Ginsburg and Civil War

[Cecilie1200]

I think it's fairly inarguable that they're usually the ones to break new ground in this area. Doesn't mean I'm not still disgusted when the right decides to rush enthusiastically after them.

I don't see much of the Right enthusiastically going after them.
But then I live in Liberal land so that might be why.

I hear about some ignorant extremist far right wing neo-nazis now and then. But it's not common.

OTOH, I hear about violence in hard core liberal areas every day (and they usually blame guns and not their own policies and actions). I hear about people like Maxine Waters often. I hear about colleges denying one conservative group after another constantly.

But I do think more people on the Right are up to there with it so we may be entering a new phase in America. The end of the silent, passive Right. maybe

Trust me, our society in general has gone waaaayyyyy over the line into crass, trashy, self-absorbed behavior. People who are putatively on the right are far too willing to say, "Well, the left did it, so we should show them what it feels like!" without ever once asking themselves if it's a good idea.

/----/ Did your magic crystal ball tell you what EVERYONE on the right says?

First of all, Kneejerk, I'm far more conservative than you ever dreamed of being (real conservatism, not this half-assed tribalist crap we've been treated to in screaming waves since the election campaign). Second, until you are willing to use the same leeway ("Oh, EVERYONE is saying that?") to the left that you do to the right, I'm not interested in hearing your hypocritical excuses.

Not everyone on the right behaves like an out-of-control, barbarian jackass to the extent that they end up on the news. The same can be said for the people on the left. That doesn't negate the fact that far too many people on both sides have gone well beyond what can be reasonably expected of educated, civilized adults in modern-day America, or the fact that far too many of the people who don't actually exhibit that behavior are nevertheless willing to accept it, excuse it, and even cheer it on.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

In other words, "brown people are the enemy", then "anyone who doesnt fall in line with that are also the enemy".

This is exactly what Putin wants. A divided USA is a weaker USA.

Why are you people so obsessed with Putin?

Its Trump himself who is obsessed with Putin, going to meet him in fFnland. Congratulating him on election win, after being told not to.

Trump claiming he got Korea idea from Putin.

Bolton doing 180 on Russia after meeting Putin.

Solving Syria crisis by asking Putin.

Clearly brown-nosing Putin by asking him to be readmitted into G7.

Doing Putin's work by ruining our alliances.

All President Trump has ever said is that it would be good to have friendly relations with them. You all want war with them. It’s the globalists’ wet dream to get Russia and the US in a nuclear war. Our only real enemy is Islam and Muslim shit holes that spawn terrorists like flies.

Wasn't it not that long ago where the left was worried we would get into a war with North Korea? China? Russia?

Now that Trump is trying to work things out besides war, they are complaining he's making friends with our enemies.

These are the very same people who praised Kerry when he made that phony deal with Iran--the world sponsors of terrorism. He gave them billions of dollars in cash, and no agreement for oversight of their nuclear facilities.

Partisans are liars and hypocrites.

Part of the job description, evidently.
.

If Trump funded the cure for cancer and it became a reality, the left would say he started an over population problem in the US.

Did anybody on the left ever ask themselves what our position be today with North Korea if Hillary were in charge? If they would have more or less money today? If our economy would be doing as well as it is today?

 

[Cellblock2429]

Why are you people so obsessed with Putin?

Its Trump himself who is obsessed with Putin, going to meet him in fFnland. Congratulating him on election win, after being told not to.

Trump claiming he got Korea idea from Putin.

Bolton doing 180 on Russia after meeting Putin.

Solving Syria crisis by asking Putin.

Clearly brown-nosing Putin by asking him to be readmitted into G7.

Doing Putin's work by ruining our alliances.

All President Trump has ever said is that it would be good to have friendly relations with them. You all want war with them. It’s the globalists’ wet dream to get Russia and the US in a nuclear war. Our only real enemy is Islam and Muslim shit holes that spawn terrorists like flies.

Wasn't it not that long ago where the left was worried we would get into a war with North Korea? China? Russia?

Now that Trump is trying to work things out besides war, they are complaining he's making friends with our enemies.

These are the very same people who praised Kerry when he made that phony deal with Iran--the world sponsors of terrorism. He gave them billions of dollars in cash, and no agreement for oversight of their nuclear facilities.

Partisans are liars and hypocrites.

Part of the job description, evidently.
.

If Trump funded the cure for cancer and it became a reality, the left would say he started an over population problem in the US.

Did anybody on the left ever ask themselves what our position be today with North Korea if Hillary were in charge? If they would have more or less money today? If our economy would be doing as well as it is today?

/——-/ Leftards don’t care. If Hildabeast had won things would be worse and the excuse from the left would be “Oh Hillary is the greatest president ever and Trump would have caused the market to crash, would have started WWIII and reinstituted slavery. Hillary saved America by winning. “

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Its Trump himself who is obsessed with Putin, going to meet him in fFnland. Congratulating him on election win, after being told not to.

Trump claiming he got Korea idea from Putin.

Bolton doing 180 on Russia after meeting Putin.

Solving Syria crisis by asking Putin.

Clearly brown-nosing Putin by asking him to be readmitted into G7.

Doing Putin's work by ruining our alliances.

All President Trump has ever said is that it would be good to have friendly relations with them. You all want war with them. It’s the globalists’ wet dream to get Russia and the US in a nuclear war. Our only real enemy is Islam and Muslim shit holes that spawn terrorists like flies.

Wasn't it not that long ago where the left was worried we would get into a war with North Korea? China? Russia?

Now that Trump is trying to work things out besides war, they are complaining he's making friends with our enemies.

These are the very same people who praised Kerry when he made that phony deal with Iran--the world sponsors of terrorism. He gave them billions of dollars in cash, and no agreement for oversight of their nuclear facilities.

Partisans are liars and hypocrites.

Part of the job description, evidently.
.

If Trump funded the cure for cancer and it became a reality, the left would say he started an over population problem in the US.

Did anybody on the left ever ask themselves what our position be today with North Korea if Hillary were in charge? If they would have more or less money today? If our economy would be doing as well as it is today?

/——-/ Leftards don’t care. If Hildabeast had won things would be worse and the excuse from the left would be “Oh Hillary is the greatest president ever and Trump would have caused the market to crash, would have started WWIII and reinstituted slavery. Hillary saved America by winning. “

Or they would do what they did during most of DumBama's years, and that is blame the Republican led Congress.

Nothing would have gotten done under Hillary except perhaps more illegals getting into the country and taking even more American jobs. She (Like Obama) would have never come to any agreement with the Republicans. At least now, we are moving forwards with the country, and moving it very quickly.

 

[Cellblock2429]

All President Trump has ever said is that it would be good to have friendly relations with them. You all want war with them. It’s the globalists’ wet dream to get Russia and the US in a nuclear war. Our only real enemy is Islam and Muslim shit holes that spawn terrorists like flies.

Wasn't it not that long ago where the left was worried we would get into a war with North Korea? China? Russia?

Now that Trump is trying to work things out besides war, they are complaining he's making friends with our enemies.

These are the very same people who praised Kerry when he made that phony deal with Iran--the world sponsors of terrorism. He gave them billions of dollars in cash, and no agreement for oversight of their nuclear facilities.

Partisans are liars and hypocrites.

Part of the job description, evidently.
.

If Trump funded the cure for cancer and it became a reality, the left would say he started an over population problem in the US.

Did anybody on the left ever ask themselves what our position be today with North Korea if Hillary were in charge? If they would have more or less money today? If our economy would be doing as well as it is today?

/——-/ Leftards don’t care. If Hildabeast had won things would be worse and the excuse from the left would be “Oh Hillary is the greatest president ever and Trump would have caused the market to crash, would have started WWIII and reinstituted slavery. Hillary saved America by winning. “

Or they would do what they did during most of DumBama's years, and that is blame the Republican led Congress.

Nothing would have gotten done under Hillary except perhaps more illegals getting into the country and taking even more American jobs. She (Like Obama) would have never come to any agreement with the Republicans. At least now, we are moving forwards with the country, and moving it very quickly.

/---/ Her gun grabbing USSC pick and the other 4 libtards would have already decided that the 2nd Amendment doesn't mean what it says and they'd be demanding every gun owner turn in their firearms.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Not just the one guy who threw chicken feces.
Red Hen protests lead to street closure, arrest in Lexington, Virginia
Red Hen Yelp listing hit by protests
This is what happens when your restaurant is also called Red Hen

I'm sorry, but your bias is showing. The Left has been doing this crap for YEARS!
The Right is just beginning because the Left is ramping up the attacks.

In fact, it's so shocking when the right FINALLY begins to push back that it blows you away.
Incredulous! How DARE the Right EVER respond !!!!!

(The Conservative Right, aren't they those quiet, meek, passive push overs that can be kicked, spat on, their God humiliated, and beaten (literally) and will never say a word.)

Proof???
Notice you NEVER EVER hear anyone blaspheme Mohammed or Allah.....oh no...but Jesus Christ???
All day long and twice on Sunday. Cowards!!!

Well now you and other sympathizers are shocked and in disbelief when the Right starts pushing back.
It's time. Suddenly pushing back is evil. The Right needs to take to the streets by the millions in protest at this point. The Left has gone too far and proved it's callous, hedonistic destructive ways.

Egypt would be a Radical Muslim state now under Morsi with Obama his best friend for absolute certain except for ONE small thing.....

The previously silent Egyptian People finally rose up and took to the streets and said ENOUGH!
Their sacrifice and change of tactics saved their nation from radical Islam.....Morsi, Obama and Radical Islam was counting on them remaining silent while the tanks and guns were all put into place to subdue the population...just behind would come the shackles and chains.

There's a time for silence.......and then.....
All that is required for evil men to prevail....is for good men to remain silent for too long.
Something's stirring. The giant has been poked a few times too many in his slumber.

My "bias"? What bias is that? The bias you ASSume I have because I'm not licking Trump's ass reflexively? Because I'm not leaping to defend everything someone "on the right" does? Oh my God, reason and logic! The HORROR!

I didn't bother to read your post, FYI, because you disqualified yourself the instant you ASSumed that anyone who isn't a neo-conservative tribalist like yourself MUST be a leftist enemy. I don't waste time arguing with lunatics.

 

[DJT for Life]

Ginsburg served with Clara Barton at Antietam.

No, it was Ginsburg's great great granddaughter who fought in the Civil War

I read about that, somewhere.

She fought in the War between the North and the South. She fought for the West.

 

[Picaro]

I heard of a poll that just came out stating that 31% of people surveyed believes that we are on the brink of another civil war. While I don't believe that for a minute, that concern doesn't surprise me with the hatred of Trump spewed by the MSM on a daily basis.

Civil war would mean a lot of deaths, and while leftists are extremely violent people, I just can't see it.

The announcement today of Kennedy leaving the court to spend the rest of his days fishing has probably made record alcohol sales in liberal cities and states, I still don't see the left getting violent enough to start this war. However..........

Would this be more of a reality if something happened to Justice Ginsburg? She is an elderly lady and certainly more prone to illness or death than any other Justice; not that I'm hoping for such a thing. But would such an unfortunate incident make this so-called civil war more of a reality in the US?

The media is a mind controlling machine. Another new poll came out that said 51% approve of the Trump economy. My only question was, WTF are these other 49% that think the economy isn't doing great? Brainwashing media.

In other words, "brown people are the enemy", then "anyone who doesnt fall in line with that are also the enemy".

This is exactly what Putin wants. A divided USA is a weaker USA.

Why are you people so obsessed with Putin?

Its Trump himself who is obsessed with Putin, going to meet him in fFnland. Congratulating him on election win, after being told not to.

Trump claiming he got Korea idea from Putin.

Bolton doing 180 on Russia after meeting Putin.

Solving Syria crisis by asking Putin.

Clearly brown-nosing Putin by asking him to be readmitted into G7.

Doing Putin's work by ruining our alliances.

All President Trump has ever said is that it would be good to have friendly relations with them. You all want war with them. It’s the globalists’ wet dream to get Russia and the US in a nuclear war. Our only real enemy is Islam and Muslim shit holes that spawn terrorists like flies.

They hope nobody remembers the $145 mil Putin laid on the Clintons, ontop of the money they laid on Podesta and other Dems, and the blowjobs Obama laid on Putin, promising him he woultget him better deals after the 20212 election.

Pay no attention to these vermin; they haven't had any real talking points since Carter ran.

 

[Picaro]

I heard of a poll that just came out stating that 31% of people surveyed believes that we are on the brink of another civil war. While I don't believe that for a minute, that concern doesn't surprise me with the hatred of Trump spewed by the MSM on a daily basis.

Civil war would mean a lot of deaths, and while leftists are extremely violent people, I just can't see it.

The announcement today of Kennedy leaving the court to spend the rest of his days fishing has probably made record alcohol sales in liberal cities and states, I still don't see the left getting violent enough to start this war. However..........

Would this be more of a reality if something happened to Justice Ginsburg? She is an elderly lady and certainly more prone to illness or death than any other Justice; not that I'm hoping for such a thing. But would such an unfortunate incident make this so-called civil war more of a reality in the US?

The media is a mind controlling machine. Another new poll came out that said 51% approve of the Trump economy. My only question was, WTF are these other 49% that think the economy isn't doing great? Brainwashing media.

/-----/ Dems are in free fall

ROTFLMAO

missed that one the last time through. lol

 

[dudmuck]

I heard of a poll that just came out stating that 31% of people surveyed believes that we are on the brink of another civil war. While I don't believe that for a minute, that concern doesn't surprise me with the hatred of Trump spewed by the MSM on a daily basis.

Civil war would mean a lot of deaths, and while leftists are extremely violent people, I just can't see it.

The announcement today of Kennedy leaving the court to spend the rest of his days fishing has probably made record alcohol sales in liberal cities and states, I still don't see the left getting violent enough to start this war. However..........

Would this be more of a reality if something happened to Justice Ginsburg? She is an elderly lady and certainly more prone to illness or death than any other Justice; not that I'm hoping for such a thing. But would such an unfortunate incident make this so-called civil war more of a reality in the US?

The media is a mind controlling machine. Another new poll came out that said 51% approve of the Trump economy. My only question was, WTF are these other 49% that think the economy isn't doing great? Brainwashing media.

In other words, "brown people are the enemy", then "anyone who doesnt fall in line with that are also the enemy".

This is exactly what Putin wants. A divided USA is a weaker USA.

Why are you people so obsessed with Putin?

Its Trump himself who is obsessed with Putin, going to meet him in fFnland. Congratulating him on election win, after being told not to.

Trump claiming he got Korea idea from Putin.

Bolton doing 180 on Russia after meeting Putin.

Solving Syria crisis by asking Putin.

Clearly brown-nosing Putin by asking him to be readmitted into G7.

Doing Putin's work by ruining our alliances.

All President Trump has ever said is that it would be good to have friendly relations with them. You all want war with them. It’s the globalists’ wet dream to get Russia and the US in a nuclear war. Our only real enemy is Islam and Muslim shit holes that spawn terrorists like flies.

They hope nobody remembers the $145 mil Putin laid on the Clintons, ontop of the money they laid on Podesta and other Dems, and the blowjobs Obama laid on Putin, promising him he woultget him better deals after the 20212 election.

Pay no attention to these vermin; they haven't had any real talking points since Carter ran.

Wow, Putin really got a raw deal on that, considering how Hillary was constantly calling out Putin's bullshit. See why putin hates hillary.

 

[Picaro]

In other words, "brown people are the enemy", then "anyone who doesnt fall in line with that are also the enemy".

This is exactly what Putin wants. A divided USA is a weaker USA.

Why are you people so obsessed with Putin?

Its Trump himself who is obsessed with Putin, going to meet him in fFnland. Congratulating him on election win, after being told not to.

Trump claiming he got Korea idea from Putin.

Bolton doing 180 on Russia after meeting Putin.

Solving Syria crisis by asking Putin.

Clearly brown-nosing Putin by asking him to be readmitted into G7.

Doing Putin's work by ruining our alliances.

All President Trump has ever said is that it would be good to have friendly relations with them. You all want war with them. It’s the globalists’ wet dream to get Russia and the US in a nuclear war. Our only real enemy is Islam and Muslim shit holes that spawn terrorists like flies.

They hope nobody remembers the $145 mil Putin laid on the Clintons, ontop of the money they laid on Podesta and other Dems, and the blowjobs Obama laid on Putin, promising him he woultget him better deals after the 20212 election.

Pay no attention to these vermin; they haven't had any real talking points since Carter ran.

Wow, Putin really got a raw deal on that, considering how Hillary was constantly calling out Putin's bullshit. See why putin hates hillary.

How so? He got a lot of high quality uranium to sell to his Iranian buddies, who in turn got billions in untraceable cash from their fellow Muslim agent Obama to buy it from Putin with.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Ginsburg and Civil War

I don't know what it will take for the left to ratchet down the vitriol over Trump. I mean, he's making America great again all over the place, what the hell else do they want

We are in a cycle and people have lost it.

So what ?

A few people will get killed and we'll all move on.

Remember Kent State.

 

[dudmuck]

Why are you people so obsessed with Putin?

Its Trump himself who is obsessed with Putin, going to meet him in fFnland. Congratulating him on election win, after being told not to.

Trump claiming he got Korea idea from Putin.

Bolton doing 180 on Russia after meeting Putin.

Solving Syria crisis by asking Putin.

Clearly brown-nosing Putin by asking him to be readmitted into G7.

Doing Putin's work by ruining our alliances.

All President Trump has ever said is that it would be good to have friendly relations with them. You all want war with them. It’s the globalists’ wet dream to get Russia and the US in a nuclear war. Our only real enemy is Islam and Muslim shit holes that spawn terrorists like flies.

They hope nobody remembers the $145 mil Putin laid on the Clintons, ontop of the money they laid on Podesta and other Dems, and the blowjobs Obama laid on Putin, promising him he woultget him better deals after the 20212 election.

Pay no attention to these vermin; they haven't had any real talking points since Carter ran.

Wow, Putin really got a raw deal on that, considering how Hillary was constantly calling out Putin's bullshit. See why putin hates hillary.

How so? He got a lot of high quality uranium to sell to his Iranian buddies, who in turn got billions in untraceable cash from their fellow Muslim agent Obama to buy it from Putin with.

Pure fantasy. That was debunked long ago.

 

[Picaro]

Its Trump himself who is obsessed with Putin, going to meet him in fFnland. Congratulating him on election win, after being told not to.

Trump claiming he got Korea idea from Putin.

Bolton doing 180 on Russia after meeting Putin.

Solving Syria crisis by asking Putin.

Clearly brown-nosing Putin by asking him to be readmitted into G7.

Doing Putin's work by ruining our alliances.

All President Trump has ever said is that it would be good to have friendly relations with them. You all want war with them. It’s the globalists’ wet dream to get Russia and the US in a nuclear war. Our only real enemy is Islam and Muslim shit holes that spawn terrorists like flies.

They hope nobody remembers the $145 mil Putin laid on the Clintons, ontop of the money they laid on Podesta and other Dems, and the blowjobs Obama laid on Putin, promising him he woultget him better deals after the 20212 election.

Pay no attention to these vermin; they haven't had any real talking points since Carter ran.

Wow, Putin really got a raw deal on that, considering how Hillary was constantly calling out Putin's bullshit. See why putin hates hillary.

How so? He got a lot of high quality uranium to sell to his Iranian buddies, who in turn got billions in untraceable cash from their fellow Muslim agent Obama to buy it from Putin with.

Pure fantasy. That was debunked long ago.

Hate to break it to you, but Party hacks aren't 'debunkers' of anything. We do, however, have all kind of evidence for Hillary's uranium deal, Podesta's involvement, and Obama himself on a live recording telling Putin just what I said he did. We also know about the pallet loads of American dollars OBama handed over to the terrorists.

 

[dudmuck]

All President Trump has ever said is that it would be good to have friendly relations with them. You all want war with them. It’s the globalists’ wet dream to get Russia and the US in a nuclear war. Our only real enemy is Islam and Muslim shit holes that spawn terrorists like flies.

They hope nobody remembers the $145 mil Putin laid on the Clintons, ontop of the money they laid on Podesta and other Dems, and the blowjobs Obama laid on Putin, promising him he woultget him better deals after the 20212 election.

Pay no attention to these vermin; they haven't had any real talking points since Carter ran.

Wow, Putin really got a raw deal on that, considering how Hillary was constantly calling out Putin's bullshit. See why putin hates hillary.

How so? He got a lot of high quality uranium to sell to his Iranian buddies, who in turn got billions in untraceable cash from their fellow Muslim agent Obama to buy it from Putin with.

Pure fantasy. That was debunked long ago.

Hate to break it to you, but Party hacks aren't 'debunkers' of anything. We do, however, have all kind of evidence for Hillary's uranium deal, Podesta's involvement, and Obama himself on a live recording telling Putin just what I said he did. We also know about the pallet loads of American dollars OBama handed over to the terrorists.

Snopes isnt connected to any political party, and snopes has been found to be unbiased.
Back in May, 3 panels in congress looked into this uranium one, and found nothing. This is from 2010. Pre benghazi, Pre emails. They wasted their time on benghazi and emails; why? because there is no there there.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Ginsburg and Civil War

I don't know what it will take for the left to ratchet down the vitriol over Trump. I mean, he's making America great again all over the place, what the hell else do they want

We are in a cycle and people have lost it.

So what ?

A few people will get killed and we'll all move on.

Remember Kent State.

I think it may be more serious than Kent State. A total loss of power for the Democrats not only today, but quite possibly for the next 20 or 30 years is something they aren't going to take lightly. Listen to them now with Kennedy leaving. Promising lost rights like abortion, women's rights, gay rights, workers rights, all kinds of rights we never even knew existed in the document.

But it's more than just losing power, it's the feeling like you are backed into a corner, and what do animals and humans do when backed into a corner?

It's one thing if something happened to Ginsburg in three or four years, but she's an old lady and not known for being in the best of health. If something happens to her soon, maybe this poll of people believing we are on the verge of a civil war just might be closer. I hope not, but we both know how unhinged the left can get.

 

[Richard-H]

The first and primary reason why the workers never gain in wealth is that they don't know the difference between an apppreciable investment and a non-appreciable investment.

Worker spend all their money on stuff that loses all all it's value immediately after purchase, they don't know how to make their money make money for them...they are NOT capitalists.

You don't have to be a capitalist, you just have to have the desire.

Ignorance doesn't work in our modern era. You can learn anything on this internet if you really want to know about something, and investing isn't all that hard.

With just high school, I invested in real estate and became a landlord. No special trick to it, just a willingness to do a lot of work when you come home from work. I spent several years in the commodities market. I lost in the end, but I learned a hell of a lot reading and trading commodities. If I could get caught up on some bills, I just may do it again. It was the most exciting thing I've ever done.

My IRA is in a managed account which (of course) I keep an eye on.

The second is that they refuse to demand their fair share - they simply accept salaries and wages that keep them just at their living level. Most don't realize that the real value of their labor is far above what they are being paid.

No, the value of your labor is what your employer could pay somebody else to do the same job with the same quality as you do. That's it.

If you operate a drill press for 20 bucks an hour, demand a raise, and it's refused, you can find another job that pays more. If your employer can find another press operator for the same money, then he was paying you what your labor was worth. If he can find somebody to do the job cheaper, then you were being overpaid. If he has to offer 22 bucks an hour before he finds somebody, then you were correct, you were being underpaid.

You can request a raise, but you can't demand it.

The fault of the wealthy is based on their egos - they refuse to admit that their wealth is entirely dependant on the soceity in which they live and the laws of the government. If they actually unstood economis they'd throw their money at the government. They'd do everything in their power to keep our soceity fair and well balanced.

They do understand economics which is why they don't throw their money at the government. All government will do is waste it.

Society didn't create wealthy people, the people themselves did. They took their money, invested it, and with some luck and skill, became wealthy.

They're nothing wrong with wanting material wealth, however being a 'materialist' really implies a lack of any other values. It is a sickness. Most wealthy people I've known are unhappy and frustrated. They continually think that they will be happier if they had more money, but when they get more money they are not happy.

They need to expand their conscience - to care about more than just their wallets.

For people with money, it's an obsession like anything else. The amount could be one million or a hundred, it doesn't matter. If they had a hundred million, their obsession would make them want 101 million and so on.

Because it's an obsession, they always strive to get more even though they will never use a tenth of it. Money to them is a measure of success and skill. It's really no different than those who are obsessed with early model automobiles, sports, technology....... some guys are obsessed with women and can't get enough of them.

First, I agree that understanding finances in not very difficult, but in a society that's primarily capitalist education is piss poor. When my wife migrated from Russia she was given courses in finances - and she learned far more then I ever knew. While people SHOULD get themselves educated in this area, it should also be a basic high school criteria since people who do not understand finances are at a serious disadvantage.

Second, your absolutely wrong when you say that the value of people's labor is only what your employer would have to pay some else to do your job. If that were true then it would not be profitable for any employer to higher anybody. The true value of people's labor is ALWAYS greater than what employers are willing to pay. Many times the value of people's labor is incredibly more valuable than what they are being paid - thus making great profits for the employer.

Your belief that people should only be paid at a level dictated by the employer's capability of replacing them, is just the wealthy taking advantage of people's economic disadvantage. It's also an incentive for all employers to keep employees and potential employees absolutely economically desparate - so they can ALWAYS find some desparate person that will accept ANY wage no matter how low.

Perhaps there should be a relationship with the real productive value of people's work and their wages. Employers do deserve a profit, but often times the gap between the value of people's productiviy and what they get paid is obscene.

Third, whether government spending is a waste (or the degree to which it is a waste), is both a matter of opinion, and a result of people's willingness to monitor government and vote for representatives that do not waste their money.

In the Soviet Union, since the government provided education, housing, healthcare, transportation, guaranteed pensions etc..., the average Soviet citizen was far wealthier than the average American. In you'd calculate the value of these government provided costs and subtract that from the wages and salaries of Americans, you'd find that the vast majority of American are piss poor.

Yes, the desire for wealth can be an obsession. However it really is a zero sum game. Wealth that goes to those who are obsessed is being taken from many other people. Money does not grow on trees. It is a representation of the real productive work of employees. The pricipal that people should be free to do what they want, unless it violates other people's rights applies. Hording mony does violate the economic rights of those who create wealth thru their labor. Taking advantage of other's people's ignorance does not justify it.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

The first and primary reason why the workers never gain in wealth is that they don't know the difference between an apppreciable investment and a non-appreciable investment.

Worker spend all their money on stuff that loses all all it's value immediately after purchase, they don't know how to make their money make money for them...they are NOT capitalists.

You don't have to be a capitalist, you just have to have the desire.

Ignorance doesn't work in our modern era. You can learn anything on this internet if you really want to know about something, and investing isn't all that hard.

With just high school, I invested in real estate and became a landlord. No special trick to it, just a willingness to do a lot of work when you come home from work. I spent several years in the commodities market. I lost in the end, but I learned a hell of a lot reading and trading commodities. If I could get caught up on some bills, I just may do it again. It was the most exciting thing I've ever done.

My IRA is in a managed account which (of course) I keep an eye on.

The second is that they refuse to demand their fair share - they simply accept salaries and wages that keep them just at their living level. Most don't realize that the real value of their labor is far above what they are being paid.

No, the value of your labor is what your employer could pay somebody else to do the same job with the same quality as you do. That's it.

If you operate a drill press for 20 bucks an hour, demand a raise, and it's refused, you can find another job that pays more. If your employer can find another press operator for the same money, then he was paying you what your labor was worth. If he can find somebody to do the job cheaper, then you were being overpaid. If he has to offer 22 bucks an hour before he finds somebody, then you were correct, you were being underpaid.

You can request a raise, but you can't demand it.

The fault of the wealthy is based on their egos - they refuse to admit that their wealth is entirely dependant on the soceity in which they live and the laws of the government. If they actually unstood economis they'd throw their money at the government. They'd do everything in their power to keep our soceity fair and well balanced.

They do understand economics which is why they don't throw their money at the government. All government will do is waste it.

Society didn't create wealthy people, the people themselves did. They took their money, invested it, and with some luck and skill, became wealthy.

They're nothing wrong with wanting material wealth, however being a 'materialist' really implies a lack of any other values. It is a sickness. Most wealthy people I've known are unhappy and frustrated. They continually think that they will be happier if they had more money, but when they get more money they are not happy.

They need to expand their conscience - to care about more than just their wallets.

For people with money, it's an obsession like anything else. The amount could be one million or a hundred, it doesn't matter. If they had a hundred million, their obsession would make them want 101 million and so on.

Because it's an obsession, they always strive to get more even though they will never use a tenth of it. Money to them is a measure of success and skill. It's really no different than those who are obsessed with early model automobiles, sports, technology....... some guys are obsessed with women and can't get enough of them.

First, I agree that understanding finances in not very difficult, but in a society that's primarily capitalist education is piss poor. When my wife migrated from Russia she was given courses in finances - and she learned far more then I ever knew. While people SHOULD get themselves educated in this area, it should also be a basic high school criteria since people who do not understand finances are at a serious disadvantage.

Second, your absolutely wrong when you say that the value of people's labor is only what your employer would have to pay some else to do your job. If that were true then it would not be profitable for any employer to higher anybody. The true value of people's labor is ALWAYS greater than what employers are willing to pay. Many times the value of people's labor is incredibly more valuable than what they are being paid - thus making great profits for the employer.

Your belief that people should only be paid at a level dictated by the employer's capability of replacing them, is just the wealthy taking advantage of people's economic disadvantage. It's also an incentive for all employers to keep employees and potential employees absolutely economically desparate - so they can ALWAYS find some desparate person that will accept ANY wage no matter how low.

Perhaps there should be a relationship with the real productive value of people's work and their wages. Employers do deserve a profit, but often times the gap between the value of people's productiviy and what they get paid is obscene.

Third, whether government spending is a waste (or the degree to which it is a waste), is both a matter of opinion, and a result of people's willingness to monitor government and vote for representatives that do not waste their money.

In the Soviet Union, since the government provided education, housing, healthcare, transportation, guaranteed pensions etc..., the average Soviet citizen was far wealthier than the average American. In you'd calculate the value of these government provided costs and subtract that from the wages and salaries of Americans, you'd find that the vast majority of American are piss poor.

Yes, the desire for wealth can be an obsession. However it really is a zero sum game. Wealth that goes to those who are obsessed is being taken from many other people. Money does not grow on trees. It is a representation of the real productive work of employees. The pricipal that people should be free to do what they want, unless it violates other people's rights applies. Hording mony does violate the economic rights of those who create wealth thru their labor. Taking advantage of other's people's ignorance does not justify it.

There is no such thing as an economic right. It doesn't exist.

If you were cleaning your attic and found some old Archie and Jughead comic books, decided to get rid of them, and put them on e-bay, the value of your comic books is only worth as much as the highest bidder will pay for them. Forget the fact that you purchased them for 25 cents each as a child, if they are worth $150.00 a copy, then that's what they are worth. If the highest bid is only 25 cents a copy, that's what they are worth.

If you did get $150.00 a copy, you are not taking advantage of anybody no more than if you operate a drill press for 20 bucks an hour and your employer sells your work for $200.00 an hour. When you get a job, an employer is making an investment in you. He gives you work to do and sells your work at a profit. It matters not what that profit is. That's his business. Your business is that YOU AGREED to work for 20 bucks an hour and that deal was met. Your employer is at no obligation to share his profit with you.

Wealth is not shared because there is no finite amount of wealth in the country. If we took every dollar from every millionaire and billionaire today, you would have the same amount of money tomorrow. What somebody else has is in no way responsible for what you have. If you want or need more money, you can get it. You can work more hours, invest yourself, get a second job, cut down on unnecessary spending, just a number of things. But you won't get more money by somebody else having less. It's a failed concept.

I dare you to show me any evidence that a Soviet citizen used to have more wealth than an American. Nobody left the US to live in the Soviet Union. But people were dying to get out of there and come here. Reminds me of something that happened a few years back:

I went to one of our stops and told the shipper I was going to the bathroom so just load the truck. He made some cute comment I forget what it was now. I told him I was not going for that. I'm a diabetic and I was going to the bathroom to take my shot. We began talking about medial problems. He told me that if I were in the Soviet Union as a diabetic, I would have been dead long ago. Diabetics he told me were not given insulin by the government unless you had government connections. If you became diabetic or had any other life threatening condition, they just let you die. It happened to several people in his family before he escaped and came to the US. That changed the subject for me.

I asked if he ever missed the Ukraine? He said no he didn't. I'm going to type in broken English the way he talked because it's so much funnier that way. He said "I half Jew. If somebody here say I beat you up because you Jew, I call police and they take him away. In Ukraine, if I go to police and say somebody beat me up because I'm Jew, police would beat me up because I'm Jew."

Nobody back then even lived close to how good we had or have it over here.