Why is jesus not a jew in churches?

[jillian]

After the Romans destroyed the Temple in Jerusalem, Judaism changed its hierarchy. Gone were the Levites and priests and Pharisees and in came the rabbis.

jesus lived during the time of the san hedrin... not after the destruction of the temple in 70 A.D.

rabbi was a generic term for teacher and still is.

There was no San Hedrin or Jewish court at that time.

I could be wrong, but it's my understanding that the gospels describe jesus' trial before the san hedrin. no?

Sanhedrin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Cecilie1200]

Thanks for the affirmation. I've been writing and teaching JudeoChristian history for years, but I am constantly revising the fine details and try to include as many different perspectives as possible. I figure we all have bits and pieces of the real deal on this stuff but none of us have it all totally figured out.

well, i was raised in a kosher home where we went out for chinese food every sunday night. lol.. so i know the basics, but there's a lot i don't know. but the subject of religion always fascinates me.

Me too. I have never ever gotten bored with it. True story: some time back somebody in my class asked how an orthodox Jew would know the Sabbath had begun if he had no time piece on a cloudy day? I had no clue so I went to some on line Jewish chat rooms to ask. I was treated rather badly there because I was perceived as a meanspirited Christian trolling their rooms and could not get an answer. But apparently one kind hearted soul, an elderly gentleman, decided to trust me and sent me an e-mail to explain that 'the Sabbath began when supper was on the table." I liked that answer.

(I wrote back to thank him and he and I communicated and discussed things for several years before he died late last year before last.)

That makes sense. I was raised to believe that God was logical and practical, rather than a stick-up-the-butt rules lawyer. The POINT is to remember the Sabbath and keep it holy, not to sit and stare at the second hand of your watch.

 

[CMike]

jesus lived during the time of the san hedrin... not after the destruction of the temple in 70 A.D.

rabbi was a generic term for teacher and still is.

There was no San Hedrin or Jewish court at that time.

I could be wrong, but it's my understanding that the gospels describe jesus' trial before the san hedrin. no?

Sanhedrin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They did. It's one more thing that they got wrong.

 

[Cecilie1200]

jesus lived during the time of the san hedrin... not after the destruction of the temple in 70 A.D.

rabbi was a generic term for teacher and still is.

There was no San Hedrin or Jewish court at that time.

I could be wrong, but it's my understanding that the gospels describe jesus' trial before the san hedrin. no?

Sanhedrin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

He was, indeed.

John 18:13-14, 24 tells us of a hearing before Annas, the father-in-law of Caiaphas, the high priest, who was formerly the high priest himself and arguably the most powerful man in Jewish affairs. Matthew 26:57 tells us of a hearing before Caiaphas. Mark 14:53 and 15:1 tells us of two hearings before the Sanhedrin. After this, He was taken to Pilate, the Roman.

 

[CMike]

well, i was raised in a kosher home where we went out for chinese food every sunday night. lol.. so i know the basics, but there's a lot i don't know. but the subject of religion always fascinates me.

Me too. I have never ever gotten bored with it. True story: some time back somebody in my class asked how an orthodox Jew would know the Sabbath had begun if he had no time piece on a cloudy day? I had no clue so I went to some on line Jewish chat rooms to ask. I was treated rather badly there because I was perceived as a meanspirited Christian trolling their rooms and could not get an answer. But apparently one kind hearted soul, an elderly gentleman, decided to trust me and sent me an e-mail to explain that 'the Sabbath began when supper was on the table." I liked that answer.

(I wrote back to thank him and he and I communicated and discussed things for several years before he died late last year before last.)

That makes sense. I was raised to believe that God was logical and practical, rather than a stick-up-the-butt rules lawyer. The POINT is to remember the Sabbath and keep it holy, not to sit and stare at the second hand of your watch.

Actually the exact time that the shabbat starts is critical for an orthodox jew. An orthodox jew can't turn off or on electricity when it's shabbat. Therefore, he needs to know when it starts.

These days almost all jewish calendars have the time for sunset for Friday night.

 

[CMike]

There was no San Hedrin or Jewish court at that time.

I could be wrong, but it's my understanding that the gospels describe jesus' trial before the san hedrin. no?

Sanhedrin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

He was, indeed.

John 18:13-14, 24 tells us of a hearing before Annas, the father-in-law of Caiaphas, the high priest, who was formerly the high priest himself and arguably the most powerful man in Jewish affairs. Matthew 26:57 tells us of a hearing before Caiaphas. Mark 14:53 and 15:1 tells us of two hearings before the Sanhedrin. After this, He was taken to Pilate, the Roman.

Fiction.

 

[jillian]

There was no San Hedrin or Jewish court at that time.

I could be wrong, but it's my understanding that the gospels describe jesus' trial before the san hedrin. no?

Sanhedrin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They did. It's one more thing that they got wrong.

my, admittedly rudimentary, knowledge on the subject and very, very quick research, indicates there was a greater and lesser sanhedrin and it's last binding act was the establishment of the jewish calendar.

can you explain why you think it didn't exist when jesus (or yeshua, as it were) was alive?

 

[CMike]

Now it is my turn to be taught I think.

My understanding is that the Kohan were chosen from among the Levite Tribe and were assigned the responsibilities of the Priesthood. So all Kohan are Levite but not all Levite are Kohanin which, if I'm remembering the history correctly, the title of Kohan was first assigned to Aaron, brother of Moses, as an 'everlasting covenant'. And it was indeed the Kohan who performed the priestly duties in the Tabernacle during the years of wandering in the desert.

From your perspective, how far off am I?

Well done.

see Marc's link for the history...

Thanks for the affirmation. I've been writing and teaching JudeoChristian history for years, but I am constantly revising the fine details and try to include as many different perspectives as possible. I figure we all have bits and pieces of the real deal on this stuff but none of us have it all totally figured out.

I think it's really very simple.

• Jesus was not the son of G-D. G-D made it clear in numerous passages that there is only him, and to not put your faith in anyone but him.
  
• The god becoming man thing doesn't work either -- . Jesus apparently spoke many times to the actual god, and said you have to go through him to get to god.
  
• Jesus wasn't the jewish messiah. He didn't fulfill the messianic prophesies which are in Michah 4:3 and Ezekiel 37. Also no jewish messiah would expect to be worshipped as that is a grave sin.
  
  

Who was jesus? Someone charismatic who turned some jews away from their G-D to worship him, and created a religion centered upon himself.

 

[Newby]

Well done.

see Marc's link for the history...

Thanks for the affirmation. I've been writing and teaching JudeoChristian history for years, but I am constantly revising the fine details and try to include as many different perspectives as possible. I figure we all have bits and pieces of the real deal on this stuff but none of us have it all totally figured out.

I think it's really very simple.

• Jesus was not the son of G-D. G-D made it clear in numerous passages that there is only him, and to not put your faith in anyone but him.
  
• The god becoming man thing doesn't work either -- . Jesus apparently spoke many times to the actual god, and said you have to go through him to get to god.
  
• Jesus wasn't the jewish messiah. He didn't fulfill the messianic prophesies which are in Michah 4:3 and Ezekiel 37. Also no jewish messiah would expect to be worshipped as that is a grave sin.
  
  

Who was jesus? Someone charismatic who turned some jews away from their G-D to worship him, and created a religion centered upon himself.

Then you also know that according to scripture you are condemned, because no mortal man could keep all of the laws.

 

[CMike]

Thanks for the affirmation. I've been writing and teaching JudeoChristian history for years, but I am constantly revising the fine details and try to include as many different perspectives as possible. I figure we all have bits and pieces of the real deal on this stuff but none of us have it all totally figured out.

I think it's really very simple.

• Jesus was not the son of G-D. G-D made it clear in numerous passages that there is only him, and to not put your faith in anyone but him.
  
• The god becoming man thing doesn't work either -- . Jesus apparently spoke many times to the actual god, and said you have to go through him to get to god.
  
• Jesus wasn't the jewish messiah. He didn't fulfill the messianic prophesies which are in Michah 4:3 and Ezekiel 37. Also no jewish messiah would expect to be worshipped as that is a grave sin.
  
  

Who was jesus? Someone charismatic who turned some jews away from their G-D to worship him, and created a religion centered upon himself.

Then you also know that according to scripture you are condemned, because no mortal man could keep all of the laws.

Whose scripture? Not mine.

 

[CMike]

I could be wrong, but it's my understanding that the gospels describe jesus' trial before the san hedrin. no?

Sanhedrin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They did. It's one more thing that they got wrong.

my, admittedly rudimentary, knowledge on the subject and very, very quick research, indicates there was a greater and lesser sanhedrin and it's last binding act was the establishment of the jewish calendar.

can you explain why you think it didn't exist when jesus (or yeshua, as it were) was alive?

A Sanhedrin (jewish court) could not exist when the jews were in exile, and didn't have it's own established government.

BTW Yeshua is Joshua, who was indeed a great jewish leader.

 

[CMike]

The Sanhedrin

The earliest record of a Sanhedrin is by Josephus who wrote of a political Sanhedrin convened by the Romans in 57 B.C.E. Hellenistic sources generally depict the Sanhedrin as a political and judicial council headed by the country’s ruler.


No jewish ruler (no jewish government), no Sanhedrin.

 

[Avatar4321]

There was Priesthood and Priests before Aaron was even thought of. Father Abraham paid His tithes to such a Priest. A Priesthood that was not hereditary

 

[DiveCon]

Because he WAS a trained Rabbi. Jesus was trained like any Jewish man.
The Bible is full of this. Try reading it as it is a great book.

My own understanding is that he was called 'rabbi' in the sense that he was a "teacher", not in the sense that he was ordained.

doesn't the Hebrew word "rabbi" mean "teacher"?

 

[CMike]

There was Priesthood and Priests before Aaron was even thought of. Father Abraham paid His tithes to such a Priest. A Priesthood that was not hereditary

Prove it.

Should be interesting since Abraham was the first Jew .

 

[DiveCon]

There was Priesthood and Priests before Aaron was even thought of. Father Abraham paid His tithes to such a Priest. A Priesthood that was not hereditary

Prove it.

Should be interesting since Abraham was the first Jew .

who do you think Melchizedek(SP?) was?

 

[Gadawg73]

I read or was told or taught that Rabbi meant teacher.

The fairy tale version.
Rabbi means Rabbi.
Ask any Jew.

I am a jew... rabbi means teacher. it can also be an ordained rabbi, but not necessarily.

To a Jew Rabbi means teacher as to a Christian Reverend means teacher.
Guess what they are a teacher of?
Their religion.
Jesus was a Rabbi and the Bible states it many times. Many Christians dispute that but the fact remains Jesus was a Rabbi. A Jewish Rabbi teaches the Jewish religion the same as a Christian Reverend teaches the Christian religion.
The claims that Jesus was NOT a Rabbi and was not Jewish are from Christians that refuse to admit Jesus WAS a Jew.
Guess why?

 

[CMike]

The fairy tale version.
Rabbi means Rabbi.
Ask any Jew.

I am a jew... rabbi means teacher. it can also be an ordained rabbi, but not necessarily.

To a Jew Rabbi means teacher as to a Christian Reverend means teacher.
Guess what they are a teacher of?
Their religion.
Jesus was a Rabbi and the Bible states it many times. Many Christians dispute that but the fact remains Jesus was a Rabbi. A Jewish Rabbi teaches the Jewish religion the same as a Christian Reverend teaches the Christian religion.
The claims that Jesus was NOT a Rabbi and was not Jewish are from Christians that refuse to admit Jesus WAS a Jew.
Guess why?

Whose bible says so? Certainly not the jewish bible.

Someone who teaches that a jew can only reach G-D by going through him is not teaching judaism. In fact, he is teaching the furthest thing from judaism. It's called idol worship.

Once again, his followers may call him King of Israel , that doesn't mean he actually was a king of Israel or the jews. It's all in the mind of his followers.

 

[CMike]

There was Priesthood and Priests before Aaron was even thought of. Father Abraham paid His tithes to such a Priest. A Priesthood that was not hereditary

Prove it.

Should be interesting since Abraham was the first Jew .

who do you think Melchizedek(SP?) was?

He was a goodly man for welcoming and blessing Abraham after his victories of the four kins who captured his nephew lot.

However, him being a "priest" has nothing to do with a jewish priest. Jewish priests occurred only after G-D set up the system with Aaron.

Abraham was the first jew.

 

[Gadawg73]

The title "Rabbi" in the first century Jewish society could refer to both Torah teachers (teachers of the Jewish law) AND sages/rabbis with s'mikah (authority). Jesus, who was clearly recognized by this title, would have fallen into ONE of those two categories but clearly, from scripture, it was the latter.
Let us look at the facts:
All through the Bible Jesus was recognized by 7 groups of society as having authority.
Mark 1:22 The people were amazed at his teaching, because he taught them as one who had authority, NOT AS THE TEACHER OF THE LAW
John the Baptist was also considered to be a similar sort of Rabbi as he also had disciples and followers.
Now you can argue all you want that Jesus was nor a traditional Rabbi in the midrash model of today but that was not practiced until after 70 AD, AFTER the time of Jesus.
Jesus was recognized in the Bible in numerous scriptures as having s'mikah by his disciples (Mark), Pharrisses (John), John the Baptists' disciples (John), everyday citizens and commoners(Mark), Torah teachers (Matthew), Herodians (Luke) and the Sadduccees (Matthew).
Jesus also refers to himself to that title in John and Luke.
You can not compare a Rabbi in the time of Jesus to a Jewish Orthodox Rabbi in today's world. It is not the same.