mole game to play with ISIS

Look at the post just above yours for exactly why they have become extremists. IT IS BECAUSE WE BECAME EXTREMISTS FIRST and they fear cultural annihilation. Do you know how I know that? It's because I stopped myself and thought about it from their perspective; and I know a little bit about primate behaviors. That's why they're reacting in such extreme behaviors you just listed. It's a deep, primal force in young male primates when they feel threatened down to their very core of existence, they lash out in extreme anger as a mask for their extreme fear of annihilation..

Just go to a monkey cage at a zoo and watch the dynamics between the adolescent and young adult males. We may have opposable thumbs but we're still in the jungle when it comes to fights.. Some young less dominant males will even fight for their silverbacks knowing they'll likely die in order to preserve the troop's continuity as a whole..

Even if we stop our actions, there is no guarantee that the number of terrorists will stop growing.

 

[Silhouette]

Even if we stop our actions, there is no guarantee that the number of terrorists will stop growing.

Of course there's no guarantee. When has that ever stopped good ambitious men from trying? We are Americans! We roll up our sleeves. When did "being American" become synonymous with "never being wrong" or "refusing to work hard to set things right" for fear of uncertain assurances?

 

[paulitician]

One man's 'Terrorist' is another man's 'Freedom Fighter.' We need to stop meddling in so many nations around the world. We need to especially disengage from the Middle East. We just don't belong in their lands.

If Muslims choose to kill Muslims, than so be it. But we shouldn't be involved. We gotta let go of the 'Regime Change' stuff, and all the meddling. Time to come home.

 

[Wildman]

I know I'm going to get tons and tons of criticism for this idea but frankly I don't give a crap.

can not vote, not enough choices, mine would be, "KILL'EM ALL"!!

 

[Silhouette]

"KILL'EM ALL"!!

How, exactly? When new ones are recruited every day all over the world, how would you "kill 'em all"?