McDonald's may be liable for worker lawsuits

[Skull Pilot]

No, what I learned is that no matter how hard you work, no matter what you accomplish, that if you don't have a union and a government watching your back, you can get stabbed in it at any time.

The real problem is, asking the greediest of us to do what is fair is kind of silly.

I agree with that last statement. Which is why I believe it is silly to expect a union to do what is fair.

And yes, you can get stabbed in the back. But then, you can get stabbed in the back on a nion job as well. The question is how you recover and move forward.

You have obviously done well enough. After all, the power emanating from your cubicle cause everyone around you to tremble in fear.

Must be, I'm the one the rest of them come to to solve problems.

Sorry, guy, I grew up in a union household. What I remember was that when my dad got cancer, the union took care of my mom and the family.

As opposed to when I slipped on the ice, and the rest is history.

So why aren't you working in a union shop?

 

[Skull Pilot]

You mean the fact that the government has made it easier and easier to suck on the public tit?

That loophole is being exploited by those who refuse to better themselves and get better paying jobs.

Sorry but there is no guarantee that one job will be enough to pay your living expenses and there never was.

But it should be, and that's actually the way the rest of the industrialized world does it.

Come on, guy, I know you are horrified at the notion of not being able to cheat and exploit people at every turn, but you really think this is a good system?

Oh, wait, you probably do.

"But it should be"
Oh? Says who?
You lefties believe a lifestyle is an entitlement. That everyone has a right to cell phones high speed internet, vacations to expensive destinations, a home in the burbs, two cars, etc...Then you look to businesses that have a wage scale that does not meet your sense of entitlement and deem them evil.

People like Joe think a guy who pushes a broom for aliving should make enough to buy a house have 2 cars take expensive vacations every year and put 4 kids through college.

 

[JoeB131]

[

No, I mean the union that refused to negotiate.

When the union pressed for raises, jack Warner told them that the plant was not making enough money and that it needed to be refurbished and that he would give the raises as soon as he finished redoing the plant. But he warned them that if they went on strike he would close the plant.

The union called the members in and wanted them to vote to strike. The membership voted NOT to strike. So the union called for another vote. And another. And another. Finally, on the 5th vote a strike was called for. They went on strike. The plant closed.

The union officials went elsewhere. The workers struggled to make ends meet. many of them never recovered. 2 of my neighbors were in that boat.

Oh, and your claims that they would have shut it down anyway is bullshit. Many of the major pieces of the overhaul of the plant had already been delivered to the plant. You don't order new machines for a plant you plan to close.

So your claims that the union cares about the workers falls on deaf ears here. I have seen different. I have seen the families struggle when the union screwed them by trying to increase their power or flex their muscles.

Link?

This would be the same Jack Warner who owned an art collection worth millions that he used corporate funds to buy?

Warner Foundation seeks judgment against Westervelt Company | TuscaloosaNews.com

That Jack Warner...

EDITORIAL: Give sympathy to Jack Warner for his loss, too | TuscaloosaNews.com

Yup, he was just the salt of the earth, wanting to make his plant more profitable so he could use funds to buy art.

FUck them working people asking for a raise.

 

[JoeB131]

[

People like Joe think a guy who pushes a broom for aliving should make enough to buy a house have 2 cars take expensive vacations every year and put 4 kids through college.

Why not?

Frankly, someone needs to push a broom. I don't particularly want to do it, but i think the person who does should be able to feed his family.

 

[WinterBorn]

[

No, I mean the union that refused to negotiate.

When the union pressed for raises, jack Warner told them that the plant was not making enough money and that it needed to be refurbished and that he would give the raises as soon as he finished redoing the plant. But he warned them that if they went on strike he would close the plant.

The union called the members in and wanted them to vote to strike. The membership voted NOT to strike. So the union called for another vote. And another. And another. Finally, on the 5th vote a strike was called for. They went on strike. The plant closed.

The union officials went elsewhere. The workers struggled to make ends meet. many of them never recovered. 2 of my neighbors were in that boat.

Oh, and your claims that they would have shut it down anyway is bullshit. Many of the major pieces of the overhaul of the plant had already been delivered to the plant. You don't order new machines for a plant you plan to close.

So your claims that the union cares about the workers falls on deaf ears here. I have seen different. I have seen the families struggle when the union screwed them by trying to increase their power or flex their muscles.

Link?

This would be the same Jack Warner who owned an art collection worth millions that he used corporate funds to buy?

Warner Foundation seeks judgment against Westervelt Company | TuscaloosaNews.com

That Jack Warner...

EDITORIAL: Give sympathy to Jack Warner for his loss, too | TuscaloosaNews.com

Yup, he was just the salt of the earth, wanting to make his plant more profitable so he could use funds to buy art.

FUck them working people asking for a raise.

Did he say fuck the people asking for a raise? Or did he say wait until we refurbish the plant?

And why did the union keep pressing for votes until they got their way? Obviously the workers understood. That is why they voted not to strike 4 times.

 

[WinterBorn]

[

People like Joe think a guy who pushes a broom for aliving should make enough to buy a house have 2 cars take expensive vacations every year and put 4 kids through college.

Why not?

Frankly, someone needs to push a broom. I don't particularly want to do it, but i think the person who does should be able to feed his family.

Why not? What was described by Skull Pilot was considerably more than feeding his family. And if you have no skills, perhaps your spouse should be working as well?

 

[Skull Pilot]

[

People like Joe think a guy who pushes a broom for aliving should make enough to buy a house have 2 cars take expensive vacations every year and put 4 kids through college.

Why not?

Frankly, someone needs to push a broom. I don't particularly want to do it, but i think the person who does should be able to feed his family.

The slug who aspires to do nothing but push a broom isn't worth anything to an employer.

 

[thereisnospoon]

[

People like Joe think a guy who pushes a broom for aliving should make enough to buy a house have 2 cars take expensive vacations every year and put 4 kids through college.

Why not?

Frankly, someone needs to push a broom. I don't particularly want to do it, but i think the person who does should be able to feed his family.

See now here's an example of the entitlement mentality of the typical American liberal.
You say that a person who does a menial low or no skill job should be compensated not based on his skill or production, but based on his marital status and the number of kids her decided to produce.
In fact, the system is and as it should be, it opposite.
One adjusts their lifestyle according to their means.
The employer is NOT responsible for the choices made by his employees.

 

[thereisnospoon]

I fully take responsibility for the mistakes i've made. I've willingly made tradeoffs. For instance, I chose to work a second job instead of quitting my current one for more money. But that's the thing. It was my choice.

Letting me go for running up too many medical bills was not my choice. It was theirs.





Unions have declined, and so has America and her middle class. Sorry you are too stupid to see that.

You are too stupid to realize two things. One the "union" did not take care of you and your mother. The company did that because the union was able to coerce the benefits under threat of the company being shut down. A labor collective should never have that kind of an advantage.
Second, because of examples such as yours, unions fucked themselves and put themselves out of business.

Big business fucked their employees for greater profit. No business closed because of Unions. Businesses closed because they failed to compete.

Yeah right. Businesses closed because unions made them non competitive.
There are so many examples of this. How anyone can turn a blind eye to these facts is a mystery that can only be solved by realizing the denier's blind loyalty to the labor collectives.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Yes. If you don't do your due diligence you could be on the hook financially.

Lol. So, its your job to follow the businessman around to make sure he is in compliance?

If the janitor at McDonalds corporate murders someone on the premises, should the CEO be held responsible.

Mark

If I hire a contractor, I'm going to take the necessary steps to limit my liability.

Thanks. In effect, franchisees are contractors. Of course the parent company is going to limit their exposure to liability. They will build a wall of separation between the parent company and the franchisee.
It's standard business practice. So what?
Now you people want to scream "wait a minute. No fair. Do over"?

 

[JoeB131]

[

Did he say fuck the people asking for a raise? Or did he say wait until we refurbish the plant?

And why did the union keep pressing for votes until they got their way? Obviously the workers understood. That is why they voted not to strike 4 times.

Here's the better question. Why did the fourth vote succeed when the first four failed?

Maybe because they were watching this guy buy rich man's toys for himself with company funds.

 

[JoeB131]

[

People like Joe think a guy who pushes a broom for aliving should make enough to buy a house have 2 cars take expensive vacations every year and put 4 kids through college.

Why not?

Frankly, someone needs to push a broom. I don't particularly want to do it, but i think the person who does should be able to feed his family.

See now here's an example of the entitlement mentality of the typical American liberal.
You say that a person who does a menial low or no skill job should be compensated not based on his skill or production, but based on his marital status and the number of kids her decided to produce.
In fact, the system is and as it should be, it opposite.
One adjusts their lifestyle according to their means.
The employer is NOT responsible for the choices made by his employees.

I think if a person does a job, he should be compensated in such a way that he can support his family. Period.

And frankly, guy, here's what you fuckwads don't get. THose fucking poor people, they refuse to fucking starve to death to make you happy.

Nope. They get food stamps, Section 8 housing, Medicaid and a bunch of other benefits that the rest of us end up paying for. And our floors didn't even get swept.

 

[JoeB131]

[

People like Joe think a guy who pushes a broom for aliving should make enough to buy a house have 2 cars take expensive vacations every year and put 4 kids through college.

Why not?

Frankly, someone needs to push a broom. I don't particularly want to do it, but i think the person who does should be able to feed his family.

The slug who aspires to do nothing but push a broom isn't worth anything to an employer.

Well, obviously, he is.

If the alternative is that someone slips on something on that floor and breaks his back and sues the company for a lot more than that broom pusher was making, then it kind of makes sense to pay the guy to sweep the floor, doesn't it?

 

[JoeB131]

[

People like Joe think a guy who pushes a broom for aliving should make enough to buy a house have 2 cars take expensive vacations every year and put 4 kids through college.

Why not?

Frankly, someone needs to push a broom. I don't particularly want to do it, but i think the person who does should be able to feed his family.

Why not? What was described by Skull Pilot was considerably more than feeding his family. And if you have no skills, perhaps your spouse should be working as well?

Or maybe we can fairly compensate him.

Me, I don't see a good reason why CEO's deserve 8 or 9 figure salaries. Especially when they get those benefit packages when their companies fail.

"but..but..but... that's what he negotiated with the board..." whine the Plutocrat Apologist.

Guess what, the government and a union tell the board you have to pay a fair wage, that's that, then.

 

[OnePercenter]

But it should be, and that's actually the way the rest of the industrialized world does it.

Come on, guy, I know you are horrified at the notion of not being able to cheat and exploit people at every turn, but you really think this is a good system?

Oh, wait, you probably do.

"But it should be"
Oh? Says who?
You lefties believe a lifestyle is an entitlement. That everyone has a right to cell phones high speed internet, vacations to expensive destinations, a home in the burbs, two cars, etc...Then you look to businesses that have a wage scale that does not meet your sense of entitlement and deem them evil.

People like Joe think a guy who pushes a broom for aliving should make enough to buy a house have 2 cars take expensive vacations every year and put 4 kids through college.

You did, why shouldn't others....

 

[OnePercenter]

You are too stupid to realize two things. One the "union" did not take care of you and your mother. The company did that because the union was able to coerce the benefits under threat of the company being shut down. A labor collective should never have that kind of an advantage.
Second, because of examples such as yours, unions fucked themselves and put themselves out of business.

Big business fucked their employees for greater profit. No business closed because of Unions. Businesses closed because they failed to compete.

Yeah right. Businesses closed because unions made them non competitive.
There are so many examples of this. How anyone can turn a blind eye to these facts is a mystery that can only be solved by realizing the denier's blind loyalty to the labor collectives.

US auto makers designing and engineering CRAP. Hostess not hitting the 'US health kick' market. Big bad Unions, sure it is.

 

[WinterBorn]

[

Did he say fuck the people asking for a raise? Or did he say wait until we refurbish the plant?

And why did the union keep pressing for votes until they got their way? Obviously the workers understood. That is why they voted not to strike 4 times.

Here's the better question. Why did the fourth vote succeed when the first four failed?

Maybe because they were watching this guy buy rich man's toys for himself with company funds.

Did you read the article? He bought some with company funds, some with his own and some were gifts. The corporate office was known for it's art too.

The 4th vote didn't succeed. It was the 5th vote.

 

[JoeB131]

[
"Real world, they aren't going to give you the 5K they are probably spending on you in a group plan."
That is a defeatist attitude. I detest the "I give up/in" mantra.
And if one has health issues, they are a higher risk to the insurer. Insurance is in it's most basic of concepts about assigning risk.
If you own a home or have ever owned a home, the term "risk" is ion the language of the policy.
Quite frankly, it is those who have the poorest health and the worst lifestyle habits who demand cheaper more comprehensive coverage.
It's symptom of the entitlement mentality of many Americans.

Oh, look, we have another "Medical Calvinist". Your health issues are your own fault, you sinner.

The reality is, if we got the employers out of it, and everyone had to negotiate their own health care coverage like they have to negotiate their own car insurance, or home owners insurance, the system will collapse on its own weight.

As it stands now, the only reason the system works is because the government takes responsibility for those too poor or too old to get private insurance. The rest of the risk pool is collectivized in those who are healthy enough to work, but if you told those people, "Here's $5000 we would have spent on you", the young wouldn't buy insurance and the old couldn't get much coverage.

Or we could just do what the Europeans, Canadians and Japanese have already done, and have single payer that collectivizes risks and controls costs with minimal overhead.

 

[JoeB131]

You are too stupid to realize two things. One the "union" did not take care of you and your mother. The company did that because the union was able to coerce the benefits under threat of the company being shut down.

If the company had its druthers, it probably would have fired my dad the moment he got sick and was spending more time at the hospital than at work.

Even though his illness was probably work related. (He was a sheet metal worker, and had lung cancer due to asbestos exposure. although the two packs of cigarettes he smoked every day probably didn't help.)

A labor collective should never have that kind of an advantage.
Second, because of examples such as yours, unions fucked themselves and put themselves out of business.

right. It was because of those unions!

Um, no, not really.

The American business lost out to the Japanese and Germans. They have unions that actually have a say in every business decision AND even get to choose the CEO's of their companies.

Nope, what happened was we had CEO's at GM who insisted on making big gas guzzling SUV's when the market was insisting on fuel efficient cars.

We had the folks at Hostess who kept insisting on concessions from the Unions while looting the assets of the company.

So maybe it's time to stop waiting for the rich douchebags to start "Trickling Down" on the rest of us.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Why not?

Frankly, someone needs to push a broom. I don't particularly want to do it, but i think the person who does should be able to feed his family.

See now here's an example of the entitlement mentality of the typical American liberal.
You say that a person who does a menial low or no skill job should be compensated not based on his skill or production, but based on his marital status and the number of kids her decided to produce.
In fact, the system is and as it should be, it opposite.
One adjusts their lifestyle according to their means.
The employer is NOT responsible for the choices made by his employees.

I think if a person does a job, he should be compensated in such a way that he can support his family. Period.

And frankly, guy, here's what you fuckwads don't get. THose fucking poor people, they refuse to fucking starve to death to make you happy.

Nope. They get food stamps, Section 8 housing, Medicaid and a bunch of other benefits that the rest of us end up paying for. And our floors didn't even get swept.

So every time someone decides to have a kid he or she should get a raise?

Sorry but it's up to you to earn enough to support yourself and your lifestyle not up to someone else to fund your decisions.