No Excuses: Keystone XL Pipeline Clears Major Hurdle

[Vandalshandle]

(Quote) Goodod Websites to facilitate learning. I doubt leftists have such a large variety of information outlets.
Conservative Policy Research and Analysis
The Economist - World News, Politics, Economics, Business & Finance
DRUDGE REPORT 2014®
Fox News - Breaking News Updates | Latest News Headlines | Photos & News Videos
WND - A Free Press for a Free People
Newsmax.com - Breaking news from around the globe: U.S. news, politics, world, health, finance, video, science, technology, live news stream
Glenn Beck
Cato Institute | Individual Liberty, Free Markets, and Peace (end of quote)

Well, not exactly good information sources, but highly effective RW nut propaganda sources!


And 500,000 employees? In your dreams! But I can say this with certainty. It would put much more employees out of a job than they will need to hire, because shipping natural gas by rail is very labor intensive, compared to shipping by pipeline.

It's a crude oil line, not gas. But thanks for playing.

And this makes what difference to the point I was making?

Oh, sorry. I failed to give you credit for your deflection!!!

 

[oreo]

It is becoming increasingly clear that Hussein does not give one damn about you or me. The Keystone pipeline could cure the crisis we are currently in, but Hussein Obama in his bid to destroy America, instead choses to lounge around like a shiftless lazy man. He is too busy shuckin' and jivin' from the truth to face the realities that we face as a nation.

Obama doesn't like it because it's G.A.S---SSSSS. And probably because he can't get any political donations from it--by approving it. He only gets campaign donations when it's green energy.

 

[cutter]

Jobs Gained, Jobs Lost by the Construction of Keystone XL
A report by Cornell University global labor institute

Main Findings

The main points in this briefing paper can be summarized as follows:

» The industry’s US jobs claims are linked to a $7 billion KXL project budget. However, the budget for KXL that will have a bearing on US jobs figures is dramatically lower—only around $3 to $4 billion. A lower project budget means fewer jobs.

» The project will create no more than 2,500-4,650 temporary direct construction jobs for two years, according to TransCanada’s own data supplied to the State Department.

» The company’s claim that KXL will create 20,000 direct construction and manufacturing jobs in the U.S is not substantiated.

» There is strong evidence to suggest that a large portion of the primary material input for KXL—steel pipe—will not even be produced in the United States. A substantial amount of pipe has already been manufactured in advance of pipeline permit issuance.

» The industry’s claim that KXL will create 119,000 total jobs (direct, indirect, and induced) is based on a flawed and poorly documented study commissioned by TransCanada (The Perryman Group study). Perryman wrongly includes over $1 billion in spending and over 10,000 person-years of employment for a section of the Keystone project in Kansas and Oklahoma that is not part of KXL and has already been built.

» KXL will not be a major source of US jobs, nor will it play any substantial role at all in putting Americans back to work. Even if the Perryman figures were accurate, and all of the workers for the next phase of the project were hired immediately, the US seasonally adjusted unemployment rate would remain at 9.1%—exactly where it is now.

» KXL will divert Tar Sands oil now supplying Midwest refineries, so it can be sold at higher prices to the Gulf Coast and export markets. As a result, consumers in the Midwest could be paying 10 to 20 cents more per gallon for gasoline and diesel fuel. These additional costs (estimated to total $2–4 billion) will suppress other spending and will therefore cost jobs.

» Pipeline spills incur costs and therefore kill jobs. Clean-up operations and permanent pipeline spill damage will divert public and private funds away from productive economic activity. In 2010 US pipeline spills and explosions killed 22 people, released over 170,000 barrels of petroleum into the environment, and caused $1 billion dollars worth of damage in the United States.

» Rising carbon emissions and other pollutants from the heavy crude transported by Keystone XL will also incur increased health care costs. Emissions also increase both the risk and costs of further climate instability.

» By helping to lock in US dependence on fossil fuels, Keystone XL will impede progress toward green and sustainable economic renewal and will have a chilling effect on green investments and green jobs creation. The green economy has already generated 2.7 million jobs in the US and could generate many more.

http://www.ilr.cornell.edu/globallaborinstitute/research/upload/GLI_KeystoneXL_012312_FIN.pdf

I'm very happy that someone on this thread actually posted this, because I was just about to do so myself and thought it was pretty daunting because of how much information there is to go through.

What makes me angry is that these companies bandy about numbers like 500,000 jobs but then when it comes time to submit their proposals for government approval, the truth comes out.

Reminds me of the Trans-Alaska pipeline. It was supposed to created all these wonderful jobs but ended creating not very many.

The Keystone pipeline is essentially going to make suckers out of American citizens. It benefits Canada, it benefits China, it benefits the Koch brothers, and if a pipeline leaks or explodes (it would be carrying the dirtiest most dangerous kind of oil) in a neighborhood near you, what the hell is your job worth if your drinking water can't be, you know, drunk?

Obama has adopted a "Drill Baby Drill" energy policy. Drilling in the U.S. has dramatically increased. Green jobs are also dramatically up.

I'm not sure he'll give the go ahead for Keystone, only because the numbers the Kochs and the Canadians advertise are simply not the numbers in their proposals to the government. They're lying on purpose in order to get the public on their side so as to put pressure on President Obama to make a quick decision in their favor, but he doesn't seem to be falling for it, and neither should we.

If you're for this project, than what you are for is a great deal for Canadians, the Chinese, and people like the Koch brothers. Don't be fooled by the bamboozling online that says 500,000 jobs are coming to a town near you because it just won't happen. They lied about Trans-Alaska job creation and they're lying about this project, too.

But O fell for allowing other billionaires, buffett, to ship oil through the states on his rail line and you were all for it.

It's amazing how this pipeline will build itself and operate itself with no gov. Money and employ nobody. We would be much better with something like Solendra and all the long term jobs they created for the money. Green energy is paying off. Are you guys cold yet back east? Where would you be without all that evil fossle fuel?

 

[thereisnospoon]

(Quote) Goodod Websites to facilitate learning. I doubt leftists have such a large variety of information outlets.
Conservative Policy Research and Analysis
The Economist - World News, Politics, Economics, Business & Finance
DRUDGE REPORT 2014®
Fox News - Breaking News Updates | Latest News Headlines | Photos & News Videos
WND - A Free Press for a Free People
Newsmax.com - Breaking news from around the globe: U.S. news, politics, world, health, finance, video, science, technology, live news stream
Glenn Beck
Cato Institute | Individual Liberty, Free Markets, and Peace (end of quote)

Well, not exactly good information sources, but highly effective RW nut propaganda sources!


And 500,000 employees? In your dreams! But I can say this with certainty. It would put much more employees out of a job than they will need to hire, because shipping natural gas by rail is very labor intensive, compared to shipping by pipeline.

Oh but of course. For a source to be credible, it MUST demonstrate the "proper" liberal bias.
Tell me, why are you so dead opposed to US energy independence?
Do you have financial interests in OPEC countries? Do you have friends or relatives in any of those nations?
Come on. No one is pure. We all have our own self interest to fulfill FIRST.

 

[Vandalshandle]

In New Orleans, I lived 30 miles from a major oil refinery that operated 24/7.

They had fewer than 80 employees on three shifst, total.

Today, I live withing 4 miles of the 3rd largest copper mine in the USA. They also operate 24/7, and have fewer than 100 employees on two shifts per day, total.

But running a pipeline is going to take half a million people? Maybe they should go back to the drawing board on this. Something seems to be wrong with the design, since it only takes 811 people to run the Alaska pipeline!

http://www.alyeska-pipe.com/AboutUs

 

[kiwiman127]

It is becoming increasingly clear that Hussein does not give one damn about you or me. The Keystone pipeline could cure the crisis we are currently in, but Hussein Obama in his bid to destroy America, instead choses to lounge around like a shiftless lazy man. He is too busy shuckin' and jivin' from the truth to face the realities that we face as a nation.

I can't seem to find any article within The Economists that states that Keystone XL would create 500,000 jobs.
Just thought I'd bring this up as this is the second time the author of the OP has listed The Economist as a resource, yet it as with the first time he was shooting blanks.

 

[thereisnospoon]

2.5x more private sector jobs have been created in Obama's 5 years than in Bush's 8.

Bullllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll.....................................SHIT

 

[healthmyths]

In New Orleans, I lived 30 miles from a major oil refinery that operated 24/7.

They had fewer than 80 employees on three shifst, total.

Today, I live withing 4 miles of the 3rd largest copper mine in the USA. They also operate 24/7, and have fewer than 100 employees on two shifts per day, total.

But running a pipeline is going to take half a million people? Maybe they should go back to the drawing board on this. Something seems to be wrong with the design, since it only takes 811 people to run the Alaska pipeline!

Alyeska Pipeline - About Us

Well you are looking at the realities honestly.
So tell me what you think of these facts?

Exxon Valdez carried nearly 1,264,155 barrels in one tanker in one mile.
A train carried about 40,000 barrels in 73 cars in one mile.
Keystone pipeline will carry over 1,179 miles 830,000 barrels in 24 hours or in one mile: 703 barrels of oil.

One tanker accident puts at risk 1.2 million barrels in the ocean probably worst weather situation.
One train totally derailed puts in one mile 40,000 barrels.
One mile of pipeline having a leak in the entire ONE mile will spill 703 barrels.
Which is worse???

 

[LordBrownTrout]

I'm very happy that someone on this thread actually posted this, because I was just about to do so myself and thought it was pretty daunting because of how much information there is to go through.

What makes me angry is that these companies bandy about numbers like 500,000 jobs but then when it comes time to submit their proposals for government approval, the truth comes out.

Reminds me of the Trans-Alaska pipeline. It was supposed to created all these wonderful jobs but ended creating not very many.

The Keystone pipeline is essentially going to make suckers out of American citizens. It benefits Canada, it benefits China, it benefits the Koch brothers, and if a pipeline leaks or explodes (it would be carrying the dirtiest most dangerous kind of oil) in a neighborhood near you, what the hell is your job worth if your drinking water can't be, you know, drunk?

Obama has adopted a "Drill Baby Drill" energy policy. Drilling in the U.S. has dramatically increased. Green jobs are also dramatically up.

I'm not sure he'll give the go ahead for Keystone, only because the numbers the Kochs and the Canadians advertise are simply not the numbers in their proposals to the government. They're lying on purpose in order to get the public on their side so as to put pressure on President Obama to make a quick decision in their favor, but he doesn't seem to be falling for it, and neither should we.

If you're for this project, than what you are for is a great deal for Canadians, the Chinese, and people like the Koch brothers. Don't be fooled by the bamboozling online that says 500,000 jobs are coming to a town near you because it just won't happen. They lied about Trans-Alaska job creation and they're lying about this project, too.

But O fell for allowing other billionaires, buffett, to ship oil through the states on his rail line and you were all for it.

It's amazing how this pipeline will build itself and operate itself with no gov. Money and employ nobody. We would be much better with something like Solendra and all the long term jobs they created for the money. Green energy is paying off. Are you guys cold yet back east? Where would you be without all that evil fossle fuel?

This must be for bfgn because I explore and drill nat gas.

 

[thereisnospoon]

In reality the Kochstone Pipeline will put $100 million/yr in the Koch Brother's pockets.

Pretty sure there's nothing real about that figure either.

You both need to check your facts.

Koch Brothers Positioned To Be Big Winners If Keystone XL Pipeline Is Approved | Reuters

Koch Brothers Positioned To Be Big Winners If Keystone XL Pipeline Is Approved

The two brothers together own virtually all of Koch Industries Inc. — a giant oil conglomerate headquartered in Wichita, Kan., with annual revenues estimated to be $100 billion.

A SolveClimate News analysis, based on publicly available records, shows that Koch Industries is already responsible for close to 25 percent of the oil sands crude that is imported into the United States, and is well-positioned to benefit from increasing Canadian oil imports.

A Koch Industries operation in Calgary, Alberta, called Flint Hills Resources Canada LP, supplies about 250,000 barrels of tar sands oil a day to a heavy oil refinery in Minnesota, also owned by the Koch brothers.

Flint Hills Resources Canada also operates a crude oil terminal in Hardisty, Alberta, the starting point of the proposed Keystone XL pipeline.

The company's website says it is "among Canada's largest crude oil purchasers, shippers and exporters." Koch Industries also owns Koch Exploration Canada, L.P., an oil sands-focused exploration company also based in Calgary that acquires, develops and trades petroleum properties.

snip/

Although the pipeline, if approved, would increase the supply of oil reaching the U.S., a 2009 market analysis conducted by TransCanada, builder of the pipeline, forecast higher prices. The analysis, which TransCanada conducted as part of its Canadian permit application, projected that prices would increase about $3 per barrel as a result of the pipeline.

That would send at least an additional $2 billion from American consumers to Canadian and multinational oil interests, despite the increase in supply. Given its deep involvement in the Canadian petroleum industry, the Koch brothers' operation stands to snare some of the windfall.

SO?....It's THEIR money. They are investing wisely.
Perhaps instead of crying in your cornflakes about how terrible this country is, take a few bucks and invest in the oil markets. I did...Oil makes me MONEY....

 

[Vandalshandle]

In New Orleans, I lived 30 miles from a major oil refinery that operated 24/7.

They had fewer than 80 employees on three shifst, total.

Today, I live withing 4 miles of the 3rd largest copper mine in the USA. They also operate 24/7, and have fewer than 100 employees on two shifts per day, total.

But running a pipeline is going to take half a million people? Maybe they should go back to the drawing board on this. Something seems to be wrong with the design, since it only takes 811 people to run the Alaska pipeline!

Alyeska Pipeline - About Us

Well you are looking at the realities honestly.
So tell me what you think of these facts?

Exxon Valdez carried nearly 1,264,155 barrels in one tanker in one mile.
A train carried about 40,000 barrels in 73 cars in one mile.
Keystone pipeline will carry over 1,179 miles 830,000 barrels in 24 hours or in one mile: 703 barrels of oil.

One tanker accident puts at risk 1.2 million barrels in the ocean probably worst weather situation.
One train totally derailed puts in one mile 40,000 barrels.
One mile of pipeline having a leak in the entire ONE mile will spill 703 barrels.
Which is worse???

I suspect that you are correct, and if the radical Right would stick to the facts, they might be able to make some persuasive points. But, coming up with absurd arguements, like it will create half a million permenat jobs, just discredits pretty much everything else that they have to say. It's kind of like Obama telling his base, "I really am going to close Gitmo next year!

 

[thereisnospoon]

Jobs Gained, Jobs Lost by the Construction of Keystone XL
A report by Cornell University global labor institute

Main Findings

The main points in this briefing paper can be summarized as follows:

» The industry’s US jobs claims are linked to a $7 billion KXL project budget. However, the budget for KXL that will have a bearing on US jobs figures is dramatically lower—only around $3 to $4 billion. A lower project budget means fewer jobs.

» The project will create no more than 2,500-4,650 temporary direct construction jobs for two years, according to TransCanada’s own data supplied to the State Department.

» The company’s claim that KXL will create 20,000 direct construction and manufacturing jobs in the U.S is not substantiated.

» There is strong evidence to suggest that a large portion of the primary material input for KXL—steel pipe—will not even be produced in the United States. A substantial amount of pipe has already been manufactured in advance of pipeline permit issuance.

» The industry’s claim that KXL will create 119,000 total jobs (direct, indirect, and induced) is based on a flawed and poorly documented study commissioned by TransCanada (The Perryman Group study). Perryman wrongly includes over $1 billion in spending and over 10,000 person-years of employment for a section of the Keystone project in Kansas and Oklahoma that is not part of KXL and has already been built.

» KXL will not be a major source of US jobs, nor will it play any substantial role at all in putting Americans back to work. Even if the Perryman figures were accurate, and all of the workers for the next phase of the project were hired immediately, the US seasonally adjusted unemployment rate would remain at 9.1%—exactly where it is now.

» KXL will divert Tar Sands oil now supplying Midwest refineries, so it can be sold at higher prices to the Gulf Coast and export markets. As a result, consumers in the Midwest could be paying 10 to 20 cents more per gallon for gasoline and diesel fuel. These additional costs (estimated to total $2–4 billion) will suppress other spending and will therefore cost jobs.

» Pipeline spills incur costs and therefore kill jobs. Clean-up operations and permanent pipeline spill damage will divert public and private funds away from productive economic activity. In 2010 US pipeline spills and explosions killed 22 people, released over 170,000 barrels of petroleum into the environment, and caused $1 billion dollars worth of damage in the United States.

» Rising carbon emissions and other pollutants from the heavy crude transported by Keystone XL will also incur increased health care costs. Emissions also increase both the risk and costs of further climate instability.

» By helping to lock in US dependence on fossil fuels, Keystone XL will impede progress toward green and sustainable economic renewal and will have a chilling effect on green investments and green jobs creation. The green economy has already generated 2.7 million jobs in the US and could generate many more.

http://www.ilr.cornell.edu/globallaborinstitute/research/upload/GLI_KeystoneXL_012312_FIN.pdf

Cornell...Yes a bastion of liberalism is the ONLY credible source for this kind of info.
Of course this study is totally independent and nary a word of anti fossil fuel bias was on the minds of the people doing the study.
Sure.

 

[thereisnospoon]

That's according to the false TransCanada (They are fudging the numbers to be much lower, as they have no vested interest in this stuff) numbers, the real figures say 500k.



Media Advisory - TransCanada Releases Detailed Keystone XL Job Creation Data

Try reading harder:

The $7 billion oil pipeline is the largest infrastructure project on the books in the U.S. right now. It would create 20,000 jobs: 13,000 in construction, 7,000 in manufacturing.

That 561 number isn't 561,000, it's 561 people. Stop. Just stop.

I'd love for you to prove that it WOULD employ 500k people, though, on the other hand.

Those are 516 construction jobs per spread times 17 spreads equals 8772 jobs on the line. Ya need to read it, not just scan it. There are about 20,000 directly involved in the construction and manufacturing for the construction. I didn't see an accounting for jobs created for transportation of materials and equipment, spare parts and maintenance for the equipment used, food supply and transportation for the construction camps and I could go on all night but I think you get the idea. As slow joe said, this is a big fucking deal and that just for the construction.

Then like I said in an earlier post you have the operation which requires a butt load of people on the line itself then in the refineries and finished product handlers from exporters to the guy driving oil and chemical tankers.

Add in the workers needed for infrastructure, construction of housing, new employees of local businesses along the pipeline, etc.
These people oppose this project for one reason. Because Obama opposes the project.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Oh, and BTW, nobody is going to get away with building it anywhere that I live! But, I am sure that nobody else feels that way!

 

[thereisnospoon]

One other thing.... Look at the harm the Trans Alaska pipeline has done to Alaska....

Resource Development Council for Alaska, Inc.

Alaska’s Oil & Gas Industry

Background

The oil and gas industry has driven much of the growth in Alaska’s economy and has paid for most of the state government’s operations for 40 years. In fact, oil production currently accounts for approximately 93 percent of Alaska’s unrestricted general fund revenues, or $8.86 billion in fiscal year 2012. The general fund pays for almost every state service, including the education system, transportation infrastructure, public health and safety services, and a host of other programs throughout Alaska. In FY 2013, unrestricted revenue from oil production is anticipated to be $6.9 billion and $6.4 billion in FY 2014. Since Statehood, Alaska has received $164 billion in revenues from oil.

According to a special report by the University of Alaska’s Institute for Social and Economic Research (ISER), without oil, the economy in Alaska today would be only half its current size. A third of Alaska’s jobs, 127,000, are oil related and depend on oil production.

Alaska also has no Income Tax and no Sales Tax.

Alaska also gifts each and every qualified resident of the State with a check every year from Oil Revenue.

This year, a paltry $900. In past years, as much as $2,069 per resident.

Yeah, that Trans Alaska Pipeline really fucked over The People of Alaska, didn't it?

I hate dimocraps. Stupid, arrogant, ignorant, dishonest, regressive, backwards-assed inbreeds. All of them

That pipeline paid for my niece's college education at the U of Alaska/ Anchorage.
That's right. My brother and his wife banked every pipeline check along with their daughter's and created a college fund for her.

 

[Sallow]

2.5x more private sector jobs have been created in Obama's 5 years than in Bush's 8.

Bullllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll.....................................SHIT

It's not bullshit.

It's math.

More Jobs Created Under Obama Than Bush, Nonpartisan Report Finds - Careers Articles
Surprise! Obama Is Creating More New Jobs Than George W. Bush - Rick Newman (usnews.com)
Jobs created during U.S. presidential terms - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And if you factor in that GW Bush had lots of spending to employ federal/state/city workers and Obama lost that spending and those jobs..Obama's record looks that much better.

 

[thereisnospoon]

It will add co2 into the planets atmosphere. That alone is the reason to oppose it.

WHAT?!!!!
Ok, so you've sold your car, heat your house with..Oh wait a minute, burning wood POLLUTES the atmosphere. Guess you have no heat..
You fucking people are hypocrites. You finger wag at this and that, oppose it for reasons you cannot support while doing EXACTLY the things you demand others should not do.
YOU breathe, don't you? Ok, how about you just kill yourself so you don't add CO2 to the atmosphere.

 

[thereisnospoon]

The far left math on numbers only works when it is their favor and most of the time they have to make those up.

Sort of like those 5 million jobs Obama has created all by himself.

 

[thereisnospoon]

"The Keystone Pipline would create 500,000 permenate jobs, why does obama reject it?"

Because it would create 500,000 jobs, which means 500,000 people who are NOT dependent on government for their survival.

But it wouldn't create that many jobs. In fact, it wouldn't create many jobs at all.

And the danger of an oil spill would poison the aquifers in the midwest. You know, the ones we depend on to irrigate the food.

Had they said the same things about the Hoover Dam project, there would be no Southern California, Arizona, etc.
The human condition involves risk.
You libs.....the ideology of "why should we".

 

[rightwinger]

Every American who wants a job could find it on the Keystone Pip-line

There are ten million unemployed in America. So...I don't think so!

We need that many people to check for leaks