Wish Kasich would just switch parties and get it over with

[DJT for Life]

So, what you guys are really saying is Conservatives don't really control all those state houses or the senate or the House?

No. We're saying you only control governorships in 15 states and only have
total legislative control of 5 states.

But you guys constantly tell us about all those RINOs who might as well be liberal Democrats.

Actually, we keep telling you that you've lost over 1,040 seats of
government since Zero took over.

We maybe electing far right folks, tea party folks, moderates, even populists
but nobody except those loons on the West Coast are electing dems.

Nothing personal you understand...but y'all bruise too easily.

The numbers don't look so bad for the Democrats when you add up all the RINO's like Kasich though, do they?

The numbers remain the same. 35-15.

Kasich is pretty much shot in Ohio and he knows it. He acted like
a whining baby after the primary. (Doing his John McCain impersonation
I guess) He basically worked against Trump getting the Ohio vote in the
General Election. Ohio...the toss-up state...Trump won by 8%.

That showed Kasich his power in Ohio. He's running in circles right
now. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if a photo gets released showing
Kasich and McCain engaged in heavy homo sex.

 

[Aldo Raine]

Funny we have had a republican controlled congress for many years. We have had a completely republican government for many months. Yet the debt ceiling is going to be increased and they are demanding to spend more on a wall. Wake up already.

The wall would cost anywhere from 10 to 30 billion dollars depending on what figures you use. It's a one time expense that will pay for itself eventually by not having to hire more border agents, supporting these illegals, not having to conduct court hearings to deport them, and medical expenses we have to pay for.

In contrast, we spent over 70 billion dollars on food stamps in 2016, and even more per year during the previous years.

So even if we spent half of what we spend on food stamps in one year for a wall, it would be the best wall with the latest technologies. It's called an investment.

Ok so repubs are increasing spending on a wall we don't need. Supposedly immigration is already way down right? I think the economy would be better served by hiring more border agents than building a wall btw. And I sure don't see them doing anything about this food stamp spending you are talking about. So yes, they are INCREASING spending. Amazing they blatantly spend and dopes like you are blind to it.

No, you are blind. Ever since Republicans took leadership of Congress and most of the governorships in states, food stamp spending did decrease. If you don't believe me, look up Maine's food stamp requirements or Georgia.

Not needing a wall is the leftist opinion. We on the right believe the exact opposite. Our border agents side with the Republicans idea of a wall. That's why (for the first time) they actually endorsed a Republican presidential candidate. I think they know more about what we need to control immigration than you do.

Democrats and RINO's are stopping us from spending unnecessary money. We don't need to fund Planned Parenthood. We don't need to fund PBS or NPR. We don't need to fund Commie Care. If we had the power to stop funding for all this nonsense, we could build a wall on every border in our country and still have money left over.

Is Mexico going to pay for it as promised?

Don't know. We are not even near that point yet. The Democrats threaded to shut down the government if we tried.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

OK so you honestly believe that Mexico is going to cut a check for this border wall? And they going to like it as well, as promised?

 

[NYcarbineer]

Gee what happened to that vaunted conservative TOLERANCE for differing opinions that conservatives are always trying to rub liberals' noses in?

What happened was that with people like Kasich, McCain, McConnell etc. etc. "differing opinion" has morphed into covert - Hell no, - overt sabotage.

That's sort of what I said, regarding the conservative attitude towards those they don't wholly agree with...

...you consider them the enemy.

 

[Siete]

Wish Kasich would just switch parties and get it over with


like Trump did ?




SUCKERS.

 

[g5000]

I WAS a Kasich supporter. I supported him for his reelection as Governor, and I supported him for his presidential bid. But now I regret and am even ashamed that I did.

Besides his childish behavior during the primaries, he not only went back on his word to support whoever the Republican nominee might be, he also didn't attend the RNC held by his own party in his very own state. Afterwards had nothing kind to say about our new President. But now he's gone off the deep end.

Gov. John Kasich blasts President Donald Trump, invites immigrant 'Dreamers' to Ohio

Who does this clown think he is anyway? Does he now believe he's the king of Ohio where he can say "And, by the way, if the Dreamers want to go somewhere and live? Come to Ohio. We want all the immigrants to come to Ohio, because we know how much they contribute to America."

Who is this "we" that he's talking about here? There is no "we" that feels this way, there is you and speak for yourself! I would expect a statement like this out of California, Massachusetts or New York, but not out of my state of Ohio.

Kasich is finished as Governor because he can only serve two terms; not that he would get reelected again anyway, but I seriously doubt he will just go away. If he runs for any other public office, he should just switch to the Democrat party first and get it over with. After all, Republicans have no use for this guy anymore, and so it seems, Democrat voters really like him. Now I can understand why. He's petulant, feels he's entitled, thinks like a liberal, and has little in the way of integrity.

I am also a Republican who refuses to support Trump. Trump is a thieving liar and a purely evil person. I am not going to support someone just because he recently taped an R at the end of his name so he could hoax the pseudocons for his personal gain. The man stood opposed to every conservative cause until he decided he had a better shot as a Republican.

Don't be one of those idiots who suffers from a serious false dichotomy. Don't assume if someone is opposed to Trump, they have to support Clinton and/or the Democrats.

Nope. Not even close.

Trump is the big supporter of the Clintons. Always has been. He's been their friend for a very long time, and even wished Hillary would be President one day.

It astounds me ANYONE could be fooled by this obviously blatant huckster, much less millions.

There are a lot more retards in this country than I realized.

A lot more.

 

[Aldo Raine]

I WAS a Kasich supporter. I supported him for his reelection as Governor, and I supported him for his presidential bid. But now I regret and am even ashamed that I did.

Besides his childish behavior during the primaries, he not only went back on his word to support whoever the Republican nominee might be, he also didn't attend the RNC held by his own party in his very own state. Afterwards had nothing kind to say about our new President. But now he's gone off the deep end.

Gov. John Kasich blasts President Donald Trump, invites immigrant 'Dreamers' to Ohio

Who does this clown think he is anyway? Does he now believe he's the king of Ohio where he can say "And, by the way, if the Dreamers want to go somewhere and live? Come to Ohio. We want all the immigrants to come to Ohio, because we know how much they contribute to America."

Who is this "we" that he's talking about here? There is no "we" that feels this way, there is you and speak for yourself! I would expect a statement like this out of California, Massachusetts or New York, but not out of my state of Ohio.

Kasich is finished as Governor because he can only serve two terms; not that he would get reelected again anyway, but I seriously doubt he will just go away. If he runs for any other public office, he should just switch to the Democrat party first and get it over with. After all, Republicans have no use for this guy anymore, and so it seems, Democrat voters really like him. Now I can understand why. He's petulant, feels he's entitled, thinks like a liberal, and has little in the way of integrity.

I am also a Republican who refuses to support Trump. Trump is a thieving liar and a purely evil person. I am not going to support someone just because he recently taped an R at the end of his name so he could hoax the pseudocons for his personal gain. The man stood opposed to every conservative cause until he decided he had a better shot as a Republican.

Don't be one of those idiots who suffers from a serious false dichotomy. Don't assume if someone is opposed to Trump, they have to support Clinton and/or the Democrats.

Nope. Not even close.

This pretty much says it, end thread!

 

[g5000]

Hey, where do I register as a Republican?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I WAS a Kasich supporter. I supported him for his reelection as Governor, and I supported him for his presidential bid. But now I regret and am even ashamed that I did.

Besides his childish behavior during the primaries, he not only went back on his word to support whoever the Republican nominee might be, he also didn't attend the RNC held by his own party in his very own state. Afterwards had nothing kind to say about our new President. But now he's gone off the deep end.

Gov. John Kasich blasts President Donald Trump, invites immigrant 'Dreamers' to Ohio

Who does this clown think he is anyway? Does he now believe he's the king of Ohio where he can say "And, by the way, if the Dreamers want to go somewhere and live? Come to Ohio. We want all the immigrants to come to Ohio, because we know how much they contribute to America."

Who is this "we" that he's talking about here? There is no "we" that feels this way, there is you and speak for yourself! I would expect a statement like this out of California, Massachusetts or New York, but not out of my state of Ohio.

Kasich is finished as Governor because he can only serve two terms; not that he would get reelected again anyway, but I seriously doubt he will just go away. If he runs for any other public office, he should just switch to the Democrat party first and get it over with. After all, Republicans have no use for this guy anymore, and so it seems, Democrat voters really like him. Now I can understand why. He's petulant, feels he's entitled, thinks like a liberal, and has little in the way of integrity.

I am also a Republican who refuses to support Trump. Trump is a thieving liar and a purely evil person. I am not going to support someone just because he recently taped an R at the end of his name so he could hoax the pseudocons for his personal gain. The man stood opposed to every conservative cause until he decided he had a better shot as a Republican.

Don't be one of those idiots who suffers from a serious false dichotomy. Don't assume if someone is opposed to Trump, they have to support Clinton and/or the Democrats.

Nope. Not even close.

Trump is the big supporter of the Clintons. Always has been. He's been their friend for a very long time, and even wished Hillary would be President one day.

It astounds me ANYONE could be fooled by this obviously blatant huckster, much less millions.

There are a lot more retards in this country than I realized.

A lot more.

And your rant is on behalf of Kasich?????

If you're going to look for a Republican that stood with Republicans on every issue, you will be looking a long time. That's besides the fact that most everybody realizes Trump is not conservative and never was. He got voted in because of the issues he was conservative about mostly on the border and of course a great Supreme Court judge among the many he has to pick.

And what personal gain does Trump get from being President? He's losing money every day and in fact, donated his first two quarterly paychecks as President.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

The wall would cost anywhere from 10 to 30 billion dollars depending on what figures you use. It's a one time expense that will pay for itself eventually by not having to hire more border agents, supporting these illegals, not having to conduct court hearings to deport them, and medical expenses we have to pay for.

In contrast, we spent over 70 billion dollars on food stamps in 2016, and even more per year during the previous years.

So even if we spent half of what we spend on food stamps in one year for a wall, it would be the best wall with the latest technologies. It's called an investment.

Ok so repubs are increasing spending on a wall we don't need. Supposedly immigration is already way down right? I think the economy would be better served by hiring more border agents than building a wall btw. And I sure don't see them doing anything about this food stamp spending you are talking about. So yes, they are INCREASING spending. Amazing they blatantly spend and dopes like you are blind to it.

No, you are blind. Ever since Republicans took leadership of Congress and most of the governorships in states, food stamp spending did decrease. If you don't believe me, look up Maine's food stamp requirements or Georgia.

Not needing a wall is the leftist opinion. We on the right believe the exact opposite. Our border agents side with the Republicans idea of a wall. That's why (for the first time) they actually endorsed a Republican presidential candidate. I think they know more about what we need to control immigration than you do.

Democrats and RINO's are stopping us from spending unnecessary money. We don't need to fund Planned Parenthood. We don't need to fund PBS or NPR. We don't need to fund Commie Care. If we had the power to stop funding for all this nonsense, we could build a wall on every border in our country and still have money left over.

Is Mexico going to pay for it as promised?

Don't know. We are not even near that point yet. The Democrats threaded to shut down the government if we tried.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

OK so you honestly believe that Mexico is going to cut a check for this border wall? And they going to like it as well, as promised?

I don't know and it's secondary of my concerns. My main concern is getting the wall built and then see who pays for it. Either way I don't really care.

 

[Aldo Raine]

Ok so repubs are increasing spending on a wall we don't need. Supposedly immigration is already way down right? I think the economy would be better served by hiring more border agents than building a wall btw. And I sure don't see them doing anything about this food stamp spending you are talking about. So yes, they are INCREASING spending. Amazing they blatantly spend and dopes like you are blind to it.

No, you are blind. Ever since Republicans took leadership of Congress and most of the governorships in states, food stamp spending did decrease. If you don't believe me, look up Maine's food stamp requirements or Georgia.

Not needing a wall is the leftist opinion. We on the right believe the exact opposite. Our border agents side with the Republicans idea of a wall. That's why (for the first time) they actually endorsed a Republican presidential candidate. I think they know more about what we need to control immigration than you do.

Democrats and RINO's are stopping us from spending unnecessary money. We don't need to fund Planned Parenthood. We don't need to fund PBS or NPR. We don't need to fund Commie Care. If we had the power to stop funding for all this nonsense, we could build a wall on every border in our country and still have money left over.

Is Mexico going to pay for it as promised?

Don't know. We are not even near that point yet. The Democrats threaded to shut down the government if we tried.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

OK so you honestly believe that Mexico is going to cut a check for this border wall? And they going to like it as well, as promised?

I don't know and it's secondary of my concerns. My main concern is getting the wall built and then see who pays for it. Either way I don't really care.

So he lied to you, you know he lied to you and you love it. Makes sense, carry on!

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I WAS a Kasich supporter. I supported him for his reelection as Governor, and I supported him for his presidential bid. But now I regret and am even ashamed that I did.

Besides his childish behavior during the primaries, he not only went back on his word to support whoever the Republican nominee might be, he also didn't attend the RNC held by his own party in his very own state. Afterwards had nothing kind to say about our new President. But now he's gone off the deep end.

Gov. John Kasich blasts President Donald Trump, invites immigrant 'Dreamers' to Ohio

Who does this clown think he is anyway? Does he now believe he's the king of Ohio where he can say "And, by the way, if the Dreamers want to go somewhere and live? Come to Ohio. We want all the immigrants to come to Ohio, because we know how much they contribute to America."

Who is this "we" that he's talking about here? There is no "we" that feels this way, there is you and speak for yourself! I would expect a statement like this out of California, Massachusetts or New York, but not out of my state of Ohio.

Kasich is finished as Governor because he can only serve two terms; not that he would get reelected again anyway, but I seriously doubt he will just go away. If he runs for any other public office, he should just switch to the Democrat party first and get it over with. After all, Republicans have no use for this guy anymore, and so it seems, Democrat voters really like him. Now I can understand why. He's petulant, feels he's entitled, thinks like a liberal, and has little in the way of integrity.

So you want a pro-2nd amendment guy who wants to defund Planned Parenthood and lower Social Security benefits to become a Democrat and be welcome there, only because he's not as super bat-shit right-wing crazy as you are?

No.

Well then I guess nobody wants him and maybe he should get out of politics. The less people like him in politics, the better.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

So we need less people who seem to get things done and more trumps who get nothing done. Funny.

Funny how you are in a political forum without the slightest idea of how our system of government works.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

No, you are blind. Ever since Republicans took leadership of Congress and most of the governorships in states, food stamp spending did decrease. If you don't believe me, look up Maine's food stamp requirements or Georgia.

Not needing a wall is the leftist opinion. We on the right believe the exact opposite. Our border agents side with the Republicans idea of a wall. That's why (for the first time) they actually endorsed a Republican presidential candidate. I think they know more about what we need to control immigration than you do.

Democrats and RINO's are stopping us from spending unnecessary money. We don't need to fund Planned Parenthood. We don't need to fund PBS or NPR. We don't need to fund Commie Care. If we had the power to stop funding for all this nonsense, we could build a wall on every border in our country and still have money left over.

Is Mexico going to pay for it as promised?

Don't know. We are not even near that point yet. The Democrats threaded to shut down the government if we tried.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

OK so you honestly believe that Mexico is going to cut a check for this border wall? And they going to like it as well, as promised?

I don't know and it's secondary of my concerns. My main concern is getting the wall built and then see who pays for it. Either way I don't really care.

So he lied to you, you know he lied to you and you love it. Makes sense, carry on!

That's right, he said I could keep my doctor and insurance, and I couldn't. Oh wait............

 

[Aldo Raine]

Is Mexico going to pay for it as promised?

Don't know. We are not even near that point yet. The Democrats threaded to shut down the government if we tried.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

OK so you honestly believe that Mexico is going to cut a check for this border wall? And they going to like it as well, as promised?

I don't know and it's secondary of my concerns. My main concern is getting the wall built and then see who pays for it. Either way I don't really care.

So he lied to you, you know he lied to you and you love it. Makes sense, carry on!

That's right, he said I could keep my doctor and insurance, and I couldn't. Oh wait............

There it is, bbbbbbbbut Obama!never change bro, your comedy gold EVERY DAY!

 

[Brain357]

I WAS a Kasich supporter. I supported him for his reelection as Governor, and I supported him for his presidential bid. But now I regret and am even ashamed that I did.

Besides his childish behavior during the primaries, he not only went back on his word to support whoever the Republican nominee might be, he also didn't attend the RNC held by his own party in his very own state. Afterwards had nothing kind to say about our new President. But now he's gone off the deep end.

Gov. John Kasich blasts President Donald Trump, invites immigrant 'Dreamers' to Ohio

Who does this clown think he is anyway? Does he now believe he's the king of Ohio where he can say "And, by the way, if the Dreamers want to go somewhere and live? Come to Ohio. We want all the immigrants to come to Ohio, because we know how much they contribute to America."

Who is this "we" that he's talking about here? There is no "we" that feels this way, there is you and speak for yourself! I would expect a statement like this out of California, Massachusetts or New York, but not out of my state of Ohio.

Kasich is finished as Governor because he can only serve two terms; not that he would get reelected again anyway, but I seriously doubt he will just go away. If he runs for any other public office, he should just switch to the Democrat party first and get it over with. After all, Republicans have no use for this guy anymore, and so it seems, Democrat voters really like him. Now I can understand why. He's petulant, feels he's entitled, thinks like a liberal, and has little in the way of integrity.

So you want a pro-2nd amendment guy who wants to defund Planned Parenthood and lower Social Security benefits to become a Democrat and be welcome there, only because he's not as super bat-shit right-wing crazy as you are?

No.

Well then I guess nobody wants him and maybe he should get out of politics. The less people like him in politics, the better.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

So we need less people who seem to get things done and more trumps who get nothing done. Funny.

Funny how you are in a political forum without the slightest idea of how our system of government works.

I remember back when things got done. You know before repubs controlled congress..

 

[frigidweirdo]

I WAS a Kasich supporter. I supported him for his reelection as Governor, and I supported him for his presidential bid. But now I regret and am even ashamed that I did.

Besides his childish behavior during the primaries, he not only went back on his word to support whoever the Republican nominee might be, he also didn't attend the RNC held by his own party in his very own state. Afterwards had nothing kind to say about our new President. But now he's gone off the deep end.

Gov. John Kasich blasts President Donald Trump, invites immigrant 'Dreamers' to Ohio

Who does this clown think he is anyway? Does he now believe he's the king of Ohio where he can say "And, by the way, if the Dreamers want to go somewhere and live? Come to Ohio. We want all the immigrants to come to Ohio, because we know how much they contribute to America."

Who is this "we" that he's talking about here? There is no "we" that feels this way, there is you and speak for yourself! I would expect a statement like this out of California, Massachusetts or New York, but not out of my state of Ohio.

Kasich is finished as Governor because he can only serve two terms; not that he would get reelected again anyway, but I seriously doubt he will just go away. If he runs for any other public office, he should just switch to the Democrat party first and get it over with. After all, Republicans have no use for this guy anymore, and so it seems, Democrat voters really like him. Now I can understand why. He's petulant, feels he's entitled, thinks like a liberal, and has little in the way of integrity.

A PERFECT example of why PR is necessary in the modern era. There are just too many different political positions to fit into an outdated two party system.

No, not really. That's why we are sick of moderates in our party. Get them out of there.

And where are they supposed to go?

You want a party which has certain characteristics. Other Republicans want a party with other characteristics. Why are you both in the same party?

In the UK you have the Conservative Party. They are like the Republicans. The UK has FPTP. But then you have UKIP who were the party for the simple loving Conservatives. The one who think everything can be solved by doing something simple. Like leaving the EU. So the party exists. In the US it's impossible.

In Germany they have the CDU, they have Alternative For Germany, they have the FPD too. Three choices of parties who could, potentially, be a part of the governing coalition next month. Three choices. In the US there is one choice.

"choice is freedom", it's a quote and you know who from.

Well as I said, if you think Europe is so great, move to Europe. If you want to stay here, don't complain how we do things. Instead, start a third party yourself. Because government doesn't create parties, citizens do.

As for RINOs, let them join the Democrat party. After all, that's all they are anyhow. So McCain should switch parties, Kasich should switch parties, let them all leave because we don't need two Democrat parties, and some would make the case we don't even need one.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

And as I've said this is a bullshit argument.

Imagine a company, and an employee says "hey, boss, we can do things better, make more profit if we do what this other company is doing" and the boss turns around and says "well, fuck off to that company if you think it's so good then"

That's retarded.

What's the point of starting a third party Ray? Do you not listen ever? The whole point is that any third party is destined to fail because of the SYSTEM.

But then we both know you like the system because it gives an unfair advantage to the right, and we know how much you like unfair advantages, don't we?

It's funny how you demand the system stays the same, and then wish for loads of Republicans to leave the Republican Party. Do you really not see the nonsense in writing this?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I WAS a Kasich supporter. I supported him for his reelection as Governor, and I supported him for his presidential bid. But now I regret and am even ashamed that I did.

Besides his childish behavior during the primaries, he not only went back on his word to support whoever the Republican nominee might be, he also didn't attend the RNC held by his own party in his very own state. Afterwards had nothing kind to say about our new President. But now he's gone off the deep end.

Gov. John Kasich blasts President Donald Trump, invites immigrant 'Dreamers' to Ohio

Who does this clown think he is anyway? Does he now believe he's the king of Ohio where he can say "And, by the way, if the Dreamers want to go somewhere and live? Come to Ohio. We want all the immigrants to come to Ohio, because we know how much they contribute to America."

Who is this "we" that he's talking about here? There is no "we" that feels this way, there is you and speak for yourself! I would expect a statement like this out of California, Massachusetts or New York, but not out of my state of Ohio.

Kasich is finished as Governor because he can only serve two terms; not that he would get reelected again anyway, but I seriously doubt he will just go away. If he runs for any other public office, he should just switch to the Democrat party first and get it over with. After all, Republicans have no use for this guy anymore, and so it seems, Democrat voters really like him. Now I can understand why. He's petulant, feels he's entitled, thinks like a liberal, and has little in the way of integrity.

A PERFECT example of why PR is necessary in the modern era. There are just too many different political positions to fit into an outdated two party system.

No, not really. That's why we are sick of moderates in our party. Get them out of there.

And where are they supposed to go?

You want a party which has certain characteristics. Other Republicans want a party with other characteristics. Why are you both in the same party?

In the UK you have the Conservative Party. They are like the Republicans. The UK has FPTP. But then you have UKIP who were the party for the simple loving Conservatives. The one who think everything can be solved by doing something simple. Like leaving the EU. So the party exists. In the US it's impossible.

In Germany they have the CDU, they have Alternative For Germany, they have the FPD too. Three choices of parties who could, potentially, be a part of the governing coalition next month. Three choices. In the US there is one choice.

"choice is freedom", it's a quote and you know who from.

Well as I said, if you think Europe is so great, move to Europe. If you want to stay here, don't complain how we do things. Instead, start a third party yourself. Because government doesn't create parties, citizens do.

As for RINOs, let them join the Democrat party. After all, that's all they are anyhow. So McCain should switch parties, Kasich should switch parties, let them all leave because we don't need two Democrat parties, and some would make the case we don't even need one.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

And as I've said this is a bullshit argument.

Imagine a company, and an employee says "hey, boss, we can do things better, make more profit if we do what this other company is doing" and the boss turns around and says "well, fuck off to that company if you think it's so good then"

That's retarded.

What's the point of starting a third party Ray? Do you not listen ever? The whole point is that any third party is destined to fail because of the SYSTEM.

But then we both know you like the system because it gives an unfair advantage to the right, and we know how much you like unfair advantages, don't we?

It's funny how you demand the system stays the same, and then wish for loads of Republicans to leave the Republican Party. Do you really not see the nonsense in writing this?

You act like we don't have any third parties now. We do! In fact, one of those parties ran a presidential candidate last presidential election.

Here is what you don't understand: the rest of the country doesn't want a third party; at least not a serious one. It's not the system, it's the citizens......the voters. The Libertarian party is a joke, the Green party is a joke, the Independent party is a joke, none of them are even mentioned in the election results because they don't mean anything outside who they stole votes from.

We have customers that used to be employees at our other customers. One employee discovered how to do things more profitable and efficiently. When he took his ideas to the President of the company, the President told him to just do the job he's paid to do. So the employee eventually left the company and started his own. His company grew three times the size of his former employer. In fact, he recently purchased his old employers company. They kept us as their delivery company and we had to get another tractor-trailer to service them. It's was great for us.

 

[frigidweirdo]

A PERFECT example of why PR is necessary in the modern era. There are just too many different political positions to fit into an outdated two party system.

No, not really. That's why we are sick of moderates in our party. Get them out of there.

And where are they supposed to go?

You want a party which has certain characteristics. Other Republicans want a party with other characteristics. Why are you both in the same party?

In the UK you have the Conservative Party. They are like the Republicans. The UK has FPTP. But then you have UKIP who were the party for the simple loving Conservatives. The one who think everything can be solved by doing something simple. Like leaving the EU. So the party exists. In the US it's impossible.

In Germany they have the CDU, they have Alternative For Germany, they have the FPD too. Three choices of parties who could, potentially, be a part of the governing coalition next month. Three choices. In the US there is one choice.

"choice is freedom", it's a quote and you know who from.

Well as I said, if you think Europe is so great, move to Europe. If you want to stay here, don't complain how we do things. Instead, start a third party yourself. Because government doesn't create parties, citizens do.

As for RINOs, let them join the Democrat party. After all, that's all they are anyhow. So McCain should switch parties, Kasich should switch parties, let them all leave because we don't need two Democrat parties, and some would make the case we don't even need one.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

And as I've said this is a bullshit argument.

Imagine a company, and an employee says "hey, boss, we can do things better, make more profit if we do what this other company is doing" and the boss turns around and says "well, fuck off to that company if you think it's so good then"

That's retarded.

What's the point of starting a third party Ray? Do you not listen ever? The whole point is that any third party is destined to fail because of the SYSTEM.

But then we both know you like the system because it gives an unfair advantage to the right, and we know how much you like unfair advantages, don't we?

It's funny how you demand the system stays the same, and then wish for loads of Republicans to leave the Republican Party. Do you really not see the nonsense in writing this?

You act like we don't have any third parties now. We do! In fact, one of those parties ran a presidential candidate last presidential election.

Here is what you don't understand: the rest of the country doesn't want a third party; at least not a serious one. It's not the system, it's the citizens......the voters. The Libertarian party is a joke, the Green party is a joke, the Independent party is a joke, none of them are even mentioned in the election results because they don't mean anything outside who they stole votes from.

We have customers that used to be employees at our other customers. One employee discovered how to do things more profitable and efficiently. When he took his ideas to the President of the company, the President told him to just do the job he's paid to do. So the employee eventually left the company and started his own. His company grew three times the size of his former employer. In fact, he recently purchased his old employers company. They kept us as their delivery company and we had to get another tractor-trailer to service them. It's was great for us.

Yes, I do. Do you know why?

Here's why.

Germany election 2005, 6 parties in government. The smallest party had 46 seats.

Argentinian election 2015, 24 parties in government, though they form into groups, with 5 groups.

US election 2016, 2 parties in government.

The Libertarian Party is the third party in the US, they have NO SEATS in Federal government. None, not a single one.

Out of 1,972 Senate seats in all of the US states, the Libertarian Party, as the third party, has ONE SEAT.

Out of 5,411 House seats, they have 3.

That's the third party. So, excuse me for acting like there aren't any third parties. Because when I think of 3rd party Ray, I think of parties that actually have enough power to be more than the threat of drizzle on a hot summer's day for the main two parties.

As for running for the presidency. How many people do you think believe that a 3rd party candidate can do anything? If anything, most people vote 3rd party simply because they don't like the main two. At no point did anyone think anyone other than a Republican or Democrat could win.

Why did Trump go Republican? He's not a Republican at all. He went Republican because he KNEW he stood no chance in a 3rd party.

In fact you know the Koch brothers tried to take over the Libertarian Party in the 1980s, don't you? And you know what they knew? That a third party was never going to do anything. So they also shifted to the Republican Party.

Also you have the Tea Party, in any other country they'd have gone on to be a party, like UKIP, like Alternative for Germany, and yet they're a part of the Republican Party.

It's all there Ray, it's quite simple.

The rest of country doesn't want a third party? Amazing Ray, amazing argument. How do they know they don't want a third party? Perhaps because the Republicans and Democrats have TOLD THEM they don't want one. If you don't realize just how controlled the people of America are right now, you'll never know.

The Libertarian Party is a joke, well, why? This is the whole point of what we're talking about. They're a joke because the system doesn't allow them a way in. None of them are ever mentioned in election results.

The question is this Ray, wouldn't you like the CHOICE of who to vote for more than, this party, that party, or a joke which will never, ever get mentioned. Never get mentioned because the system is a two party system, never get mentioned because the media likes having it easy, never get mentioned because the rich love a system where they can easily buy, and legitimately buy, politicians?

Come on Ray, half the time you're pointing out the reasons why the system is shit, the other half the time you're telling us why the US needs to be shit.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

It's all there Ray, it's quite simple.

What's all there? The only thing that's there is voters don't vote third party. It's that simple. A third party stands no chance and every voter wants their vote to count. If you vote a third party, you might as well not even bother to vote at all; a waste of time.

The rest of country doesn't want a third party? Amazing Ray, amazing argument. How do they know they don't want a third party?

Uhhhhh, because we do have third parties and nobody votes for them??????

The Libertarian Party is a joke, well, why? This is the whole point of what we're talking about. They're a joke because the system doesn't allow them a way in. None of them are ever mentioned in election results.

There is no controlling system that you speak of. If there is, please explain what that system is that I'm totally unaware of.

The truth about voting is we seldom vote for a candidate; we vote to keep the other candidate out. So if you throw your vote away on a third party candidate, you actually usher in the candidate you didn't want.

Liberals are using one of their many excuses why Hil-Liar lost, and that is votes were taken from her by a third party candidate. Voters who were sick of the Dem party and wanted to send a message to them that voted third party are now regretting it because their vote was responsible for the Trump presidency. See how it works now?

And if YOU actually did something about it and started your own third party, it would be met with the same results; not because of the system, not because of the two power parties, but because people don't want to throw away their vote on your party candidate.

 

[frigidweirdo]

It's all there Ray, it's quite simple.

What's all there? The only thing that's there is voters don't vote third party. It's that simple. A third party stands no chance and every voter wants their vote to count. If you vote a third party, you might as well not even bother to vote at all; a waste of time.

The rest of country doesn't want a third party? Amazing Ray, amazing argument. How do they know they don't want a third party?

Uhhhhh, because we do have third parties and nobody votes for them??????

The Libertarian Party is a joke, well, why? This is the whole point of what we're talking about. They're a joke because the system doesn't allow them a way in. None of them are ever mentioned in election results.

There is no controlling system that you speak of. If there is, please explain what that system is that I'm totally unaware of.

The truth about voting is we seldom vote for a candidate; we vote to keep the other candidate out. So if you throw your vote away on a third party candidate, you actually usher in the candidate you didn't want.

Liberals are using one of their many excuses why Hil-Liar lost, and that is votes were taken from her by a third party candidate. Voters who were sick of the Dem party and wanted to send a message to them that voted third party are now regretting it because their vote was responsible for the Trump presidency. See how it works now?

And if YOU actually did something about it and started your own third party, it would be met with the same results; not because of the system, not because of the two power parties, but because people don't want to throw away their vote on your party candidate.

Okay Ray, let's try this. Why don't people vote for a third party? Is it because they don't want a third party, or is it because the system doesn't allow for it?

I've told you before, under the German system where they vote FPTP and PR on the same day, 10% of people switch their votes from the large parties under FPTP to smaller parties under PR. Why is that? Is it that they don't want a third party? No, it's the when you have a FPTP type system, you think "only these two stand a chance of winning, I don't want that one to win, so I'm going to vote for this one instead, even though I don't like them that much", but under PR they're like "hey, I like this party, I'll vote for them"

FPTP encourages NEGATIVE voting. PR encourages POSITIVE voting.

Exclusive: Top reason Americans will vote for Trump: 'To stop Clinton' - poll

"Exclusive: Top reason Americans will vote for Trump: 'To stop Clinton' - poll"

"Nearly half of American voters who support either Democrat Hillary Clinton or Republican Donald Trump for the White House said they will mainly be trying to block the other side from winning, according to a Reuters/Ipsos poll released Thursday."

This isn't a case of people just voting who they wanted to vote for. People didn't want to vote Hillary or Trump in the US election. They'd have prefered someone else, but they got to choose who the people in the parties wanted to choose and felt they had no choice but to choose which one they didn't want.

And you've just given the BIGGEST reason for having PR, people feel that a 3rd party vote is a waste of time. In Germany this isn't the case, in almost all countries with PR this isn't the case. You have PR, you don't have to feel a vote for a 3rd party is a waste of time.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

It's all there Ray, it's quite simple.

What's all there? The only thing that's there is voters don't vote third party. It's that simple. A third party stands no chance and every voter wants their vote to count. If you vote a third party, you might as well not even bother to vote at all; a waste of time.

The rest of country doesn't want a third party? Amazing Ray, amazing argument. How do they know they don't want a third party?

Uhhhhh, because we do have third parties and nobody votes for them??????

The Libertarian Party is a joke, well, why? This is the whole point of what we're talking about. They're a joke because the system doesn't allow them a way in. None of them are ever mentioned in election results.

There is no controlling system that you speak of. If there is, please explain what that system is that I'm totally unaware of.

The truth about voting is we seldom vote for a candidate; we vote to keep the other candidate out. So if you throw your vote away on a third party candidate, you actually usher in the candidate you didn't want.

Liberals are using one of their many excuses why Hil-Liar lost, and that is votes were taken from her by a third party candidate. Voters who were sick of the Dem party and wanted to send a message to them that voted third party are now regretting it because their vote was responsible for the Trump presidency. See how it works now?

And if YOU actually did something about it and started your own third party, it would be met with the same results; not because of the system, not because of the two power parties, but because people don't want to throw away their vote on your party candidate.

Okay Ray, let's try this. Why don't people vote for a third party? Is it because they don't want a third party, or is it because the system doesn't allow for it?

I've told you before, under the German system where they vote FPTP and PR on the same day, 10% of people switch their votes from the large parties under FPTP to smaller parties under PR. Why is that? Is it that they don't want a third party? No, it's the when you have a FPTP type system, you think "only these two stand a chance of winning, I don't want that one to win, so I'm going to vote for this one instead, even though I don't like them that much", but under PR they're like "hey, I like this party, I'll vote for them"

FPTP encourages NEGATIVE voting. PR encourages POSITIVE voting.

Exclusive: Top reason Americans will vote for Trump: 'To stop Clinton' - poll

"Exclusive: Top reason Americans will vote for Trump: 'To stop Clinton' - poll"

"Nearly half of American voters who support either Democrat Hillary Clinton or Republican Donald Trump for the White House said they will mainly be trying to block the other side from winning, according to a Reuters/Ipsos poll released Thursday."

This isn't a case of people just voting who they wanted to vote for. People didn't want to vote Hillary or Trump in the US election. They'd have prefered someone else, but they got to choose who the people in the parties wanted to choose and felt they had no choice but to choose which one they didn't want.

And you've just given the BIGGEST reason for having PR, people feel that a 3rd party vote is a waste of time. In Germany this isn't the case, in almost all countries with PR this isn't the case. You have PR, you don't have to feel a vote for a 3rd party is a waste of time.

I don't know what a PR is or what it does, nor an FPTP, but we've been voting the same way for centuries and that's never going to change. If people get pissed enough at one party or the other, they will (on their own) vote for a similar party. Look for that to happen with the Republicans if Congress keeps stopping Trump from his agenda. With the Trump victory, the Republicans (particularly the establishment Republicans) haven't yet figured out their constituents are pissed off about nothing getting done when we put them in power.

I've always called the Democrat party the party of excuses, but I'm beginning to think it applies to both.