Trump supporters: How are you punishing the Establishment?

[candycorn]

...I guess you are a consumer of the “lame stream” media since you know what they are reporting?...

Indeed. I listen to it all. I weight it all. On both sides. And I judge for myself, which is Real and which is Contrived. Don’t you?

Mainly the AP and NPR.

The logic of listening to what you consider “lame” is pretty silly. But hey, your mileage may vary. What is the old line about 2 politicians arguing…where one says to the other, “You’re lying” and the other says, “Yes but hear me out…” Why would you bother “hearing out” the “lame stream media”.

...Its good to see you guys have claimed your first “career politician” though. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

You mean, like Bernie has been trying to do for so many months? You're not laughing about that schism, and how to heal it, are you? Bwaaahahaha indeed.

He has? Didn’t know that. He was running for President (as a career Politician).

Dude, did you get any sleep last night? You’re not making much sense.

 

[BluesLegend]

OP millions of Republicans are fed up with the GOP establishment's LIES and arrogant mocking of the very voters who gave them back the House and Senate. The establishment's 'fuck you' attitude has been eye opening for many, hence Trump is the nominee for better or worse. We have no reason NONE to trust anything that spews from the lying establishments mouths. Plus the dumb asses have lost the last two elections to a nobody with no resume idiot Obama. If you can't beat a guy like that who's resume is damn near blank again well we don't need their advice.

For fucks sake the establishment was pushing a 3rd Bush are they fucking insane?? In short the GOP establishment can kiss our ass.

 

[Toro]

To get a little more specific here (okay, and to bump the thread, guilty), as I understand it the reason you're mad at the establishment is that you would elect people who say they're conservative, but then don't act as conservative as you want them to when they're in office. Okay, I do get that.

So it appears to be about frustration over elected Republican officials not being conservative enough.

So in response, you run a guy who would certainly be considered a RINO if it were not for his (insert adjective here, I'm out of them) behavior.

That's the disconnect that I'm asking about.
.

YOur understanding is flawed.

This issue is not that they are not conservative enough, it is that they have not accomplished their stated agenda enough.


THey have become comfortable in their secure jobs, and focusing on the PROCESS of governing, not on the results.


Our interests are NOT being represented.


Trumps sounds like he is serious about getting these things DONE.

I don't think his plan is to give the appearance of working on the problem. I think he wants to actually SOLVE the problems.


I don't want to hear that deportations are UP.

I want to hear that the Illegal population is DOWN or back in freaking Mexico.


I don't want to hear that he is punishing China for bad trade policies.


I want to hear that the Trade Deficit is DOWN, and that jobs are rising.


I want concrete RESULTS.

A lower trade deficit does not mean more jobs.

Well, constantly HIGHER trade deficits have not been very helpful, so lets try the other thing.

It's false logic.

The other thing is probably worse.

It's why you learn in Econ 101 that trade restrictions reduce aggregate wealth.

 

[Toro]

They are more interested in punishing their own leaders than winning an election. They are more interested in tearing things down than building things up. So they nominated the guy most offensive to their leaders, a guy who is going to get smoked in the election. Then, they'll blame their leaders for not supporting him enough, even though he's clearly an unqualified buffoon.

No, we will blame them for actively working to sabotage our Candidate, as they have been doing and are openly discussing doing more so.

If you wanted something else, then your leaders should not have worked so hard to thwart the democratic primary process.

Or to support the lies, smears and panic mongering of the Left.

If - and I'm expecting when - Trump loses, it will be because he's an awful candidate. It will be his - and his supporters - who will be responsible and no one else's.

Hillary is a weak candidate, and could easily lose this election with a good candidate, but Trump is terrible.

Oh?

Are you claiming that all the efforts of the GOP establishment, and all the negative press of watching the GOP establishment support the smears of the Left and actively work to tear down their own candidate has had no effect?

The reason why there has been so much resistance is because he's a brutal candidate.

The last week has proven the establishment correct. Trump whining about the "Mexican" heritage of a judge in which he is involved in a civil suit has absolutely nothing to do with the establishment. That's Trump screwing up Trump. That's Trump not listening to the advice he is given. That's Trump debasing the Republican brand.

That has nothing to do with the establishment. That is all on Trump and his supporters who made him the nominee.

 

[Boss]

I had difficulty as well until I started putting two and two together. Conservatives were shut out once again by the same dunderheads who just HAD to support Romney and McCain because the establishment told them those were the candidates who could win. All the while, us telling them we needed a Conservative. They fucking insisted it was going to be McCain and then Romney. Two elections in a row, this same group of voters overwhelmingly threw their support to the establishment pick.... BUT.... Now that things have gone totally tits-up for the establishment, they crawdad over to Trump and again, reject the common sense Conservative. I guarantee you... MOST registered GOP Trump supporters voted for McCain and Romney in their primaries.

Here's the problem with this silly argument.

How was Romney "not" a conservative. 2012 Romney toed the line on every bit of Conservative Crazy you put out there. He was plenty conservative.

The real problem you guys had in 2012 was the Mitt Romney thought he was wearing magic underwear,and he was STILL less crazy than the other guys running.

The establishment tried its best to breathe life into Lying' Ted. Cruz should have challenged Trump's nonsense early on. He didn't. INstead he waited for Trump to implode so he could sweep up the malcontents he was building. Except, of course, he didn't.

MY argument is where those voters went who so strongly supported Mitt Romney in the primary. He was not the Conservative candidate, that was Rick Santorum. I realize you're too retarded to understand what a conservative is and it's easier for you to just assume all things republican are conservative. But most conservatives didn't consider Mittens a conservative. However, most republicans supported Mittens, that's how he won the nomination.

Now, it's true, the establishment did attempt, in the eleventh-hour, to try and feign support for Cruz in a failed effort to stave off Trump. If they had supported Ted Cruz back when he was filibustering the funding of Obamacare, maybe there wouldn't have ever been a Trump candidacy? But again... MY argument is not about what the establishment has done, who they've supported, or who is or isn't a true conservative. MY argument is the demographics of those who are supporting Trump. My contention is, it's the same idiots who supported Romney and McCain when everyone else was telling them they weren't conservatives and couldn't win the general.

 

[amrchaos]

Romney and McCains supporters have fought against Trump tooth and nail through this nomination process and many of them STILL oppose him. Bill Kristol the moron has been desperately trying to recruit a third partry conservative challenger to Trump - no success so far. Romney has been doing everything he can to help Kristol.

Do you have any clue of what the hell you are talking about or are you just another Glen Beck nutbag drone?

Nonsense. Romney and McCain got millions and millions of votes. They soundly defeated the conservative and all other contenders in their respective races. Now where did all those voters go in 2016? To Jeb Bush and Chris Christie? Nope... no one got those votes this time, they all went to Trump.

The bulk of Trump's supporters are the same people who insisted we nominate Romney and McCain.

I agree with you that conservatives are not supporting Trump. But the moderates are not supporting Trump either. There is a third faction that is actually smaller than either the conservatives or moderates that consolidated behind Trump to help propelled him to the front.

Remember, at the beginning, the republican primary had several moderate and conservative candidates, but the votes were split between them. However Turn support was around 12% and did not grow until candidates started dropping out.

There is a group of right wingers--not moderates nor conservatives--that form the core of ump supporters.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

We need to define "conservatism" and "the establishment."

It seems to mean something different to every poster on here

 

[Correll]

To the last point, as to why?


For the Right, imo, blind ideology.

For the Left, contributions from big business and a knowledge that poor and afraid workers are more likely to want big government to help them than well off and secure workers.

How is getting the government to protect them from foreign competition not the government helping them?

That's not what lefties think of when they think of government helping.

THey want thousands of government bureaucrats, all union members paying dues that partial go to support dem candidates, working in ever larger departments, working with desperate people, making sure that those people know that the government is helping them,

Maybe with some nice strings attached to give the bureaucrats some power over them,


And the bigger the better.

 

[Correll]

To get a little more specific here (okay, and to bump the thread, guilty), as I understand it the reason you're mad at the establishment is that you would elect people who say they're conservative, but then don't act as conservative as you want them to when they're in office. Okay, I do get that.

So it appears to be about frustration over elected Republican officials not being conservative enough.

So in response, you run a guy who would certainly be considered a RINO if it were not for his (insert adjective here, I'm out of them) behavior.

That's the disconnect that I'm asking about.
.

YOur understanding is flawed.

This issue is not that they are not conservative enough, it is that they have not accomplished their stated agenda enough.


THey have become comfortable in their secure jobs, and focusing on the PROCESS of governing, not on the results.


Our interests are NOT being represented.


Trumps sounds like he is serious about getting these things DONE.

I don't think his plan is to give the appearance of working on the problem. I think he wants to actually SOLVE the problems.


I don't want to hear that deportations are UP.

I want to hear that the Illegal population is DOWN or back in freaking Mexico.


I don't want to hear that he is punishing China for bad trade policies.


I want to hear that the Trade Deficit is DOWN, and that jobs are rising.


I want concrete RESULTS.

A lower trade deficit does not mean more jobs.

Well, constantly HIGHER trade deficits have not been very helpful, so lets try the other thing.

It's false logic.

The other thing is probably worse.

It's why you learn in Econ 101 that trade restrictions reduce aggregate wealth.

What about Unfair and Predatory Trade? Is that good for Aggregate Wealth? Or Working CLass Americans? Or Middle Class Americans?

The last 30 years does has NOT gone as Free Trade Ideology said it would.

 

[g5000]

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he supported the impeachment of George Bush.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he wanted to cut and run from Iraq.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he said he is "very pro-choice".

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he supports an Assault Weapons Ban.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he supports single payer health care.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he and his entire family donated to all of Hillary's campaigns.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he funded the DNC Chairman's run for the governor of Virginia.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he said Bill Clinton was a great President.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he said Hillary Clinton would make a great President.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he said Hillary Clinton was the best Secretary of State ever.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he runs a string of casinos which prey on the middle class and the poor.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he is a serial adulterer.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that his budget plan has the highest deficits of all 19 candidates, save Bernie Sanders's plan!

In short, to bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to have seven pounds of brain damage.

 

[Correll]

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he supported the impeachment of George Bush.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he wanted to cut and run from Iraq.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he said he is "very pro-choice".

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he supports an Assault Weapons Ban.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he supports single payer health care.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he and his entire family donated to all of Hillary's campaigns.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he funded the DNC Chairman's run for the governor of Virginia.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he said Bill Clinton was a great President.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he said Hillary Clinton would make a great President.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he said Hillary Clinton was the best Secretary of State ever.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he runs a string of casinos which prey on the middle class and the poor.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that he is a serial adulterer.

To bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to blank out of your mind that his budget plan has the highest deficits of all 19 candidates, save Bernie Sanders's plan!

In short, to bleev Trump is a Republican conservative, you have to have seven pounds of brain damage.

He believes in America First.

To the Left that is heresy.

To the Right that is Common Sense.

Except to the Free Trade Ideologues who want to follow Ideology even if it is not working for America or Americans.

Or the Country Club Republicans who want to get along with their fellow Congressmen on the other side of the aisle.

 

[JoeB131]

MY argument is where those voters went who so strongly supported Mitt Romney in the primary. He was not the Conservative candidate, that was Rick Santorum. I realize you're too retarded to understand what a conservative is and it's easier for you to just assume all things republican are conservative. But most conservatives didn't consider Mittens a conservative. However, most republicans supported Mittens, that's how he won the nomination.

Except that the voices of conservatism didn't support Santorum outside of the Crazy Religious Right. The NeoCons, Talk Radio, the Koch Brothers and such all got behind the Romney. The reason why the Religious Right supported Santorum was because Romney was a Mormon, not because of ideological differences. If you look at all the states Santorum won, they were all states where the SBC dominated.

Now, it's true, the establishment did attempt, in the eleventh-hour, to try and feign support for Cruz in a failed effort to stave off Trump. If they had supported Ted Cruz back when he was filibustering the funding of Obamacare, maybe there wouldn't have ever been a Trump candidacy? But again... MY argument is not about what the establishment has done, who they've supported, or who is or isn't a true conservative. MY argument is the demographics of those who are supporting Trump. My contention is, it's the same idiots who supported Romney and McCain when everyone else was telling them they weren't conservatives and couldn't win the general.

So let me get this straight. McCain and Romney won't support Trump, but the people who voted for them will? Is this your argument.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Nonsense. Romney and McCain got millions and millions of votes. They soundly defeated the conservative and all other contenders in their respective races. Now where did all those voters go in 2016? To Jeb Bush and Chris Christie? Nope... no one got those votes this time, they all went to Trump.

I agree with you that conservatives are not supporting Trump. But the moderates are not supporting Trump either.

Well, I guess that means that NO ONE IS SUPPORTING Trump.

He must have won the nomination with the largest vote count in the history of GOP primaries by some kind of CONSPIRACY, since NO ONE VOTED FOR HIM!

roflmao

 

[JimBowie1958]

They are more interested in punishing their own leaders than winning an election. They are more interested in tearing things down than building things up. So they nominated the guy most offensive to their leaders, a guy who is going to get smoked in the election. Then, they'll blame their leaders for not supporting him enough, even though he's clearly an unqualified buffoon.

No, we will blame them for actively working to sabotage our Candidate, as they have been doing and are openly discussing doing more so.

If you wanted something else, then your leaders should not have worked so hard to thwart the democratic primary process.

Or to support the lies, smears and panic mongering of the Left.

If - and I'm expecting when - Trump loses, it will be because he's an awful candidate. It will be his - and his supporters - who will be responsible and no one else's.

Hillary is a weak candidate, and could easily lose this election with a good candidate, but Trump is terrible.

Oh?

Are you claiming that all the efforts of the GOP establishment, and all the negative press of watching the GOP establishment support the smears of the Left and actively work to tear down their own candidate has had no effect?

The reason why there has been so much resistance is because he's a brutal candidate.

The last week has proven the establishment correct. Trump whining about the "Mexican" heritage of a judge in which he is involved in a civil suit has absolutely nothing to do with the establishment. That's Trump screwing up Trump. That's Trump not listening to the advice he is given. That's Trump debasing the Republican brand.

That has nothing to do with the establishment. That is all on Trump and his supporters who made him the nominee.

The Hispanic American judge is a member of the la Raza movement and it has a history of fascism and racism associated with it.
CDZ - The Hidden History of the La Raza or Chicano Movement

Trump has every right to an impartial judge even if it harshes you sensibilities to be PC.

 

[ogibillm]

They are more interested in punishing their own leaders than winning an election. They are more interested in tearing things down than building things up. So they nominated the guy most offensive to their leaders, a guy who is going to get smoked in the election. Then, they'll blame their leaders for not supporting him enough, even though he's clearly an unqualified buffoon.

No, we will blame them for actively working to sabotage our Candidate, as they have been doing and are openly discussing doing more so.

If you wanted something else, then your leaders should not have worked so hard to thwart the democratic primary process.

Or to support the lies, smears and panic mongering of the Left.

If - and I'm expecting when - Trump loses, it will be because he's an awful candidate. It will be his - and his supporters - who will be responsible and no one else's.

Hillary is a weak candidate, and could easily lose this election with a good candidate, but Trump is terrible.

Oh?

Are you claiming that all the efforts of the GOP establishment, and all the negative press of watching the GOP establishment support the smears of the Left and actively work to tear down their own candidate has had no effect?

The reason why there has been so much resistance is because he's a brutal candidate.

The last week has proven the establishment correct. Trump whining about the "Mexican" heritage of a judge in which he is involved in a civil suit has absolutely nothing to do with the establishment. That's Trump screwing up Trump. That's Trump not listening to the advice he is given. That's Trump debasing the Republican brand.

That has nothing to do with the establishment. That is all on Trump and his supporters who made him the nominee.

The Hispanic American judge is a member of the la Raza movement and it has a history of fascism and racism associated with it.
CDZ - The Hidden History of the La Raza or Chicano Movement

Trump has every right to an impartial judge even if it harshes you sensibilities to be PC.

the judge is a member of a professional networking organization.

 

[JimBowie1958]

the judge is a member of a professional networking organization.

that is also a racist organization.

You think the two things cannot go together?

Suppose a group of whites only lawyers legal association only supported aid and legal assistance to white people.

Would you consider that racist?

Would you think that minorities could get a fair hearing from a judge in such a group?

 

[ogibillm]

the judge is a member of a professional networking organization.

that is also a racist organization.

There is nothing racist about it

 

[JimBowie1958]

the judge is a member of a professional networking organization.

that is also a racist organization.

There is nothing racist about it

Yes, there is.
CDZ - The Hidden History of the La Raza or Chicano Movement

Jose Vasconcelos shown to be a Nazi collaborator in a Life magazine article, and he is the founding intellectual of la Raza.
LIFE

 

[Silhouette]

To get a little more specific here (okay, and to bump the thread, guilty), as I understand it the reason you're mad at the establishment is that you would elect people who say they're conservative, but then don't act as conservative as you want them to when they're in office. Okay, I do get that.

So it appears to be about frustration over elected Republican officials not being conservative enough.

So in response, you run a guy who would certainly be considered a RINO if it were not for his (insert adjective here, I'm out of them) behavior.

That's the disconnect that I'm asking about.
.

It might help to understand that I just saw a poll that says 20% of Trump's supporters never graduated high school. And what they did muddle through, I'm sure didn't include a course in deductive logical reasoning.

 

[JimBowie1958]

To get a little more specific here (okay, and to bump the thread, guilty), as I understand it the reason you're mad at the establishment is that you would elect people who say they're conservative, but then don't act as conservative as you want them to when they're in office. Okay, I do get that.

So it appears to be about frustration over elected Republican officials not being conservative enough.

So in response, you run a guy who would certainly be considered a RINO if it were not for his (insert adjective here, I'm out of them) behavior.

That's the disconnect that I'm asking about.
.

It might help to understand that I just saw a poll that says 20% of Trump's supporters never graduated high school. And what they did muddle through, I'm sure didn't include a course in deductive logical reasoning.

But the liberals have already drawn the conclusion that nobody voted for Trump, so you have to be in error here.

Dont high school drop outs deserve their fair share of the pie too, or are you just an elitist NR minion who says Middle Class white Americans should all die off?

And what is the percentage of graduates of Hillary Clinton supporters?