Is Israel the Same as South Africa?

[georgephillip]

We were not talking about land-conquest or land-stealing.

We were talking about your accusations of so-called 'treason' by a faction of the Palestinian Jews against the wider European Jewish Community.

Accusations which I easily and logically counterpointed, here: http://www.usmessageboard.com/israel-and-palestine/305058-is-israel-the-same-as-south-africa-90.html#post7847653 .

We were talking about illegal Jewish immigrants from Europe taking the homes and land of indigenous Arab Palestinians. Why do you suppose 99% of those migrants would have preferred coming to the USA instead of England's "little loyal Jewish Ulster" in Palestine?

We were obviously talking about different things.

YOU wanted to steer the conversation back to land-grabs.

I wanted to refute your charges of Treason by one Jewish faction against the other.

Which I did.

Doesn't matter.

Feel free to steer the conversation back in that direction, now that the Treason charge is off the table.

Except YOU didn't.
What you're calling "Treason" required Zionists collaborating with Hitler to transfer European Jews to Palestine in order to facilitate land grabs from indigenous Palestinians, a tactic all good Nazis would endorse without a hint of "Treason" against one's sovereign or nation.

 

[Kondor3]

We were talking about illegal Jewish immigrants from Europe taking the homes and land of indigenous Arab Palestinians. Why do you suppose 99% of those migrants would have preferred coming to the USA instead of England's "little loyal Jewish Ulster" in Palestine?

We were obviously talking about different things.

YOU wanted to steer the conversation back to land-grabs.

I wanted to refute your charges of Treason by one Jewish faction against the other.

Which I did.

Doesn't matter.

Feel free to steer the conversation back in that direction, now that the Treason charge is off the table.

Except YOU didn't.
What you're calling 'Treason' required Zionists collaborating with Hitler to transfer European Jews to Palestine in order to facilitate land grabs from indigenous Palestinians, a tactic all good Nazis would endorse without a hint of 'Treason' against one's sovereign or nation.

Yes, I did.

I was referring to a charge of Treason allegedly committed by the Jews of Palestine against their European Jewish brethren.

You know...

The charge that YOU raised...

"...these treasons against the Jews..."

...in your post at the following link...

http://www.usmessageboard.com/israel-and-palestine/305058-is-israel-the-same-as-south-africa-89.html#post7844448

Palestinians natives and land are non sequitur in the narrow context of that so-called treason-by-Jews-against-Jews which YOU established.

The context in which I was responding.

 

[georgephillip]

We were obviously talking about different things.

YOU wanted to steer the conversation back to land-grabs.

I wanted to refute your charges of Treason by one Jewish faction against the other.

Which I did.

Doesn't matter.

Feel free to steer the conversation back in that direction, now that the Treason charge is off the table.

Except YOU didn't.
What you're calling 'Treason' required Zionists collaborating with Hitler to transfer European Jews to Palestine in order to facilitate land grabs from indigenous Palestinians, a tactic all good Nazis would endorse without a hint of 'Treason' against one's sovereign or nation.

Yes, I did.

I was referring to a charge of Treason allegedly committed by the Jews of Palestine against their European Jewish brethren.

You know...

The charge that YOU raised...

"...these treasons against the Jews..."

...in your post at the following link...

http://www.usmessageboard.com/israel-and-palestine/305058-is-israel-the-same-as-south-africa-89.html#post7844448

Palestinians natives and land are non sequitur in the narrow context of that so-called treason-by-Jews-against-Jews which YOU established.

The context in which I was responding.

"Oran's Dictionary of the Law (1983) defines treason as '...[a]...citizen's actions to help a foreign government overthrow, make war against, or seriously injure the [parent nation].'"
So, in your context, Jews who offered to kill British soldiers on Hitler's behalf were doing nothing to "seriously injure (their) parent nation?"

Treason - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Kondor3]

"...Oran's Dictionary of the Law (1983) defines treason as '...[a]...citizen's actions to help a foreign government overthrow, make war against, or seriously injure the [parent nation].' ..."

YOU were the one who raised the point of Palestinian Jews committing 'treason' against their European Jewish brethren (in contradiction to the literal definition of 'treason'), not I.

But, knowing full-well, that the Palestinian Jews and the European Jews ere not de jure citizens of the same country, I construed you to mean METAPHORICAL 'treason' (betrayal) between co-religionists; which most reasonable folks would construe in the context of the earlier exchange.

"...So, in your context, Jews who offered to kill British soldiers on Hitler's behalf were doing nothing to "seriously injure (their) parent nation?..."

I did not comment one way or another, about that small faction of Palestinian Jews who offered to fight the British in Palestine (in the context of harming their parent nation), in return for allowing the Jews to continue emmigrating from Europe.

De jure, that small faction of Jews in Palestine (who attempted to strike a bargain with the Nazis over Jewish emmigration) quite probably DID commit Sedition or Treason-Lite in such communications, in thought if not in deed, and, of course, had they carried through with their fight against the British (with or without Nazi endorsement), then they probably would, indeed, be considered Traitors to the British Crown.

And, even though the 'mainstream' segment of the Jewish population of Palestine supported the British War Effort and even fielded Combat-Arms and Police and Militia units put at the disposal of the Crown, they did so in the hope of being granted their own Homeland in fulfillment of the Balfour Declaration, as society-wide payment for their support, as well as wanting to neutralize the Nazi threat to their brethren in Europe, rather than out of any particular en masse loyalty to the British or their Mandate Rule.

But, in any event, that small faction of the Jews of Palestine which contacted the Nazis does NOT appear to have been engaged in 'treason' (small 'T') or 'betrayal' of their European Jewish brethren, as your original in this series claimed.

 

[Roudy]

We were talking about illegal Jewish immigrants from Europe taking the homes and land of indigenous Arab Palestinians. Why do you suppose 99% of those migrants would have preferred coming to the USA instead of England's "little loyal Jewish Ulster" in Palestine?

We were obviously talking about different things.

YOU wanted to steer the conversation back to land-grabs.

I wanted to refute your charges of Treason by one Jewish faction against the other.

Which I did.

Doesn't matter.

Feel free to steer the conversation back in that direction, now that the Treason charge is off the table.

Except YOU didn't.
What you're calling "Treason" required Zionists collaborating with Hitler to transfer European Jews to Palestine in order to facilitate land grabs from indigenous Palestinians, a tactic all good Nazis would endorse without a hint of "Treason" against one's sovereign or nation.

Oh I see, so the Jews trying to escape without getting murdered by giving up all their possessions and German citizenship is called "collaboration". But the well known love affair between the Nazis and Arab Palestinians who fought for the Nazis and idolized them to this day, isn't.

Interesting.

Amin Al Husseini: Nazi Father of Jihad, Al Qaeda, Arafat, Saddam Hussein and the Muslim Brotherhood - Tell The Children The Truth - Homepage

 

[georgephillip]

We were obviously talking about different things.

YOU wanted to steer the conversation back to land-grabs.

I wanted to refute your charges of Treason by one Jewish faction against the other.

Which I did.

Doesn't matter.

Feel free to steer the conversation back in that direction, now that the Treason charge is off the table.

Except YOU didn't.
What you're calling "Treason" required Zionists collaborating with Hitler to transfer European Jews to Palestine in order to facilitate land grabs from indigenous Palestinians, a tactic all good Nazis would endorse without a hint of "Treason" against one's sovereign or nation.

Oh I see, so the Jews trying to escape without getting murdered by giving up all their possessions and German citizenship is called "collaboration". But the well known love affair between the Nazis and Arab Palestinians who fought for the Nazis and idolized them to this day, isn't.

Interesting.

Amin Al Husseini: Nazi Father of Jihad, Al Qaeda, Arafat, Saddam Hussein and the Muslim Brotherhood - Tell The Children The Truth - Homepage

Now tell us why all those good German Jews fleeing to Palestine were entitled to colonize Arab land?

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

Except YOU didn't.
What you're calling "Treason" required Zionists collaborating with Hitler to transfer European Jews to Palestine in order to facilitate land grabs from indigenous Palestinians, a tactic all good Nazis would endorse without a hint of "Treason" against one's sovereign or nation.

Oh I see, so the Jews trying to escape without getting murdered by giving up all their possessions and German citizenship is called "collaboration". But the well known love affair between the Nazis and Arab Palestinians who fought for the Nazis and idolized them to this day, isn't.

Interesting.

Amin Al Husseini: Nazi Father of Jihad, Al Qaeda, Arafat, Saddam Hussein and the Muslim Brotherhood - Tell The Children The Truth - Homepage

Now tell us why all those good German Jews fleeing to Palestine were entitled to colonize Arab land?

How easily you forget facts.​

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubDhnM0MUmY]Howard Grief - EC4I middle east conflict documentary: Give Peace A Chance - YouTube[/ame]

 

[rhodescholar]

Now tell us why all those good German Jews fleeing to Palestine were entitled to colonize Arab land?

A year later, and this asshole is still at it....

Tell us what exactly is "arab" land? Is the US "whitey" land, and no one black or hispanic can move there? And then tell us what nation was there when the jews began immigrating in the 1800s, you lying fucking trash?

 

[P F Tinmore]

Oh I see, so the Jews trying to escape without getting murdered by giving up all their possessions and German citizenship is called "collaboration". But the well known love affair between the Nazis and Arab Palestinians who fought for the Nazis and idolized them to this day, isn't.

Interesting.

Amin Al Husseini: Nazi Father of Jihad, Al Qaeda, Arafat, Saddam Hussein and the Muslim Brotherhood - Tell The Children The Truth - Homepage

Now tell us why all those good German Jews fleeing to Palestine were entitled to colonize Arab land?

How easily you forget facts.​

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubDhnM0MUmY]Howard Grief - EC4I middle east conflict documentary: Give Peace A Chance - YouTube[/ame]

If what these guys say is true, why did the Zionists agree to half of Palestine in 1947 when they received the whole pie thirty years earlier?

 

[georgephillip]

Now tell us why all those good German Jews fleeing to Palestine were entitled to colonize Arab land?

A year later, and this asshole is still at it....

Tell us what exactly is "arab" land? Is the US "whitey" land, and no one black or hispanic can move there? And then tell us what nation was there when the jews began immigrating in the 1800s, you lying fucking trash?

Are you still confused about
"Palestine (Arabic: فلسطين* Filasṭīn, Falasṭīn, Filisṭīn; Greek: Παλαιστίνη, Palaistinē; Latin: Palaestina; Hebrew: פלשתינה Palestina)...a geographic region in Western Asia between the Mediterranean Sea and the Jordan River..."

"The name was used by Ancient Greek writers, and was later used for the Roman province Syria Palaestina, the Byzantine Palaestina Prima and the Umayyad and Abbasid province of Jund Filastin.

"The region is also known as the Land of Israel (Hebrew: ארץ־ישראל Eretz-Yisra'el),[1] the Holy Land, the Southern Levant,[2] Cisjordan, and historically has been known by other names including Canaan, Southern Syria and Jerusalem.

Who ruled Filastin in the 1800s, is that the question, Golda?

"In 1830, on the eve of Muhammad Ali's invasion, the Ottoman Porte transferred control of the sanjaks of Jerusalem and Nablus to Abdullah Pasha, the governor of Acre. According to Silverburg, in regional and cultural terms this move was important for creating an Arab Palestine detached from Syria (bilad al-Shams). According to Pappe, it was an attempt to reinforce the Syrian front in face of Muhammad Ali's invasion.[40][41] Two years later, in 1832, Palestine was conquered by Muhammad Ali's Egypt, but in 1840, Britain intervened and returned control of the Levant to the Ottomans in return for further capitulations."

Ottomans.
Egyptians.
British.
No Jews required.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine#Modern_period

 

[georgephillip]

Now tell us why all those good German Jews fleeing to Palestine were entitled to colonize Arab land?

How easily you forget facts.​

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubDhnM0MUmY]Howard Grief - EC4I middle east conflict documentary: Give Peace A Chance - YouTube[/ame]

If what these guys say is true, why did the Zionists agree to half of Palestine in 1947 when they received the whole pie thirty years earlier?

San Remo and Oil

Full Spectrum Dominance U.S. Power in Iraq and Beyond by Rahul Mahajan

"OlL AND HISTORICAL U.S. MIDDLE EAST POLICY

"Actually, it has never been a secret that U.S. Middle East policy revolves around oil.

"Strong U.S. interest in the region's oil dates from after World War I, in particular after the 1920 San Remo agreement, in which Britain and France essentially divided the oil of the Middle East between them.

"Britain had early on established the standard colonial means of dealing with oil; pressuring a weak, corrupt government to grant an oil concession, essentially a deal whereby some corporation gained the right to all the oil that lay under the land in the area covered by the concession, and was required to pay only token royalties to the government of the country.

"In the first 50 years of Middle East oil concessions, Western corporations and a small ruling elite in the Middle East got very rich, but the people benefited minimally if at all.

"Unhappy U.S. oil companies complained strenuously about their exclusion, and through the intervention of the U.S. government (Herbert Hoover played a major role in this), replaced the San Remo agreement with the 1928 'Red-line' agreement, which gave them a 23.5 percent share of all oil concessions in the former Ottoman Empire (excluding Kuwait); later this agreement came to apply only to Iraq.

"In 1933, Texaco and Chevron gained the ultimate prize-a 60-year concession on the lion's share of Saudi oil, which they later shared with Exxon and Mobil in the formation of Aramco. Around that time, Gulf also obtained 50 percent of the Kuwaiti concession."

Israel's "legitimacy' comes from a resolution by western imperialists to divide the spoils of Middle East oil. I'll bet Saddam, Gaddafi, and Assad feel much better. Or not.

 

[Kondor3]

"...I'll bet Saddam, Gaddafi, and Assad feel much better..."

Actually, I'll bet Saddam and Gaddafi are feeling a little 'dead' right about now.

And it's a good bet that Assad feels the noose tightening more and more every day.

Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of folk.

 

[abu afak]

Yet you say nothing Kondy of the thousands DEAD at the hands of the Israelis

CAT GOT YA TONGUE

ps........Strange but why haven't the Germans been exposed for supplying the GAS ??????????????Are you German Kondy

Perhaps You would like to put some meat on that bone.
No you wouldn't, so I will.

There are 100,000 dead in/and more than a million immigrants from.. Syria in just 2 years.
In Iraq, Saddam was responsible for the deaths of over 1 Million people, invading with the intention of conquering Iran and Kuwait. as well as genociding Kurds and Shia.

In Israel, OTOH, Several Thousand Palestinians are dead in a War THEY STARTED.
Virtually No Palestinians died before the Year 2000 Intifada, and since 2006 virtually all the 'Palestinian' dead are Gazans/Hamas instigated casualties.

That bears NO resemblance to Assad or Saddam except in the mind of Israel-Hating moral equivalence Attempters.
.

 

[Kondor3]

"...Yet you say nothing Kondy..."

Seen.

 

[Kondor3]

Yet you say nothing Kondy of the thousands DEAD at the hands of the Israelis

CAT GOT YA TONGUE

ps........Strange but why haven't the Germans been exposed for supplying the GAS ??????????????Are you German Kondy

Perhaps You would like to put some meat on that bone.
No you wouldn't, so I will.

There are 100,000 dead in/and more than a million immigrants from.. Syria in just 2 years.
In Iraq, Saddam was responsible for the deaths of over 1 Million people, invading with the intention of conquering Iran and Kuwait. as well as genociding Kurds and Shia.

In Israel, OTOH, Several Thousands Palestinians are dead in a War THEY STARTED.
Virtually No Palestinians died before the Year 2000 Intifada, and since 2006 virtually all the 'Palestinian' dead are Gazans/Hamas instigated casualties.

That bears NO resemblance to Assad or Saddam except in the mind of Israel-Hating moral equivalence Attempters.
.

 

[toastman]

Yet you say nothing Kondy of the thousands DEAD at the hands of the Israelis

CAT GOT YA TONGUE

ps........Strange but why haven't the Germans been exposed for supplying the GAS ??????????????Are you German Kondy

Perhaps You would like to put some meat on that bone.
No you wouldn't, so I will.

There are 100,000 dead in/and more than a million immigrants from.. Syria in just 2 years.
In Iraq, Saddam was responsible for the deaths of over 1 Million people, invading with the intention of conquering Iran and Kuwait. as well as genociding Kurds and Shia.

In Israel, OTOH, Several Thousand Palestinians are dead in a War THEY STARTED.
Virtually No Palestinians died before the Year 2000 Intifada, and since 2006 virtually all the 'Palestinian' dead are Gazans/Hamas instigated casualties.

That bears NO resemblance to Assad or Saddam except in the mind of Israel-Hating moral equivalence Attempters.
.

Excellent post !

 

[georgephillip]

"...I'll bet Saddam, Gaddafi, and Assad feel much better..."

Actually, I'll bet Saddam and Gaddafi are feeling a little 'dead' right about now.

And it's a good bet that Assad feels the noose tightening more and more every day.

Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of folk.

With the exception of rich US terrorists like Dick, Dubya, and Bubba whose personal war crimes dwarf any imagined by lesser lights like Saddam, Gaddafi, and Assad, the latter lacking the means to maim, murder, and displace millions of civilians on the opposite side of the planet from their homelands.

 

[docmauser1]

With the exception of rich US terrorists like Dick, Dubya, and Bubba whose personal war crimes dwarf any imagined by lesser lights like Saddam, Gaddafi, and Assad, the latter lacking the means to maim, murder, and displace millions of civilians on the opposite side of the planet from their homelands.

Drivel.

 

[Kondor3]

"...I'll bet Saddam, Gaddafi, and Assad feel much better..."

Actually, I'll bet Saddam and Gaddafi are feeling a little 'dead' right about now.

And it's a good bet that Assad feels the noose tightening more and more every day.

Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of folk.

With the exception of rich US terrorists like Dick, Dubya, and Bubba whose personal war crimes dwarf any imagined by lesser lights like Saddam, Gaddafi, and Assad, the latter lacking the means to maim, murder, and displace millions of civilians on the opposite side of the planet from their homelands.

Ain't it fun, being the Biggest Dog in the Junkyard?

 

[georgephillip]

Actually, I'll bet Saddam and Gaddafi are feeling a little 'dead' right about now.

And it's a good bet that Assad feels the noose tightening more and more every day.

Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of folk.

With the exception of rich US terrorists like Dick, Dubya, and Bubba whose personal war crimes dwarf any imagined by lesser lights like Saddam, Gaddafi, and Assad, the latter lacking the means to maim, murder, and displace millions of civilians on the opposite side of the planet from their homelands.

Ain't it fun, being the Biggest Dog in the Junkyard?

American War Crimes