New poll on does Obama love America

[Pogo]

I wouldn't expect any less from the ODS stricken rightwingers of this country. The shocking thing is that, in a Rasmussen poll, only 35% said he doesn't love his country.

Half of America isn't convinced their President loves his country and you consider that a victory? Seriously?

I don't understand why you people don't understand how stupid this poll really is. It is a testament to how stupid Americans are. It's such typical overly-emotional garbage from the RW that is ultimately pointless.

Zackly. What Guiliani was doing is the same tired old fallacy he was running with the "a noun a verb and '911'" campaign....

Appeals to emotion include appeals to fear, envy, hatred, pity, pride, and more. It's important to note that sometimes a logically coherent argument may inspire emotion or have an emotional aspect, but the problem and fallacy occurs when emotion is used instead of a logical argument, or to obscure the fact that no compelling rational reason exists for one's position. Everyone, bar sociopaths, is affected by emotion, and so appeals to emotion are a very common and effective argument tactic, but they're ultimately flawed, dishonest, and tend to make one's opponents justifiably emotional.
​

Apparently it's all Giuliani has in his tank. And the poll fuels on the same fallacy. That's why it's worthless.

 

[Billy000]

I wouldn't expect any less from the ODS stricken rightwingers of this country. The shocking thing is that, in a Rasmussen poll, only 35% said he doesn't love his country.

Half of America isn't convinced their President loves his country and you consider that a victory? Seriously?

I don't understand why you people don't understand how stupid this poll really is. It is a testament to how stupid Americans are. It's such typical overly-emotional garbage from the RW that is ultimately pointless.

Zackly. What Guiliani was doing is the same tired old fallacy he was running with the "a noun a verb and '911'" campaign....

Appeals to emotion include appeals to fear, envy, hatred, pity, pride, and more. It's important to note that sometimes a logically coherent argument may inspire emotion or have an emotional aspect, but the problem and fallacy occurs when emotion is used instead of a logical argument, or to obscure the fact that no compelling rational reason exists for one's position. Everyone, bar sociopaths, is affected by emotion, and so appeals to emotion are a very common and effective argument tactic, but they're ultimately flawed, dishonest, and tend to make one's opponents justifiably emotional.
​

Apparently it's all Giuliani has in his tank. And the poll fuels on the same fallacy. That's why it's worthless.

That quote is spot on. Thanks.

 

[Billy000]

I wouldn't expect any less from the ODS stricken rightwingers of this country. The shocking thing is that, in a Rasmussen poll, only 35% said he doesn't love his country.

Half of America isn't convinced their President loves his country and you consider that a victory? Seriously?

I don't understand why you people don't understand how stupid this poll really is. It is a testament to how stupid Americans are. It's such typical overly-emotional garbage from the RW that is ultimately pointless.

The whole leftists agenda is based on how stupid Americans are, your success shows that a lot better than this poll does. Actually this poll shows that maybe everyone isn't as stupid as you think they are. Half the country sees through the liar in chief and recognizes him for what he is

The results of the poll really isnt my point. I wouldn't care if 80% said Obama loved this country. The poll itself is completely dumb. It's a play on emotion which makes it pointless as far as politics should go. RWs insist on emotion over logic and substance.

 

[kaz]

Appeals to emotion include appeals to fear, envy, hatred, pity, pride, and more

You mean like calling your opponents racists, sexists, homophobes, xenophobes haters of the elderly and the poor, Christian bigots and lovers of oil companies, the rich and corporations? Appeals to emotion like that?

 

[kaz]

I wouldn't expect any less from the ODS stricken rightwingers of this country. The shocking thing is that, in a Rasmussen poll, only 35% said he doesn't love his country.

Half of America isn't convinced their President loves his country and you consider that a victory? Seriously?

I don't understand why you people don't understand how stupid this poll really is. It is a testament to how stupid Americans are. It's such typical overly-emotional garbage from the RW that is ultimately pointless.

Zackly. What Guiliani was doing is the same tired old fallacy he was running with the "a noun a verb and '911'" campaign....

Appeals to emotion include appeals to fear, envy, hatred, pity, pride, and more. It's important to note that sometimes a logically coherent argument may inspire emotion or have an emotional aspect, but the problem and fallacy occurs when emotion is used instead of a logical argument, or to obscure the fact that no compelling rational reason exists for one's position. Everyone, bar sociopaths, is affected by emotion, and so appeals to emotion are a very common and effective argument tactic, but they're ultimately flawed, dishonest, and tend to make one's opponents justifiably emotional.
​

Apparently it's all Giuliani has in his tank. And the poll fuels on the same fallacy. That's why it's worthless.

That quote is spot on. Thanks.

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

 

[Pogo]

I wouldn't expect any less from the ODS stricken rightwingers of this country. The shocking thing is that, in a Rasmussen poll, only 35% said he doesn't love his country.

Half of America isn't convinced their President loves his country and you consider that a victory? Seriously?

I don't understand why you people don't understand how stupid this poll really is. It is a testament to how stupid Americans are. It's such typical overly-emotional garbage from the RW that is ultimately pointless.

Zackly. What Guiliani was doing is the same tired old fallacy he was running with the "a noun a verb and '911'" campaign....

Appeals to emotion include appeals to fear, envy, hatred, pity, pride, and more. It's important to note that sometimes a logically coherent argument may inspire emotion or have an emotional aspect, but the problem and fallacy occurs when emotion is used instead of a logical argument, or to obscure the fact that no compelling rational reason exists for one's position. Everyone, bar sociopaths, is affected by emotion, and so appeals to emotion are a very common and effective argument tactic, but they're ultimately flawed, dishonest, and tend to make one's opponents justifiably emotional.
​

Apparently it's all Giuliani has in his tank. And the poll fuels on the same fallacy. That's why it's worthless.

That quote is spot on. Thanks.

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

We could then revert to my first post here. To wit -- somebody show me where the word "love" appears in the Oath of Office. Or how such a subjective observation from a third-party demagogue is relevant to anything.

Trust me, there was never a moment, however instantaneous, where it even occurred to me to wonder what George W. Bush "loves" or "doesn't love". Or any other POTUS. That ain't my business. Kinda kinky if it's yours.

 

[kaz]

Half of America isn't convinced their President loves his country and you consider that a victory? Seriously?

I don't understand why you people don't understand how stupid this poll really is. It is a testament to how stupid Americans are. It's such typical overly-emotional garbage from the RW that is ultimately pointless.

Zackly. What Guiliani was doing is the same tired old fallacy he was running with the "a noun a verb and '911'" campaign....

Appeals to emotion include appeals to fear, envy, hatred, pity, pride, and more. It's important to note that sometimes a logically coherent argument may inspire emotion or have an emotional aspect, but the problem and fallacy occurs when emotion is used instead of a logical argument, or to obscure the fact that no compelling rational reason exists for one's position. Everyone, bar sociopaths, is affected by emotion, and so appeals to emotion are a very common and effective argument tactic, but they're ultimately flawed, dishonest, and tend to make one's opponents justifiably emotional.
​

Apparently it's all Giuliani has in his tank. And the poll fuels on the same fallacy. That's why it's worthless.

That quote is spot on. Thanks.

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

We could then revert to my first post here. To wit -- somebody show me where the word "love" appears in the Oath of Office. Or how such a subjective observation from a third-party demagogue is relevant to anything.

The poll is relevant to the reflection of the opinion of Americans. Where does it claim to be anything else?

I don't get what point you're making, is that because you aren't making one? What exactly prohibits polls just to find out what people think? I actually thought that was the point of polls

 

[Billy000]

I wouldn't expect any less from the ODS stricken rightwingers of this country. The shocking thing is that, in a Rasmussen poll, only 35% said he doesn't love his country.

Half of America isn't convinced their President loves his country and you consider that a victory? Seriously?

I don't understand why you people don't understand how stupid this poll really is. It is a testament to how stupid Americans are. It's such typical overly-emotional garbage from the RW that is ultimately pointless.

Zackly. What Guiliani was doing is the same tired old fallacy he was running with the "a noun a verb and '911'" campaign....

Appeals to emotion include appeals to fear, envy, hatred, pity, pride, and more. It's important to note that sometimes a logically coherent argument may inspire emotion or have an emotional aspect, but the problem and fallacy occurs when emotion is used instead of a logical argument, or to obscure the fact that no compelling rational reason exists for one's position. Everyone, bar sociopaths, is affected by emotion, and so appeals to emotion are a very common and effective argument tactic, but they're ultimately flawed, dishonest, and tend to make one's opponents justifiably emotional.
​

Apparently it's all Giuliani has in his tank. And the poll fuels on the same fallacy. That's why it's worthless.

That quote is spot on. Thanks.

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

Hmm so how would you react to the poll if he was republican? Are you suggesting I am more hypocritical than you? Based on what? I'm sure you can appreciate how this poll would differ considering it has a conservative bias.

I really don't care what most Americans think when it comes to politics. Sure it matters objectively what they think, but their attitudes doesn't sway me one way or the other. I care about facts and substance. The polls I care about are grounded with facts and substance, not emotional crap like this poll.

 

[Pogo]

I don't understand why you people don't understand how stupid this poll really is. It is a testament to how stupid Americans are. It's such typical overly-emotional garbage from the RW that is ultimately pointless.

Zackly. What Guiliani was doing is the same tired old fallacy he was running with the "a noun a verb and '911'" campaign....

Appeals to emotion include appeals to fear, envy, hatred, pity, pride, and more. It's important to note that sometimes a logically coherent argument may inspire emotion or have an emotional aspect, but the problem and fallacy occurs when emotion is used instead of a logical argument, or to obscure the fact that no compelling rational reason exists for one's position. Everyone, bar sociopaths, is affected by emotion, and so appeals to emotion are a very common and effective argument tactic, but they're ultimately flawed, dishonest, and tend to make one's opponents justifiably emotional.
​

Apparently it's all Giuliani has in his tank. And the poll fuels on the same fallacy. That's why it's worthless.

That quote is spot on. Thanks.

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

We could then revert to my first post here. To wit -- somebody show me where the word "love" appears in the Oath of Office. Or how such a subjective observation from a third-party demagogue is relevant to anything.

The poll is relevant to the reflection of the opinion of Americans. Where does it claim to be anything else?

I don't get what point you're making, is that because you aren't making one? What exactly prohibits polls just to find out what people think? I actually thought that was the point of polls

It is the point of a poll. And this one uses as its basis a question that is utterly irrelevant to anything.

 

[Billy000]

I don't understand why you people don't understand how stupid this poll really is. It is a testament to how stupid Americans are. It's such typical overly-emotional garbage from the RW that is ultimately pointless.

Zackly. What Guiliani was doing is the same tired old fallacy he was running with the "a noun a verb and '911'" campaign....

Appeals to emotion include appeals to fear, envy, hatred, pity, pride, and more. It's important to note that sometimes a logically coherent argument may inspire emotion or have an emotional aspect, but the problem and fallacy occurs when emotion is used instead of a logical argument, or to obscure the fact that no compelling rational reason exists for one's position. Everyone, bar sociopaths, is affected by emotion, and so appeals to emotion are a very common and effective argument tactic, but they're ultimately flawed, dishonest, and tend to make one's opponents justifiably emotional.
​

Apparently it's all Giuliani has in his tank. And the poll fuels on the same fallacy. That's why it's worthless.

That quote is spot on. Thanks.

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

We could then revert to my first post here. To wit -- somebody show me where the word "love" appears in the Oath of Office. Or how such a subjective observation from a third-party demagogue is relevant to anything.

The poll is relevant to the reflection of the opinion of Americans. Where does it claim to be anything else?

I don't get what point you're making, is that because you aren't making one? What exactly prohibits polls just to find out what people think? I actually thought that was the point of polls

It matters because this poll is so vague and cliche. It doesn't do anything to reflect Obama's actual policy record. There is no substance to it. There's no specifics.

 

[Pogo]

Zackly. What Guiliani was doing is the same tired old fallacy he was running with the "a noun a verb and '911'" campaign....

Appeals to emotion include appeals to fear, envy, hatred, pity, pride, and more. It's important to note that sometimes a logically coherent argument may inspire emotion or have an emotional aspect, but the problem and fallacy occurs when emotion is used instead of a logical argument, or to obscure the fact that no compelling rational reason exists for one's position. Everyone, bar sociopaths, is affected by emotion, and so appeals to emotion are a very common and effective argument tactic, but they're ultimately flawed, dishonest, and tend to make one's opponents justifiably emotional.
​

Apparently it's all Giuliani has in his tank. And the poll fuels on the same fallacy. That's why it's worthless.

That quote is spot on. Thanks.

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

We could then revert to my first post here. To wit -- somebody show me where the word "love" appears in the Oath of Office. Or how such a subjective observation from a third-party demagogue is relevant to anything.

The poll is relevant to the reflection of the opinion of Americans. Where does it claim to be anything else?

I don't get what point you're making, is that because you aren't making one? What exactly prohibits polls just to find out what people think? I actually thought that was the point of polls

It matters because this poll is so vague and cliche. It doesn't do anything to reflect Obama's actual policy record. There is no substance to it. There's no specifics.

"Specifics", ezzackly. What's the requisite number of Presidential Love Units (PLUs) for a POTUS? There oughta be a threshold where he can be impeached, doncha think?

Whatever it is I'm sure it's exactly inverse to his measurement of participation in the national Two Minutes Hate. However you measure that.

 

[kaz]

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

Hmm so how would you react to the poll if he was republican? Are you suggesting I am more hypocritical than you? Based on what? I'm sure you can appreciate how this poll would differ considering it has a conservative bias.

I really don't care what most Americans think when it comes to politics. Sure it matters objectively what they think, but their attitudes doesn't sway me one way or the other. I care about facts and substance. The polls I care about are grounded with facts and substance, not emotional crap like this poll.

Well, since you're so stupid you think I'm a Republican it's hard to say what you would and wouldn't get. And you don't know what a poll is, polls are about opinions. That is what they are. How stupid are you?

 

[kaz]

Zackly. What Guiliani was doing is the same tired old fallacy he was running with the "a noun a verb and '911'" campaign....

Appeals to emotion include appeals to fear, envy, hatred, pity, pride, and more. It's important to note that sometimes a logically coherent argument may inspire emotion or have an emotional aspect, but the problem and fallacy occurs when emotion is used instead of a logical argument, or to obscure the fact that no compelling rational reason exists for one's position. Everyone, bar sociopaths, is affected by emotion, and so appeals to emotion are a very common and effective argument tactic, but they're ultimately flawed, dishonest, and tend to make one's opponents justifiably emotional.
​

Apparently it's all Giuliani has in his tank. And the poll fuels on the same fallacy. That's why it's worthless.

That quote is spot on. Thanks.

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

We could then revert to my first post here. To wit -- somebody show me where the word "love" appears in the Oath of Office. Or how such a subjective observation from a third-party demagogue is relevant to anything.

The poll is relevant to the reflection of the opinion of Americans. Where does it claim to be anything else?

I don't get what point you're making, is that because you aren't making one? What exactly prohibits polls just to find out what people think? I actually thought that was the point of polls

It is the point of a poll. And this one uses as its basis a question that is utterly irrelevant to anything.

Right, you care only about polls that validate the Democrats or are negative to Republicans. The ones that reflect badly on Democrats are just a snooze to you

 

[Pogo]

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

Hmm so how would you react to the poll if he was republican? Are you suggesting I am more hypocritical than you? Based on what? I'm sure you can appreciate how this poll would differ considering it has a conservative bias.

I really don't care what most Americans think when it comes to politics. Sure it matters objectively what they think, but their attitudes doesn't sway me one way or the other. I care about facts and substance. The polls I care about are grounded with facts and substance, not emotional crap like this poll.

Well, since you're so stupid you think I'm a Republican it's hard to say what you would and wouldn't get. And you don't know what a poll is, polls are about opinions. That is what they are. How stupid are you?

Ah. Appeal to Emotion wasn't working, now it's back to the familiar.
Good, good -- let the ad hom flow through you....

 

[kaz]

Zackly. What Guiliani was doing is the same tired old fallacy he was running with the "a noun a verb and '911'" campaign....

Appeals to emotion include appeals to fear, envy, hatred, pity, pride, and more. It's important to note that sometimes a logically coherent argument may inspire emotion or have an emotional aspect, but the problem and fallacy occurs when emotion is used instead of a logical argument, or to obscure the fact that no compelling rational reason exists for one's position. Everyone, bar sociopaths, is affected by emotion, and so appeals to emotion are a very common and effective argument tactic, but they're ultimately flawed, dishonest, and tend to make one's opponents justifiably emotional.
​

Apparently it's all Giuliani has in his tank. And the poll fuels on the same fallacy. That's why it's worthless.

That quote is spot on. Thanks.

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

We could then revert to my first post here. To wit -- somebody show me where the word "love" appears in the Oath of Office. Or how such a subjective observation from a third-party demagogue is relevant to anything.

The poll is relevant to the reflection of the opinion of Americans. Where does it claim to be anything else?

I don't get what point you're making, is that because you aren't making one? What exactly prohibits polls just to find out what people think? I actually thought that was the point of polls

It matters because this poll is so vague and cliche. It doesn't do anything to reflect Obama's actual policy record. There is no substance to it. There's no specifics.

It's a ... wait for it ... poll. It collects opinions. Give me an example of a poll that is relevant by your standard

 

[g5000]

Here is a Rassmussen poll that shows that 35% of Americans agrees with Rudy that Obama doesn't love his country (to be clear we are now referring to the USA, not Kenya or Indonesia) and 14% aren't sure -- so almost half the country doesn't believe that Obama loves America.

One of the dumbest logical fallacies out there is the Argumentum ad Populum Fallacy.

If a majority of people believe the moon is made of cheese, it MUST be true!

 

[Pogo]

That quote is spot on. Thanks.

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

We could then revert to my first post here. To wit -- somebody show me where the word "love" appears in the Oath of Office. Or how such a subjective observation from a third-party demagogue is relevant to anything.

Trust me, there was never a moment, however instantaneous, where it even occurred to me to wonder what George W. Bush "loves" or "doesn't love". Or any other POTUS. That ain't my business. Kinda kinky if it's yours.

The poll is relevant to the reflection of the opinion of Americans. Where does it claim to be anything else?

I don't get what point you're making, is that because you aren't making one? What exactly prohibits polls just to find out what people think? I actually thought that was the point of polls

It is the point of a poll. And this one uses as its basis a question that is utterly irrelevant to anything.

Right, you care only about polls that validate the Democrats or are negative to Republicans. The ones that reflect badly on Democrats are just a snooze to you

Speculation fallacy. But you're "not a Republican". Gotta remember that.

This poll doesn't "validate" jack squat. Its only function is a lubricant for Rudy Giuliani's massive attention-whore ego.

So come on big boy-and/or-girl -- show us how "love" is a function of Presidentin'. Go back to the first question I asked here -- where is it in the Oath of Office? How do you quantify it?

 

[kaz]

If half the country didn't believe a Republican President loved his country you both would suddenly get it

Hmm so how would you react to the poll if he was republican? Are you suggesting I am more hypocritical than you? Based on what? I'm sure you can appreciate how this poll would differ considering it has a conservative bias.

I really don't care what most Americans think when it comes to politics. Sure it matters objectively what they think, but their attitudes doesn't sway me one way or the other. I care about facts and substance. The polls I care about are grounded with facts and substance, not emotional crap like this poll.

Well, since you're so stupid you think I'm a Republican it's hard to say what you would and wouldn't get. And you don't know what a poll is, polls are about opinions. That is what they are. How stupid are you?

Ah. Appeal to Emotion wasn't working, now it's back to the familiar.
Good, good -- let the ad hom flow through you....

So when he calls me a Republican and I call him stupid, the only ad hominem you're interested in is the return volley

 

[Pogo]

Not an answer, is it?


"Republican" is ad hominem?

 

[kaz]

Here is a Rassmussen poll that shows that 35% of Americans agrees with Rudy that Obama doesn't love his country (to be clear we are now referring to the USA, not Kenya or Indonesia) and 14% aren't sure -- so almost half the country doesn't believe that Obama loves America.

One of the dumbest logical fallacies out there is the Argumentum ad Populum Fallacy.

If a majority of people believe the moon is made of cheese, it MUST be true!

So Obama is the Peter Pan President? He only shines if we believe?

And wow, I'm not familiar with that aspect of polls, that taking a poll makes the outcome true. I wish they'd mentioned that in my Six Sigma Blackbelt training, now I'm afraid to take another poll. I'm a trained and certified expert in polling and I had no idea they were that powerful. I only thought we were gathering data, but wow, we were playing with dynamite. What if I ask if people think aliens are invading and it comes back yes? Crap, I'd have destroyed humanity. I'll never take another poll now, damn. That was scary.

You are committing the you are full of crap fallacy. Those of us who realize Obama's disdain for his country are only happy to see that more of the country realizes that than we knew. There is no cause and effect in that