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I dunno, maybe it is me, but I see a lot of hostility from the rightwingloons on this thread toward Jews. And that is surprising since they pretend to be the champions of Israel.
Fox and I have been having a mature conversion, I believe it is Mike that has been very insulting and hostile towards our posts.
Again I'm not going to fight with you about it Cmike. I appreciate that you disagree.
But surely you know that Jew can mean a religion or it can mean a race. Those Jews who accepted Jesus of Nazareth as the Messiah, as God, as their savior were absolutely Christian Jews.
I did not say the Jews were wrong to want their freedom. Nobody is wrong to want their freedom. I said they were imprudent in choosing to go for it against such overwhelming odds. One can be righteous, right, principled, and pure of heart and mind and still be imprudent.
I really am sorry that you are unable to discuss these things without such anger. It must be very difficult dealing with so much constant angst.
I'll answer Gadawg too in this post.
There is no such thing as being a christian jew. You have to pick your G-D. You either worship G-D or jesus, you can't worship both.
We learns this from Kings 1 18
21. And Elijah drew near to all the people and said, "Until when are you hopping between two ideas? If the Lord is God, go after Him, and if the Baal, go after him." And the people did not answer him a word.
You gotta big, you can't have both. You are either christian and worship jesus, or you are jewish, and worship only G-D. You can not have both.
Pot kettle.Again I'm not going to fight with you about it Cmike. I appreciate that you disagree.
But surely you know that Jew can mean a religion or it can mean a race. Those Jews who accepted Jesus of Nazareth as the Messiah, as God, as their savior were absolutely Christian Jews.
I did not say the Jews were wrong to want their freedom. Nobody is wrong to want their freedom. I said they were imprudent in choosing to go for it against such overwhelming odds. One can be righteous, right, principled, and pure of heart and mind and still be imprudent.
I really am sorry that you are unable to discuss these things without such anger. It must be very difficult dealing with so much constant angst.
It's rather arrogant to tell other people about their own religion.
Also jews fighting against overwhelming odds is why the jews have a state in Israel.
I dunno, maybe it is me, but I see a lot of hostility from the rightwingloons on this thread toward Jews. And that is surprising since they pretend to be the champions of Israel.
It's just you apparently.
Poor misunderstood roman oppressor conquerors against the unruly jews who revolted against the kind roman governorship over their lives
The spin is almost unfathomable.
It's almost like saying those kind loving misunderstood nazis, if only the jews weren't so unruly they wouldn't have been exterminated.
Mike, what religion were the first Christians from?
Jewish?
That is why some call them "Christian Jews".
Why freak out dude?
That is historical fact.
What other religion were the first Christians.?
Again I'm not going to fight with you about it Cmike. I appreciate that you disagree.
But surely you know that Jew can mean a religion or it can mean a race. Those Jews who accepted Jesus of Nazareth as the Messiah, as God, as their savior were absolutely Christian Jews.
I did not say the Jews were wrong to want their freedom. Nobody is wrong to want their freedom. I said they were imprudent in choosing to go for it against such overwhelming odds. One can be righteous, right, principled, and pure of heart and mind and still be imprudent.
I really am sorry that you are unable to discuss these things without such anger. It must be very difficult dealing with so much constant angst.
I'll answer Gadawg too in this post.
There is no such thing as being a christian jew. You have to pick your G-D. You either worship G-D or jesus, you can't worship both.
We learns this from Kings 1 18
21. And Elijah drew near to all the people and said, "Until when are you hopping between two ideas? If the Lord is God, go after Him, and if the Baal, go after him." And the people did not answer him a word.
You gotta big, you can't have both. You are either christian and worship jesus, or you are jewish, and worship only G-D. You can not have both.
They are one and the same, you clearly do not understand Christianity.
Pot kettle.Again I'm not going to fight with you about it Cmike. I appreciate that you disagree.
But surely you know that Jew can mean a religion or it can mean a race. Those Jews who accepted Jesus of Nazareth as the Messiah, as God, as their savior were absolutely Christian Jews.
I did not say the Jews were wrong to want their freedom. Nobody is wrong to want their freedom. I said they were imprudent in choosing to go for it against such overwhelming odds. One can be righteous, right, principled, and pure of heart and mind and still be imprudent.
I really am sorry that you are unable to discuss these things without such anger. It must be very difficult dealing with so much constant angst.
It's rather arrogant to tell other people about their own religion.
Also jews fighting against overwhelming odds is why the jews have a state in Israel.
The Romans drove most of the Jews from Jerusalem in or close to 70 AD.
The Jews could not call Israel their land again for more than 1800 years.
I have not presumed to tell you or anybody else about 'your' religion.
I am telling people about MY religion and MY understanding of the events that are important to it.
If you think that improper, I suggest you would appear less hypcritical if you would not utter or type another word about Christianity.
but they would still be ethnically JewishJews are not just a religion
does a Jew cease to be a Jew if they become atheist?
Sure, you could talk about culture or tradition. I was responding only to the religious aspect of it. If a Jew becomes an atheist or another mutually exclusive religion, they are by definition no longer religiously Jewish.
so a Christian Jew would be someone ethnically Jewish and a Christian
so then there can be no atheistic Jewsbut they would still be ethnically JewishSure, you could talk about culture or tradition. I was responding only to the religious aspect of it. If a Jew becomes an atheist or another mutually exclusive religion, they are by definition no longer religiously Jewish.
so a Christian Jew would be someone ethnically Jewish and a Christian
A jew is someone with a jewish mother or converts to judaism.
However, if a jew worships a different god like jesus, he is no longer considered a jew by jews.
The proof for that is the passage I quoted in Kings I, where Elijah tells the people to pick betwen G-D and Baal. They can't have both.
I am unsure.so then there can be no atheistic Jewsbut they would still be ethnically Jewish
so a Christian Jew would be someone ethnically Jewish and a Christian
A jew is someone with a jewish mother or converts to judaism.
However, if a jew worships a different god like jesus, he is no longer considered a jew by jews.
The proof for that is the passage I quoted in Kings I, where Elijah tells the people to pick betwen G-D and Baal. They can't have both.
but they would still be ethnically JewishJews are not just a religion
does a Jew cease to be a Jew if they become atheist?
Sure, you could talk about culture or tradition. I was responding only to the religious aspect of it. If a Jew becomes an atheist or another mutually exclusive religion, they are by definition no longer religiously Jewish.
so a Christian Jew would be someone ethnically Jewish and a Christian
but they would still be ethnically JewishSure, you could talk about culture or tradition. I was responding only to the religious aspect of it. If a Jew becomes an atheist or another mutually exclusive religion, they are by definition no longer religiously Jewish.
so a Christian Jew would be someone ethnically Jewish and a Christian
I don't think Jews who accept Jesus Christ as their Savior ever stop seeing themselves as Jews. Certainly those First Century Jews did not stop being Jews when they became Christians. In studying the writings of Paul of Tarsus, you can see his understanding that Jesus paid the price and covered the sins of the people that now live by faith and the leading of the Holy Spirit and not by the old Jewish law, but he was too much of a Jew to discard the Law and here and there he goes back to rescue it and restore respectability to it.
The simple fact is that the Christian "New Testament" cannot be accurately comprehended without a good grounding in what we refer to as the "Old Testament". Most Christians do not separate Christianity and Judaism but see Christianity as a continuation of Judaism. Many of our customs, traditions, and liturgies are taken from those ancient Jewish traditions.
I'll answer Gadawg too in this post.
There is no such thing as being a christian jew. You have to pick your G-D. You either worship G-D or jesus, you can't worship both.
We learns this from Kings 1 18
21. And Elijah drew near to all the people and said, "Until when are you hopping between two ideas? If the Lord is God, go after Him, and if the Baal, go after him." And the people did not answer him a word.
You gotta big, you can't have both. You are either christian and worship jesus, or you are jewish, and worship only G-D. You can not have both.
They are one and the same, you clearly do not understand Christianity.
Obviously they are not.
According to jesus, he prayed to god, and talked to god. That means that they were two separate entities.
Your god is not my god.
Also something else I wanted to deal with.
The true jewish heroes were the ones that took toture and death rather than convert to Christianity.
One of the most famous was a person called Rabbi Akiva. He was burned at the stake and the christians made sure it was a slow death.
As he was dying he telled out the most important prayer in judaism "Hear O'Israel The Lord is our G-D, The Lord is One".
What does jesus say "G-D why have you forsaken me"?
That is another difference between a true jewish leader/hero, and someone whom is not.
My brother in law was Jewish and he married my sister in law who was Catholic.
What are their kids Mike if neither of the parents practices religion?
From Jewish and Christian backgrounds.
Their two kids had the traditional Jewish barmitzvahs. (after the younger one had his and my family was invited my oldest son had so much fun he asked "Daddy,can I be Jewish?)
I never said there were Jews practicing both religions.
However, the first Christians were predominantly from Jewish communities and backgrounds.
Why you dodge that is beyond me but religion is probably the cause.
And that is what fucks up the world.
My brother in law was Jewish and he married my sister in law who was Catholic.
What are their kids Mike if neither of the parents practices religion?
From Jewish and Christian backgrounds.
Their two kids had the traditional Jewish barmitzvahs. (after the younger one had his and my family was invited my oldest son had so much fun he asked "Daddy,can I be Jewish?)
I never said there were Jews practicing both religions.
However, the first Christians were predominantly from Jewish communities and backgrounds.
Why you dodge that is beyond me but religion is probably the cause.
And that is what fucks up the world.
I'll answer Gadawg too in this post.
There is no such thing as being a christian jew. You have to pick your G-D. You either worship G-D or jesus, you can't worship both.
We learns this from Kings 1 18
21. And Elijah drew near to all the people and said, "Until when are you hopping between two ideas? If the Lord is God, go after Him, and if the Baal, go after him." And the people did not answer him a word.
You gotta big, you can't have both. You are either christian and worship jesus, or you are jewish, and worship only G-D. You can not have both.
They are one and the same, you clearly do not understand Christianity.
Obviously they are not.
According to jesus, he prayed to god, and talked to god. That means that they were two separate entities.Your god is not my god.
Also something else I wanted to deal with.
The true jewish heroes were the ones that took toture and death rather than convert to Christianity.
One of the most famous was a person called Rabbi Akiva. He was burned at the stake and the christians made sure it was a slow death.
As he was dying he telled out the most important prayer in judaism "Hear O'Israel The Lord is our G-D, The Lord is One".
What does jesus say "G-D why have you forsaken me"?
That is another difference between a true jewish leader/hero, and someone whom is not.
If Jesus is God, then who did He pray to?
by Matt Slick
This is a very common question and the answer is found in understanding the Trinity and the incarnation of Jesus.
The Trinity is the doctrine that there is only one God in all existence. This one God exists as three persons: The Father, The Son, and the Holy Spirit. They are not three gods, but one God. Each is a separate person, yet each of them is, in essence, divine in nature.
A close analogy of the Trinity can be found by looking at the concept of time. Time is past, present, and future. There are three "aspects" or "parts" of time. This does not mean that there are three "times," but only one. Each is separate, in a sense, yet each shares the same nature, or essence. In a similar way, the Trinity is three separate persons who share the same nature.
The Incarnation
The doctrine of the incarnation in Christian teaching is that Jesus, who is the second person of the Trinity, added to himself human nature and became a man.
The Bible says that Jesus is God in flesh, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.....and the word became flesh and dwelt among us," (John 1:1, 14); and, "For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form," (Col. 2:9). Jesus, therefore, has two natures. He is both God and man.
Jesus is completely human, but He also has a divine nature.
GOD MAN
He is worshiped (Matt. 2:2,11; 14:33; 28:9)
He is prayed to (Acts 7:59; 1 Cor. 1:2)
He was called God (John 20:28; Heb. 1:8)
He was called Son of God (Mark 1:1)
He is sinless (1 Pet. 2:22; Heb. 4:15)
He knew all things (John 21:17)
He gives eternal life (John 20:28)
The fullness of deity dwells in Him (Col. 2:9)
He worshiped the Father (John 17)
He prayed to the Father (John 17:1)
He was called man (Mark 15:39; John 19:5).
He was called Son of Man (John 9:35-37)
He was tempted (Matt. 4:1)
He grew in wisdom (Luke 2:52)
He died (Rom. 5:8)
He has a body of flesh and bones (Luke 24:39)
As a man, Jesus needed to pray. When He was praying he was not praying to Himself, but to God the Father.
since Christian had no real authority until Constantine, and then not till later in his life and this man(Rabbi Akiva) died over 100 years before Constantine was born, just how did Christians have anything to do with his deathThey are one and the same, you clearly do not understand Christianity.
Obviously they are not.
According to jesus, he prayed to god, and talked to god. That means that they were two separate entities.
Your god is not my god.
Also something else I wanted to deal with.
The true jewish heroes were the ones that took toture and death rather than convert to Christianity.
One of the most famous was a person called Rabbi Akiva. He was burned at the stake and the christians made sure it was a slow death.
As he was dying he telled out the most important prayer in judaism "Hear O'Israel The Lord is our G-D, The Lord is One".
What does jesus say "G-D why have you forsaken me"?
That is another difference between a true jewish leader/hero, and someone whom is not.
Where is what I bolded documented?
since Christian had no real authority until Constantine, and then not till later in his life and this man(Rabbi Akiva) died over 100 years before Constantine was born, just how did Christians have anything to do with his deathObviously they are not.
According to jesus, he prayed to god, and talked to god. That means that they were two separate entities.
Your god is not my god.
Also something else I wanted to deal with.
The true jewish heroes were the ones that took toture and death rather than convert to Christianity.
One of the most famous was a person called Rabbi Akiva. He was burned at the stake and the christians made sure it was a slow death.
As he was dying he telled out the most important prayer in judaism "Hear O'Israel The Lord is our G-D, The Lord is One".
What does jesus say "G-D why have you forsaken me"?
That is another difference between a true jewish leader/hero, and someone whom is not.
Where is what I bolded documented?
Akiva ben Joseph - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
