Okay...to settle this, the church shooter could not legally own any gun...

[Skull Pilot]

This is to settle the discussion on wether a dishonorable discharge is a felony, thereby banning gun ownership....

Dishonorable Discharge and NFA Firearms

The dishonorable discharge is based on a general court-martial conviction. This means the conviction is a felony, regardless of what the underlying offense may have been. The convicted felon is banned from possessing a firearm including Title II Firearms (a Silencer, SBR, SBS, AOW, or Machine Gun).

A person who is convicted of a crime that is punishable by imprisonment for more than one year ( including a dishonorable discharge) is prohibited from possessing a firearm. Under 18 U.S.C. 922(g), a felon who is found guilty of gun possession may serve up to 10 years in prison.

If you have been convicted of a felony or a dishonorable discharge, be careful of constructive possession. You could be guilty of being in possession of a firearm if your spouse or another family or household member has a firearm that you “could” access.


So...which gun law stopped this guy from getting his gun?

You Goddamned ignorant fuck. One of the posters here told how he bought an AR from a private party in a Wal Mart parking lot, no questions asked, just handed over the cash, and took possesion of the gun, ammo, and magazines. It is cocksucks like you that are directly responsible for this reign of death from the crazies. You wanted more guns on the streets, and we got more guns on the streets, and weekly mass killings. Time for a special license to have one of these guns outside of your home, with it being a felony is you are caught without it, your guns confiscated and destroyed, and you can never own or have a gun on your person again. And enforce the law, no exceptions.

How will any law stop that from happening.

Maybe we can model our gun laws on the drug laws hat have been so successful at stopping the illegal sale of drugs


Oh wait.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Anybody who knew about his weapons and that he should not have had them has murder blood guilt on them.

Until the second he killed the first person, the NRA still considered him to be a good guy with a gun.

You were just told he was in violation of the Gun laws. NRA CAN'T GET the Feds to enforce enough of the EXISTING gun laws. Keep your fictional political scripts to yourself.

The NRA wants everybody to be armed. Doesn't matter if you are mentally incapacitated, or blind.

The NRA WORKS TIRELESSLY to get current laws enforced and doesn't DO what you 1st alleged. NOW you change the goal posts. Mentally incapacited is a LEGAL term. Doesn't describe the types of ailments that the Psych industry think that 60% of Americans have. I don't want or trust them to make determinations. Neither do you actually if you were pressed on voiding voting or parenting rights on THEIR assessment.

I think that determination has to WAIT another decade when "mental illness" has some REAL diagnostic tools to MEASURE incapacity.. And THAT'S the issue. Not that we like guns in the hands of "crazy" people.

The NRA is always working to make gun ownership easier for everyone, including the lobbying they did to make it so people with mental illnesses could buy guns again, despite the fact that the people killed the most by guns are those that commit suicide.

That is complete bullshit.

They were fighting a clause in Social Security laws that defined an elderly person who might need help balancing his checkbook as mentally ill

 

[Skull Pilot]

Anybody who knew about his weapons and that he should not have had them has murder blood guilt on them.

Until the second he killed the first person, the NRA still considered him to be a good guy with a gun.

You were just told he was in violation of the Gun laws. NRA CAN'T GET the Feds to enforce enough of the EXISTING gun laws. Keep your fictional political scripts to yourself.

The NRA wants everybody to be armed. Doesn't matter if you are mentally incapacitated, or blind.

The NRA WORKS TIRELESSLY to get current laws enforced and doesn't DO what you 1st alleged. NOW you change the goal posts. Mentally incapacited is a LEGAL term. Doesn't describe the types of ailments that the Psych industry think that 60% of Americans have. I don't want or trust them to make determinations. Neither do you actually if you were pressed on voiding voting or parenting rights on THEIR assessment.

I think that determination has to WAIT another decade when "mental illness" has some REAL diagnostic tools to MEASURE incapacity.. And THAT'S the issue. Not that we like guns in the hands of "crazy" people.

The NRA is always working to make gun ownership easier for everyone, including the lobbying they did to make it so people with mental illnesses could buy guns again, despite the fact that the people killed the most by guns are those that commit suicide.

Suicide is a choice not a crime
It's none of your business if a person wants to kill himself

 

[Skull Pilot]

He illegally owned a gun... and posted it on his Facebook to the world and people didn't notify law enforcement. All those people are complicity in the murders he committed for not doing something. We can't expect law enforcement to be EVERYWHERE and do EVERYTHING...

Exactly you moron...that is why we need concealed and open carry laws so the people being shot at by these killers can stop them before the 5 minutes it takes the police to get there.....

As you said.....the cops can't be everywhere and do everything......

What you posted had nothing to do with what I said, you just took it as a chance to respond in order to make a personal attack.

How about you address what I said? He illegally had a gun, flaunted it on Facebook, and no one said anything. People died.

How would anyone on Facebook know he was not eligible to own a gun?

 

[Skull Pilot]

Exactly you moron...that is why we need concealed and open carry laws so the people being shot at by these killers can stop them before the 5 minutes it takes the police to get there.....

As you said.....the cops can't be everywhere and do everything......

What you posted had nothing to do with what I said, you just took it as a chance to respond in order to make a personal attack.

How about you address what I said? He illegally had a gun, flaunted it on Facebook, and no one said anything. People died.

Yes...he broke your gun laws...and murdered people...and you want to keep normal, law abiding people from being able to defend themselves from monsters like this...my post was right on target...

Not what I said at all. I've said hundreds of times on this forum I'm pro-gun and not for prohibition of guns, but your mind can't grasp a rational argument that involves tighter gun laws make sense. To you it is either the wild west or North Korea, with nothing in between.

No moron, I have frequently stated what I believe...

1) if you use a gun to commit an actual crime, rape, robbery or murder, you go to prison for 30 years.

2) if you are a violent felon who is caught with a gun, you go to jail for 30 years.

Those two items are all we need to deal with actual gun criminals...until people like you let them out.

Putting people in jail for 30 years isn't going to solve gun crime.

If you studied this you'd know that.

But letting people who commit gun crimes out on the street will?
Or will preventing the 99.999% of people who will never commit a crime with a gun from owning firearms do that?

 

[Skull Pilot]

Yes...he broke your gun laws...and murdered people...and you want to keep normal, law abiding people from being able to defend themselves from monsters like this...my post was right on target...

Not what I said at all. I've said hundreds of times on this forum I'm pro-gun and not for prohibition of guns, but your mind can't grasp a rational argument that involves tighter gun laws make sense. To you it is either the wild west or North Korea, with nothing in between.

No moron, I have frequently stated what I believe...

1) if you use a gun to commit an actual crime, rape, robbery or murder, you go to prison for 30 years.

2) if you are a violent felon who is caught with a gun, you go to jail for 30 years.

Those two items are all we need to deal with actual gun criminals...until people like you let them out.

Putting people in jail for 30 years isn't going to solve gun crime.

If you studied this you'd know that.

Link to back that up?

The United States has over 2.1 million people in prison... and the number is growing. The next closest is China at 1.6 million.

The U.S. has a total population of around 325 million... China is 1.4 BILLION.

Locking people up in jail and throwing away the key isn't working, and hasn't for several years. All it does is cause more problems, including an endless cycle of younger generations following the foot steps of their parents into jail.

In order to solve the issue, you have to go further into the source of the problem... being proactive rather than reactive. You educate people better, you give more help with mental illness and substance abuse, and provide other programs to help people generate their own ability to live.

Highest to Lowest - Prison Population Total | World Prison Brief

We tend to lock up people for nonviolent crimes.

Prison should be reserved for violent pieces of shit and alternate sentencing used for nonviolent offenders.

 

[Skull Pilot]

No moron, I have frequently stated what I believe...

1) if you use a gun to commit an actual crime, rape, robbery or murder, you go to prison for 30 years.

2) if you are a violent felon who is caught with a gun, you go to jail for 30 years.

Those two items are all we need to deal with actual gun criminals...until people like you let them out.

Putting people in jail for 30 years isn't going to solve gun crime.

If you studied this you'd know that.

Link to back that up?

The United States has over 2.1 million people in prison... and the number is growing. The next closest is China at 1.6 million.

The U.S. has a total population of around 325 million... China is 1.4 BILLION.

Locking people up in jail and throwing away the key isn't working, and hasn't for several years. All it does is cause more problems, including an endless cycle of younger generations following the foot steps of their parents into jail.

In order to solve the issue, you have to go further into the source of the problem... being proactive rather than reactive. You educate people better, you give more help with mental illness and substance abuse, and provide other programs to help people generate their own ability to live.

Highest to Lowest - Prison Population Total | World Prison Brief

Your link doesn't back up your claim.

It doesn't back my claim that putting people in jail doesn't work?

Despite the U.S. being the most FREE country in the world, we have the largest prison population in the world... by a MILE. What's wrong with that picture?

Half of all prisoners are in jail for drug offenses.

 

[Esmeralda]

This is to settle the discussion on wether a dishonorable discharge is a felony, thereby banning gun ownership....

Dishonorable Discharge and NFA Firearms

The dishonorable discharge is based on a general court-martial conviction. This means the conviction is a felony, regardless of what the underlying offense may have been. The convicted felon is banned from possessing a firearm including Title II Firearms (a Silencer, SBR, SBS, AOW, or Machine Gun).

A person who is convicted of a crime that is punishable by imprisonment for more than one year ( including a dishonorable discharge) is prohibited from possessing a firearm. Under 18 U.S.C. 922(g), a felon who is found guilty of gun possession may serve up to 10 years in prison.

If you have been convicted of a felony or a dishonorable discharge, be careful of constructive possession. You could be guilty of being in possession of a firearm if your spouse or another family or household member has a firearm that you “could” access.


So...which gun law stopped this guy from getting his gun?

This is why laws are stupid. If people want to, they break them all the time.

Okay, cool. No laws for anything--murder, rape, bank robbery, hijacking, mass murder, terrorism, whatever. Why have laws when people just ignore them anyway.

Laws define illegal behaviors and set penalties they do not stop anyone from committing that illegal behavior.

Bullshit.

 

[Skull Pilot]

This is to settle the discussion on wether a dishonorable discharge is a felony, thereby banning gun ownership....

Dishonorable Discharge and NFA Firearms

The dishonorable discharge is based on a general court-martial conviction. This means the conviction is a felony, regardless of what the underlying offense may have been. The convicted felon is banned from possessing a firearm including Title II Firearms (a Silencer, SBR, SBS, AOW, or Machine Gun).

A person who is convicted of a crime that is punishable by imprisonment for more than one year ( including a dishonorable discharge) is prohibited from possessing a firearm. Under 18 U.S.C. 922(g), a felon who is found guilty of gun possession may serve up to 10 years in prison.

If you have been convicted of a felony or a dishonorable discharge, be careful of constructive possession. You could be guilty of being in possession of a firearm if your spouse or another family or household member has a firearm that you “could” access.


So...which gun law stopped this guy from getting his gun?

This is why laws are stupid. If people want to, they break them all the time.

Okay, cool. No laws for anything--murder, rape, bank robbery, hijacking, mass murder, terrorism, whatever. Why have laws when people just ignore them anyway.

Laws define illegal behaviors and set penalties they do not stop anyone from committing that illegal behavior.

Bullshit.

REally?

Then you can tell me exactly how many murders were prevented by the laws against murder?

How about the laws against drugs? How many drug buys have been stopped by those laws?

 

[AvgGuyIA]

You Goddamned ignorant fuck. One of the ... snip ... It is cocksucks like you that are directly responsible for this reign of death from the crazies. You wanted more guns on the streets, and we got more guns on the streets, and weekly mass killings. Time for a special license to have one of these guns outside of your home, with it being a felony is you are caught without it, your guns confiscated and destroyed, and you can never own or have a gun on your person again. And enforce the law, no exceptions.

What clause in the 2nd Amendment supports that action by our government?

 

[Esmeralda]

This is to settle the discussion on wether a dishonorable discharge is a felony, thereby banning gun ownership....

Dishonorable Discharge and NFA Firearms

The dishonorable discharge is based on a general court-martial conviction. This means the conviction is a felony, regardless of what the underlying offense may have been. The convicted felon is banned from possessing a firearm including Title II Firearms (a Silencer, SBR, SBS, AOW, or Machine Gun).

A person who is convicted of a crime that is punishable by imprisonment for more than one year ( including a dishonorable discharge) is prohibited from possessing a firearm. Under 18 U.S.C. 922(g), a felon who is found guilty of gun possession may serve up to 10 years in prison.

If you have been convicted of a felony or a dishonorable discharge, be careful of constructive possession. You could be guilty of being in possession of a firearm if your spouse or another family or household member has a firearm that you “could” access.


So...which gun law stopped this guy from getting his gun?

This is why laws are stupid. If people want to, they break them all the time.

Okay, cool. No laws for anything--murder, rape, bank robbery, hijacking, mass murder, terrorism, whatever. Why have laws when people just ignore them anyway.

Laws define illegal behaviors and set penalties they do not stop anyone from committing that illegal behavior.

Bullshit.

REally?

Then you can tell me exactly how many murders were prevented by the laws against murder?

How about the laws against drugs? How many drug buys have been stopped by those laws?

The vast majority of Americans do not commit crimes. Do you think that is because they just want to do the right thing or because they are deterred by the laws and penalties?

 

[Yousaidwhat]

Somebodies knew he had guns that he should not have had and failed to call LEO.

I'm sure he is not the only one.

Not going to be easy to encourage friends or family to contact authorities when criminals are in possession of illegal firearms.

Here in the Baltimore-Washington metro area snitching is a death sentence.

 

[Old Rocks]

This is to settle the discussion on wether a dishonorable discharge is a felony, thereby banning gun ownership....

Dishonorable Discharge and NFA Firearms

The dishonorable discharge is based on a general court-martial conviction. This means the conviction is a felony, regardless of what the underlying offense may have been. The convicted felon is banned from possessing a firearm including Title II Firearms (a Silencer, SBR, SBS, AOW, or Machine Gun).

A person who is convicted of a crime that is punishable by imprisonment for more than one year ( including a dishonorable discharge) is prohibited from possessing a firearm. Under 18 U.S.C. 922(g), a felon who is found guilty of gun possession may serve up to 10 years in prison.

If you have been convicted of a felony or a dishonorable discharge, be careful of constructive possession. You could be guilty of being in possession of a firearm if your spouse or another family or household member has a firearm that you “could” access.


So...which gun law stopped this guy from getting his gun?

You Goddamned ignorant fuck. One of the posters here told how he bought an AR from a private party in a Wal Mart parking lot, no questions asked, just handed over the cash, and took possesion of the gun, ammo, and magazines. It is cocksucks like you that are directly responsible for this reign of death from the crazies. You wanted more guns on the streets, and we got more guns on the streets, and weekly mass killings. Time for a special license to have one of these guns outside of your home, with it being a felony is you are caught without it, your guns confiscated and destroyed, and you can never own or have a gun on your person again. And enforce the law, no exceptions.

Yes you ignorant goddamned fuck IT WAS AGAINST THE LAW FOR HIM TO BE IN POSSESSION OF THAT GUN!. Wow. Those laws suuuure are effective!

OK, let us find out where he got the guns. Notice the plural? And charge anyone that sold him a gun with 26 counts of murder and 20 counts of attempted murder.

 

[Old Rocks]

You Goddamned ignorant fuck. One of the ... snip ... It is cocksucks like you that are directly responsible for this reign of death from the crazies. You wanted more guns on the streets, and we got more guns on the streets, and weekly mass killings. Time for a special license to have one of these guns outside of your home, with it being a felony is you are caught without it, your guns confiscated and destroyed, and you can never own or have a gun on your person again. And enforce the law, no exceptions.

What clause in the 2nd Amendment supports that action by our government?

The same one that the Supreme Court upheld when it said that the government had the right to require that you have a special license to own a machine gun. Since it was shown on this board that these guns are effectively machine guns, a law like this would be Constitutional. Or do you really want to wait until the sane citizens finally get tired of the weekly massacres and lay down some really draconian gun laws?

 

[BlackSand]

The same one that the Supreme Court upheld when it said that the government had the right to require that you have a special license to own a machine gun. Since it was shown on this board that these guns are effectively machine guns, a law like this would be Constitutional. Or do you really want to wait until the sane citizens finally get tired of the weekly massacres and lay down some really draconian gun laws?

What are you going to do when they don't care you are tired ... Cry about it ...
It isn't like you could make them ... The majority of your supporters would be unarmed.

Until you can give the majority of armed citizens the ability or reason to trust the government ... There is nothing you can really do.
Think about it ... If you were a politician and close to a third of the country owns firearms ... Who would you really rather piss off?

Would it be the people that know the difference between a machine gun and an assault weapon ... Or the people that don't?

.

 

[Old Rocks]

The same one that the Supreme Court upheld when it said that the government had the right to require that you have a special license to own a machine gun. Since it was shown on this board that these guns are effectively machine guns, a law like this would be Constitutional. Or do you really want to wait until the sane citizens finally get tired of the weekly massacres and lay down some really draconian gun laws?

What are you going to do when they don't care you are tired ... Cry about it ...
It isn't like you could make them ... The majority of your supporters would be unarmed.

Until you can give the majority of armed citizens the ability or reason to trust the government ... There is nothing you can really do.
Think about it ... If you were a politician and close to a third of the country owns firearms ... Who would you really rather piss off?

Would it be the people that know the difference between a machine gun and an assault weapon ... Or the people that don't?

.

Youtube took down the video, but a gun nut posted on these boards, a demonstration of how to hold the AR 15 so it would fire like a machine gun without any mechanical assistance. And the bump stocks effectively make the semi-auto's machine guns. So, there is no difference. I have several long rifles, from .22 to .50 caliber. Hunting guns, some accurate to 600 yards. Do you consider me unarmed? Who the fuck needs a machine gun for self defense? And when I was young, no one seemed to need these kinds of weapons to defend themselves against the big bad government.

 

[BlackSand]

Youtube took down the video, but a gun nut posted on these boards, a demonstration of how to hold the AR 15 so it would fire like a machine gun without any mechanical assistance. And the bump stocks effectively make the semi-auto's machine guns. So, there is no difference. I have several long rifles, from .22 to .50 caliber. Hunting guns, some accurate to 600 yards. Do you consider me unarmed? Who the fuck needs a machine gun for self defense? And when I was young, no one seemed to need these kinds of weapons to defend themselves against the big bad government.

An AR-15 cannot be a machine gun ... Because what you can do to it won't make it machine gun.
At best ... It would be a sub-machine gun ...
That's why people like you don't get to write legislation ... Because you don't know what the fuck you are talking about.

And no ... I don't consider you unarmed ... But then again I didn't limit my comment to you.
In fact ... I didn't suggest they need to convince your stupid ass to trust the government ... But you are not the majority of firearms owners.

.

 

[Peach]

Not in Florida I believe.

 

[BlackSand]

President Clinton's Assault Weapons Ban didn't work and was allowed to expire ... Because they weren't able to effectively define and prevent the sale of the weapons they wanted off the market.

I legally bought my first AR-15 from a licensed dealer ... During the Assault Weapons Ban.

.

 

[Skull Pilot]

This is why laws are stupid. If people want to, they break them all the time.

Okay, cool. No laws for anything--murder, rape, bank robbery, hijacking, mass murder, terrorism, whatever. Why have laws when people just ignore them anyway.

Laws define illegal behaviors and set penalties they do not stop anyone from committing that illegal behavior.

Bullshit.

REally?

Then you can tell me exactly how many murders were prevented by the laws against murder?

How about the laws against drugs? How many drug buys have been stopped by those laws?

The vast majority of Americans do not commit crimes. Do you think that is because they just want to do the right thing or because they are deterred by the laws and penalties?

You do know that most people wouldn't kill if there were no laws against killing don't you?

And as I said no law has ever PREVENTED anyone from committing any crime.