Why is jesus not a jew in churches?

[CMike]

The title "Rabbi" in the first century Jewish society could refer to both Torah teachers (teachers of the Jewish law) AND sages/rabbis with s'mikah (authority). Jesus, who was clearly recognized by this title, would have fallen into ONE of those two categories but clearly, from scripture, it was the latter.
Let us look at the facts:
All through the Bible Jesus was recognized by 7 groups of society as having authority.
Mark 1:22 The people were amazed at his teaching, because he taught them as one who had authority, NOT AS THE TEACHER OF THE LAW
John the Baptist was also considered to be a similar sort of Rabbi as he also had disciples and followers.
Now you can argue all you want that Jesus was nor a traditional Rabbi in the midrash model of today but that was not practiced until after 70 AD, AFTER the time of Jesus.
Jesus was recognized in the Bible in numerous scriptures as having s'mikah by his disciples (Mark), Pharrisses (John), John the Baptists' disciples (John), everyday citizens and commoners(Mark), Torah teachers (Matthew), Herodians (Luke) and the Sadduccees (Matthew).
Jesus also refers to himself to that title in John and Luke.
You can not compare a Rabbi in the time of Jesus to a Jewish Orthodox Rabbi in today's world. It is not the same.

A rabbi which means "teacher" is a jew who is ordained to teach jewish law.

Clearly jesus and his followers did not do this.

I realize he is the christian god so I guess christians can give him any title that they want too. However, he was not a rabbi.

 

[DiveCon]

Prove it.

Should be interesting since Abraham was the first Jew .

who do you think Melchizedek(SP?) was?

He was a goodly man for welcoming and blessing Abraham after his victories of the four kins who captured his nephew lot.

However, him being a "priest" has nothing to do with a jewish priest. Jewish priests occurred only after G-D set up the system with Aaron.

Abraham was the first jew.

no one said he was a "Jewish Priest"

and Abraham could not have been the first "Jew" since Jews are of the tribe of Judah(4th generation after Abraham)
that would make Judah the "first" Jew

 

[Gadawg73]

I am a jew... rabbi means teacher. it can also be an ordained rabbi, but not necessarily.

To a Jew Rabbi means teacher as to a Christian Reverend means teacher.
Guess what they are a teacher of?
Their religion.
Jesus was a Rabbi and the Bible states it many times. Many Christians dispute that but the fact remains Jesus was a Rabbi. A Jewish Rabbi teaches the Jewish religion the same as a Christian Reverend teaches the Christian religion.
The claims that Jesus was NOT a Rabbi and was not Jewish are from Christians that refuse to admit Jesus WAS a Jew.
Guess why?

Whose bible says so? Certainly not the jewish bible.

Someone who teaches that a jew can only reach G-D by going through him is not teaching judaism. In fact, he is teaching the furthest thing from judaism. It's called idol worship.

Once again, his followers may call him King of Israel , that doesn't mean he actually was a king of Israel or the jews. It's all in the mind of his followers.

Ok. If you say so.
The Bible says he had authority as a Rabbi.
And that is not a Torah teacher.
Secipture clearly states it.
Jesus was a Rabbi with more authority than a Torah teacher.

 

[CMike]

To a Jew Rabbi means teacher as to a Christian Reverend means teacher.
Guess what they are a teacher of?
Their religion.
Jesus was a Rabbi and the Bible states it many times. Many Christians dispute that but the fact remains Jesus was a Rabbi. A Jewish Rabbi teaches the Jewish religion the same as a Christian Reverend teaches the Christian religion.
The claims that Jesus was NOT a Rabbi and was not Jewish are from Christians that refuse to admit Jesus WAS a Jew.
Guess why?

Whose bible says so? Certainly not the jewish bible.

Someone who teaches that a jew can only reach G-D by going through him is not teaching judaism. In fact, he is teaching the furthest thing from judaism. It's called idol worship.

Once again, his followers may call him King of Israel , that doesn't mean he actually was a king of Israel or the jews. It's all in the mind of his followers.

Ok. If you say so.
The Bible says he had authority as a Rabbi.
And that is not a Torah teacher.
Secipture clearly states it.
Jesus was a Rabbi with more authority than a Torah teacher.

Whose scripture?

Are we talking about christianity or judaism?

I realize he is your god. That is your religion--christianity.

In judaism he had no relevance.

Your religion has no moral basis to tell me whom the leaders in my religion have been.

Jesus is as much a rabbi in my religion as Mohammed has been in yours.

 

[SFC Ollie]

I seem to remember hearing or being taught that the Jewish consider Jesus a prophet.

 

[Gadawg73]

The title "Rabbi" in the first century Jewish society could refer to both Torah teachers (teachers of the Jewish law) AND sages/rabbis with s'mikah (authority). Jesus, who was clearly recognized by this title, would have fallen into ONE of those two categories but clearly, from scripture, it was the latter.
Let us look at the facts:
All through the Bible Jesus was recognized by 7 groups of society as having authority.
Mark 1:22 The people were amazed at his teaching, because he taught them as one who had authority, NOT AS THE TEACHER OF THE LAW
John the Baptist was also considered to be a similar sort of Rabbi as he also had disciples and followers.
Now you can argue all you want that Jesus was nor a traditional Rabbi in the midrash model of today but that was not practiced until after 70 AD, AFTER the time of Jesus.
Jesus was recognized in the Bible in numerous scriptures as having s'mikah by his disciples (Mark), Pharrisses (John), John the Baptists' disciples (John), everyday citizens and commoners(Mark), Torah teachers (Matthew), Herodians (Luke) and the Sadduccees (Matthew).
Jesus also refers to himself to that title in John and Luke.
You can not compare a Rabbi in the time of Jesus to a Jewish Orthodox Rabbi in today's world. It is not the same.

A rabbi which means "teacher" is a jew who is ordained to teach jewish law.

Clearly jesus and his followers did not do this.

I realize he is the christian god so I guess christians can give him any title that they want too. However, he was not a rabbi.

If you can't read don't blame me.
There were two definitions of Rabbi before 70 AD.
A Torah teacher rabbi and a Rabbi with authority.
He was a Rabbi. Not by today's orthodox standards but we are talking 2000 years ago.
According to Hebrew tradition for a sage/rabbi, NOT a Torah teacher, to have s'mikah authority to make new teachings to interpret existing scriptures, he had to be recognized as a prophet from God himself, or as Aaron and Moses had traditionally given this authority to 70 elders, they HAD TO be recognized as having that s'mikah-the authority as a Rabbi, by TWO OTHER RABBIS with s'mikah.
That is JEWISH LAW brother. I do not make it up. I just report historical facts. You may not like the facts, that is your problem with comprehension skills, not mine, but this is history, NOT my or anyone else's belief.

 

[Kalam]

There were two definitions of Rabbi before 70 AD.
A Torah teacher rabbi and a Rabbi with authority.

Please cite a notable Hebrew lexicography or similarly credible source that says as much.

Attempting to tell other people what their own religion teaches them is generally not a good idea.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Soon, someone will be arguing that the Church ENCOURAGED Martin Luther, and has never excommunicated anyone for questioning church doctrine.

Yes, because the Catholic Church is the only Christian church in existence, and it is now and has always been exactly as it was in the Middle Ages.

 

[jillian]

I seem to remember hearing or being taught that the Jewish consider Jesus a prophet.

I was taught he was a great rabbi. Nothing about him being a prophet.

 

[CMike]

I seem to remember hearing or being taught that the Jewish consider Jesus a prophet.

They don't.

 

[jillian]

Then you also know that according to scripture you are condemned, because no mortal man could keep all of the laws.

Good thing I don't believe in a G-d who would condemn people for not following every law.

What a wacko pov.

 

[CMike]

The title "Rabbi" in the first century Jewish society could refer to both Torah teachers (teachers of the Jewish law) AND sages/rabbis with s'mikah (authority). Jesus, who was clearly recognized by this title, would have fallen into ONE of those two categories but clearly, from scripture, it was the latter.
Let us look at the facts:
All through the Bible Jesus was recognized by 7 groups of society as having authority.
Mark 1:22 The people were amazed at his teaching, because he taught them as one who had authority, NOT AS THE TEACHER OF THE LAW
John the Baptist was also considered to be a similar sort of Rabbi as he also had disciples and followers.
Now you can argue all you want that Jesus was nor a traditional Rabbi in the midrash model of today but that was not practiced until after 70 AD, AFTER the time of Jesus.
Jesus was recognized in the Bible in numerous scriptures as having s'mikah by his disciples (Mark), Pharrisses (John), John the Baptists' disciples (John), everyday citizens and commoners(Mark), Torah teachers (Matthew), Herodians (Luke) and the Sadduccees (Matthew).
Jesus also refers to himself to that title in John and Luke.
You can not compare a Rabbi in the time of Jesus to a Jewish Orthodox Rabbi in today's world. It is not the same.

A rabbi which means "teacher" is a jew who is ordained to teach jewish law.

Clearly jesus and his followers did not do this.

I realize he is the christian god so I guess christians can give him any title that they want too. However, he was not a rabbi.

If you can't read don't blame me.
There were two definitions of Rabbi before 70 AD.
A Torah teacher rabbi and a Rabbi with authority.
He was a Rabbi. Not by today's orthodox standards but we are talking 2000 years ago.
According to Hebrew tradition for a sage/rabbi, NOT a Torah teacher, to have s'mikah authority to make new teachings to interpret existing scriptures, he had to be recognized as a prophet from God himself, or as Aaron and Moses had traditionally given this authority to 70 elders, they HAD TO be recognized as having that s'mikah-the authority as a Rabbi, by TWO OTHER RABBIS with s'mikah.
That is JEWISH LAW brother. I do not make it up. I just report historical facts. You may not like the facts, that is your problem with comprehension skills, not mine, but this is history, NOT my or anyone else's belief.

You are making it up. Once again, you are trying to tell a jew, who their leaders are. And you are doing it wrongly.

A rabbi is an ordained teacher of jewish law. Period.

You can also be a rabbi with authority such as sitting on a jewish court or whatever.

However, a rabbi has a clear definition, which I posted.

 

[CMike]

I seem to remember hearing or being taught that the Jewish consider Jesus a prophet.

I was taught he was a great rabbi. Nothing about him being a prophet.

He wasn't great nor a rabbi. He was actually pretty horrible from a jewish point of view.

 

[CMike]

There were two definitions of Rabbi before 70 AD.
A Torah teacher rabbi and a Rabbi with authority.

Please cite a notable Hebrew lexicography or similarly credible source that says as much.

Attempting to tell other people what their own religion teaches them is generally not a good idea.

It really irritates me when Kalam is right about something.

 

[jillian]

He wasn't great nor a rabbi. He was actually pretty horrible from a jewish point of view.

I don't think so. Nor do I think he intended to be. Ultimaetly, it became terrible because of how it was misused by people.

 

[CMike]

Jesus told his followers that they must go through him to get to G-D and equated himself with G-D.

That violates at least 12 explicit passages where G-D said not to rely on anyone but him. It also violates the Ten Commandments.

Not only did he perpetuate idol worship. He made himself the idol.

To my knowledge there is nothing in jewish law that is a greater sin than that.

 

[Kalam]

There were two definitions of Rabbi before 70 AD.
A Torah teacher rabbi and a Rabbi with authority.

Please cite a notable Hebrew lexicography or similarly credible source that says as much.

Attempting to tell other people what their own religion teaches them is generally not a good idea.

It really irritates me when Kalam is right about something.

You must be pissed all the time.

 

[CMike]

Please cite a notable Hebrew lexicography or similarly credible source that says as much.

Attempting to tell other people what their own religion teaches them is generally not a good idea.

It really irritates me when Kalam is right about something.

You must be pissed all the time.

I gotta admit that was funny

 

[Gadawg73]

There were two definitions of Rabbi before 70 AD.
A Torah teacher rabbi and a Rabbi with authority.

Please cite a notable Hebrew lexicography or similarly credible source that says as much.

Attempting to tell other people what their own religion teaches them is generally not a good idea.

I am not doing that.
I am quoting Hebrew history.
Show me where I am wrong.
If you do not know that s'mikah is authority in Hebrew then I can not teach you either.

 

[Kalam]

There were two definitions of Rabbi before 70 AD.
A Torah teacher rabbi and a Rabbi with authority.

Please cite a notable Hebrew lexicography or similarly credible source that says as much.

Attempting to tell other people what their own religion teaches them is generally not a good idea.

I am not doing that.
I am quoting Hebrew history.

But did you support your claims with outside information?