Debt-free college: Where the 2020 presidential candidates stand

[The Sage of Main Street]

'A clear divide exists among 2020 presidential Democrats who are rolling out plans to tackle the student debt crisis, whether tuition-free or debt-free policies are the way to win voter support.

By the numbers: Student debt in the United States has reached $1.5 trillion, and is responsible for much of millennials and generation Z's anguish.

In Congress

• Congressional committees have launched hearings to reauthorize the Higher Education Act, which looks to discuss more affordability in college costs, student loan programs and more. Sen. Brian Schatz (D-Hawaii) and Rep. Mark Pocan (D-Wisc.) reintroduced legislation to help students become debt free within 5 years of graduating.

Tuition free
These programs provide students 2 years of free tuition at participating state community colleges, associate-degree programs and vocational schools. The majority fall into the category of "last dollar" scholarships, indicating the program pays the difference in tuition after financial aid and grants have kicked in, per CNBC.

• Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) is still running on his 2016 campaign promise to make college tuition free and debt free. In 2016, Sanders introduced a bill called the "College for All Act," making public college tuition-free to students through a partnership between the federal government.
• Former HUD Secretary Julián Castro supports tuition-free college.
• Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-Hawaii) wants to eliminate tuition and fees at 4-year public colleges and universities. She also supports free community college tuition for everyone.
• New-age spiritual guru Marianne Williamson supports universal pre-school and free college.

Debt free
This idea aims to cover the costs associated with attending public college without requiring students to take out loans, by establishing federal matches for state spending on higher education and using those funds to fill unmet need for people pursuing degrees

• Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) is running her campaign on students being debt free by using proceeds from her wealth tax. Warren is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. She has sponsored and co-sponsored several others including one in 2014 that allowed federal student loan borrowers to refinance their debt at a lower interest rate.
• Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.): She believes universal pre-K and college should be a "fundamental right," to be debt-free, The Atlantic reports. She is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill.
• Sen. Cory Booker (D-N.J.): Introduced a bill in 2018 for baby bonds, which attempted to close the racial-wealth gap in education. Booker is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill.
• Former Texas representative Beto O’Rourke has supported debt-free ideals. In 2018, he tweeted: "We should allow Texans who commit to working in in-demand fields and in underserved communities the chance to graduate debt free." O`Rourke co-sponsored Student Loan Affordability Act until 2015.
• Former tech executive Andrew Yang: Debt forgiveness plans and loan repayment plans, according to his campaign website.

Refinance student loans

• Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D-Minn.) rejected the idea of tuition-free college at a CNN town hall, but called for has called for free 2-year community college degrees. She offered up the idea to refinance loans and expand Pell grants.
• Former representative John Delaney has called for reforming bankruptcy laws so student loan debt can be discharged like all other debts as well as refinancing.

Mixed statements

• Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand (D-N.Y.) is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. In February, she tweeted she'd "allow all students to refinance their loans at 4%" if she were elected president.'

Debt-free college: Where the 2020 presidential candidates stand


I can understand universal healthcare and the $15 minimum wage (I don't fully agree with them - but I can certainly understand the logic behind them).

But this is just bat shit nuts.

No one put a fucking gun to these students heads to go massively into debt...it was 100% their choosing. Why the 'f' do students suddenly deserve to have their tuition paid off by taxpayers? Why this generation and not previous generations? And what makes student loans more important then mortgages? Or business loans? Why have taxpayers pay off student loans but do nothing for low income people with heavy mortgages/debts or business loans (NOT that I am for paying those off either - but at least they make far more sense then just paying off student loans)? What is fucking next? Progressives want taxpayers to pay off their credit cards? Car payments? Gambling debts?

This is progressives being flat out selfish. Many progressives are under 30 with HUGE student debt. So naturally their first thought is themselves.

I will say it again - HELLO? You people voluntarily took the huge student loans. You have no one to blame for them but yourselves. They are 100% YOUR responsibility. Stop pawning your bad decisions on to the rest of America. You fucked up - you get yourselves out of it. It's called 'taking responsibility for your actions'. DUH.

WTF are people still not understanding about how and why tuitions in America are the most inflated thing on this planet. Government guarantees the loan. Because banks know the loans HAVE to be paid back and you can’t declare bankruptcy, they give you as much money as possible. Colleges know students are having loan money thrown at them so they’ll let students take as many classes as they please, including fake as shit classes. This isn’t that hard to figure out.

Athletes Provide an Entertainment Center for Your Degenerate Preppy Idols

So much for the lie that college athletes get what the Preppies and no other students get because they make money for the university so it won't have to charge higher tuition.

 

[Flopper]

'A clear divide exists among 2020 presidential Democrats who are rolling out plans to tackle the student debt crisis, whether tuition-free or debt-free policies are the way to win voter support.

By the numbers: Student debt in the United States has reached $1.5 trillion, and is responsible for much of millennials and generation Z's anguish.

In Congress

• Congressional committees have launched hearings to reauthorize the Higher Education Act, which looks to discuss more affordability in college costs, student loan programs and more. Sen. Brian Schatz (D-Hawaii) and Rep. Mark Pocan (D-Wisc.) reintroduced legislation to help students become debt free within 5 years of graduating.

Tuition free
These programs provide students 2 years of free tuition at participating state community colleges, associate-degree programs and vocational schools. The majority fall into the category of "last dollar" scholarships, indicating the program pays the difference in tuition after financial aid and grants have kicked in, per CNBC.

• Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) is still running on his 2016 campaign promise to make college tuition free and debt free. In 2016, Sanders introduced a bill called the "College for All Act," making public college tuition-free to students through a partnership between the federal government.
• Former HUD Secretary Julián Castro supports tuition-free college.
• Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-Hawaii) wants to eliminate tuition and fees at 4-year public colleges and universities. She also supports free community college tuition for everyone.
• New-age spiritual guru Marianne Williamson supports universal pre-school and free college.

Debt free
This idea aims to cover the costs associated with attending public college without requiring students to take out loans, by establishing federal matches for state spending on higher education and using those funds to fill unmet need for people pursuing degrees

• Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) is running her campaign on students being debt free by using proceeds from her wealth tax. Warren is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. She has sponsored and co-sponsored several others including one in 2014 that allowed federal student loan borrowers to refinance their debt at a lower interest rate.
• Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.): She believes universal pre-K and college should be a "fundamental right," to be debt-free, The Atlantic reports. She is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill.
• Sen. Cory Booker (D-N.J.): Introduced a bill in 2018 for baby bonds, which attempted to close the racial-wealth gap in education. Booker is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill.
• Former Texas representative Beto O’Rourke has supported debt-free ideals. In 2018, he tweeted: "We should allow Texans who commit to working in in-demand fields and in underserved communities the chance to graduate debt free." O`Rourke co-sponsored Student Loan Affordability Act until 2015.
• Former tech executive Andrew Yang: Debt forgiveness plans and loan repayment plans, according to his campaign website.

Refinance student loans

• Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D-Minn.) rejected the idea of tuition-free college at a CNN town hall, but called for has called for free 2-year community college degrees. She offered up the idea to refinance loans and expand Pell grants.
• Former representative John Delaney has called for reforming bankruptcy laws so student loan debt can be discharged like all other debts as well as refinancing.

Mixed statements

• Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand (D-N.Y.) is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. In February, she tweeted she'd "allow all students to refinance their loans at 4%" if she were elected president.'

Debt-free college: Where the 2020 presidential candidates stand


I can understand universal healthcare and the $15 minimum wage (I don't fully agree with them - but I can certainly understand the logic behind them).

But this is just bat shit nuts.

No one put a fucking gun to these students heads to go massively into debt...it was 100% their choosing. Why the 'f' do students suddenly deserve to have their tuition paid off by taxpayers? Why this generation and not previous generations? And what makes student loans more important then mortgages? Or business loans? Why have taxpayers pay off student loans but do nothing for low income people with heavy mortgages/debts or business loans (NOT that I am for paying those off either - but at least they make far more sense then just paying off student loans)? What is fucking next? Progressives want taxpayers to pay off their credit cards? Car payments? Gambling debts?

This is progressives being flat out selfish. Many progressives are under 30 with HUGE student debt. So naturally their first thought is themselves.

I will say it again - HELLO? You people voluntarily took the huge student loans. You have no one to blame for them but yourselves. They are 100% YOUR responsibility. Stop pawning your bad decisions on to the rest of America. You fucked up - you get yourselves out of it. It's called 'taking responsibility for your actions'. DUH.

Believing in Getting a Job Just for Going 4 Years Without a Job Shows How Stupid We All Are

Tell it to the spoiled Preppie pukes and their dumb-jock circus performers. If students aren't paid a salary plus free tuition, they aren't worth anything. As usual, the public debate is intentionally shifted away from the fact that this is class-biased indentured servitude even with free tuition.

So we should pay their tuition and pay them to go to school. Where do I sign up?

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

Effort and dedication...while admirable...aren't a guarantee to decent pay(six figures)

Sadists Love Sweat

Those are generic qualities. Workoholic brown-noses get ahead, but that doesn't mean they deserve to. Only natural talent matters, and the self-sacrificing bootlickers will eventually bring their companies down.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

'A clear divide exists among 2020 presidential Democrats who are rolling out plans to tackle the student debt crisis, whether tuition-free or debt-free policies are the way to win voter support.

By the numbers: Student debt in the United States has reached $1.5 trillion, and is responsible for much of millennials and generation Z's anguish.

In Congress

• Congressional committees have launched hearings to reauthorize the Higher Education Act, which looks to discuss more affordability in college costs, student loan programs and more. Sen. Brian Schatz (D-Hawaii) and Rep. Mark Pocan (D-Wisc.) reintroduced legislation to help students become debt free within 5 years of graduating.

Tuition free
These programs provide students 2 years of free tuition at participating state community colleges, associate-degree programs and vocational schools. The majority fall into the category of "last dollar" scholarships, indicating the program pays the difference in tuition after financial aid and grants have kicked in, per CNBC.

• Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) is still running on his 2016 campaign promise to make college tuition free and debt free. In 2016, Sanders introduced a bill called the "College for All Act," making public college tuition-free to students through a partnership between the federal government.
• Former HUD Secretary Julián Castro supports tuition-free college.
• Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-Hawaii) wants to eliminate tuition and fees at 4-year public colleges and universities. She also supports free community college tuition for everyone.
• New-age spiritual guru Marianne Williamson supports universal pre-school and free college.

Debt free
This idea aims to cover the costs associated with attending public college without requiring students to take out loans, by establishing federal matches for state spending on higher education and using those funds to fill unmet need for people pursuing degrees

• Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) is running her campaign on students being debt free by using proceeds from her wealth tax. Warren is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. She has sponsored and co-sponsored several others including one in 2014 that allowed federal student loan borrowers to refinance their debt at a lower interest rate.
• Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.): She believes universal pre-K and college should be a "fundamental right," to be debt-free, The Atlantic reports. She is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill.
• Sen. Cory Booker (D-N.J.): Introduced a bill in 2018 for baby bonds, which attempted to close the racial-wealth gap in education. Booker is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill.
• Former Texas representative Beto O’Rourke has supported debt-free ideals. In 2018, he tweeted: "We should allow Texans who commit to working in in-demand fields and in underserved communities the chance to graduate debt free." O`Rourke co-sponsored Student Loan Affordability Act until 2015.
• Former tech executive Andrew Yang: Debt forgiveness plans and loan repayment plans, according to his campaign website.

Refinance student loans

• Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D-Minn.) rejected the idea of tuition-free college at a CNN town hall, but called for has called for free 2-year community college degrees. She offered up the idea to refinance loans and expand Pell grants.
• Former representative John Delaney has called for reforming bankruptcy laws so student loan debt can be discharged like all other debts as well as refinancing.

Mixed statements

• Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand (D-N.Y.) is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. In February, she tweeted she'd "allow all students to refinance their loans at 4%" if she were elected president.'

Debt-free college: Where the 2020 presidential candidates stand


I can understand universal healthcare and the $15 minimum wage (I don't fully agree with them - but I can certainly understand the logic behind them).

But this is just bat shit nuts.

No one put a fucking gun to these students heads to go massively into debt...it was 100% their choosing. Why the 'f' do students suddenly deserve to have their tuition paid off by taxpayers? Why this generation and not previous generations? And what makes student loans more important then mortgages? Or business loans? Why have taxpayers pay off student loans but do nothing for low income people with heavy mortgages/debts or business loans (NOT that I am for paying those off either - but at least they make far more sense then just paying off student loans)? What is fucking next? Progressives want taxpayers to pay off their credit cards? Car payments? Gambling debts?

This is progressives being flat out selfish. Many progressives are under 30 with HUGE student debt. So naturally their first thought is themselves.

I will say it again - HELLO? You people voluntarily took the huge student loans. You have no one to blame for them but yourselves. They are 100% YOUR responsibility. Stop pawning your bad decisions on to the rest of America. You fucked up - you get yourselves out of it. It's called 'taking responsibility for your actions'. DUH.

Believing in Getting a Job Just for Going 4 Years Without a Job Shows How Stupid We All Are

Tell it to the spoiled Preppie pukes and their dumb-jock circus performers. If students aren't paid a salary plus free tuition, they aren't worth anything. As usual, the public debate is intentionally shifted away from the fact that this is class-biased indentured servitude even with free tuition.

So we should pay their tuition and pay them to go to school. Where do I sign up?

This Terminal Society Rewards Mamas' Boys Who Suck Their Thumbs in College

Typical Low-IQ distortion of a proposal that makes him feel uncomfortable. Under my proposed system, you don't sign up; you are recruited. I can tell by your flippant attitude that you wouldn't qualify to be recruited, so you had no more right to go to college than you had to be on the college football team, which is also about talent. You pretend you're capable of understanding things at that level, but your defensive remark shows that even you know you can't.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

Why would any company send a job overseas with the workforce available to them here?

Judas, Inc.

Betrayal for money is the lowest form of treason. In a man's country, outsourcing would be outlawed.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

Free shit for your vote. Except its not free and someone has to pay. The loons, answer tax the rich out of prosperity and then work your way down until everyone is equally miserable and dependent on the benevolence of the Government. Democratic socialism.

It’s not free

It’s deciding how we spend our general revenue. Should we help the people or should you spend on a military deployed tens of thousand of miles away?

It’s all about priorities

How about we not spend it on anything and let the people keep their money.

You Resent Being Dependent on High IQs; That's Why You Humiliate Us and Wind Up Losing Our Wealth-Production

Where do you think their money comes from? And there'd be a lot more of it coming there way if people with productive natural talent were paid up front instead of sacrificing their youth to get a job that they were owed from the beginning.

 

[Andylusion]

Our society is demanding more education. Not just college but technical

Make the employers pay

What?

Yeah, that's going to work..... So my company, is going to pay for a worker to get a degree in Art History, and that worker isn't even going to stay with my company after graduation.

You think I'm doing that? I'll lay off my employees first, and move out of country, before wasting that much money on education.

Now if you mean paying for people to get education in something the company can use..... we already have that.

My company pays for training in positions we have on staff. And we've already been burned doing that. One of the women we trained just 6 months ago, sent her to a week of training, room and board, she already quit and is moving to a new job.

Why should we pay to educate people, when they leave?

And if you think that Wendy's is going to pay for someone's degree in marine biology, you are crazy.

Again, there are plenty of companies that do have training programs for free, and tuition reimbursement.

Had a lady that got a degree in management, through I believe Meijer. She's not a district manager.

The problem is not that there are not enough ways to get an education. The problem is people getting and education worth having, and being a person worth training.

The Dumbest (Real) College Courses

The people that 'go after it', end up getting somewhere. The people that don't, generally don't.

This isn't a problem of the cost of education. It's a problem is motivation, and having a work ethic.

Anyone can get a degree. Anyone. I had a co-worker that was taking one class a quarter. He was working a full time job, paying his way through, and got a degree in education and chemistry.

His parents were.... problematic. No support. No money. Nothing. He was paying for his own food. At least they let him sleep at his parents house, which was funny since neither parent lived at that house. (long screwed up story).... but the point is, a guy with no help, no money, but a willingness to work, was able to get a degree. Anyone can get a degree. It's a matter of effort and work ethic.

And he's debt free. Paid his way through.

You want to hire an employee with a masters in art history...you pay for it
You want to hire an engineer...pay for that

Why should the government subsidize your employees that you profit off of ?

First.... the government shouldn't subsidize anything. Stop doing that. You engage in stupid, does not obligate me an employer, to pay for your stupid. Just stop doing stupid.

Second, what Wendy's is looking for a masters in Art History? In fact, what company anywhere is looking for Art History majors?

See that's my point. None of the people who want a degree, are working for companies that require degrees.

If you think that Verizon Wireless, is going to pay for the 4-degree in electronic engineer, for an employee over at Wendy's that may not even want to work for Verizon, or may say they want to work for Verizon, until they get the degree and get a better offer elsewhere.... YOU ARE CRAZY.

Reminds me of my nephews ex-wife. She went four years to college for advertising. She works at a bank now I believe.

What company would want to hire her where her worthless degree is involved if they had to pay for that nonsense?

In Today's College, the Student Lives Like a Child. So He Winds Up With the Superficial and Dishonest Mind of a Child

Typical Diploma Dumbo logic. The most productive system will be that an individual business pays the talented high-school graduate to major in what that business needs. You Low-IQs pretend that we are talking about a system that you can easily discredit. So, similar to pro-athlete recruits, your nephew's wife would have signed a contract to work in advertising for a certain number of years

Funny how all the ideas of the high-IQ people never work, but they have no problem being arrogant and looking down on others.

At least you are honest about your arrogance and elitism.

Those programs where you sign on for a certain number of years, already exist, and they suck. People hate them, because you end up trapped in a job that could be terrible.

Specifically my sister who was considering going in to be a teacher, was sent to a public school where if you sign on to work x number of years, you get their entire student loan forgiven. She almost went into it, until she started talking with all the teachers who had done it. It was miserable. Every single one said if they had known how it would be, they would have never done it.

Similarly, when employers know that you can't go anywhere else, because you signed some contract for them to pay for your education, you are treated differently. I know people who have done this. If we put your plan in place, you would be right back on this forum, screaming about how people under these contracts are locked in like indentured servants.

No, the best system is where students pay for the education they want. When they have to pay the bill, they will both be far more careful in what degree they get, and more likely to use the degree they get. The reason I meet so many students working garbage jobs, when they have 4 year degrees, is because they are not paying the bill. If they were, they would be making something of themselves.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

'A clear divide exists among 2020 presidential Democrats who are rolling out plans to tackle the student debt crisis, whether tuition-free or debt-free policies are the way to win voter support.

By the numbers: Student debt in the United States has reached $1.5 trillion, and is responsible for much of millennials and generation Z's anguish.

In Congress

• Congressional committees have launched hearings to reauthorize the Higher Education Act, which looks to discuss more affordability in college costs, student loan programs and more. Sen. Brian Schatz (D-Hawaii) and Rep. Mark Pocan (D-Wisc.) reintroduced legislation to help students become debt free within 5 years of graduating.

Tuition free
These programs provide students 2 years of free tuition at participating state community colleges, associate-degree programs and vocational schools. The majority fall into the category of "last dollar" scholarships, indicating the program pays the difference in tuition after financial aid and grants have kicked in, per CNBC.

• Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) is still running on his 2016 campaign promise to make college tuition free and debt free. In 2016, Sanders introduced a bill called the "College for All Act," making public college tuition-free to students through a partnership between the federal government.
• Former HUD Secretary Julián Castro supports tuition-free college.
• Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-Hawaii) wants to eliminate tuition and fees at 4-year public colleges and universities. She also supports free community college tuition for everyone.
• New-age spiritual guru Marianne Williamson supports universal pre-school and free college.

Debt free
This idea aims to cover the costs associated with attending public college without requiring students to take out loans, by establishing federal matches for state spending on higher education and using those funds to fill unmet need for people pursuing degrees

• Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) is running her campaign on students being debt free by using proceeds from her wealth tax. Warren is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. She has sponsored and co-sponsored several others including one in 2014 that allowed federal student loan borrowers to refinance their debt at a lower interest rate.
• Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.): She believes universal pre-K and college should be a "fundamental right," to be debt-free, The Atlantic reports. She is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill.
• Sen. Cory Booker (D-N.J.): Introduced a bill in 2018 for baby bonds, which attempted to close the racial-wealth gap in education. Booker is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill.
• Former Texas representative Beto O’Rourke has supported debt-free ideals. In 2018, he tweeted: "We should allow Texans who commit to working in in-demand fields and in underserved communities the chance to graduate debt free." O`Rourke co-sponsored Student Loan Affordability Act until 2015.
• Former tech executive Andrew Yang: Debt forgiveness plans and loan repayment plans, according to his campaign website.

Refinance student loans

• Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D-Minn.) rejected the idea of tuition-free college at a CNN town hall, but called for has called for free 2-year community college degrees. She offered up the idea to refinance loans and expand Pell grants.
• Former representative John Delaney has called for reforming bankruptcy laws so student loan debt can be discharged like all other debts as well as refinancing.

Mixed statements

• Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand (D-N.Y.) is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. In February, she tweeted she'd "allow all students to refinance their loans at 4%" if she were elected president.'

Debt-free college: Where the 2020 presidential candidates stand


I can understand universal healthcare and the $15 minimum wage (I don't fully agree with them - but I can certainly understand the logic behind them).

But this is just bat shit nuts.

No one put a fucking gun to these students heads to go massively into debt...it was 100% their choosing. Why the 'f' do students suddenly deserve to have their tuition paid off by taxpayers? Why this generation and not previous generations? And what makes student loans more important then mortgages? Or business loans? Why have taxpayers pay off student loans but do nothing for low income people with heavy mortgages/debts or business loans (NOT that I am for paying those off either - but at least they make far more sense then just paying off student loans)? What is fucking next? Progressives want taxpayers to pay off their credit cards? Car payments? Gambling debts?

This is progressives being flat out selfish. Many progressives are under 30 with HUGE student debt. So naturally their first thought is themselves.

I will say it again - HELLO? You people voluntarily took the huge student loans. You have no one to blame for them but yourselves. They are 100% YOUR responsibility. Stop pawning your bad decisions on to the rest of America. You fucked up - you get yourselves out of it. It's called 'taking responsibility for your actions'. DUH.

Our society is demanding more education. Not just college but technical

Make the employers pay

What?

Yeah, that's going to work..... So my company, is going to pay for a worker to get a degree in Art History, and that worker isn't even going to stay with my company after graduation.

You think I'm doing that? I'll lay off my employees first, and move out of country, before wasting that much money on education.

Now if you mean paying for people to get education in something the company can use..... we already have that.

My company pays for training in positions we have on staff. And we've already been burned doing that. One of the women we trained just 6 months ago, sent her to a week of training, room and board, she already quit and is moving to a new job.

Why should we pay to educate people, when they leave?

And if you think that Wendy's is going to pay for someone's degree in marine biology, you are crazy.

Again, there are plenty of companies that do have training programs for free, and tuition reimbursement.

Had a lady that got a degree in management, through I believe Meijer. She's not a district manager.

The problem is not that there are not enough ways to get an education. The problem is people getting and education worth having, and being a person worth training.

The Dumbest (Real) College Courses

The people that 'go after it', end up getting somewhere. The people that don't, generally don't.

This isn't a problem of the cost of education. It's a problem is motivation, and having a work ethic.

Anyone can get a degree. Anyone. I had a co-worker that was taking one class a quarter. He was working a full time job, paying his way through, and got a degree in education and chemistry.

His parents were.... problematic. No support. No money. Nothing. He was paying for his own food. At least they let him sleep at his parents house, which was funny since neither parent lived at that house. (long screwed up story).... but the point is, a guy with no help, no money, but a willingness to work, was able to get a degree. Anyone can get a degree. It's a matter of effort and work ethic.

And he's debt free. Paid his way through.

You want to hire an employee with a masters in art history...you pay for it
You want to hire an engineer...pay for that

Why should the government subsidize your employees that you profit off of ?

It's not the employers responsibility to wipe after you. It's your responsibility to pay for your own school.

Flat-Lined by Flattery

The King Ape Low-IQ economic bullies freeload off the development of minds far superior to theirs. It certainly is his responsibility. Not only that, he will make more money after a few years if he invests it in salary and tuition for those he recruits.

But to get this development of our most potentially productive human resources going, businesses should be granted this investment as a substitute for corporate taxes, even though it is the most lucrative investment a corporation can make. You oppose it because you know you don't have the talent to get recruited and would never get anywhere if the talented replaced you bootlickers who take the bosses' side even though, as is obvious in any other investment, the boss is foolishly for listening to the way you support his self-destructive stinginess.

High IQs created all the world's wealth. But we will have to shake you out of your smug conceit by pointing out that we also created all the world's weapons.

 

[Flopper]

'A clear divide exists among 2020 presidential Democrats who are rolling out plans to tackle the student debt crisis, whether tuition-free or debt-free policies are the way to win voter support.

By the numbers: Student debt in the United States has reached $1.5 trillion, and is responsible for much of millennials and generation Z's anguish.

In Congress

• Congressional committees have launched hearings to reauthorize the Higher Education Act, which looks to discuss more affordability in college costs, student loan programs and more. Sen. Brian Schatz (D-Hawaii) and Rep. Mark Pocan (D-Wisc.) reintroduced legislation to help students become debt free within 5 years of graduating.

Tuition free
These programs provide students 2 years of free tuition at participating state community colleges, associate-degree programs and vocational schools. The majority fall into the category of "last dollar" scholarships, indicating the program pays the difference in tuition after financial aid and grants have kicked in, per CNBC.

• Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) is still running on his 2016 campaign promise to make college tuition free and debt free. In 2016, Sanders introduced a bill called the "College for All Act," making public college tuition-free to students through a partnership between the federal government.
• Former HUD Secretary Julián Castro supports tuition-free college.
• Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-Hawaii) wants to eliminate tuition and fees at 4-year public colleges and universities. She also supports free community college tuition for everyone.
• New-age spiritual guru Marianne Williamson supports universal pre-school and free college.

Debt free
This idea aims to cover the costs associated with attending public college without requiring students to take out loans, by establishing federal matches for state spending on higher education and using those funds to fill unmet need for people pursuing degrees

• Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) is running her campaign on students being debt free by using proceeds from her wealth tax. Warren is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. She has sponsored and co-sponsored several others including one in 2014 that allowed federal student loan borrowers to refinance their debt at a lower interest rate.
• Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.): She believes universal pre-K and college should be a "fundamental right," to be debt-free, The Atlantic reports. She is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill.
• Sen. Cory Booker (D-N.J.): Introduced a bill in 2018 for baby bonds, which attempted to close the racial-wealth gap in education. Booker is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill.
• Former Texas representative Beto O’Rourke has supported debt-free ideals. In 2018, he tweeted: "We should allow Texans who commit to working in in-demand fields and in underserved communities the chance to graduate debt free." O`Rourke co-sponsored Student Loan Affordability Act until 2015.
• Former tech executive Andrew Yang: Debt forgiveness plans and loan repayment plans, according to his campaign website.

Refinance student loans

• Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D-Minn.) rejected the idea of tuition-free college at a CNN town hall, but called for has called for free 2-year community college degrees. She offered up the idea to refinance loans and expand Pell grants.
• Former representative John Delaney has called for reforming bankruptcy laws so student loan debt can be discharged like all other debts as well as refinancing.

Mixed statements

• Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand (D-N.Y.) is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. In February, she tweeted she'd "allow all students to refinance their loans at 4%" if she were elected president.'

Debt-free college: Where the 2020 presidential candidates stand


I can understand universal healthcare and the $15 minimum wage (I don't fully agree with them - but I can certainly understand the logic behind them).

But this is just bat shit nuts.

No one put a fucking gun to these students heads to go massively into debt...it was 100% their choosing. Why the 'f' do students suddenly deserve to have their tuition paid off by taxpayers? Why this generation and not previous generations? And what makes student loans more important then mortgages? Or business loans? Why have taxpayers pay off student loans but do nothing for low income people with heavy mortgages/debts or business loans (NOT that I am for paying those off either - but at least they make far more sense then just paying off student loans)? What is fucking next? Progressives want taxpayers to pay off their credit cards? Car payments? Gambling debts?

This is progressives being flat out selfish. Many progressives are under 30 with HUGE student debt. So naturally their first thought is themselves.

I will say it again - HELLO? You people voluntarily took the huge student loans. You have no one to blame for them but yourselves. They are 100% YOUR responsibility. Stop pawning your bad decisions on to the rest of America. You fucked up - you get yourselves out of it. It's called 'taking responsibility for your actions'. DUH.

Believing in Getting a Job Just for Going 4 Years Without a Job Shows How Stupid We All Are

Tell it to the spoiled Preppie pukes and their dumb-jock circus performers. If students aren't paid a salary plus free tuition, they aren't worth anything. As usual, the public debate is intentionally shifted away from the fact that this is class-biased indentured servitude even with free tuition.

So we should pay their tuition and pay them to go to school. Where do I sign up?

This Terminal Society Rewards Mamas' Boys Who Suck Their Thumbs in College

Typical Low-IQ distortion of a proposal that makes him feel uncomfortable. Under my proposed system, you don't sign up; you are recruited. I can tell by your flippant attitude that you wouldn't qualify to be recruited, so you had no more right to go to college than you had to be on the college football team, which is also about talent. You pretend you're capable of understanding things at that level, but your defensive remark shows that even you know you can't.

Then a doctor would only go to college if the hospital was satisfied with his surgeries? A law firm would see how well their employers do in court before they get their law degree. How many bridges would a person have to build to prove they deserved to go to college to a get a civil engineering degree. You need to rethink your plan.

 

[Flopper]

'A clear divide exists among 2020 presidential Democrats who are rolling out plans to tackle the student debt crisis, whether tuition-free or debt-free policies are the way to win voter support.

By the numbers: Student debt in the United States has reached $1.5 trillion, and is responsible for much of millennials and generation Z's anguish.

In Congress

• Congressional committees have launched hearings to reauthorize the Higher Education Act, which looks to discuss more affordability in college costs, student loan programs and more. Sen. Brian Schatz (D-Hawaii) and Rep. Mark Pocan (D-Wisc.) reintroduced legislation to help students become debt free within 5 years of graduating.

Tuition free
These programs provide students 2 years of free tuition at participating state community colleges, associate-degree programs and vocational schools. The majority fall into the category of "last dollar" scholarships, indicating the program pays the difference in tuition after financial aid and grants have kicked in, per CNBC.

• Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) is still running on his 2016 campaign promise to make college tuition free and debt free. In 2016, Sanders introduced a bill called the "College for All Act," making public college tuition-free to students through a partnership between the federal government.
• Former HUD Secretary Julián Castro supports tuition-free college.
• Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-Hawaii) wants to eliminate tuition and fees at 4-year public colleges and universities. She also supports free community college tuition for everyone.
• New-age spiritual guru Marianne Williamson supports universal pre-school and free college.

Debt free
This idea aims to cover the costs associated with attending public college without requiring students to take out loans, by establishing federal matches for state spending on higher education and using those funds to fill unmet need for people pursuing degrees

• Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) is running her campaign on students being debt free by using proceeds from her wealth tax. Warren is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. She has sponsored and co-sponsored several others including one in 2014 that allowed federal student loan borrowers to refinance their debt at a lower interest rate.
• Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.): She believes universal pre-K and college should be a "fundamental right," to be debt-free, The Atlantic reports. She is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill.
• Sen. Cory Booker (D-N.J.): Introduced a bill in 2018 for baby bonds, which attempted to close the racial-wealth gap in education. Booker is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill.
• Former Texas representative Beto O’Rourke has supported debt-free ideals. In 2018, he tweeted: "We should allow Texans who commit to working in in-demand fields and in underserved communities the chance to graduate debt free." O`Rourke co-sponsored Student Loan Affordability Act until 2015.
• Former tech executive Andrew Yang: Debt forgiveness plans and loan repayment plans, according to his campaign website.

Refinance student loans

• Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D-Minn.) rejected the idea of tuition-free college at a CNN town hall, but called for has called for free 2-year community college degrees. She offered up the idea to refinance loans and expand Pell grants.
• Former representative John Delaney has called for reforming bankruptcy laws so student loan debt can be discharged like all other debts as well as refinancing.

Mixed statements

• Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand (D-N.Y.) is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. In February, she tweeted she'd "allow all students to refinance their loans at 4%" if she were elected president.'

Debt-free college: Where the 2020 presidential candidates stand


I can understand universal healthcare and the $15 minimum wage (I don't fully agree with them - but I can certainly understand the logic behind them).

But this is just bat shit nuts.

No one put a fucking gun to these students heads to go massively into debt...it was 100% their choosing. Why the 'f' do students suddenly deserve to have their tuition paid off by taxpayers? Why this generation and not previous generations? And what makes student loans more important then mortgages? Or business loans? Why have taxpayers pay off student loans but do nothing for low income people with heavy mortgages/debts or business loans (NOT that I am for paying those off either - but at least they make far more sense then just paying off student loans)? What is fucking next? Progressives want taxpayers to pay off their credit cards? Car payments? Gambling debts?

This is progressives being flat out selfish. Many progressives are under 30 with HUGE student debt. So naturally their first thought is themselves.

I will say it again - HELLO? You people voluntarily took the huge student loans. You have no one to blame for them but yourselves. They are 100% YOUR responsibility. Stop pawning your bad decisions on to the rest of America. You fucked up - you get yourselves out of it. It's called 'taking responsibility for your actions'. DUH.

Our society is demanding more education. Not just college but technical

Make the employers pay

What?

Yeah, that's going to work..... So my company, is going to pay for a worker to get a degree in Art History, and that worker isn't even going to stay with my company after graduation.

You think I'm doing that? I'll lay off my employees first, and move out of country, before wasting that much money on education.

Now if you mean paying for people to get education in something the company can use..... we already have that.

My company pays for training in positions we have on staff. And we've already been burned doing that. One of the women we trained just 6 months ago, sent her to a week of training, room and board, she already quit and is moving to a new job.

Why should we pay to educate people, when they leave?

And if you think that Wendy's is going to pay for someone's degree in marine biology, you are crazy.

Again, there are plenty of companies that do have training programs for free, and tuition reimbursement.

Had a lady that got a degree in management, through I believe Meijer. She's not a district manager.

The problem is not that there are not enough ways to get an education. The problem is people getting and education worth having, and being a person worth training.

The Dumbest (Real) College Courses

The people that 'go after it', end up getting somewhere. The people that don't, generally don't.

This isn't a problem of the cost of education. It's a problem is motivation, and having a work ethic.

Anyone can get a degree. Anyone. I had a co-worker that was taking one class a quarter. He was working a full time job, paying his way through, and got a degree in education and chemistry.

His parents were.... problematic. No support. No money. Nothing. He was paying for his own food. At least they let him sleep at his parents house, which was funny since neither parent lived at that house. (long screwed up story).... but the point is, a guy with no help, no money, but a willingness to work, was able to get a degree. Anyone can get a degree. It's a matter of effort and work ethic.

And he's debt free. Paid his way through.

You want to hire an employee with a masters in art history...you pay for it
You want to hire an engineer...pay for that

Why should the government subsidize your employees that you profit off of ?

It's not the employers responsibility to wipe after you. It's your responsibility to pay for your own school.

Flat-Lined by Flattery

The King Ape Low-IQ economic bullies freeload off the development of minds far superior to theirs. It certainly is his responsibility. Not only that, he will make more money after a few years if he invests it in salary and tuition for those he recruits.

But to get this development of our most potentially productive human resources going, businesses should be granted this investment as a substitute for corporate taxes, even though it is the most lucrative investment a corporation can make. You oppose it because you know you don't have the talent to get recruited and would never get anywhere if the talented replaced you bootlickers who take the bosses' side even though, as is obvious in any other investment, the boss is foolishly for listening to the way you support his self-destructive stinginess.

High IQs created all the world's wealth. But we will have to shake you out of your smug conceit by pointing out that we also created all the world's weapons.

Employers began paying for a college education for employees back in the fifties. It increased in popularity till almost every major company was doing it. Paying for education was treated tax wise just like all benefits, they were deductions from income. About 25 or 30 years ago college costs started rising rapidly and employee retention began to fall. That trend has contend to this day. The result has been employers have either totally dropped the education benefit or curtailed it's use. It really doesn't make much sense today for employers or employees because it generally takes 6 to 8 years for students with full time jobs, to get a bachelor's degree. This means it is very likely that the employee will have changed jobs long before they graduated. The employer wouldn't have got any real benefit and the employee would probably be faced with transferring credits to a new school which he might have pay for himself.

It was a good concept but it's time has past. Employers are interested in what you can do for them today, not in 8 or 10 years. Businesses move so fast that many of them don't last 8 or 10 years so why should they make a large investment in employee education.

Business's today spend a lot money on training to improve the employees job performance on current tasks not to develop their long term potential.

 

[ThunderKiss1965]

Free shit for your vote. Except its not free and someone has to pay. The loons, answer tax the rich out of prosperity and then work your way down until everyone is equally miserable and dependent on the benevolence of the Government. Democratic socialism.

It’s not free

It’s deciding how we spend our general revenue. Should we help the people or should you spend on a military deployed tens of thousand of miles away?

It’s all about priorities

How about we not spend it on anything and let the people keep their money.

You Resent Being Dependent on High IQs; That's Why You Humiliate Us and Wind Up Losing Our Wealth-Production

Where do you think their money comes from? And there'd be a lot more of it coming there way if people with productive natural talent were paid up front instead of sacrificing their youth to get a job that they were owed from the beginning.

I don't put much stock in the IQ test even though I score in the top 2% on everyone I've taken and no one is owed a job.

 

[MarathonMike]

The focus should be on a manageable level of debt weighed against your most likely earning power for the 10 years after graduating. If you can't show that the debt is eliminated in 10 years, start over with a new school, and/or a new degree and/or different living/dining/transportation arrangements.

 

[Andylusion]

Free shit for your vote. Except its not free and someone has to pay. The loons, answer tax the rich out of prosperity and then work your way down until everyone is equally miserable and dependent on the benevolence of the Government. Democratic socialism.

It’s not free

It’s deciding how we spend our general revenue. Should we help the people or should you spend on a military deployed tens of thousand of miles away?

It’s all about priorities

How about we not spend it on anything and let the people keep their money.

You Resent Being Dependent on High IQs; That's Why You Humiliate Us and Wind Up Losing Our Wealth-Production

Where do you think their money comes from? And there'd be a lot more of it coming there way if people with productive natural talent were paid up front instead of sacrificing their youth to get a job that they were owed from the beginning.

Nothing irritates me more than some self-important person, staring at his own reflection in a mirror, saying they were 'owed' something.

 

[Andylusion]

Free shit for your vote. Except its not free and someone has to pay. The loons, answer tax the rich out of prosperity and then work your way down until everyone is equally miserable and dependent on the benevolence of the Government. Democratic socialism.

It’s not free

It’s deciding how we spend our general revenue. Should we help the people or should you spend on a military deployed tens of thousand of miles away?

It’s all about priorities

How about we not spend it on anything and let the people keep their money.

You Resent Being Dependent on High IQs; That's Why You Humiliate Us and Wind Up Losing Our Wealth-Production

Where do you think their money comes from? And there'd be a lot more of it coming there way if people with productive natural talent were paid up front instead of sacrificing their youth to get a job that they were owed from the beginning.

I don't put much stock in the IQ test even though I score in the top 2% on everyone I've taken and no one is owed a job.

Agreed. I scored highest in my class. The IQ test means practically nothing.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

I don't believe school should be paid by the taxpayers. Seriously, whats coming out of our k-12 now isn't what you would call educated.

About 60% of my property taxes go to our schools to educate other people's kids. I don't have any kids in school and never have; neither do my tenants.

IMO, if you want to have kids, you clothe them, you feed them, you educate them, and if you can't do those things for your children, you have no business having them in the first place. Now they want us to fund their education right into their mid to late 20's.

A couple of years ago I went downtown to a hearing to have my property taxes reevaluated. The school sent their lawyer downtown to fight me. When I got the decision through mail, I was very unhappy, so I filed an appeal which is held over 100 miles away at our state capital. I didn't attend, but the school once again sent their lawyer down there to fight against my claim. Luckily for me, the judges there were fair, and a three panel judge ruled unanimously in my favor.

The point is that this public education farce is a racket. The school was not happy with the tens of thousands I already paid to educate children that aren't mine, but they fought me because I wanted to pay a little less. And where did the school board get the money to pay their lawyer to attend the two hearings????

I agree 100 percent. You shouldnt have to pay a dime to educate someone else.

When other people pay for your things you have, you don't take as much of an interest.

When my niece started skipping school and her grades began to suffer, my sister took immediate acton. She grounded my niece indefinately. She sat with her every night catching up on her studies, double checking her homework. She made sure my niece had very minimal television time and what she did on the internet was mostly for school. She called the school twice a week to measure her progress.

That girl turned things around real quick. Before you knew it, she was back to an A student again and later in life graduated college at the top of half her classes. That's what you do when you're paying 15K a year for your child to attend a good religious school. You make sure you're going to get your monies worth.

With public school kids, the parents throw them on the bus and once those doors close, the kid is the teachers problem.

I think if the parents paid for their kids education, or at least a good chunk of it instead of us taxpayers, those parents would be more involved with their studies. When the kid doesn't amount to anything, they blame the schools instead of themselves. Public school the way it's run around here is a disadvantage to the teachers, taxpayers, and the students.

Didn't you just say the problem was with the students and the parents?

Yes I did, why? If the parent(s) aren't going to participate in the education of their children, then there are some kids that will fail no matter what you do.

This Whole Thread Is Soaked With Dumbed-Down Conformist Blowhards

If we weren't blinded by conformity to whatever is told us by those who set themselves above us, we'd see through that oft-repeated lie by comparing it to kids' development in sports. There parental interest might help a little, but it is not needed at all. Athletes are self-motivated.

 

[Staidhup]

Nobody points out the financially disturbing fact that each one of these candidates proposes giving this or that out for free while paying for it by taxing the wealth of the nation to fund these hollow proposals. Apparently none of these candidates are capable of reading a financial statement, do not understand monetary policy, nor comprehends the economic consequences resulting from their proposals, yet the handouts continue with each trying to outspend the other at the expense of a money pot that simply does not exist.

 

[bendog]

'A clear divide exists among 2020 presidential Democrats who are rolling out plans to tackle the student debt crisis, whether tuition-free or debt-free policies are the way to win voter support.

By the numbers: Student debt in the United States has reached $1.5 trillion, and is responsible for much of millennials and generation Z's anguish.

In Congress

• Congressional committees have launched hearings to reauthorize the Higher Education Act, which looks to discuss more affordability in college costs, student loan programs and more. Sen. Brian Schatz (D-Hawaii) and Rep. Mark Pocan (D-Wisc.) reintroduced legislation to help students become debt free within 5 years of graduating.

Tuition free
These programs provide students 2 years of free tuition at participating state community colleges, associate-degree programs and vocational schools. The majority fall into the category of "last dollar" scholarships, indicating the program pays the difference in tuition after financial aid and grants have kicked in, per CNBC.

• Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) is still running on his 2016 campaign promise to make college tuition free and debt free. In 2016, Sanders introduced a bill called the "College for All Act," making public college tuition-free to students through a partnership between the federal government.
• Former HUD Secretary Julián Castro supports tuition-free college.
• Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-Hawaii) wants to eliminate tuition and fees at 4-year public colleges and universities. She also supports free community college tuition for everyone.
• New-age spiritual guru Marianne Williamson supports universal pre-school and free college.

Debt free
This idea aims to cover the costs associated with attending public college without requiring students to take out loans, by establishing federal matches for state spending on higher education and using those funds to fill unmet need for people pursuing degrees

• Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) is running her campaign on students being debt free by using proceeds from her wealth tax. Warren is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. She has sponsored and co-sponsored several others including one in 2014 that allowed federal student loan borrowers to refinance their debt at a lower interest rate.
• Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.): She believes universal pre-K and college should be a "fundamental right," to be debt-free, The Atlantic reports. She is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill.
• Sen. Cory Booker (D-N.J.): Introduced a bill in 2018 for baby bonds, which attempted to close the racial-wealth gap in education. Booker is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill.
• Former Texas representative Beto O’Rourke has supported debt-free ideals. In 2018, he tweeted: "We should allow Texans who commit to working in in-demand fields and in underserved communities the chance to graduate debt free." O`Rourke co-sponsored Student Loan Affordability Act until 2015.
• Former tech executive Andrew Yang: Debt forgiveness plans and loan repayment plans, according to his campaign website.

Refinance student loans

• Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D-Minn.) rejected the idea of tuition-free college at a CNN town hall, but called for has called for free 2-year community college degrees. She offered up the idea to refinance loans and expand Pell grants.
• Former representative John Delaney has called for reforming bankruptcy laws so student loan debt can be discharged like all other debts as well as refinancing.

Mixed statements

• Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand (D-N.Y.) is a co-sponsor for the Schatz-Pocan bill and the Sanders bill. In February, she tweeted she'd "allow all students to refinance their loans at 4%" if she were elected president.'

Debt-free college: Where the 2020 presidential candidates stand


I can understand universal healthcare and the $15 minimum wage (I don't fully agree with them - but I can certainly understand the logic behind them).

But this is just bat shit nuts.

No one put a fucking gun to these students heads to go massively into debt...it was 100% their choosing. Why the 'f' do students suddenly deserve to have their tuition paid off by taxpayers? Why this generation and not previous generations? And what makes student loans more important then mortgages? Or business loans? Why have taxpayers pay off student loans but do nothing for low income people with heavy mortgages/debts or business loans (NOT that I am for paying those off either - but at least they make far more sense then just paying off student loans)? What is fucking next? Progressives want taxpayers to pay off their credit cards? Car payments? Gambling debts?

This is progressives being flat out selfish. Many progressives are under 30 with HUGE student debt. So naturally their first thought is themselves.

I will say it again - HELLO? You people voluntarily took the huge student loans. You have no one to blame for them but yourselves. They are 100% YOUR responsibility. Stop pawning your bad decisions on to the rest of America. You fucked up - you get yourselves out of it. It's called 'taking responsibility for your actions'. DUH.

Our society is demanding more education. Not just college but technical

Make the employers pay

Trump is cutting Work for America and other work for debt programs. To cut taxes on himself. Well, if he paid any taxes.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

About 60% of my property taxes go to our schools to educate other people's kids. I don't have any kids in school and never have; neither do my tenants.

IMO, if you want to have kids, you clothe them, you feed them, you educate them, and if you can't do those things for your children, you have no business having them in the first place. Now they want us to fund their education right into their mid to late 20's.

A couple of years ago I went downtown to a hearing to have my property taxes reevaluated. The school sent their lawyer downtown to fight me. When I got the decision through mail, I was very unhappy, so I filed an appeal which is held over 100 miles away at our state capital. I didn't attend, but the school once again sent their lawyer down there to fight against my claim. Luckily for me, the judges there were fair, and a three panel judge ruled unanimously in my favor.

The point is that this public education farce is a racket. The school was not happy with the tens of thousands I already paid to educate children that aren't mine, but they fought me because I wanted to pay a little less. And where did the school board get the money to pay their lawyer to attend the two hearings????

I agree 100 percent. You shouldnt have to pay a dime to educate someone else.

When other people pay for your things you have, you don't take as much of an interest.

When my niece started skipping school and her grades began to suffer, my sister took immediate acton. She grounded my niece indefinately. She sat with her every night catching up on her studies, double checking her homework. She made sure my niece had very minimal television time and what she did on the internet was mostly for school. She called the school twice a week to measure her progress.

That girl turned things around real quick. Before you knew it, she was back to an A student again and later in life graduated college at the top of half her classes. That's what you do when you're paying 15K a year for your child to attend a good religious school. You make sure you're going to get your monies worth.

With public school kids, the parents throw them on the bus and once those doors close, the kid is the teachers problem.

I think if the parents paid for their kids education, or at least a good chunk of it instead of us taxpayers, those parents would be more involved with their studies. When the kid doesn't amount to anything, they blame the schools instead of themselves. Public school the way it's run around here is a disadvantage to the teachers, taxpayers, and the students.

Ray, new college students today pay little attention to the cost because anything their parents, scholarships, of financial aid does not pay goes into a college loan. Typically students pay no attention to their college loan until they get toward the end. Then it becomes a "Oh My God, how in the hell am I going to pay this?"

I took my granddaughter to college last fall and sat through much of her new student program with her and her friends. Believe me, these kids are not concerned at all about the costs nor their loan. They are interested in decorating their dorm room, class schedules, meal plans, and parties. Most new freshmen are 16 to 18 years old. They are still teenagers and they are bat shit crazy. Most of them have never had a bank account, paid a bill, bought a bus ticket or paid a parking ticket.

It is very difficult for parents to be involved because colleges today don't deal with parents. They deal with the student. Recruiters prefer to meet with students, not the parents. Applications are done online by the student, acceptance letters go to student as well as all communications. The tuition bills go to the student and the student decides how it's going to be paid. They make decisions on their loan. Usually they ask their parent but not always. Remember the age we are dealing with. They are trying to prove they are independent. Somewhere around their third year they wake up and discover they have a huge college loan and they still have 3 years to go and Mommy and Daddy are not going to pay off their loan.

I think most high school students after graduating should live at home and go to a local community for the first 2 years. That not only saves a bundle of money but gives them time to mature.

Actually I was addressing primary education and not college. I think a considerable amount of kids do realize the debt they are getting into, however they have this fantasy of graduating college and getting a six figure job somewhere which would give them the capability to erase their debt in a matter of a few years.

In many cases that's not true. College gives these kids a world of dreams that are usually only a realty for a few. As I stated earlier, my nephews ex-wife took four years of advertising. She had no interest in advertising, but was promised gold paved roads if she chose this opportunity. She now works at a bank. Prior to that, she was renting apartments.

But back to the OP, public college is not in the works for a country that's 21 trillion in debt and growing. We simply cannot keep depending on government for everything. It's like I was telling my father yesterday when we were discussing my niece and nephews college debt. I'm going to go to work everyday, make money which gets taxed, and the government will use my tax money to fund the eduction of my future doctor or lawyer. Then when I need professional help, I go to one of those lawyers I paid the eduction for, and he or she charges me $500.00 for a twenty minute consultation.

College is an investment no different than real estate, stocks, commodities or a business. Taxpayers should not be funding investments for people.

If we end up with either plan, I believe free community college is a better choice because.

• It creates a career path for kids not planning on a 4 year degree with 2 year para-professional degree in many of the high demand areas such as technology, healthcare, construction.
• For those that are going to continue to a 4 year degree, it lowers the overall cost by over 50%.
• It reduces both college loans and federal and state aid to education
• Lastly, it encourages kids to remain at home the first two years out of high school giving time to mature, work and decide on their future.

High IQs Have Invented Everything That Prevents You Education Slavers From Living Like Wild Animals, So That's What You Are

A student can have a full-time job and finish a two-year degree in four years. Since you brainless conformists have continually insulted the intelligent on this thread, this should apply to the STEM-talented, whose contribution to the economy you people don't deserve.

So if someone has the talent to become a great doctor, he shouldn't cripple himself by going through 8 years of the childish and depressing work-without-pay that you ungrateful parasites demand of him. He should get a nursing degree. He will be a lot better off emotionally and will make enough money to satisfy his needs rather than luxuries that aren't worth the permanent psychological damage that unpaid education produces.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

K-12 is paid by taxpayers
Employers are given an educated workforce at taxpayer expense

Yes they are, but shouldn't us taxpayers be reimbursed for the tens of thousands of dollars we spent on those kids?

Yes we should

By those who profit off of those skills

Well then if it's the employers responsibility to pay for your personal education to better yourself, shouldn't they be paying for your home as well? After all, it's to the employers advantage their workers have a place to live. And how about your auto payments? It's to the employers advantage their employees are well fed too.

I'm so glad I wasn't born a Democrat. I would never want to go through life believing that I should be coddled by everybody else to get by in life.

The employer is not making a profit off that house.

The employer makes a profit with the machines he uses to create the product, should he pay for the education of the engineers that designed it? He makes a profit off the electricity he uses to make the product, should he pay for the education of the people who created the electric grid?

The Seflfish Are Criminally Anti-Social. Also, They Deprive Themselves Because of Their Jealousy of the Talented.

You're too stupid to understand a sequence of logic. The manufacturer of the machines your fatcat idol buys should pay for the tuition and living expenses of the engineers he freeloads off; he himself should pay for his own employees' educational preparation. Same with the electric company's bosses, or we should pull the plug on all these parasites.

Therefore, the reason you oppose paying students is that you realize that only the smartest would be allowed to go to college and you obviously aren't smart enough. You love this bullying economic system because it puts inferior people like you and the other education sadists on this thread in superior positions.

 

[ThunderKiss1965]

Nobody points out the financially disturbing fact that each one of these candidates proposes giving this or that out for free while paying for it by taxing the wealth of the nation to fund these hollow proposals. Apparently none of these candidates are capable of reading a financial statement, do not understand monetary policy, nor comprehends the economic consequences resulting from their proposals, yet the handouts continue with each trying to outspend the other at the expense of a money pot that simply does not exist.

The problem is taxing the wealthy will not pay for everything the loons want so they will have to raise taxes on everyone.