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How is it that what you believe is the Holy Spirit has not done even one single thing that Jesus said that God would send the Spirit of truth to do when he came if he came at Pentecost?
As far as I know Jews have not and will never be convinced by a 'spirit' that they were wrong to refuse to believe in Jesus or that Jesus was right about anything especially since seeking the guidance of spirits is a violation of divine law.
How do you resolve this?
I've met some Orthodox Jews and they won't allow me to use anything other than the first five books of the Bible to show them even though they believe the rest of the Old Testament are scriptures.
How do I resolve your question?
Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
They've been blinded until a certain time. The word "blindness" also has a hint of stubbornness:
Exodus 32:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, I have seen this people, and, behold, it [is] a stiffnecked people:
Exodus 20:19 And they said unto Moses, Speak thou with us, and we will hear: but let not God speak with us, lest we die.
They didn't want to speak to God. It is that kind of thing which keeps people from knowing God.
They actually provoked God in the wilderness and the first generation except Joshua and Caleb didn't enter into Israel but their children did. They went through two captivities and the Holocaust so they are stiffnecked until it is their time again.
Romans 9, 10 and 11 explain the past, present and future of Israel in the Kingdom of God as a starting point.
Your ignorance of the Holy Spirit doesn't mean He doesn't exist. And considering the way you mock God, I'm not surprised you're ignorant of Him.
I have a few questions about what you call the Holy Spirit.
Do you believe the Holy Spirit to be an invisible disembodied spirit sent by God to help believers understand mysteries by entering into peoples heads in some way and guiding their thoughts to the truth, who made his first appearance at Pentecost?
If so my question is, if what you believe to be the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of truth that Jesus said would be sent by God in his name to do certain specific things outlined in John 16:8-15;
"When he comes he will confute the world, and show where wrong and right and judgment lie. He will convict them of wrong, by their refusal to believe in me; he will convince them that right is on my side, by showing that I go to the Father when I pass from your sight; and he will convince them of divine judgment, by showing that the prince of this world stands condemned."
"However when he comes who is the Spirit of truth, he will guide you into all the truth; for he shall not speak on his own authority, but will tell you only what he hears; and he will make known to you the things that are coming. He will glorify me, for everything he makes known to you he will draw from what is mine. All that the Father has is mine, and that is why I said, "Everything he makes known to you he will draw from what is mine."
How is it that what you believe is the Holy Spirit has not done even one single thing that Jesus said that God would send the Spirit of truth to do when he came if he came at Pentecost?
As far as I know Jews have not and will never be convinced by a 'spirit' that they were wrong to refuse to believe in Jesus or that Jesus was right about anything especially since seeking the guidance of spirits is a violation of divine law.
How do you resolve this?
Nothing to resolve. Christ told His disciples that the Holy Spirit would come and do that and He does do that with His disciples. Even now, He continually calls people to follow the Good Shepheard and teaches us the Truth of all things.
How is it that what you believe is the Holy Spirit has not done even one single thing that Jesus said that God would send the Spirit of truth to do when he came if he came at Pentecost?
As far as I know Jews have not and will never be convinced by a 'spirit' that they were wrong to refuse to believe in Jesus or that Jesus was right about anything especially since seeking the guidance of spirits is a violation of divine law.
How do you resolve this?
I've met some Orthodox Jews and they won't allow me to use anything other than the first five books of the Bible to show them even though they believe the rest of the Old Testament are scriptures.
How do I resolve your question?
Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
They've been blinded until a certain time. The word "blindness" also has a hint of stubbornness:
Exodus 32:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, I have seen this people, and, behold, it [is] a stiffnecked people:
Exodus 20:19 And they said unto Moses, Speak thou with us, and we will hear: but let not God speak with us, lest we die.
They didn't want to speak to God. It is that kind of thing which keeps people from knowing God.
They actually provoked God in the wilderness and the first generation except Joshua and Caleb didn't enter into Israel but their children did. They went through two captivities and the Holocaust so they are stiffnecked until it is their time again.
Romans 9, 10 and 11 explain the past, present and future of Israel in the Kingdom of God as a starting point.
no we dont you cant prove a negative thats not therenonsenceIf a roman or greek god rose from the dead then people who saw it most likely would believe in it.
The reason people believe in Jesus is because there were eyewitnesses of his miracles, or his resurrection, other historical evidence and other reasons because that would be the only way to get man to believe.
noboby who was there at the time wrote anything
people have seen
santa claus
the loch ness monster
space ships
aliens
and so on and so on
Fourth, to place belief in Santa Claus or mermaids and belief in God on the same level is mistaken. The issue is not that we have no good evidence for these mythical entities; rather, we have strong evidence that they do not exist. Absence of evidence is not at all the same as evidence of absence, which some atheists fail to see.
The atheist also shares the burden of proof that God doesn't exist.
The Presumptuousness of Atheism
The Presumptuousness of Atheism | CRI
no we dont you cant prove a negative thats not therenonsence
noboby who was there at the time wrote anything
people have seen
santa claus
the loch ness monster
space ships
aliens
and so on and so on
Fourth, to place belief in Santa Claus or mermaids and belief in God on the same level is mistaken. The issue is not that we have no good evidence for these mythical entities; rather, we have strong evidence that they do not exist. Absence of evidence is not at all the same as evidence of absence, which some atheists fail to see.
The atheist also shares the burden of proof that God doesn't exist.
The Presumptuousness of Atheism
The Presumptuousness of Atheism | CRI
the statement by believers is GOD EXISTS
answer by theists you made a statement of fact .PROVE IT
y
Why do you bible thumpers always think that someone who doesn't agree with you is ignorant of the scriptures? It's always: and if you just learn... Well maybe I have learned about it and STILL think it's bs. If there's such a thing as god and he wants to reach out to me, I'm pretty sure he knows where I am (or should, lol), and I shouldn't have to read it in some books of fairy tales.
Because you've admitted you are ignorant of them when you were talking about the clear teachings of the scriptures being gibberish. The only reason you wouldn't understand them is if you haven't studied them.
God is reaching out to you. You need to listen sometime and reach back. He isn't going to force you to listen to Him. He doesn't compel people to come to Him. He invites, entices, and exhorts you to come to Him of your own free will.
If you don't want people to think you are ignorant of the scriptures, don't brag about being ignorant of them.
Oh, you miserable sinner, how could any action taken by ourselves justify such filth as human beings before the Lord?It's amazing that no one here can answer the op's question of what does it take to get into Heaven. People that claim faith alone is enough to get in is a cop-out, since anyone can say they believe; but without walking the talk in their daily lives, how is that justified?
How is it that what you believe is the Holy Spirit has not done even one single thing that Jesus said that God would send the Spirit of truth to do when he came if he came at Pentecost?
As far as I know Jews have not and will never be convinced by a 'spirit' that they were wrong to refuse to believe in Jesus or that Jesus was right about anything especially since seeking the guidance of spirits is a violation of divine law.
How do you resolve this?
I've met some Orthodox Jews and they won't allow me to use anything other than the first five books of the Bible to show them even though they believe the rest of the Old Testament are scriptures.
How do I resolve your question?
Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
They've been blinded until a certain time. The word "blindness" also has a hint of stubbornness:
Exodus 32:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, I have seen this people, and, behold, it [is] a stiffnecked people:
Exodus 20:19 And they said unto Moses, Speak thou with us, and we will hear: but let not God speak with us, lest we die.
They didn't want to speak to God. It is that kind of thing which keeps people from knowing God.
They actually provoked God in the wilderness and the first generation except Joshua and Caleb didn't enter into Israel but their children did. They went through two captivities and the Holocaust so they are stiffnecked until it is their time again.
Romans 9, 10 and 11 explain the past, present and future of Israel in the Kingdom of God as a starting point.
Thank you, but what you posted is an attempt to explain why they didn't believe in Jesus. It does not resolve why they have not yet been convinced that Jesus was right for the past 2000 years and counting if the Holy Spirit supposedly has already come..
Jesus came and accomplished what God sent him to do in only a few short years.
You have resolved nothing.
JohnA
no we dont you cant prove a negative thats not there
the statement by believers is GOD EXISTS
answer by theists you made a statement of fact .PROVE IT
y
Avatar4321
Everything in the universe denotes that there is a God. But if you want a personal witness, you need to go to Him in humility and sincere prayer.
Thank you, but what you posted is an attempt to explain why they didn't believe in Jesus. It does not resolve why they have not yet been convinced that Jesus was right for the past 2000 years and counting if the Holy Spirit supposedly has already come..
Jesus came and accomplished what God sent him to do in only a few short years.
You have resolved nothing.
There are Messianic Jews that believe in Jesus.
The verse is misunderstood.
The Holy Spirit isn't done working.
Satan has blinded the minds so that people won't believe.
God has a remnant to be saved in Israel.
People are still allowed to choose whether they wish to believe or not.
Not all Israel is Israel.
Do all of them sound like easy topics to explain in one message board post without taking the topic off track? Do I look like I have a lot of time? Do I get paid for this? No.
Thank you, but what you posted is an attempt to explain why they didn't believe in Jesus. It does not resolve why they have not yet been convinced that Jesus was right for the past 2000 years and counting if the Holy Spirit supposedly has already come..
Jesus came and accomplished what God sent him to do in only a few short years.
You have resolved nothing.
There are Messianic Jews that believe in Jesus.
The verse is misunderstood.
The Holy Spirit isn't done working.
Satan has blinded the minds so that people won't believe.
God has a remnant to be saved in Israel.
People are still allowed to choose whether they wish to believe or not.
Not all Israel is Israel.
Do all of them sound like easy topics to explain in one message board post without taking the topic off track? Do I look like I have a lot of time? Do I get paid for this? No.
The they that Jesus referred to who would be convinced by the spirit of truth when he came was obviously the dominant ruling authority of Judaism, the Pharisees in particular, the generation of error who teaches a literal interpretation and application of Mosaic law that persists to this day.
Some Jews believed in Jesus at the time too and many persons of any consequence in Judaism know that Jews who accept the modern Christian perversions of Jesus are nuts.
Obviously people who jump and gibber for Jesus who profess to worship and believe in him as a triune entity and disregard the divine commands are full of something but it isn't holy and it isn't the truth.
Since the described purpose of the Spirit of truth when he came is to convince the Religious establishment that rejected Jesus that he was right it is impossible that whatever you imagine the holy spirit to be had come 2000 years ago at Pentecost.
If he did, it would not still be a requirement to reject Jesus to qualify as a real Jew.
There are Messianic Jews that believe in Jesus.
The verse is misunderstood.
The Holy Spirit isn't done working.
Satan has blinded the minds so that people won't believe.
God has a remnant to be saved in Israel.
People are still allowed to choose whether they wish to believe or not.
Not all Israel is Israel.
Do all of them sound like easy topics to explain in one message board post without taking the topic off track? Do I look like I have a lot of time? Do I get paid for this? No.
The they that Jesus referred to who would be convinced by the spirit of truth when he came was obviously the dominant ruling authority of Judaism, the Pharisees in particular, the generation of error who teaches a literal interpretation and application of Mosaic law that persists to this day.
Some Jews believed in Jesus at the time too and many persons of any consequence in Judaism know that Jews who accept the modern Christian perversions of Jesus are nuts.
Obviously people who jump and gibber for Jesus who profess to worship and believe in him as a triune entity and disregard the divine commands are full of something but it isn't holy and it isn't the truth.
Since the described purpose of the Spirit of truth when he came is to convince the Religious establishment that rejected Jesus that he was right it is impossible that whatever you imagine the holy spirit to be had come 2000 years ago at Pentecost.
If he did, it would not still be a requirement to reject Jesus to qualify as a real Jew.
I consulted about 20 translations and only the Douay-Rheims Bible uses the word "Convince" and the NIV and Net Bible use the word "Prove" but the NIV isn't a literal translation (word for word). At least 11 of the translations use the word "Convict" and four use the word "Reprove". The Aramaic Bible in Plain English use the word "Correct". There are two definitions for the word and they fall under "1" and "2". The majority use the #1 definition.
Here is an extra translation by an NASB translator:
"But if I depart, I will send Him to you. And having come, that One will convict the world with respect to sin, and with respect to righteousness, and with respect to judgment; with respect to sin on the one hand, because they are not believing on me; with respect to righteousness on the other hand, because to the Father I am going away and no longer are you seeing me; and with the respect to judgment, because the ruler of this world has been judged and is now under judgment."- The New Testament, An Expanded Translation
The KJ I use says this:
John 16:8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
And if I am wrong, so what. People reject the truth all of the time because the heart makes a convert of the mind. People see evil all the time and don't do anything because they know there are consequences even though they are convicted.
People don't come to Christ because they feel their friends won't accept them if they do. I've actually heard people say they know that God exists but they would rather would be in hell because that is where all of their friends are going to be. They are convicted of the truth but they choose wrongly.
Did you ever consider that everyone who ever chose to reject the promise of eternal pleasures and refused to worship a god man man made cracker made by human hands chose correctly, even under threat of torture and death?
JohnA
no we dont you cant prove a negative thats not there
the statement by believers is GOD EXISTS
answer by theists you made a statement of fact .PROVE IT
y
Avatar4321
Everything in the universe denotes that there is a God. But if you want a personal witness, you need to go to Him in humility and sincere prayer.
"Everything in the universe denotes that there is a God" -
no, that is not correct, it is the contrast between Earth and (our) lifeless Solar System that is the "Proof" of a certain existence and providence that is greater than the empty space of its surroundings.
the statement by believers is GOD EXISTS
The Existence of Earth is a Providence of itself and explanatory for the existence of a Deity.
* at least more so than Santa Clause and the 7 Dwarfs.
Did you ever consider that everyone who ever chose to reject the promise of eternal pleasures and refused to worship a god man man made cracker made by human hands chose correctly, even under threat of torture and death?
That is funny because my Western Civilization professor said that in the middle ages, most left their faith on the shore when they left and went out to sea.
"Everything in the universe denotes that there is a God" -
no, that is not correct, it is the contrast between Earth and (our) lifeless Solar System that is the "Proof" of a certain existence and providence that is greater than the empty space of its surroundings.
the statement by believers is GOD EXISTS
The Existence of Earth is a Providence of itself and explanatory for the existence of a Deity.
* at least more so than Santa Clause and the 7 Dwarfs.
"Everything in the universe denotes that there is a God" -
no, that is not correct, it is the contrast between Earth and (our) lifeless Solar System that is the "Proof" of a certain existence and providence that is greater than the empty space of its surroundings.
the statement by believers is GOD EXISTS
The Existence of Earth is a Providence of itself and explanatory for the existence of a Deity.
* at least more so than Santa Clause and the 7 Dwarfs.
The solar system has not been proven to be lifeless.
The space around it isn't empty.
The existence of earth is only proof of the existence of earth. The deity will have to have it's own REAL proof.
Please try again.
is there a Sea between Earth and the Moon or Atmosphere conducive to life - no."Everything in the universe denotes that there is a God" -
no, that is not correct, it is the contrast between Earth and (our) lifeless Solar System that is the "Proof" of a certain existence and providence that is greater than the empty space of its surroundings.
the statement by believers is GOD EXISTS
The Existence of Earth is a Providence of itself and explanatory for the existence of a Deity.
* at least more so than Santa Clause and the 7 Dwarfs.
The solar system has not been proven to be lifeless.
The space around it isn't empty.
The existence of earth is only proof of the existence of earth. The deity will have to have it's own REAL proof.
Please try again.
not the existence of Earth but the Garden of Earth is the proof of a Deity - of one sort or another, that may be represented by J/C Scriptural writings and the Mythicals but it is the writings that are fallacious not the God.
The fact that most religions claim that theirs is the only way to heaven tells me they're all wrong.
You realize that your conclusion is completely illogical, don't you?
