Christy bans gay conversion "therapy"

[C_Clayton_Jones]

What about the Christian "lifestyle that is mocked, criticized, subject to prejudice." and a government that grabs control of a basic family decision and Constitutional rights?

No one mocks the lifestyles of the truly devout as long as they keep their beliefs to themselves, Lumpy. It is only if they attempt to impose their "lifestyles" on others that they incur mockery, criticism and prejudice. A case in point is followers of Islam. Prior to 9/11 no one really cared about Moslems unless they were like Malcom X and made a big issue about their faith. The average Moslem was left to go about their lives pretty much normally. After 9/11 they found themselves to be the objects of "mockery, criticism and prejudice" even though they were just as shocked and appalled by what had happened.

So they too know what it is like to live a "lifestyle that is mocked, criticized, subject to prejudice". Let me take this one step further. As an Atheist no one cares how I live my life but if any Atheist decides to object a religious artifact being sponsored with government funding in violation of the Constitution then suddenly all Atheists are "mocked, criticized and subject to prejudice".

Does this make it right for it to happen to Christians? Of course it doesn't. In each and every instance it is a minority who are grabbing the headlines and this causes problems for all of those who happen to be in the same category.

Sooo bottom line.. Gays can speak out and promote their lifestyle but the opposing view can't without being persecuted. Is that what your saying, I want to be sure?

Which raises an important question: Why would anyone be in opposition to homosexuals seeking their due process and equal protection rights?

What is it about homosexuals that conservatives find so threatening where gays must be ‘opposed’ and their civil liberties violated?

The only logical extrapolation is fear and ignorance, coupled with conservative authoritarianism where diversity and dissent must be condemned, and everyone compelled to conform to subjective rightist/Christian dogma.

Moreover, gays are not ‘promoting’ anything; it’s a bizarre myth that homosexuals want to ‘convert’ anyone to their ‘lifestyle.’

When gays speak out it’s only in a justified response to those who seek to deny them their civil liberties, as any other class of persons adversely effected would do and have the right to do.

And if the opposing view to the ‘gay lifestyle’ constitutes indeed seeking to deprive homosexuals of their civil liberties, when the courts strike down such efforts as being un-Constitutional, that doesn’t manifest ‘persecution’ of those hostile to homosexuals and their fundamental rights.

Conservatives have the First Amendment right to freely express their hate and ignorance concerning homosexuals, free from government interference; but they do not have the right to attempt to codify that hate and ignorance.

 

[Uncensored2008]

United States Bill of Rights - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

from the OP link

"The Republican governor also said the health risks of trying to change a child's sexual orientation, as identified by the American Psychological Association, outweigh concerns over the government setting limits on parental choice."

No doubt he will soon move to outlaw Alcoholics Anonymous, sinc they seek to alter the orientation people have toward booze - and any other organization which seeks to alter the orientation of persons in regard to vices.

 

[Lumpy 1]

No one mocks the lifestyles of the truly devout as long as they keep their beliefs to themselves, Lumpy. It is only if they attempt to impose their "lifestyles" on others that they incur mockery, criticism and prejudice. A case in point is followers of Islam. Prior to 9/11 no one really cared about Moslems unless they were like Malcom X and made a big issue about their faith. The average Moslem was left to go about their lives pretty much normally. After 9/11 they found themselves to be the objects of "mockery, criticism and prejudice" even though they were just as shocked and appalled by what had happened.

So they too know what it is like to live a "lifestyle that is mocked, criticized, subject to prejudice". Let me take this one step further. As an Atheist no one cares how I live my life but if any Atheist decides to object a religious artifact being sponsored with government funding in violation of the Constitution then suddenly all Atheists are "mocked, criticized and subject to prejudice".

Does this make it right for it to happen to Christians? Of course it doesn't. In each and every instance it is a minority who are grabbing the headlines and this causes problems for all of those who happen to be in the same category.

Sooo bottom line.. Gays can speak out and promote their lifestyle but the opposing view can't without being persecuted. Is that what your saying, I want to be sure?

Which raises an important question: Why would anyone be in opposition to homosexuals seeking their due process and equal protection rights?

What is it about homosexuals that conservatives find so threatening where gays must be ‘opposed’ and their civil liberties violated?

The only logical extrapolation is fear and ignorance, coupled with conservative authoritarianism where diversity and dissent must be condemned, and everyone compelled to conform to subjective rightist/Christian dogma.

Moreover, gays are not ‘promoting’ anything; it’s a bizarre myth that homosexuals want to ‘convert’ anyone to their ‘lifestyle.’

When gays speak out it’s only in a justified response to those who seek to deny them their civil liberties, as any other class of persons adversely effected would do and have the right to do.

And if the opposing view to the ‘gay lifestyle’ constitutes indeed seeking to deprive homosexuals of their civil liberties, when the courts strike down such efforts as being un-Constitutional, that doesn’t manifest ‘persecution’ of those hostile to homosexuals and their fundamental rights.

Conservatives have the First Amendment right to freely express their hate and ignorance concerning homosexuals, free from government interference; but they do not have the right to attempt to codify that hate and ignorance.

 

[Mertex]

What about the Christian "lifestyle that is mocked, criticized, subject to prejudice." and a government that grabs control of a basic family decision and Constitutional rights?

What about the Christian lifestyle. Would you like therapy forced on you to change your Christian behavior?

From the Government?

From anyone, including the government.

 

[Mertex]

United States Bill of Rights - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

from the OP link

"The Republican governor also said the health risks of trying to change a child's sexual orientation, as identified by the American Psychological Association, outweigh concerns over the government setting limits on parental choice."

No doubt he will soon move to outlaw Alcoholics Anonymous, sinc they seek to alter the orientation people have toward booze - and any other organization which seeks to alter the orientation of persons in regard to vices.

Oh geez, now you are saying homosexuality is a vice? I've heard everything.

 

[Lumpy 1]

What about the Christian lifestyle. Would you like therapy forced on you to change your Christian behavior?

From the Government?

From anyone, including the government.

Am I the child of a loving family that wants the best for me (non liberal Democrat for example)...?

 

[ClosedCaption]

2. "This is banning the practice being used on children."
Children are the charge of their parents.
While the 'therapy' is often used on young adults....if it is used on small children, I say let their parents decide.....not you, or the governor.....or the state.

If Abusive, which it is. Abuse because its from their parent is not an option

a. "Children don't need to be pushed in to quack "therapy" which has never been proven to work."

Does this count?
 In 1980 a study was published in the American Journal of Psychiatry which stated that eleven former homosexual men became heterosexuals "without explicit treatment and/or long-term psychotherapy" through their participation in a Pentecostal church.[3]
Homosexuality Statistics - Conservapedia

And....If it doesn't work, why are you so worried about it?

No that doesn't count. Going to church isn't the same as this "therapy' they are talking about.

And did you link to Conservapedia!?!??!? ROFL!

1. If it is abuse....file charges of abuse.
Were there such criminal convictions for use of this plan?
No?
So...it isn't abuse.

So the parents that subjected their children to the abuse didnt file charges and you wonder why? Is that what you're saying? Maybe because the parents didnt want to admit they volunteered them to abuse. Its really simple

2. Why do I constantly find myself teaching basic English to dolts like you?
A doctor telling a person to get out in the fresh air is therapy.....

ther·a·py (thr-p)
n. pl. ther·a·pies
1. Treatment of illness or disability.
2. Psychotherapy.
3. Healing power or quality: the therapy of fresh air and sun.

Thanks that proves nothing about this shit being therapy. I have some stick therapy where I smack people with sticks. Its not beating them see, because I call it "therapy". Call it whatever you want, its harmful

3. How stupid do you have to be to claim that Liberal sources will regularly provide the truth about Liberal boondoggles?

Conservapedia....if you have evidence of errors in there.....reveal 'em.

Otherwise....you remain a dope.l

Conservapedia says that going to church is the same as going to homo therapy. Its not, one is going to church the other isnt. Understand? Also, you asked if going to church counts.

You asked a question. The answer is...its not the same. The proof that it isnt the same is your own confusion on if it is or not. You wouldnt ask if it was

 

[Mertex]

resort to the dramatics...this is a THREAPY...
what right does Christy have to decide what is good or NOT...
some of you are so helpless you can't make decisions for yourself or your families..
cheering this by Christy proves it

Stephanie, there have been studies done on this "therapy' by psychological professionals, the results I posted within post #66. The results show why there are a very good reasons not to let a novice to mental health to make such a decision. That's like letting a parent perform heart surgery on their kids and theyhave never touch a scalpel in their life.

there are studies on everything and we can pick out both from the good and the bad
still doesn't give a Governor the right TO BAN anything..there are studies showing abortion is harmful but let him try and BAN THAT..all frikken hell would break loose...I'm talking about a government who feels it has a right to make the decision for a parent...I could care less about some threapy

Abortion is legal, made into law by the SCOTUS, so neither Christie nor any governor can ban it. Therapy to change homosexuals is not. And don't be so melodramatic, parents are still able to try and force their children not to be gay, if they are so inclined, there is no government coming into people's homes and telling them they can't verbally abuse their children, however, charlatans that set up these fraudulent "therapies" need to be exposed for what they are and any Governor should have the right to shut them down in his state.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

For teenagers, how it is a choice to go to some fake doctor? They are being pushed by their parents, who have made them believe that they need to change, that there is something wrong with them.
If parents would get their heads out of the Bible and love their children for who they are, there wouldn't be a problem.

All psychologists are fake doctors, yet schools practically mandate them.

Do you intentionally talk out of your ass? Literally every thread you decide to invade you somehow manage to make the most asinine statements that nobody with a shred of honesty or intelligence would be able to make with a straight face.

Don't get me wrong. I enjoy your posts for their pure entertainment value, but it's scary to think sometimes that you are actually being serious.

Feel free to demonstrate the actual falsifiable and repeatable experiments that define psychology as a science.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

The Right doesn't want to remove options even if the options are harmful.

See how that works

I see you ascribe to the "Make assertions without evidence" school of debating.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

There have always been gays amongst us and there will always be gays. Nothing is going to alter that. This nation was founded on the basis of equality. Just as there should be no government discrimination based on race, sex or creed there should not be any based upon orientation either in my opinion. Adolescence is a confusing time for young people since they are moving from childhood to adulthood. We no longer insist that women must only remain in the kitchen and raise the children. As a society we are evolving towards being more understanding of what others have to contribute. If there is an "agenda" it was one that the Founding Fathers put in place for us.

oh so understanding is banning our freedoms of choice? and it's only ones that some of you find reasonable...then lets ban abortions it's not good for our Society..we should be evolving in wanting to stop killing off our children, NO?

Minors do not have a "choice" as far as this undiagnosed "therapy" is concerned. Once they become adults there is nothing stopping them from availing themselves of this "therapy" if they so choose for themselves. Gov Christie is protecting children from being exposed to a "therapy" for which there is no legitimate diagnosis. That falls within the duties that he was elected to do for the people of New Jersey. The NJ Legislature passed this law based upon a careful evaluation of the benefit/harm to the children. Why do you want to deny the people of New Jersey their freedom of choice to decide what is best for their own children? Doesn't NJ have a "states right" to make this choice for themselves?

Minors don't have a choice about a lot of things, what makes this one more egregious than any of the other things minors don't have a choice about?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Minors do not have a "choice" as far as this undiagnosed "therapy" is concerned. Once they become adults there is nothing stopping them from availing themselves of this "therapy" if they so choose for themselves. Gov Christie is protecting children from being exposed to a "therapy" for which there is no legitimate diagnosis. That falls within the duties that he was elected to do for the people of New Jersey. The NJ Legislature passed this law based upon a careful evaluation of the benefit/harm to the children. Why do you want to deny the people of New Jersey their freedom of choice to decide what is best for their own children? Doesn't NJ have a "states right" to make this choice for themselves?

REALLY? since when don't PARENTS have rights in this country over their OWN CHILDREN?
now the government is THE PARENT?
some of you people don't deserve to live free or have children you see this as a good thing stepping on Parents RIGHTS

So parents must be allowed to poison and/or molest their children because that is their "Parents RIGHTS"?

Reparation therapy is murder?

 

[EriktheRed]

Glad it was banned. It amounts to child abuse, and any parent who takes their kid to these quacks needs to be charged.

No, parents shouldn't be charged. It's unfortunate, but we have to let parents have autonomy over how they wish to raise their kids. Not sure where one draws the line, but I wouldn't put it here, personally.


I have no problem, however, with making it so any doc who wants to do this will not have a valid license as a consequense, since this practice has been shown to be ineffective.

 

[EriktheRed]

Chris Christie To Sign Gay Conversion Therapy Ban



Well ............ its a start.

And, looks more and ore like he's running for prez.

About his stomach stapling surgery - does it look like he's lost weight?

Bad spot for him to be in. If he didn't sign it, then it would be used against him in the general election should he become the Republican nominee in 2016. Of course, the bigger problem is that by signing it, he pretty much doused his chances of winning the Republican nomination because the Religious Right Whack Jobs will never support him since he is against God and for Gays.

Whoaa.. I'm supposing you're not interested in showing tolerance, yet you oddly expect it..

Tolerance for what?

 

[EriktheRed]

what is a "major election"?

the GOP controls the HOR and 30 governors are GOP

President seems like a pretty major election, don't ya think?

never mind you lost the previous two.

didya forget dat?

No, but it doesn't mean shit, either.

 

[EriktheRed]

Glad it was banned. It amounts to child abuse, and any parent who takes their kid to these quacks needs to be charged.

Why is it child abuse to tell a child that they have a choice about their sexual preference, but not to tell a boy that they are really a girl? Why is it legal to get a child therapy to help it believe that it is a different sex, but illegal to tell that same child that it can chose whatever sexual preference they want?

Can you repeat that in English, please?

 

[EriktheRed]

Chris Christie To Sign Gay Conversion Therapy Ban

Well ............ its a start.

And, looks more and ore like he's running for prez.

About his stomach stapling surgery - does it look like he's lost weight?

True.

And it’s going to be a real headache for social conservatives and Christian fundamentalists.

Why is Christie posturing for reelection in New Jersey going to bother anyone outside New Jersey?

Does rereading this part help?

And, looks more and ore like he's running for prez.

 

[EriktheRed]

Christy should take the next step and just BAN all therapy...If he finds this one should be banned none of them can be good for a person

GO CHRISTY, GO GOVERNMENT...ban ban ban

lets give a clue to ban abortion, call him folks suggest it

Research has been done on this type of therapy and it's been found to be basically a harmful fraud.
http://www.apa.org/pi/lgbt/resource...proven not to work &__utmv=-&__utmk=193237549

So in other words. Christy is stopping a fraud practiced by unqualified snake oil salesmen. It can be harmful to the "patient" and of course there's the cost of this unproven practice which goes against professional studies.
States often outlaw fraudulent scams to protect it's citizens and this is no different.

Funny how you make a claim, and then don't back it up. Is that typical of your debating style, or does it only apply when the government does something you like?

Are deliberately being obtuse here?

He posted a link in the very quote you responded to.

 

[EriktheRed]

Funny how you make a claim, and then don't back it up. Is that typical of your debating style, or does it only apply when the government does something you like?

Didn't back it up? Geez QW, for some odd reason I don't think you read posts, you must skim read. I used three resources in my posts! And that's how I post consistently, I back them up and that sucks for you every time I do. Now QW will demonize my resources.

There was only one link in the post I quoted.

As for what that report says, the abstract says this.

The American Psychological Association Task Force on Appropriate Therapeutic Responses to Sexual Orientation conducted a systematic review of the peer-reviewed journal literature on sexual orientation change efforts (SOCE) and concluded that efforts to change sexual orientation are unlikely to be successful and involve some risk of harm, contrary to the claims of SOCE practitioners and advocates. Even though the research and clinical literature demonstrate that same-sex sexual and romantic attractions, feelings, and behaviors are normal and positive variations of human sexuality, regardless of sexual orientation identity, the task force concluded that the population that undergoes SOCE tends to have strongly conservative religious views that lead them to seek to change their sexual orientation. Thus, the appropriate application of affirmative therapeutic interventions for those who seek SOCE involves therapist acceptance, support, and understanding of clients and the facilitation of clients’ active coping, social support, and identity exploration and development, without imposing a specific sexual orientation identity outcome.

Doesn't say a damn think about abuse there, does it? In fact, it concludes that not giving people the therapy they want is abusive.

No, it doesn't.

 

[Noomi]

Glad it was banned. It amounts to child abuse, and any parent who takes their kid to these quacks needs to be charged.

Why is it child abuse to tell a child that they have a choice about their sexual preference, but not to tell a boy that they are really a girl? Why is it legal to get a child therapy to help it believe that it is a different sex, but illegal to tell that same child that it can chose whatever sexual preference they want?

Because no one does have a choice about their sexual preference. No one can pick and choose who they are attracted to.