Which "side" of the "fence" are you on?

[usmbguest5318]

it has allowed intolerant ideologues (sorry, redundancy)

LOL

 

[usmbguest5318]

I am a strong proponent of discussion and agreeing to disagree. Coming to a compromise is difficult, even with level headed people that are firmly entrenched in their beliefs.

When it reaches this level, unfortunately, a fight to the death can be the deciding factor. It happens often in nature. Obviously, we view ourselves as above all other animals, so, we should know better... but sometimes nature takes over. The ID lives.

Coming to a compromise is difficult, even with level headed people that are firmly entrenched in their beliefs.

I don't agree with that assertion. Without exception, every temperate and prudent person with whom I've interacted -- personally and professionally -- recognizes that their position need not be one of "all or nothing;" thus they strive sincerely for genuinely win-win solutions. Every rube I've encounters, all of whom are indolently pusillanimous SOBs, on the other hand, dastardly conceive and construe everything binarily.

The problem is that your second group is the one that is the loudest and therefore attracts the most attention and influence.

Here's what really worries me: This in anecdotal only, but as part of my profession I speak at a fairly in-depth level with a lot of people I haven't met before. And it just seems like more and more often, some switch goes off, and they go off on a very binary, partisan tangent. They use words and phrases that you'd hear on conservative talk radio or left wing website.

And look at what is happening in popular culture: There is now nowhere to go to escape partisan politics, for a moment or two.

I could be wrong on that, but it just seems to me that this behavior is beginning to infect a larger percentage of our population.
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it just seems like more and more often, some switch goes off, and they go off on a very binary, partisan tangent.

I've observed that too, but only among youngsters -- people ranging from 9th graders to college undergraduate degree seekers. I have occasion to observe it among that segment of society only a few times a year, and that only because I have for the past nearly decade consistently served as a speaker in "career day" and/or "preparing for college" seminars/discussions. Not all the audience members exhibit binary thinking, but enough of them do that I've come to expect I'll encounter it at each event.

Frankly, I'm not shocked, per se, or even dismayed to see binary thinking -- particularly the unilateral form of it whereby they hear something that isn't presented in binary terms, yet they infer binary meaning of the remark -- from junior high school kids for they are novice enough that thinking with more rigor than that is something they haven't really mastered. Among high school students and collegians, it's a different matter.

I can't say I've ever encountered similarly jejune thought processes among my personal and professional peers, friends and associates. I may have, but not often enough or in such egregious form that it sticks out in my mind.

I could be wrong on that, but it just seems to me that this behavior is beginning to infect a larger percentage of our population.

I think you are correct that poor quality comprehension and analysis is pervasive among a material share of the U.S. population. What is not clear to me is whether the existential abundance of irrationality among the populace is indeed new. I'm not sure of how long this has been so for the following reasons:

• The Internet makes it possible to have at least an anecdotal/circumstantial awareness of a considerably more diverse slice of the population than one -- that is, one who wouldn't routinely encounter the uttered-with-apparent-seriousness remarks of hundreds of strangers -- could ever have obtained during almost the first fifty years of my life. More than ever before, people have and avail themselves of the opportunity to open their mouths and confirm they are the mental midgets that, before Twitter, Facebook, web forums, etc., in their quietude some may have suspected they were.
• Since perhaps the sixth grade, the course of my life has made somewhat or very well known to me, almost without exception, people who are proven high achievers -- personally, professionally, academically and socially -- either by dint of their being gifted enough that it comes comparatively easily to them or on account of their working resolutely to be high achievers. I'm savvy enough to know such people surpass the performance norm; thus I cannot infer their behavior, expressions and attitudes are in large proportion shared and manifest among society as a whole. They are people who, aside from afflictions like virulent forms of cancer or other such things, achieve and overcome nearly everything to which they set their minds. They don't give up and the tacks they undertake work.

I probably never had the highest regard for the lion's share of the population, but only in the past lustrum or so have I come to perceive that even so, I may have overestimated larger swaths of my countrymen than I'd have thought possible. It is equally opportune and disconcerting to discover that may be the case.

I think two of the largest problems both have to do with the proliferation of the internet.

First, it has allowed intolerant ideologues (sorry, redundancy) to not only exist in their own little worlds, but to expose themselves ONLY to "facts" and "truths" with which they are comfy. That's a guaranteed way to divide ourselves into camps and to stay divided.

Second, it has fed into the narcissism of the Selfie Generation, in which anyone can be a "celebrity" and no one has to be credible. Hell, I'm doing it right now, belching out my wonderful, fabulous, worthless opinion on a message board.

This is a toxic environment, and even if some brave souls are willing to be reasonable with others, they'll always be in competition with those who want the opposite.
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I think two of the largest problems both have to do with the proliferation of the internet.

First, it has allowed intolerant ideologues (sorry, redundancy) to not only exist in their own little worlds, but to expose themselves ONLY to "facts" and "truths" with which they are comfy. That's a guaranteed way to divide ourselves into camps and to stay divided.

For the life of me, I do not understand how it has come about that people "use" the Internet to that end; moreover, I cannot fathom what kind of person one must be to so crave affirmation that willfully pursuing an confirmation-bias approach to discovery be something one does.

I mean really. Why would one take comfort in leaning that others have the same notions one does? One didn't need those people to arrive at one's notions, but one does need others with sound and rigorously developed opposing notions to test the true merit of one's own. That someone else agrees with one should, at the very least, be as pleasing as it is disconcerting, most especially when total and near strangers grant one nothing beyond mere approbation.

The worth of the Internet has for me been that it makes it far easier than ever before to find highly credible content that one may use to rigorously challenge one's own beliefs and thereby and as needed alter them to something that makes more sense than what one had originally construed.

Second, it has fed into the narcissism of the Selfie Generation, in which anyone can be a "celebrity" and no one has to be credible.

It has.

• The Semiotics of Internet Celebrity: Gangnam Style Case
  
• The celebritization of society and culture: understanding the structural dynamics of celebrity culture
  
• Celebrity Status
• In the Time of the Microcelebrity: Celebrification and the YouTuber Zoella

Certainly one no longer must be credible to be heard by more than one's small and likely homogeneous circle of friends and acquaintances. That is something that before Facebook, Twitter, and the like, cultures had means of denying a wide ranging voice to people who had nothing of merit to say. "Back in the day," we called vocal individuals who were of no count "social climbers." We still call them that, but their ostracization can only happen in "the real world." In the "webverse" there's not much one can do but ignore them, but not everyone has the prudence to do that.

Hell, I'm doing it right now, belching out my wonderful, fabulous, worthless opinion on a message board.

True enough, but in this specific instance, I at least haven't challenged your opinion because previously known to me is very credible research that corroborates your opinion. Had I not been aware of such content, I would have checked to see whether your proposition aligned with what has been rigorously studied. If it didn't, I'd have challenged you. (I suppose it's also possible that I may not have cared enough about the topic to check on your statement's verity, in which, if I didn't already know of the research into the matter, I'd have had little, or more likely, nothing to say about it.)

I realize not everyone will voluntarily offer sound support for their opinions, but if one is called to do so, one should do so. That's part of how understanding and legitimate consensus develops. One wouldn't ask for corroboration if one were not sufficiently interested in the topic to want to learn more about it.

After all, in the abstract, who gives a "flying f*ck" what anyone else's opinion is, most especially those of individuals who have no real place in or impact on one's life? For example, were Trump not POTUS, I wouldn't care what he thinks about literally anything, and Obama's no longer POTUS, so I don't any longer care what he thinks or does.

 

[Billo_Really]

Try looking at the record instead of being told.

In Baltimore, they kept the kids on the bus and wouldn't let them go home. What do you think is going to happen after that?

 

[hazlnut]

This latest incident violent incident in Charlottesville is once again illustrating how our divisions are increasing, and how the "sides" of the "fence" are becoming more clear.

On one side of the fence, we have the people who appear to think they're "accomplishing" something by screaming at, verbally attacking, insulting, blaming, and now, finally, physically attacking and even KILLING those who dare to disagree with them. Attack, attack, attack, no matter what.

Their political affiliations are irrelevant, because their behaviors are so similar. They would much rather scream than communicate. They would much rather attack than heal. They would much rather "beat" those who dare to disagree than find a way to co-exist with them like normal, well-adjusted adults.

On the other side of the fence is the majority of the country, those who know that the only way to solve problems is to communicate and cooperate. That you're not always going to get your way. That sometimes you have to be a little humble, check your ego, and respect differing opinions. And that -- horror of horrors -- you may actually be wrong about something now and then.

So, which side of the fence are you on?
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No one is divided against hate.

American stands united against hate.



KKK/ Alt-right abuse the rights we give them, twist and bend civil rights into weapons against us -- just like Westboro and NAMBLA, they use 'free speech' to spew vile hate. That is sick behavior. That's the price of freedom. We carry that cross because we are better than them.

 

[skye]

This latest incident violent incident in Charlottesville is once again illustrating how our divisions are increasing, and how the "sides" of the "fence" are becoming more clear.

On one side of the fence, we have the people who appear to think they're "accomplishing" something by screaming at, verbally attacking, insulting, blaming, and now, finally, physically attacking and even KILLING those who dare to disagree with them. Attack, attack, attack, no matter what.

Their political affiliations are irrelevant, because their behaviors are so similar. They would much rather scream than communicate. They would much rather attack than heal. They would much rather "beat" those who dare to disagree than find a way to co-exist with them like normal, well-adjusted adults.

On the other side of the fence is the majority of the country, those who know that the only way to solve problems is to communicate and cooperate. That you're not always going to get your way. That sometimes you have to be a little humble, check your ego, and respect differing opinions. And that -- horror of horrors -- you may actually be wrong about something now and then.

So, which side of the fence are you on?
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I am on Trump's side of the... WALL. Fuck those people, that being said, I have no problem with anyone defending themselves against ANTIFA thugs.

This side of the fence for me too. ^^^

 

[DarkFury]

Trump's side. And the cost to the other side? Not my concern.

 

[JoeB131]

You've been sold a bill of goods that just isn't true. This tribal, simplistic, us vs. them crap is only good for the Division Pimps who are selling it.
.

The "Division Pimps"? Do they hang around with the "Regressives" and the "PC Police" and the other labels you give to people who disagree with you? Isn't that a bit "Tribal" in and of itself?

Please note that Mac will not answer this question.....

 

[JoeB131]

Second, it has fed into the narcissism of the Selfie Generation, in which anyone can be a "celebrity" and no one has to be credible. Hell, I'm doing it right now, belching out my wonderful, fabulous, worthless opinion on a message board.

Naw, man, what makes it toxic isn't that you have an opinion, it's that you don't regard anyone else's as valid.

 

[jon_berzerk]

This latest incident violent incident in Charlottesville is once again illustrating how our divisions are increasing, and how the "sides" of the "fence" are becoming more clear.

On one side of the fence, we have the people who appear to think they're "accomplishing" something by screaming at, verbally attacking, insulting, blaming, and now, finally, physically attacking and even KILLING those who dare to disagree with them. Attack, attack, attack, no matter what.

Their political affiliations are irrelevant, because their behaviors are so similar. They would much rather scream than communicate. They would much rather attack than heal. They would much rather "beat" those who dare to disagree than find a way to co-exist with them like normal, well-adjusted adults.

On the other side of the fence is the majority of the country, those who know that the only way to solve problems is to communicate and cooperate. That you're not always going to get your way. That sometimes you have to be a little humble, check your ego, and respect differing opinions. And that -- horror of horrors -- you may actually be wrong about something now and then.

So, which side of the fence are you on?
.

which side of the fence are you on


neither side they both suck to no end

 

[Tresha91203]

This latest incident violent incident in Charlottesville is once again illustrating how our divisions are increasing, and how the "sides" of the "fence" are becoming more clear.

On one side of the fence, we have the people who appear to think they're "accomplishing" something by screaming at, verbally attacking, insulting, blaming, and now, finally, physically attacking and even KILLING those who dare to disagree with them. Attack, attack, attack, no matter what.

Their political affiliations are irrelevant, because their behaviors are so similar. They would much rather scream than communicate. They would much rather attack than heal. They would much rather "beat" those who dare to disagree than find a way to co-exist with them like normal, well-adjusted adults.

On the other side of the fence is the majority of the country, those who know that the only way to solve problems is to communicate and cooperate. That you're not always going to get your way. That sometimes you have to be a little humble, check your ego, and respect differing opinions. And that -- horror of horrors -- you may actually be wrong about something now and then.

So, which side of the fence are you on?
.

But these people probably feel as though they discuss things till their blue in the face and no one gives a damn.

It seems to me that the spark to this rally was the destruction of a war memorial for General Lee. I think they felt like their history was being erased, because the government is trying to erase their white race and all history associated with them and they feel powerless to stop it.

Then on the other side of the coin you have BLM whose lives had gotten even worse under Obama. To top things off, the DNC e-mails revealed that the DNC views BLM as more of a terrorist group and have no intentions of helping them whatsoever.

So here we have two really pissed off groups without representation in government. They can talk all they want but no one gives a damn about any of them. Instead, they will all just wind up on some secret terrorist list that Homeland Security will keep track of and be labeled enemies of the state.

IMO, the extremists (in action, not thought) of both sides ARE enemies of the state. Lawful expression of opinions, however vile, is protected. Violence is not. Arrest the violent lawbreakers of both sides so normal people can work out a solution. Protect us from both sides' criminals.

 

[Mac1958]

Second, it has fed into the narcissism of the Selfie Generation, in which anyone can be a "celebrity" and no one has to be credible. Hell, I'm doing it right now, belching out my wonderful, fabulous, worthless opinion on a message board.

Naw, man, what makes it toxic isn't that you have an opinion, it's that you don't regard anyone else's as valid.

 

[Mac1958]

This latest incident violent incident in Charlottesville is once again illustrating how our divisions are increasing, and how the "sides" of the "fence" are becoming more clear.

On one side of the fence, we have the people who appear to think they're "accomplishing" something by screaming at, verbally attacking, insulting, blaming, and now, finally, physically attacking and even KILLING those who dare to disagree with them. Attack, attack, attack, no matter what.

Their political affiliations are irrelevant, because their behaviors are so similar. They would much rather scream than communicate. They would much rather attack than heal. They would much rather "beat" those who dare to disagree than find a way to co-exist with them like normal, well-adjusted adults.

On the other side of the fence is the majority of the country, those who know that the only way to solve problems is to communicate and cooperate. That you're not always going to get your way. That sometimes you have to be a little humble, check your ego, and respect differing opinions. And that -- horror of horrors -- you may actually be wrong about something now and then.

So, which side of the fence are you on?
.

But these people probably feel as though they discuss things till their blue in the face and no one gives a damn.

It seems to me that the spark to this rally was the destruction of a war memorial for General Lee. I think they felt like their history was being erased, because the government is trying to erase their white race and all history associated with them and they feel powerless to stop it.

Then on the other side of the coin you have BLM whose lives had gotten even worse under Obama. To top things off, the DNC e-mails revealed that the DNC views BLM as more of a terrorist group and have no intentions of helping them whatsoever.

So here we have two really pissed off groups without representation in government. They can talk all they want but no one gives a damn about any of them. Instead, they will all just wind up on some secret terrorist list that Homeland Security will keep track of and be labeled enemies of the state.

IMO, the extremists (in action, not thought) of both sides ARE enemies of the state. Lawful expression of opinions, however vile, is protected. Violence is not. Arrest the violent lawbreakers of both sides so normal people can work out a solution. Protect us from both sides' criminals.

The much tougher part is finding a way to culturally marginalize the zealots.

They're not going to stop acting like this, so it's up to the majority to stop giving them attention and influence.
.

 

[Mac1958]

(double post)

 

[Mac1958]

You've been sold a bill of goods that just isn't true. This tribal, simplistic, us vs. them crap is only good for the Division Pimps who are selling it.
.

The "Division Pimps"? Do they hang around with the "Regressives" and the "PC Police" and the other labels you give to people who disagree with you? Isn't that a bit "Tribal" in and of itself?

Please note that Mac will not answer this question.....

My goodness, you're desperate for my attention.

Why yes, Joe, you're right. My tribe is the majority of America, sick of the behavior of you children. Guilty as charged!

Thanks for pointing that out. That's a great way to look at it.


.

 

[dturner1157]

I'm on the side that involves cracking open heads on both sides and putting all these perps away with substantial sentences.

All the talk of love and cooperation and "coming together as one" oozing out of our politicians is just shit. No one is listening.

Media are fueling this crap by the all-day constant attention paid to them.

Outlaw these people - all of them - and get them out of the way by whatever means are legally available. If none are available, make them so.

Or become Venezuela. It's your choice.

What HE said!
I would just add that everyone knows that Obama, Hillary, and Soros are behind these "Protests/Riots". They deserve some old fashioned justice too.

ahhh, I can see you still believe in the boogeyman! How old are you?

More experienced than the likes of you fool!

 

[dturner1157]

I'm on the side that involves cracking open heads on both sides and putting all these perps away with substantial sentences.

All the talk of love and cooperation and "coming together as one" oozing out of our politicians is just shit. No one is listening.

Media are fueling this crap by the all-day constant attention paid to them.

Outlaw these people - all of them - and get them out of the way by whatever means are legally available. If none are available, make them so.

Or become Venezuela. It's your choice.

What HE said!
I would just add that everyone knows that Obama, Hillary, and Soros are behind these "Protests/Riots". They deserve some old fashioned justice too.

Everyone who's retarded knows that.

Everyone who's in denial you mean............

 

[JoeB131]

My goodness, you're desperate for my attention.

Why yes, Joe, you're right. My tribe is the majority of America, sick of the behavior of you children. Guilty as charged!

Thanks for pointing that out. That's a great way to look at it.

Guy, the majority doesn't agree with you. 2016 would have been Trump vs. Bernie if America were left to its own devices. Hillary had to cheat to win the nomination, and no one was terribly enthusastic about her.

 

[TheGreatGatsby]

Well, we know what side the liberal-hijacked govts. and civil services are on. They enabled this entire slaughter for their own purposes. Let the people who were lawfully there have their rally; and arrest people who are creating public disturbances and breaking laws. Nope though; "STAND DOWN!"

 

[AntonToo]

Well, we know what side the liberal-hijacked govts. and civil services are on. They enabled this entire slaughter for their own purposes.

So they counted on white nationalists being really violent and were proven right.

Nice conspiracy theory.

 

[TheGreatGatsby]

Well, we know what side the liberal-hijacked govts. and civil services are on. They enabled this entire slaughter for their own purposes.

So they counted on white nationalists being really violent and were proven right.

Nice conspiracy theory.

The police unlawfully barricaded the meeting place for which Unite The Right had a permit. Then the police allowed for mob rule. That's the facts, bitch.

STEP!