Was Trump Wiretapped? Just the facts.

[2aguy]

So far there is no evidence indicating any such thing.

Kind of what I thought but there is so much smoke, everyone is running around screaming and having hysterics. Like to know if there is any actual evidence yet.

Note: claims of a massive Obama administration and news media conspiracy to dethrone Trump do not constitute evidence...

The Trump Administration needs to declassify the evidence and release it, if they have seen the evidence that Obama ordered Trump Tower to be wiretapped, then they need to publicly release the evidence of this.

Again I'll ask... if there is classified evidence then wouldn't trump tweeting about it be a crime? If not then please explain how

No....the President gets to make the decision as to what is or isn't classified.....

 

[OldLady]

No spin. No smoke and mirrors. No conjecture. Was he wire tapped? If that can't be answered everything else is Conspiracy Theory material of attempting to create links between unrelated incidents.

At this point, it see - the whole wire-tap claim is unsubstantiated and taking on the guise of a conspiracy theory.

From: Analysis | Donald Trump was a conspiracy-theory candidate. Now he’s on the edge of being a conspiracy-theory president.

The problem here, of course, is that what Levin — and Breitbart — use as evidence for these claims are a series of seemingly unconnected events — from FISA court requests to Trump joking about the Russia email hack, to the release of Hillary Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta’s emails in the fall. The proof that all — or any — of these events are tied together by actual facts as opposed to supposition is not offered.


The idea that Obama’s administration authorized — and was able to get approval for — the wiretapping of the opposition party’s candidate for president is, frankly, far-fetched. And, if someone is making that claim — as Trump is now doing — the burden of proof is on them. If you are going to say there is a grand conspiracy that only you and a handful of others see, you need to offer a step-by-step explanation to the broader public to show why you’re right.


It seems unlikely — given Trump’s past pattern of making baseless claims without proof and then simply insisting he is right and no evidence is needed to prove the point — that any meaningful effort will be made by the Trump administration to connect the dots on this alleged wiretapping conspiracy.​

From the LA Times: Citing no evidence, Trump accuses Obama of tapping his phones during the election

It would be highly unusual for a sitting president to be aware of such [surveillance] requests. By blaming Obama directly, Trump accused the former president of reaching into a federal investigation and signing off on an illegal wiretap, which is a felony.


If federal investigators did monitor Trump’s phones or computers lawfully, a court would have demanded information about potential criminal misconduct or unlawful foreign contacts. Such investigations are closely held and rarely, if ever, shared with the White House.


It is possible Trump has no evidence his phones were tapped and is repeating unfounded reports circulating in conservative media circles. ​

There is a lot of smoke, mirrors and redirection going on here, an attempt I'm sure, to distract from the demands for an investigation into Russian ties with the Trump campaign.

Rather than blowing this up into a full blown conspiracy theory, how about looking at actual evidence?

First question to answer is: is there any hard evidence that Trump Tower was indeed wire tapped? If we can't answer that, the rest is meaningless distraction.

From the Washington Post: Analysis | Trump’s ‘evidence’ for Obama wiretap claims relies on sketchy, anonymously sourced reports

Trump’s ‘evidence’ for Obama wiretap claims relies on sketchy, anonymously sourced reports

Brietbart article on FISA Requests: June & October. Breitbart based it's article entirely on one source: and article written by Louise Mensch, a former Tory member of the British Parliament and an independent journalist for Heat Street. But no one seems to be able to independently confirm the claim.

The Washington Post for months has sought to confirm this report of a FISA warrant related to the Trump campaign but has been unable to do so. Presumably other U.S. news organizations have tried to do so as well. So one has to take this claim with a huge dose of skepticism. Indeed, the New York Times reported before the election that the FBI “ultimately concluded that there could be an innocuous explanation, like a marketing email or spam, for the computer contacts” with the Russian banks.​

According to the WP article:

The White House provided three other sources. Two, a National Review article and a Fox News interview, are simply derivative of the Heat Street article, with no independent confirmation. The third is a New York Times report that intelligence agencies “are examining intercepted communications and financial transactions” as part of a probe of possible links between Russian officials and Trump campaign aides. (We recall the president has previously deemed Times reporting on this matter as “fake news.”)​

The article goes on to conclude:

Only two articles, both with British roots, have reported that a FISA court order was granted in October to examine possible activity between two Russian banks and a computer server in the Trump Tower. This claim has not been confirmed by a U.S. news organizations. Moreover, neither article says President Obama requested the order or that it resulted in the tapping of Trump’s phone lines.​

And lastly:

Moreover, the articles do not support the White House’s claim that these were “potentially politically motivated investigations” led by President Obama. The articles all suggest the FISA requests — if they happened — were done by the intelligence agencies and the FBI.​

So, before we have this huge political uproar, and immediate comparisons to Watergate, lets' get at the facts first. Can anyone answer these questions?

1. Was Trump wiretapped? If yes - what evidence? Were bugs found in Trump Tower?

2. Were FISA requests issued? If yes - can the claims be confirmed by more then one source and for what specifically were they for?

Until those are answered - there's nothing but smoke.

The same could be said for all these people saying that Trump is an Agent of Putin, they have produced no evidence, yet the MSM has no problem accusing Trump of this 24/7.

How about actual concrete evidence is publicly presented to show that Trump is an Agent of Putin?

Now that the table is turned on Obama and The Obama Administration the media whores are outraged at the suggestion that Obama had Trump Tower wiretapped during an Election.

Not one of these media whores has written or stated that if Obama did have Trump Tower wiretapped that would be a very disturbing development and would be on par with the wiretapping of The Watergate Building.

The problem is the cheerleading and hysterically anti-Trump media think that Obama can do no wrong, and if it is shown that Obama did have Trump Tower wiretapped, they will spin it so they can attempt to help him all they can.

Could Obama who ordered American citizens to be Droned also order the illegal wiretapping for political purposes of Trump Tower? Yes many think he could.

It is amazing that when the accusations against Trump about the Russians are talked about in the democrat controlled press...they never say there is no evidence supporting the accusation...

But in every freaking story about Trump saying he was wire tapped...the first thing they lead with is that Trump has put out no evidence...

The double standard is mind blowing.......

I have heard over and over that there has been absolutely no evidence of any wrong doing by Trump's campaign staff or administration so far. I hear that all the time on CNN, in the paper, etc. I agree there's a lot of Dems blowing smoke right now, but if you haven't heard the truth, it's because your ears are mysteriously not hearing what is actually being said.

 

[yiostheoy]

No spin. No smoke and mirrors. No conjecture. Was he wire tapped? If that can't be answered everything else is Conspiracy Theory material of attempting to create links between unrelated incidents.

At this point, it see - the whole wire-tap claim is unsubstantiated and taking on the guise of a conspiracy theory.

From: Analysis | Donald Trump was a conspiracy-theory candidate. Now he’s on the edge of being a conspiracy-theory president.

The problem here, of course, is that what Levin — and Breitbart — use as evidence for these claims are a series of seemingly unconnected events — from FISA court requests to Trump joking about the Russia email hack, to the release of Hillary Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta’s emails in the fall. The proof that all — or any — of these events are tied together by actual facts as opposed to supposition is not offered.


The idea that Obama’s administration authorized — and was able to get approval for — the wiretapping of the opposition party’s candidate for president is, frankly, far-fetched. And, if someone is making that claim — as Trump is now doing — the burden of proof is on them. If you are going to say there is a grand conspiracy that only you and a handful of others see, you need to offer a step-by-step explanation to the broader public to show why you’re right.


It seems unlikely — given Trump’s past pattern of making baseless claims without proof and then simply insisting he is right and no evidence is needed to prove the point — that any meaningful effort will be made by the Trump administration to connect the dots on this alleged wiretapping conspiracy.​

From the LA Times: Citing no evidence, Trump accuses Obama of tapping his phones during the election

It would be highly unusual for a sitting president to be aware of such [surveillance] requests. By blaming Obama directly, Trump accused the former president of reaching into a federal investigation and signing off on an illegal wiretap, which is a felony.


If federal investigators did monitor Trump’s phones or computers lawfully, a court would have demanded information about potential criminal misconduct or unlawful foreign contacts. Such investigations are closely held and rarely, if ever, shared with the White House.


It is possible Trump has no evidence his phones were tapped and is repeating unfounded reports circulating in conservative media circles. ​

There is a lot of smoke, mirrors and redirection going on here, an attempt I'm sure, to distract from the demands for an investigation into Russian ties with the Trump campaign.

Rather than blowing this up into a full blown conspiracy theory, how about looking at actual evidence?

First question to answer is: is there any hard evidence that Trump Tower was indeed wire tapped? If we can't answer that, the rest is meaningless distraction.

From the Washington Post: Analysis | Trump’s ‘evidence’ for Obama wiretap claims relies on sketchy, anonymously sourced reports

Trump’s ‘evidence’ for Obama wiretap claims relies on sketchy, anonymously sourced reports

Brietbart article on FISA Requests: June & October. Breitbart based it's article entirely on one source: and article written by Louise Mensch, a former Tory member of the British Parliament and an independent journalist for Heat Street. But no one seems to be able to independently confirm the claim.

The Washington Post for months has sought to confirm this report of a FISA warrant related to the Trump campaign but has been unable to do so. Presumably other U.S. news organizations have tried to do so as well. So one has to take this claim with a huge dose of skepticism. Indeed, the New York Times reported before the election that the FBI “ultimately concluded that there could be an innocuous explanation, like a marketing email or spam, for the computer contacts” with the Russian banks.​

According to the WP article:

The White House provided three other sources. Two, a National Review article and a Fox News interview, are simply derivative of the Heat Street article, with no independent confirmation. The third is a New York Times report that intelligence agencies “are examining intercepted communications and financial transactions” as part of a probe of possible links between Russian officials and Trump campaign aides. (We recall the president has previously deemed Times reporting on this matter as “fake news.”)​

The article goes on to conclude:

Only two articles, both with British roots, have reported that a FISA court order was granted in October to examine possible activity between two Russian banks and a computer server in the Trump Tower. This claim has not been confirmed by a U.S. news organizations. Moreover, neither article says President Obama requested the order or that it resulted in the tapping of Trump’s phone lines.​

And lastly:

Moreover, the articles do not support the White House’s claim that these were “potentially politically motivated investigations” led by President Obama. The articles all suggest the FISA requests — if they happened — were done by the intelligence agencies and the FBI.​

So, before we have this huge political uproar, and immediate comparisons to Watergate, lets' get at the facts first. Can anyone answer these questions?

1. Was Trump wiretapped? If yes - what evidence? Were bugs found in Trump Tower?

2. Were FISA requests issued? If yes - can the claims be confirmed by more then one source and for what specifically were they for?

Until those are answered - there's nothing but smoke.

James Clapper answered it all this morning on Meet The Press --

... there was NO wiretapping of Trump Towers at any time by anyone anywhere on Clapper's watch.

Trump pulled this all out of his azz.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

No spin. No smoke and mirrors. No conjecture. Was he wire tapped? If that can't be answered everything else is Conspiracy Theory material of attempting to create links between unrelated incidents.

At this point, it see - the whole wire-tap claim is unsubstantiated and taking on the guise of a conspiracy theory.

From: Analysis | Donald Trump was a conspiracy-theory candidate. Now he’s on the edge of being a conspiracy-theory president.

The problem here, of course, is that what Levin — and Breitbart — use as evidence for these claims are a series of seemingly unconnected events — from FISA court requests to Trump joking about the Russia email hack, to the release of Hillary Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta’s emails in the fall. The proof that all — or any — of these events are tied together by actual facts as opposed to supposition is not offered.


The idea that Obama’s administration authorized — and was able to get approval for — the wiretapping of the opposition party’s candidate for president is, frankly, far-fetched. And, if someone is making that claim — as Trump is now doing — the burden of proof is on them. If you are going to say there is a grand conspiracy that only you and a handful of others see, you need to offer a step-by-step explanation to the broader public to show why you’re right.


It seems unlikely — given Trump’s past pattern of making baseless claims without proof and then simply insisting he is right and no evidence is needed to prove the point — that any meaningful effort will be made by the Trump administration to connect the dots on this alleged wiretapping conspiracy.​

From the LA Times: Citing no evidence, Trump accuses Obama of tapping his phones during the election

It would be highly unusual for a sitting president to be aware of such [surveillance] requests. By blaming Obama directly, Trump accused the former president of reaching into a federal investigation and signing off on an illegal wiretap, which is a felony.


If federal investigators did monitor Trump’s phones or computers lawfully, a court would have demanded information about potential criminal misconduct or unlawful foreign contacts. Such investigations are closely held and rarely, if ever, shared with the White House.


It is possible Trump has no evidence his phones were tapped and is repeating unfounded reports circulating in conservative media circles. ​

There is a lot of smoke, mirrors and redirection going on here, an attempt I'm sure, to distract from the demands for an investigation into Russian ties with the Trump campaign.

Rather than blowing this up into a full blown conspiracy theory, how about looking at actual evidence?

First question to answer is: is there any hard evidence that Trump Tower was indeed wire tapped? If we can't answer that, the rest is meaningless distraction.

From the Washington Post: Analysis | Trump’s ‘evidence’ for Obama wiretap claims relies on sketchy, anonymously sourced reports

Trump’s ‘evidence’ for Obama wiretap claims relies on sketchy, anonymously sourced reports

Brietbart article on FISA Requests: June & October. Breitbart based it's article entirely on one source: and article written by Louise Mensch, a former Tory member of the British Parliament and an independent journalist for Heat Street. But no one seems to be able to independently confirm the claim.

The Washington Post for months has sought to confirm this report of a FISA warrant related to the Trump campaign but has been unable to do so. Presumably other U.S. news organizations have tried to do so as well. So one has to take this claim with a huge dose of skepticism. Indeed, the New York Times reported before the election that the FBI “ultimately concluded that there could be an innocuous explanation, like a marketing email or spam, for the computer contacts” with the Russian banks.​

According to the WP article:

The White House provided three other sources. Two, a National Review article and a Fox News interview, are simply derivative of the Heat Street article, with no independent confirmation. The third is a New York Times report that intelligence agencies “are examining intercepted communications and financial transactions” as part of a probe of possible links between Russian officials and Trump campaign aides. (We recall the president has previously deemed Times reporting on this matter as “fake news.”)​

The article goes on to conclude:

Only two articles, both with British roots, have reported that a FISA court order was granted in October to examine possible activity between two Russian banks and a computer server in the Trump Tower. This claim has not been confirmed by a U.S. news organizations. Moreover, neither article says President Obama requested the order or that it resulted in the tapping of Trump’s phone lines.​

And lastly:

Moreover, the articles do not support the White House’s claim that these were “potentially politically motivated investigations” led by President Obama. The articles all suggest the FISA requests — if they happened — were done by the intelligence agencies and the FBI.​

So, before we have this huge political uproar, and immediate comparisons to Watergate, lets' get at the facts first. Can anyone answer these questions?

1. Was Trump wiretapped? If yes - what evidence? Were bugs found in Trump Tower?

2. Were FISA requests issued? If yes - can the claims be confirmed by more then one source and for what specifically were they for?

Until those are answered - there's nothing but smoke.

The same could be said for all these people saying that Trump is an Agent of Putin, they have produced no evidence, yet the MSM has no problem accusing Trump of this 24/7.

How about actual concrete evidence is publicly presented to show that Trump is an Agent of Putin?

Now that the table is turned on Obama and The Obama Administration the media whores are outraged at the suggestion that Obama had Trump Tower wiretapped during an Election.

Not one of these media whores has written or stated that if Obama did have Trump Tower wiretapped that would be a very disturbing development and would be on par with the wiretapping of The Watergate Building.

The problem is the cheerleading and hysterically anti-Trump media think that Obama can do no wrong, and if it is shown that Obama did have Trump Tower wiretapped, they will spin it so they can attempt to help him all they can.

Could Obama who ordered American citizens to be Droned also order the illegal wiretapping for political purposes of Trump Tower? Yes many think he could.

Not one of these media whores has written or stated that if Obama did have Trump Tower wiretapped that would be a very disturbing development and would be on par with the wiretapping of The Watergate Building.
Actually, Lucy, ALL the media has been saying exactly that. They are quite clear that it would be a massive scandal and that it is an extremely serious accusation. Maybe your news sources on that side of the pond are different, but it's ALL I've been hearing.
Btw, since the White House has officially declined to offer any further comment until an investigation is completed, and since no one knows what in hell the President is talking about so how do you investigate it, don't be holding your breath waiting for any closure on this.

Whoever is the President can declassify information and it can be released publicly, which is why I commented that whatever The Trump Administration has seen that says that The Obama Administration had Trump Tower wiretapped this should be declassified and released publicly.

I don't think doing that would affect any investigation, or perhaps it would, I'll have to read up if it would or wouldn't.

 

[Ame®icano]

So far there is no evidence indicating any such thing.

Intercepted Russian Communications Part of Inquiry Into Trump Associates

"intercepted communications"

 

[2aguy]

No spin. No smoke and mirrors. No conjecture. Was he wire tapped? If that can't be answered everything else is Conspiracy Theory material of attempting to create links between unrelated incidents.

At this point, it see - the whole wire-tap claim is unsubstantiated and taking on the guise of a conspiracy theory.

From: Analysis | Donald Trump was a conspiracy-theory candidate. Now he’s on the edge of being a conspiracy-theory president.

The problem here, of course, is that what Levin — and Breitbart — use as evidence for these claims are a series of seemingly unconnected events — from FISA court requests to Trump joking about the Russia email hack, to the release of Hillary Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta’s emails in the fall. The proof that all — or any — of these events are tied together by actual facts as opposed to supposition is not offered.


The idea that Obama’s administration authorized — and was able to get approval for — the wiretapping of the opposition party’s candidate for president is, frankly, far-fetched. And, if someone is making that claim — as Trump is now doing — the burden of proof is on them. If you are going to say there is a grand conspiracy that only you and a handful of others see, you need to offer a step-by-step explanation to the broader public to show why you’re right.


It seems unlikely — given Trump’s past pattern of making baseless claims without proof and then simply insisting he is right and no evidence is needed to prove the point — that any meaningful effort will be made by the Trump administration to connect the dots on this alleged wiretapping conspiracy.​

From the LA Times: Citing no evidence, Trump accuses Obama of tapping his phones during the election

It would be highly unusual for a sitting president to be aware of such [surveillance] requests. By blaming Obama directly, Trump accused the former president of reaching into a federal investigation and signing off on an illegal wiretap, which is a felony.


If federal investigators did monitor Trump’s phones or computers lawfully, a court would have demanded information about potential criminal misconduct or unlawful foreign contacts. Such investigations are closely held and rarely, if ever, shared with the White House.


It is possible Trump has no evidence his phones were tapped and is repeating unfounded reports circulating in conservative media circles. ​

There is a lot of smoke, mirrors and redirection going on here, an attempt I'm sure, to distract from the demands for an investigation into Russian ties with the Trump campaign.

Rather than blowing this up into a full blown conspiracy theory, how about looking at actual evidence?

First question to answer is: is there any hard evidence that Trump Tower was indeed wire tapped? If we can't answer that, the rest is meaningless distraction.

From the Washington Post: Analysis | Trump’s ‘evidence’ for Obama wiretap claims relies on sketchy, anonymously sourced reports

Trump’s ‘evidence’ for Obama wiretap claims relies on sketchy, anonymously sourced reports

Brietbart article on FISA Requests: June & October. Breitbart based it's article entirely on one source: and article written by Louise Mensch, a former Tory member of the British Parliament and an independent journalist for Heat Street. But no one seems to be able to independently confirm the claim.

The Washington Post for months has sought to confirm this report of a FISA warrant related to the Trump campaign but has been unable to do so. Presumably other U.S. news organizations have tried to do so as well. So one has to take this claim with a huge dose of skepticism. Indeed, the New York Times reported before the election that the FBI “ultimately concluded that there could be an innocuous explanation, like a marketing email or spam, for the computer contacts” with the Russian banks.​

According to the WP article:

The White House provided three other sources. Two, a National Review article and a Fox News interview, are simply derivative of the Heat Street article, with no independent confirmation. The third is a New York Times report that intelligence agencies “are examining intercepted communications and financial transactions” as part of a probe of possible links between Russian officials and Trump campaign aides. (We recall the president has previously deemed Times reporting on this matter as “fake news.”)​

The article goes on to conclude:

Only two articles, both with British roots, have reported that a FISA court order was granted in October to examine possible activity between two Russian banks and a computer server in the Trump Tower. This claim has not been confirmed by a U.S. news organizations. Moreover, neither article says President Obama requested the order or that it resulted in the tapping of Trump’s phone lines.​

And lastly:

Moreover, the articles do not support the White House’s claim that these were “potentially politically motivated investigations” led by President Obama. The articles all suggest the FISA requests — if they happened — were done by the intelligence agencies and the FBI.​

So, before we have this huge political uproar, and immediate comparisons to Watergate, lets' get at the facts first. Can anyone answer these questions?

1. Was Trump wiretapped? If yes - what evidence? Were bugs found in Trump Tower?

2. Were FISA requests issued? If yes - can the claims be confirmed by more then one source and for what specifically were they for?

Until those are answered - there's nothing but smoke.

The same could be said for all these people saying that Trump is an Agent of Putin, they have produced no evidence, yet the MSM has no problem accusing Trump of this 24/7.

How about actual concrete evidence is publicly presented to show that Trump is an Agent of Putin?

Now that the table is turned on Obama and The Obama Administration the media whores are outraged at the suggestion that Obama had Trump Tower wiretapped during an Election.

Not one of these media whores has written or stated that if Obama did have Trump Tower wiretapped that would be a very disturbing development and would be on par with the wiretapping of The Watergate Building.

The problem is the cheerleading and hysterically anti-Trump media think that Obama can do no wrong, and if it is shown that Obama did have Trump Tower wiretapped, they will spin it so they can attempt to help him all they can.

Could Obama who ordered American citizens to be Droned also order the illegal wiretapping for political purposes of Trump Tower? Yes many think he could.

It is amazing that when the accusations against Trump about the Russians are talked about in the democrat controlled press...they never say there is no evidence supporting the accusation...

But in every freaking story about Trump saying he was wire tapped...the first thing they lead with is that Trump has put out no evidence...

The double standard is mind blowing.......

Flynn got fired, that's enough hard evidence to justify the questions. How can you deny that?

Yeah.....I don't have to deny it...he did nothing wrong...there was nothing he did that was illegal......or in question. There is, however, the fact that his name was released which is a violation of his rights under our laws........

 

[Darkwind]

So far there is no evidence indicating any such thing.

Kind of what I thought but there is so much smoke, everyone is running around screaming and having hysterics. Like to know if there is any actual evidence yet.

Note: claims of a massive Obama administration and news media conspiracy to dethrone Trump do not constitute evidence...

The Trump Administration needs to declassify the evidence and release it, if they have seen the evidence that Obama ordered Trump Tower to be wiretapped, then they need to publicly release the evidence of this.

Again I'll ask... if there is classified evidence then wouldn't trump tweeting about it be a crime? If not then please explain how

What evidence did he tweet? He made an unsubstantiated accusation. That is not a violation of classified information.

 

[yiostheoy]

So far there is no evidence indicating any such thing.

Not only is there no evidence, but Clapper came right out and said it never happened.

 

[Coyote]

No spin. No smoke and mirrors. No conjecture. Was he wire tapped? If that can't be answered everything else is Conspiracy Theory material of attempting to create links between unrelated incidents.

At this point, it see - the whole wire-tap claim is unsubstantiated and taking on the guise of a conspiracy theory.

From: Analysis | Donald Trump was a conspiracy-theory candidate. Now he’s on the edge of being a conspiracy-theory president.

The problem here, of course, is that what Levin — and Breitbart — use as evidence for these claims are a series of seemingly unconnected events — from FISA court requests to Trump joking about the Russia email hack, to the release of Hillary Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta’s emails in the fall. The proof that all — or any — of these events are tied together by actual facts as opposed to supposition is not offered.


The idea that Obama’s administration authorized — and was able to get approval for — the wiretapping of the opposition party’s candidate for president is, frankly, far-fetched. And, if someone is making that claim — as Trump is now doing — the burden of proof is on them. If you are going to say there is a grand conspiracy that only you and a handful of others see, you need to offer a step-by-step explanation to the broader public to show why you’re right.


It seems unlikely — given Trump’s past pattern of making baseless claims without proof and then simply insisting he is right and no evidence is needed to prove the point — that any meaningful effort will be made by the Trump administration to connect the dots on this alleged wiretapping conspiracy.​

From the LA Times: Citing no evidence, Trump accuses Obama of tapping his phones during the election

It would be highly unusual for a sitting president to be aware of such [surveillance] requests. By blaming Obama directly, Trump accused the former president of reaching into a federal investigation and signing off on an illegal wiretap, which is a felony.


If federal investigators did monitor Trump’s phones or computers lawfully, a court would have demanded information about potential criminal misconduct or unlawful foreign contacts. Such investigations are closely held and rarely, if ever, shared with the White House.


It is possible Trump has no evidence his phones were tapped and is repeating unfounded reports circulating in conservative media circles. ​

There is a lot of smoke, mirrors and redirection going on here, an attempt I'm sure, to distract from the demands for an investigation into Russian ties with the Trump campaign.

Rather than blowing this up into a full blown conspiracy theory, how about looking at actual evidence?

First question to answer is: is there any hard evidence that Trump Tower was indeed wire tapped? If we can't answer that, the rest is meaningless distraction.

From the Washington Post: Analysis | Trump’s ‘evidence’ for Obama wiretap claims relies on sketchy, anonymously sourced reports

Trump’s ‘evidence’ for Obama wiretap claims relies on sketchy, anonymously sourced reports

Brietbart article on FISA Requests: June & October. Breitbart based it's article entirely on one source: and article written by Louise Mensch, a former Tory member of the British Parliament and an independent journalist for Heat Street. But no one seems to be able to independently confirm the claim.

The Washington Post for months has sought to confirm this report of a FISA warrant related to the Trump campaign but has been unable to do so. Presumably other U.S. news organizations have tried to do so as well. So one has to take this claim with a huge dose of skepticism. Indeed, the New York Times reported before the election that the FBI “ultimately concluded that there could be an innocuous explanation, like a marketing email or spam, for the computer contacts” with the Russian banks.​

According to the WP article:

The White House provided three other sources. Two, a National Review article and a Fox News interview, are simply derivative of the Heat Street article, with no independent confirmation. The third is a New York Times report that intelligence agencies “are examining intercepted communications and financial transactions” as part of a probe of possible links between Russian officials and Trump campaign aides. (We recall the president has previously deemed Times reporting on this matter as “fake news.”)​

The article goes on to conclude:

Only two articles, both with British roots, have reported that a FISA court order was granted in October to examine possible activity between two Russian banks and a computer server in the Trump Tower. This claim has not been confirmed by a U.S. news organizations. Moreover, neither article says President Obama requested the order or that it resulted in the tapping of Trump’s phone lines.​

And lastly:

Moreover, the articles do not support the White House’s claim that these were “potentially politically motivated investigations” led by President Obama. The articles all suggest the FISA requests — if they happened — were done by the intelligence agencies and the FBI.​

So, before we have this huge political uproar, and immediate comparisons to Watergate, lets' get at the facts first. Can anyone answer these questions?

1. Was Trump wiretapped? If yes - what evidence? Were bugs found in Trump Tower?

2. Were FISA requests issued? If yes - can the claims be confirmed by more then one source and for what specifically were they for?

Until those are answered - there's nothing but smoke.

Depends....

The same could be said for all these people saying that Trump is an Agent of Putin, they have produced no evidence, yet the MSM has no problem accusing Trump of this 24/7.

There is actual evidence of communication and connections between Trump campaign members and officials. What isn't clear is what it MEANS. We also have not seen his tax returns (which is odd since every other modern candidate has voluntarily supplied it). It may mean something or it may mean nothing. But it's enough to merit a bipartisan investigation to determine once and for all if there is any merit to the claims.

Now that the table is turned on Obama and The Obama Administration the media whores are outraged at the suggestion that Obama had Trump Tower wiretapped during an Election.

Except WAS IT? Unlike the stuff with Russia - Trump has offered zero evidence to back his claim. Don't you think he ought to? If there is classified material - he has the power to release it. Were any actual wire taps found? Likewise - FISA requests can be released. None of that has happened yet.

Not one of these media whores has written or stated that if Obama did have Trump Tower wiretapped that would be a very disturbing development and would be on par with the wiretapping of The Watergate Building.

IF it were true, it would be horrendous and criminal. But - like I pointed out - there isn't even any evidence to support Trump's claims yet. And that is a distinct difference from the Russia thing where there has been substantial evidence of connections and contacts. Now granted - those may be entirely innocuous - but there is more there than the wire tap allegations at this point.

The problem is the cheerleading and hysterically anti-Trump media think that Obama can do no wrong, and if it is shown that Obama did have Trump Tower wiretapped, they will spin it so they can attempt to help him all they can.

Sure they might spin it, but there are many media outlets including pro-Trump cheerleaders who think Trump can do no wrong - if the facts come out, we should be able to figure out the truth from the spin. But right now - I don't see any facts or evidence.

Could Obama who ordered American citizens to be Droned also order the illegal wiretapping for political purposes of Trump Tower? Yes many think he could.

I think that's two different situations, and comparing them is apples and oranges.

The drone attack was problematic but hardly secret and caused a great deal of discussion on it's legality (it was ultimately ruled legal) and appropriateness.
Lieberman says president can approve killing a U.S. citizen who affiliates with terrorists
Barack Obama says he's kept Congress

Wiretapping a political rival for political reasons- ala Nixon style - is absolutely illegal. No discussion. No legality.

Personally, the drone issue was/is deeply disturbing to me.

 

[Darkwind]

So far there is no evidence indicating any such thing.

Intercepted Russian Communications Part of Inquiry Into Trump Associates

"intercepted communications"

Newspaper articles are not "evidence".

Evidence is hard proof (Like a video recording or a voice recording of a phone conversation), not speculation based upon unsubstantiated opinion.

 

[2aguy]

So far there is no evidence indicating any such thing.

Intercepted Russian Communications Part of Inquiry Into Trump Associates

"intercepted communications"

Yep.....that would be the smoking gun...wouldn't it? These men are not accused of committing criminal acts...so the only way to have "wire tapped" their communications is a violation of the FISA act....as this article from another thread points out....

Yes, There Could Be Serious Legal Problems if Obama Admin Involved in Illegal Surveillance

 

[Coyote]

Interesting how "just the facts" is the standard now that the Democrats are out of power.

Will the OP be extending this "standard" to the Republicans?

I think we should when baseless allegations are put forth. Did the Republicans extend this when birtherism was embraced and Obama's legitimacy openly questioned? Eh...I don't think so.

It shouldn't be a partisan thing.

 

[yiostheoy]

Interesting how "just the facts" is the standard now that the Democrats are out of power.

Will the OP be extending this "standard" to the Republicans?

Trump stepped on his d!ck Darkwind .

Might as well get used to it.

I know Coyote loves Hillary but Hillary has got nothing to do with this this time.

 

[Coyote]

So far there is no evidence indicating any such thing.

Intercepted Russian Communications Part of Inquiry Into Trump Associates

"intercepted communications"

Newspaper articles are not "evidence".

Evidence is hard proof (Like a video recording or a voice recording of a phone conversation), not speculation based upon unsubstantiated opinion.

Newspaper articles can be evidence - when they can be independently confirmed through more then just one source. The more reliable sources attempt to do that.

 

[yiostheoy]

Interesting how "just the facts" is the standard now that the Democrats are out of power.

Will the OP be extending this "standard" to the Republicans?

I think we should when baseless allegations are put forth. Did the Republicans extend this when birtherism was embraced and Obama's legitimacy openly questioned? Eh...I don't think so.

It shouldn't be a partisan thing.

What I want to know is when will Reince, Mitch, and Paul get finally fed up and repeal and replace Trump with Pence ?!

 

[yiostheoy]

So far there is no evidence indicating any such thing.

Intercepted Russian Communications Part of Inquiry Into Trump Associates

"intercepted communications"

Newspaper articles are not "evidence".

Evidence is hard proof (Like a video recording or a voice recording of a phone conversation), not speculation based upon unsubstantiated opinion.

Newspaper articles can be evidence - when they can be independently confirmed through more then just one source. The more reliable sources attempt to do that.

It was all junk news.

 

[Darkwind]

Interesting how "just the facts" is the standard now that the Democrats are out of power.

Will the OP be extending this "standard" to the Republicans?

I think we should when baseless allegations are put forth. Did the Republicans extend this when birtherism was embraced and Obama's legitimacy openly questioned? Eh...I don't think so.

It shouldn't be a partisan thing.

I agree, and those of us who did not partake of the birth certificate issue stated why it was nonsense to begin. But you are deflecting.

It has never been the standard applied by Democrats against Republicans. Never.

I myself think that Trump lied through his teeth with this. That does not change the fact that I have never known the Democrats to wait until "the facts" where known before going after the reputation of any Republican.

 

[OldLady]

I'd like to take back any neutral, trying to be fair, attempts I've made to give this new President the benefit of the doubt. He is out to keep this country ripped open and divided. He is now my enemy.

Nobody divided America more than Obama, he Race Baited almost on a daily basis, pitting Blacks against Whites, Obama is responsible for BLM, they never existed until Blacks were whipped up into a frenzy by Obama and also by the MSM who started by fanning the flames during the Ferguson situation.

Obama seems to have left tripwires all over the place in his last month in the White House, this to deliberately sabotage The Trump Administration.

Also the majority of former American Presidents go into the sunset and do NOT speak out against the new President, Obama broke that unwritten rule during the second week of Trump becoming the President.

Now he's set himself up in a house not far from the White House and Valerie Jarrett has moved into the house and Eric Holder has said that Obama is "ready to roll" ie. to work to further sabotage The Trump Administration.

Newly rich Obama is 'ready to roll' says Eric Holder | Daily Mail Online

Eric Holder: Obama Preparing to Get Back Into Political Spotlight

Great, Lucy, your favorite boogeyman is back in place so you all can keep flogging him. I do not recall Obama behaving in any way that could fairly be compared to what Trump is doing right now. Or any reactions that would compare with what is happening now. Everyone, both sides, need a fucking time out, imo. It has spun out of control. Feeding this division is only making it worse, whatever your actual intentions are. Give us proof of wrongdoing -- we have none regarding Trump -- or stop this.

 

[2aguy]

So far there is no evidence indicating any such thing.

Not only is there no evidence, but Clapper came right out and said it never happened.

Clapper lied to congress, under oath, before........

 

[MACAULAY]

No spin. No smoke and mirrors. No conjecture. Was he wire tapped? If that can't be answered everything else is Conspiracy Theory material of attempting to create links between unrelated incidents.

At this point, it see - the whole wire-tap claim is unsubstantiated and taking on the guise of a conspiracy theory.

From: Analysis | Donald Trump was a conspiracy-theory candidate. Now he’s on the edge of being a conspiracy-theory president.

The problem here, of course, is that what Levin — and Breitbart — use as evidence for these claims are a series of seemingly unconnected events — from FISA court requests to Trump joking about the Russia email hack, to the release of Hillary Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta’s emails in the fall. The proof that all — or any — of these events are tied together by actual facts as opposed to supposition is not offered.


The idea that Obama’s administration authorized — and was able to get approval for — the wiretapping of the opposition party’s candidate for president is, frankly, far-fetched. And, if someone is making that claim — as Trump is now doing — the burden of proof is on them. If you are going to say there is a grand conspiracy that only you and a handful of others see, you need to offer a step-by-step explanation to the broader public to show why you’re right.


It seems unlikely — given Trump’s past pattern of making baseless claims without proof and then simply insisting he is right and no evidence is needed to prove the point — that any meaningful effort will be made by the Trump administration to connect the dots on this alleged wiretapping conspiracy.​

From the LA Times: Citing no evidence, Trump accuses Obama of tapping his phones during the election

It would be highly unusual for a sitting president to be aware of such [surveillance] requests. By blaming Obama directly, Trump accused the former president of reaching into a federal investigation and signing off on an illegal wiretap, which is a felony.


If federal investigators did monitor Trump’s phones or computers lawfully, a court would have demanded information about potential criminal misconduct or unlawful foreign contacts. Such investigations are closely held and rarely, if ever, shared with the White House.


It is possible Trump has no evidence his phones were tapped and is repeating unfounded reports circulating in conservative media circles. ​

There is a lot of smoke, mirrors and redirection going on here, an attempt I'm sure, to distract from the demands for an investigation into Russian ties with the Trump campaign.

Rather than blowing this up into a full blown conspiracy theory, how about looking at actual evidence?

First question to answer is: is there any hard evidence that Trump Tower was indeed wire tapped? If we can't answer that, the rest is meaningless distraction.

From the Washington Post: Analysis | Trump’s ‘evidence’ for Obama wiretap claims relies on sketchy, anonymously sourced reports

Trump’s ‘evidence’ for Obama wiretap claims relies on sketchy, anonymously sourced reports

Brietbart article on FISA Requests: June & October. Breitbart based it's article entirely on one source: and article written by Louise Mensch, a former Tory member of the British Parliament and an independent journalist for Heat Street. But no one seems to be able to independently confirm the claim.

The Washington Post for months has sought to confirm this report of a FISA warrant related to the Trump campaign but has been unable to do so. Presumably other U.S. news organizations have tried to do so as well. So one has to take this claim with a huge dose of skepticism. Indeed, the New York Times reported before the election that the FBI “ultimately concluded that there could be an innocuous explanation, like a marketing email or spam, for the computer contacts” with the Russian banks.​

According to the WP article:

The White House provided three other sources. Two, a National Review article and a Fox News interview, are simply derivative of the Heat Street article, with no independent confirmation. The third is a New York Times report that intelligence agencies “are examining intercepted communications and financial transactions” as part of a probe of possible links between Russian officials and Trump campaign aides. (We recall the president has previously deemed Times reporting on this matter as “fake news.”)​

The article goes on to conclude:

Only two articles, both with British roots, have reported that a FISA court order was granted in October to examine possible activity between two Russian banks and a computer server in the Trump Tower. This claim has not been confirmed by a U.S. news organizations. Moreover, neither article says President Obama requested the order or that it resulted in the tapping of Trump’s phone lines.​

And lastly:

Moreover, the articles do not support the White House’s claim that these were “potentially politically motivated investigations” led by President Obama. The articles all suggest the FISA requests — if they happened — were done by the intelligence agencies and the FBI.​

So, before we have this huge political uproar, and immediate comparisons to Watergate, lets' get at the facts first. Can anyone answer these questions?

1. Was Trump wiretapped? If yes - what evidence? Were bugs found in Trump Tower?

2. Were FISA requests issued? If yes - can the claims be confirmed by more then one source and for what specifically were they for?

Until those are answered - there's nothing but smoke.

_________

You should be so circumspect in demanding proof that people like Jeff Sessions...and other honorable people like Jeff Session...not from you party or your part of America...but an honorable man nevertheless...you should also be demanding proof tof how he came to be conspiring with the Russians to undermine an American election.

That is what the whole damn Democratic Party is alleging or inferring--lying Bolsheviks like you. Any person, Pelosi, Schumer, Pocahontas...any Democratic leader who has been a party to this witch hunt of claiming Trump people were conspiring with Russians....has been made without any evidence whatsoever.

It is pure unadulterated hypocrisy. You are a hypocrite.

_______