CDZ Gun deaths in all states per capita

[2aguy]

Calling someome a vile human being in the clean debate zone isn’t appropriate.

What YOU think the reason for increasing murders isn’t necessarily the actual reason.

Again, I apologize...didn't realize this was the CDZ.........too many threads to respond to......I'll edit that...

 

[XponentialChaos]

Over 27 years, from 1993 to the year 2015, we went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 19.4 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2019 (in 2020 that number is 21.52 million)...guess what happened...

New Concealed Carry Report For 2020: 19.48 Million Permit Holders, 820,000 More Than Last Year despite many states shutting down issuing permits because of the Coronavirus - Crime Prevention Research Center


-- gun murder down 49%

--gun crime down 75%

--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.


This means that access to guns does not create gun crime........

Why do our democrat party controlled cities have gun crime problems?

What changed in 2015?

The democrat party did 3 things...

1) they began a war on the police that forced officers to stop pro active police work, allowing criminals to run wild.

2) they began to release the most violent and dangerous gun offenders over and over again, not matter how many times they had been arrested for gun crimes

3) they used their brown shirts, blm/antifa to burn, loot and murder for 7 months in primarily black neighborhoods while the democrat party mayors ordered the police to stand down and not stop them......in order to hurt Trump during the election.

And about mass public shooters?

The democrats...

n the recent light of the tragic Texas Robb elementary school shooting; California State Senator Steven Bradford put out bill SB1273. This bill would take the mandatory requirement for schools to report any violent threat to the law enforcement away from schools; meaning schools don’t have to report these violent threats to law authorities.

New CA Bill Would No Longer Require Schools to Report Bad Student Behavior to Police - San Diego News Desk

Written by Diego Hays In the recent light of the tragic Texas Robb elementary school shooting; California State Senator Steven Bradford put out bill SB1273. This bill would take the mandatory requirement for schools to report any violent threat to the law enforcement away from schools; meaning...

www.sandiegonewsdesk.com

You‘re giving out opinions. I’m dealing with facts.

 

[XponentialChaos]

Again, I apologize...didn't realize this was the CDZ.........too many threads to respond to......I'll edit that...

At least you didn’t try to justify it this time.

 

[2aguy]

Calling someome a vile human being in the clean debate zone isn’t appropriate.

What YOU think the reason for increasing murders isn’t necessarily the actual reason.

No....it is the actual reason.......you want to hide that truth since your goal is to just ban guns...which will do nothing........

2015 is the year the downward trend in gun crime changed......it is the year the democrats declared war on the police as a political strategy, and started to release violent criminals en masse....

 

[XponentialChaos]

No....it is the actual reason.......you want to hide that truth since your goal is to just ban guns...which will do nothing........

2015 is the year the downward trend in gun crime changed......it is the year the democrats declared war on the police as a political strategy, and started to release violent criminals en masse....

What you’re saying is not based on facts.

 

[2aguy]

You‘re giving out opinions. I’m dealing with facts.

You aren't giving out facts.......I am giving out the truth.

Hard Data, Hollow Protests
The reason for the current increase is what I have called the Ferguson Effect.
Cops are backing off of proactive policing in high-crime minority neighborhoods, and criminals are becoming emboldened.

Having been told incessantly by politicians, the media, and Black Lives Matter activists that they are bigoted for getting out of their cars and questioning someone loitering on a known drug corner at 2 AM, many officers are instead just driving by. Such stops are discretionary; cops don’t have to make them. And when political elites demonize the police for just such proactive policing, we shouldn’t be surprised when cops get the message and do less of it.

Seventy-two percent of the nation’s officers say that they and their colleagues are now less willing to stop and question suspicious persons, according to a Pew Research poll released in January. The reason is the persistent anti-cop climate.

Four studies came out in 2016 alone rebutting the charge that police shootings are racially biased. If there is a bias in police shootings, it works in favor of blacks and against whites. That truth has not stopped the ongoing demonization of the police—including, now, by many of the country’s ignorant professional athletes. The toll will be felt, as always, in the inner city, by the thousands of law-abiding people there who desperately want more police protection.


=========


It’s something but I still think the Times is downplaying the obvious a bit. Here’s the chart of the monthly murder rate. What you’ll see is that the first month where the murder rate started to spike above the average in previous years was May. Why in May? Because George Floyd was killed on May 25th and by the next day the video was going viral. The final weekend of May became a weekend of violent protests which pushed the monthly numbers out of orbit. And from there the murder rate continued to go up as sometimes violent anti-police protests were taking place around the country:

Why would the death of George Floyd be connected with a wave of violence? I think the answer to that has to do with the nature of the protests, which were explicitly hostile to police. Police pulled back as protesters created autonomous zones in some cities.


It was basically the Ferguson Effect all on a national scale.

As police pulled back, criminals had less fear of consequences and also, some people felt more inclined to seek street justice rather than call the police when a disagreement arose. That’s the “increased distrust” mentioned above. The protests last year didn’t have to actually defund police departments in order to have a significant impact on the behavior of both cops and criminals.
----
I don’t think it’s a coincidence that Portland had some of the most consistent and most violent protests last year and also lost a lot of officers to retirement and resignations. Portland was a worst case scenario for the connection between anti-police protests and increased violence and the numbers seem to reflect that.
FBI: Murder rose by 29% last year with the biggest spike coming after the death of George Floyd (Update)

 

[XponentialChaos]

You aren't giving out facts.......I am giving out the truth.

Hard Data, Hollow Protests
The reason for the current increase is what I have called the Ferguson Effect.
Cops are backing off of proactive policing in high-crime minority neighborhoods, and criminals are becoming emboldened.

Having been told incessantly by politicians, the media, and Black Lives Matter activists that they are bigoted for getting out of their cars and questioning someone loitering on a known drug corner at 2 AM, many officers are instead just driving by. Such stops are discretionary; cops don’t have to make them. And when political elites demonize the police for just such proactive policing, we shouldn’t be surprised when cops get the message and do less of it.

Seventy-two percent of the nation’s officers say that they and their colleagues are now less willing to stop and question suspicious persons, according to a Pew Research poll released in January. The reason is the persistent anti-cop climate.

Four studies came out in 2016 alone rebutting the charge that police shootings are racially biased. If there is a bias in police shootings, it works in favor of blacks and against whites. That truth has not stopped the ongoing demonization of the police—including, now, by many of the country’s ignorant professional athletes. The toll will be felt, as always, in the inner city, by the thousands of law-abiding people there who desperately want more police protection.



=========


It’s something but I still think the Times is downplaying the obvious a bit. Here’s the chart of the monthly murder rate. What you’ll see is that the first month where the murder rate started to spike above the average in previous years was May. Why in May? Because George Floyd was killed on May 25th and by the next day the video was going viral. The final weekend of May became a weekend of violent protests which pushed the monthly numbers out of orbit. And from there the murder rate continued to go up as sometimes violent anti-police protests were taking place around the country:

Why would the death of George Floyd be connected with a wave of violence? I think the answer to that has to do with the nature of the protests, which were explicitly hostile to police. Police pulled back as protesters created autonomous zones in some cities.


It was basically the Ferguson Effect all on a national scale.

As police pulled back, criminals had less fear of consequences and also, some people felt more inclined to seek street justice rather than call the police when a disagreement arose. That’s the “increased distrust” mentioned above. The protests last year didn’t have to actually defund police departments in order to have a significant impact on the behavior of both cops and criminals.
----
I don’t think it’s a coincidence that Portland had some of the most consistent and most violent protests last year and also lost a lot of officers to retirement and resignations. Portland was a worst case scenario for the connection between anti-police protests and increased violence and the numbers seem to reflect that.
FBI: Murder rose by 29% last year with the biggest spike coming after the death of George Floyd (Update)

Correlation does not imply causation, sorry. Pretty simple stuff.

 

[AsherN]

Any gun stat that includes suicides is bullshit, as they would just off themselves in another way if they didn't have a gun. Every state has sufficient numbers of high buildings and bridges, plenty of gasoline to immolate yourself, and plenty of knives to slash wrists, etc.

Not true. A lot of things can lead to thoughts of suicide, not all of them are long lasting. It is not rare to reach that place but not act on it because of the lack of a quick, immediate way to kill yourself.

 

[Polishprince]

Not true. A lot of things can lead to thoughts of suicide, not all of them are long lasting. It is not rare to reach that place but not act on it because of the lack of a quick, immediate way to kill yourself.

There are plenty of quick , immediate ways to kill yourself besides shooting yourself.

Is someone better off if they jump from a cliff or immolate themselves because a firearm isn't available?

 

[2aguy]

Correlation does not imply causation, sorry. Pretty simple stuff.

And your response to facts is pretty typical...

You refuse to put up your ideas...then deny the obvious facts when presented............typical....

 

[XponentialChaos]

And your response to facts is pretty typical...

You refuse to put up your ideas...then deny the obvious facts when presented............typical....

I have put up my ideas. But they’re just ideas.

First we need to deal with facts, not feelings.

 

[alang1216]

What two ideas are these?

The Declaration of Independence is not the Constitution. I thought every American knew that.

It is the only correct interpretation. Other views are fraudulent.

You forgot to include the laughing emoji because that is the silliest thing I've read today.

The reason why progressives violate people's civil liberties is because progressives actually enjoy violating people's rights.

I stand corrected, that is the silliest thing I've read today.

 

[alang1216]

So you feel the same about voters in Alabama banning abortion?

I'd be lying if I said I don't. Don't forget, since Roe, abortion was considered a constitutionally protected right and States were allowed to pass restrictions on it. I'd say guns are the same.

There is a moral line that, I have to say is not crystal clear to me. If the voters in Alabama, instead of banning abortion decided to pass some Jim Crow laws, I'd have a problem with that.

 

[martybegan]

I'd be lying if I said I don't. Don't forget, since Roe, abortion was considered a constitutionally protected right and States were allowed to pass restrictions on it. I'd say guns are the same.

There is a moral line that, I have to say is not crystal clear to me. If the voters in Alabama, instead of banning abortion decided to pass some Jim Crow laws, I'd have a problem with that.

Roe was only considered a constitutional right by some hacks in black who set back the abortion issue 40+ years by thinking they could solve it.

Jim Crow laws violate the 14th amendment, gun "restrictions" like the one in NYC violate the 2nd.

An abortion ban violates nothing except YOUR belief that they are wrong.

 

[AsherN]

There are plenty of quick , immediate ways to kill yourself besides shooting yourself.

Is someone better off if they jump from a cliff or immolate themselves because a firearm isn't available?

You don't get it. in a lot of cases, the impulse to kill yourself is momentary. Having ready access to a gun is all it takes. getting in your car to find a tall building, or a bridge, or whatever is enough for that despair to pass.

 

[martybegan]

You don't get it. in a lot of cases, the impulse to kill yourself is momentary. Having ready access to a gun is all it takes. getting in your car to find a tall building, or a bridge, or whatever is enough for that despair to pass.

So is the need to defend yourself, of course you can always ask the criminal to wait while you go out and get a firearm, and come back and try to rob you at a later date.

 

[Pellinore]

Wrong....they have extreme gun control..the number of people doesn't matter, in the face of Texas and their gun laws..........

more gun murder in California with their extreme gun control laws....vs. Texas and their freedoms...

Wait. No. What? Do you really not understand ratios? This was taught in school here in like eighth grade. You should have learned this.

California has 39 million people. In 2020, 1,606 of them were killed by firearms, according to Statista.
Texas has 29 million people. In 2020, 1,491 of them were killed by firearms.

That means that out of every 100,000 Californians, an average of 4.11 of them were killed by firearms in 2020. (That's 1606 divided by 39 million, times 100K)
Out of every 100,000 Texans, an average of 5.14 of them were killed by firearms. (Same formula.)

California, which has more people, has more gun deaths, but the ratio is lower.
Texas, which has 10 million fewer people, has fewer gun deaths, but the ratio is higher.

The reason that it looks to you as if California has it worse is because you (apparently) missed ratio day in middle school.
Texas, with its freedoms, actually has a higher rate of firearm deaths.

See?

 

[2aguy]

Wait. No. What? Do you really not understand ratios? This was taught in school here in like eighth grade. You should have learned this.

California has 39 million people. In 2020, 1,606 of them were killed by firearms, according to Statista.
Texas has 29 million people. In 2020, 1,491 of them were killed by firearms.

That means that out of every 100,000 Californians, an average of 4.11 of them were killed by firearms in 2020. (That's 1606 divided by 39 million, times 100K)
Out of every 100,000 Texans, an average of 5.14 of them were killed by firearms. (Same formula.)

California, which has more people, has more gun deaths, but the ratio is lower.
Texas, which has 10 million fewer people, has fewer gun deaths, but the ratio is higher.

The reason that it looks to you as if California has it worse is because you (apparently) missed ratio day in middle school.
Texas, with its freedoms, actually has a higher rate of firearm deaths.

See?

Wrong....you did not factor in the fact that California has extreme gun control.....that means, according to idiots like you, they will have less gun crime than other states with less insanely extreme gun control.....

Texas is one of those states. They have concealed carry, open carry, gun stores on every corner......

So......you can't explain how it is that Texas with those very relaxed gun control laws doesn't have a higher gun murder rate than California.....



We aren't talking tiny degrees of difference....California has extreme gun control......you can't ignore that......

 

[2aguy]

You don't get it. in a lot of cases, the impulse to kill yourself is momentary. Having ready access to a gun is all it takes. getting in your car to find a tall building, or a bridge, or whatever is enough for that despair to pass.

And you are not the first to try to make this point.

Now, you have to explain to us how it is that Japan, South Korea (the country with the highest suicide rate) and China....all with extreme gun control....only criminals and the police have guns.......have higher suicide rates than we do......

Your theory can't explain this...

Then, you would have to explain how it is that these non-Asian countries also have higher suicide rates than we do......and they also have extreme gun control laws...

And yet Scotland has a higher suicide rate than the U.S......Japan, where only criminals and cops have guns, has a higher suicide rate than the U.S....Sweden has a higher suicide rate than the U.S....Denmark has a higher suicide rate than the u.S.....



France

Germany,

Hungary

Iceland

New Zealand

Poland

Norway

Japan

South Korea



https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/world/suiciderate.html



Scotland..



15.7 suicides per 100,000

In 2019?

16.7 suicides per 100,000.

And in the U.S.?

13.93 per 100,000



Suicide facts and figures



Changes in Suicide Rates — United States, ...



https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/world/suiciderate.html



South Korea 24.7

Hungary 21

Japan 19.4

Belgium 18.4

Finland 16.5

France 14.6

Austria 13.8

Poland 13.8

Czec Republic 12.7

New Zealand 11.9

Denmark 11.3

Sweden 11.1

Norway 10.9

Slovac Republic 10.9

Iceland 10.3

Germany 10.3

Canada 10.2

United States 10.1



A new report by Unicef contains a shocking statistic - New Zealand has by far the highest youth suicide rate in the developed world.
A shock but no surprise - it's not the first time the country tops that table.
The Unicef report found New Zealand's youth suicide rate - teenagers between 15 and 19 - to be the highest of a long list of 41 OECD and EU countries.
The rate of 15.6 suicides per 100,000 people is twice as high as the US rate and almost five times that of Britain.

 

[Captain Caveman]

Wrong....they have extreme gun control..the number of people doesn't matter, in the face of Texas and their gun laws..........

more gun murder in California with their extreme gun control laws....vs. Texas and their freedoms...

Wrong.