Question about Shanksville crash

[Fizz]

You don't give a fuck about the Stack comparison because it proves you wrong about the fbi and nstb doing their own investigations.

Saying the agency who was in charge of investigating the crash site is automatically qualified to be the best source is bullshit. The expert government authority for crash site investigations is the ntsb. Period. If the irs was in charge of the dna testing would they be a qualified authority?

Do you even understand what the term "authority" means regarding the fallacy?

is the IRS involved in DNA testing at all, jackass? there is a long list of aircraft crash investigations the FBI has been involved in. not only that but they were also assisted by the NTSB for the flight 93 hijacking.

show me one legitimate source that says the 95% claim is incorrect.

you keep trying to back pedal and there is nowhere to go. The lead investigating agency for 9/11 says 95% of the plane was recovered. you have shown absolutely no evidence that is not correct and not one expert that disputes it. you claim the FBI, the lead investigating agency, is not in a position to make such a claim. this is based on the fact that the NTSB also investigates airplane crashes yet the NTSB assisted the FBI. your entire argument is just silly.

 

[CurveLight]

You don't give a fuck about the Stack comparison because it proves you wrong about the fbi and nstb doing their own investigations.

Saying the agency who was in charge of investigating the crash site is automatically qualified to be the best source is bullshit. The expert government authority for crash site investigations is the ntsb. Period. If the irs was in charge of the dna testing would they be a qualified authority?

Do you even understand what the term "authority" means regarding the fallacy?

is the IRS involved in DNA testing at all, jackass? there is a long list of aircraft crash investigations the FBI has been involved in. not only that but they were also assisted by the NTSB for the flight 93 hijacking.

show me one legitimate source that says the 95% claim is incorrect.

you keep trying to back pedal and there is nowhere to go. The lead investigating agency for 9/11 says 95% of the plane was recovered. you have shown absolutely no evidence that is not correct and not one expert that disputes it. you claim the FBI, the lead investigating agency, is not in a position to make such a claim. this is based on the fact that the NTSB also investigates airplane crashes yet the NTSB assisted the FBI. your entire argument is just silly.

Once again....do you understand what "authority" means regarding the fallacy?
I've not backpedalled one bit because my position has always been the same. You are dodging because you are demanding something to be proven false when it has not even been proven true.

You keep ignoring the Stack comparison because he did exactly what the other terrorists did yet the fbi and ntsb did their own investigations, unlike 9E.

When you have a single fact to prove the 95% claim is true then provide it. Until then you got nothing but an unsupported claim from an unqualified source. (if the fbi was capable of doing a crash investigation they would not have needed assistance from the experts at ntsb.)

 

[DiveCon]

Rotfl! I've ignored the fact the ntsb assisted the fbi? Look on the last page you stoopid fuk.

The fbi is not the expert agency on crash investigations. That is what you keep ignoring as well as the comparison to Stack's terrorist attack and you will keep ignoring it because you are a fuxxing classic loser.

i dont give a fuck about Stack.

tell me again who is more qualified to release a statement about how much of the plane was recovered than the actual agency that was investigation the crash?

You don't give a fuck about the Stack comparison because it proves you wrong about the fbi and nstb doing their own investigations.

Saying the agency who was in charge of investigating the crash site is automatically qualified to be the best source is bullshit. The expert government authority for crash site investigations is the ntsb. Period. If the irs was in charge of the dna testing would they be a qualified authority?

Do you even understand what the term "authority" means regarding the fallacy?

and the FBI got their info from the NTSB, dipshit

 

[eots]

Col. George Nelson, MBA, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Former U.S. Air Force aircraft accident investigator and airplane parts authority. Graduate, U.S. Air Force War College. 34-year Air Force career.

Licensed commercial pilot. Licensed airframe and powerplant mechanic.
Essay: "In all my years of direct and indirect participation, I never witnessed nor even heard of an aircraft loss, where the wreckage was accessible, that prevented investigators from finding enough hard evidence to positively identify the make, model, and specific registration number of the aircraft -- and in most cases the precise cause of the accident. ...

The government alleges that four wide-body airliners crashed on the morning of September 11 2001, resulting in the deaths of more than 3,000 human beings, yet not one piece of hard aircraft evidence has been produced in an attempt to positively identify any of the four aircraft. On the contrary, it seems only that all potential evidence was deliberately kept hidden from public view. …

With all the evidence readily available at the Pentagon crash site, any unbiased rational investigator could only conclude that a Boeing 757 did not fly into the Pentagon as alleged. Similarly, with all the evidence available at the Pennsylvania crash site, it was most doubtful that a passenger airliner caused the obvious hole in the ground and certainly not the Boeing 757 as alleged. … As painful and heartbreaking as was the loss of innocent lives and the lingering health problems of thousands more, a most troublesome and nightmarish probability remains that so many Americans appear to be involved in the most heinous conspiracy





Lt. Col. Jeff Latas, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Former combat fighter pilot. Aerospace engineer. Currently Captain at a major airline. Combat experience includes Desert Storm and four tours of duty in Northern and Southern Watch. Aircraft flown: McDonnell Douglas F-15E Strike Eagle and General Dynamics F-111 Aardvark fighter/bomber. Former President, U.S. Air Force Accident Investigation Board. Also served as Pentagon Weapons Requirement Officer and as a member of the Pentagon's Quadrennial Defense Review. Awarded Distinguish Flying Cross for Heroism, four Air Medals, four Meritorious Service Medals, and nine Aerial Achievement Medals. 20-year Air Force career.
Audio interview with Rob Balsamo 6/25/07: Regarding the 9/11 Commission's account of the impact of Flight 77 at the Pentagon and discrepancies with the actual Flight Data Recorder information:

"After I did my own analysis of it, it's obvious that there's discrepancies between the two stories; between the 9/11 Commission and the flight data recorder information. And I think that's where we really need to focus a lot of our attention to get the help that we need in order to put pressure on government agencies to actually do a real investigation of 9/11. And not just from a security standpoint, but from even an aviation standpoint, like any accident investigation would actually help the aviators out by finding reasons for things happening. ...

The things that really got my attention were the amount of descent rate that you had to have at the end of the flight, of Flight 77, that would have made it practically impossible to hit the light poles. [Editor's note: Destruction of the light poles near the Pentagon by Flight 77 was stated in the 9/11 Commission Report.] Essentially it would have been too high at that point to the point of impact where the main body of the airplane was hitting between the first and second floor of the Pentagon. ...

You know, I'd ride my bike to the Pentagon. So, you know I'm a little bit familiar with that area. [Editor's note: Lt. Col. Latas served as a Weapons Requirement Officer at the Pentagon.] But, you know, that kind of descent rate it would have been impossible essentially for the results that we see physically from what the flight data recorder was recording. Like I say, that's an area that I think deserves explanation. ...

The ground track [the path of the airplane] is off from the 9/11 Commission. There are several things that can be brought up but it's been a while since I've seen the film and looked at the flight data recorder. And I can't think of all the discrepancies I saw, but there are several there. [The film he refers to is Pandora's Black Box, Chapter 2, Flight of American 77.] ...


Lt. Col. David Gapp, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Retired Pilot and Qualified Aircraft Accident Investigator. Served as President, Aircraft Accident Board. Military aircraft flown: McDonnell Douglas F-4 Phantom, Cessna T-37 Dragonfly "Tweet", Northrup T-38 Talon. 3,000+ total hours flown. 31 years of U.S. Air Force service. One year as commercial pilot for Continental Airlines. Commercial aircraft flown: ATR-42.


Member: Pilots for 9/11 Truth Association Statement: "Pilots for 9/11 Truth is an organization of aviation professionals and pilots throughout the globe that have gathered together for one purpose. We are committed to seeking the truth surrounding the events of the 11th of September 2001. Our main focus concentrates on the four flights, maneuvers performed and the reported pilots. We do not offer theory or point blame. However, we are focused on determining the truth of that fateful day since the United States Government doesn't seem to be very forthcoming with answers."




Lt. Cdr. Bernard J. Smith, U.S. Nay (ret) – Retired carrier Naval Aviator and former aircraft accident investigator.
Statement in support of Architects and Engineers petition:

"From my several years experience as an aircraft accident investigator for the U.S.Navy, I am appalled at the basic principles of investigation being ignored; ie, premature destruction of evidence, reliable eye witness accounts ignored, etc. To allow the official version to be the final word in this planned event, as is evident from the AE9/11 investigation, would be a major disservice to the victims and the nation." AE911Truth


Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report

 

[DiveCon]

You don't give a fuck about the Stack comparison because it proves you wrong about the fbi and nstb doing their own investigations.

Saying the agency who was in charge of investigating the crash site is automatically qualified to be the best source is bullshit. The expert government authority for crash site investigations is the ntsb. Period. If the irs was in charge of the dna testing would they be a qualified authority?

Do you even understand what the term "authority" means regarding the fallacy?

is the IRS involved in DNA testing at all, jackass? there is a long list of aircraft crash investigations the FBI has been involved in. not only that but they were also assisted by the NTSB for the flight 93 hijacking.

show me one legitimate source that says the 95% claim is incorrect.

you keep trying to back pedal and there is nowhere to go. The lead investigating agency for 9/11 says 95% of the plane was recovered. you have shown absolutely no evidence that is not correct and not one expert that disputes it. you claim the FBI, the lead investigating agency, is not in a position to make such a claim. this is based on the fact that the NTSB also investigates airplane crashes yet the NTSB assisted the FBI. your entire argument is just silly.

Once again....do you understand what "authority" means regarding the fallacy?
I've not backpedalled one bit because my position has always been the same. You are dodging because you are demanding something to be proven false when it has not even been proven true.

You keep ignoring the Stack comparison because he did exactly what the other terrorists did yet the fbi and ntsb did their own investigations, unlike 9E.

When you have a single fact to prove the 95% claim is true then provide it. Until then you got nothing but an unsupported claim from an unqualified source. (if the fbi was capable of doing a crash investigation they would not have needed assistance from the experts at ntsb.)

GAWD DAMN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

you are too fucking STUPID

 

[DiveCon]

Col. George Nelson, MBA, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Former U.S. Air Force aircraft accident investigator and airplane parts authority. Graduate, U.S. Air Force War College. 34-year Air Force career.

Licensed commercial pilot. Licensed airframe and powerplant mechanic.
Essay: "In all my years of direct and indirect participation, I never witnessed nor even heard of an aircraft loss, where the wreckage was accessible, that prevented investigators from finding enough hard evidence to positively identify the make, model, and specific registration number of the aircraft -- and in most cases the precise cause of the accident. ...

The government alleges that four wide-body airliners crashed on the morning of September 11 2001, resulting in the deaths of more than 3,000 human beings, yet not one piece of hard aircraft evidence has been produced in an attempt to positively identify any of the four aircraft. On the contrary, it seems only that all potential evidence was deliberately kept hidden from public view. …

With all the evidence readily available at the Pentagon crash site, any unbiased rational investigator could only conclude that a Boeing 757 did not fly into the Pentagon as alleged. Similarly, with all the evidence available at the Pennsylvania crash site, it was most doubtful that a passenger airliner caused the obvious hole in the ground and certainly not the Boeing 757 as alleged. …

As painful and heartbreaking as was the loss of innocent lives and the lingering health problems of thousands more, a most troublesome and nightmarish probability remains that so many Americans appear to be involved in the most heinous conspiracy

Lt. Col. Jeff Latas, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Former combat fighter pilot. Aerospace engineer. Currently Captain at a major airline. Combat experience includes Desert Storm and four tours of duty in Northern and Southern Watch. Aircraft flown: McDonnell Douglas F-15E Strike Eagle and General Dynamics F-111 Aardvark fighter/bomber. Former President, U.S. Air Force Accident Investigation Board. Also served as Pentagon Weapons Requirement Officer and as a member of the Pentagon's Quadrennial Defense Review. Awarded Distinguish Flying Cross for Heroism, four Air Medals, four Meritorious Service Medals, and nine Aerial Achievement Medals. 20-year Air Force career.
Audio interview with Rob Balsamo 6/25/07: Regarding the 9/11 Commission's account of the impact of Flight 77 at the Pentagon and discrepancies with the actual Flight Data Recorder information:

"After I did my own analysis of it, it's obvious that there's discrepancies between the two stories; between the 9/11 Commission and the flight data recorder information. And I think that's where we really need to focus a lot of our attention to get the help that we need in order to put pressure on government agencies to actually do a real investigation of 9/11. And not just from a security standpoint, but from even an aviation standpoint, like any accident investigation would actually help the aviators out by finding reasons for things happening. ...

The things that really got my attention were the amount of descent rate that you had to have at the end of the flight, of Flight 77, that would have made it practically impossible to hit the light poles. [Editor's note: Destruction of the light poles near the Pentagon by Flight 77 was stated in the 9/11 Commission Report.] Essentially it would have been too high at that point to the point of impact where the main body of the airplane was hitting between the first and second floor of the Pentagon. ...

You know, I'd ride my bike to the Pentagon. So, you know I'm a little bit familiar with that area. [Editor's note: Lt. Col. Latas served as a Weapons Requirement Officer at the Pentagon.] But, you know, that kind of descent rate it would have been impossible essentially for the results that we see physically from what the flight data recorder was recording. Like I say, that's an area that I think deserves explanation. ...

The ground track [the path of the airplane] is off from the 9/11 Commission. There are several things that can be brought up but it's been a while since I've seen the film and looked at the flight data recorder. And I can't think of all the discrepancies I saw, but there are several there. [The film he refers to is Pandora's Black Box, Chapter 2, Flight of American 77.] ...


Lt. Col. David Gapp, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Retired Pilot and Qualified Aircraft Accident Investigator. Served as President, Aircraft Accident Board. Military aircraft flown: McDonnell Douglas F-4 Phantom, Cessna T-37 Dragonfly "Tweet", Northrup T-38 Talon. 3,000+ total hours flown. 31 years of U.S. Air Force service. One year as commercial pilot for Continental Airlines. Commercial aircraft flown: ATR-42.


Member: Pilots for 9/11 Truth Association Statement: "Pilots for 9/11 Truth is an organization of aviation professionals and pilots throughout the globe that have gathered together for one purpose. We are committed to seeking the truth surrounding the events of the 11th of September 2001. Our main focus concentrates on the four flights, maneuvers performed and the reported pilots. We do not offer theory or point blame. However, we are focused on determining the truth of that fateful day since the United States Government doesn't seem to be very forthcoming with answers."


Lt. Cdr. Bernard J. Smith, U.S. Nay (ret) – Retired carrier Naval Aviator and former aircraft accident investigator.
Statement in support of Architects and Engineers petition:

"From my several years experience as an aircraft accident investigator for the U.S.Navy, I am appalled at the basic principles of investigation being ignored; ie, premature destruction of evidence, reliable eye witness accounts ignored, etc. To allow the official version to be the final word in this planned event, as is evident from the AE9/11 investigation, would be a major disservice to the victims and the nation." AE911Truth


Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report

were any of them there at the Pentagon on 9/11/2001?

 

[eots]

Col. George Nelson, MBA, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Former U.S. Air Force aircraft accident investigator and airplane parts authority. Graduate, U.S. Air Force War College. 34-year Air Force career.

Licensed commercial pilot. Licensed airframe and powerplant mechanic.
Essay: "In all my years of direct and indirect participation, I never witnessed nor even heard of an aircraft loss, where the wreckage was accessible, that prevented investigators from finding enough hard evidence to positively identify the make, model, and specific registration number of the aircraft -- and in most cases the precise cause of the accident. ...

The government alleges that four wide-body airliners crashed on the morning of September 11 2001, resulting in the deaths of more than 3,000 human beings, yet not one piece of hard aircraft evidence has been produced in an attempt to positively identify any of the four aircraft. On the contrary, it seems only that all potential evidence was deliberately kept hidden from public view. …

With all the evidence readily available at the Pentagon crash site, any unbiased rational investigator could only conclude that a Boeing 757 did not fly into the Pentagon as alleged. Similarly, with all the evidence available at the Pennsylvania crash site, it was most doubtful that a passenger airliner caused the obvious hole in the ground and certainly not the Boeing 757 as alleged. …

As painful and heartbreaking as was the loss of innocent lives and the lingering health problems of thousands more, a most troublesome and nightmarish probability remains that so many Americans appear to be involved in the most heinous conspiracy

Lt. Col. Jeff Latas, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Former combat fighter pilot. Aerospace engineer. Currently Captain at a major airline. Combat experience includes Desert Storm and four tours of duty in Northern and Southern Watch. Aircraft flown: McDonnell Douglas F-15E Strike Eagle and General Dynamics F-111 Aardvark fighter/bomber. Former President, U.S. Air Force Accident Investigation Board. Also served as Pentagon Weapons Requirement Officer and as a member of the Pentagon's Quadrennial Defense Review. Awarded Distinguish Flying Cross for Heroism, four Air Medals, four Meritorious Service Medals, and nine Aerial Achievement Medals. 20-year Air Force career.
Audio interview with Rob Balsamo 6/25/07: Regarding the 9/11 Commission's account of the impact of Flight 77 at the Pentagon and discrepancies with the actual Flight Data Recorder information:

"After I did my own analysis of it, it's obvious that there's discrepancies between the two stories; between the 9/11 Commission and the flight data recorder information. And I think that's where we really need to focus a lot of our attention to get the help that we need in order to put pressure on government agencies to actually do a real investigation of 9/11. And not just from a security standpoint, but from even an aviation standpoint, like any accident investigation would actually help the aviators out by finding reasons for things happening. ...

The things that really got my attention were the amount of descent rate that you had to have at the end of the flight, of Flight 77, that would have made it practically impossible to hit the light poles. [Editor's note: Destruction of the light poles near the Pentagon by Flight 77 was stated in the 9/11 Commission Report.] Essentially it would have been too high at that point to the point of impact where the main body of the airplane was hitting between the first and second floor of the Pentagon. ...

You know, I'd ride my bike to the Pentagon. So, you know I'm a little bit familiar with that area. [Editor's note: Lt. Col. Latas served as a Weapons Requirement Officer at the Pentagon.] But, you know, that kind of descent rate it would have been impossible essentially for the results that we see physically from what the flight data recorder was recording. Like I say, that's an area that I think deserves explanation. ...

The ground track [the path of the airplane] is off from the 9/11 Commission. There are several things that can be brought up but it's been a while since I've seen the film and looked at the flight data recorder. And I can't think of all the discrepancies I saw, but there are several there. [The film he refers to is Pandora's Black Box, Chapter 2, Flight of American 77.] ...


Lt. Col. David Gapp, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Retired Pilot and Qualified Aircraft Accident Investigator. Served as President, Aircraft Accident Board. Military aircraft flown: McDonnell Douglas F-4 Phantom, Cessna T-37 Dragonfly "Tweet", Northrup T-38 Talon. 3,000+ total hours flown. 31 years of U.S. Air Force service. One year as commercial pilot for Continental Airlines. Commercial aircraft flown: ATR-42.


Member: Pilots for 9/11 Truth Association Statement: "Pilots for 9/11 Truth is an organization of aviation professionals and pilots throughout the globe that have gathered together for one purpose. We are committed to seeking the truth surrounding the events of the 11th of September 2001. Our main focus concentrates on the four flights, maneuvers performed and the reported pilots. We do not offer theory or point blame. However, we are focused on determining the truth of that fateful day since the United States Government doesn't seem to be very forthcoming with answers."


Lt. Cdr. Bernard J. Smith, U.S. Nay (ret) – Retired carrier Naval Aviator and former aircraft accident investigator.
Statement in support of Architects and Engineers petition:

"From my several years experience as an aircraft accident investigator for the U.S.Navy, I am appalled at the basic principles of investigation being ignored; ie, premature destruction of evidence, reliable eye witness accounts ignored, etc. To allow the official version to be the final word in this planned event, as is evident from the AE9/11 investigation, would be a major disservice to the victims and the nation." AE911Truth


Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report

were any of them there at the Pentagon on 9/11/2001?

what a retarded question how often do you think crash investigators wittiness the crashes they investigate ?

 

[CurveLight]

I bet divedickhead never questioned how many fbi agents were in a field in shanksville when 93 crashed......more painfully obvious OCTA hypocrisy.

 

[saiweril]

* * * *

Do you debunkers think you can provide some evidence that supports your belief that most of Flight 93 had gone into the ground and was dug out?

So how much of the plane got or did not get recovered?

Read my question again, carefully.

 

[Fizz]

Once again....do you understand what "authority" means regarding the fallacy?
I've not backpedalled one bit because my position has always been the same. You are dodging because you are demanding something to be proven false when it has not even been proven true.

You keep ignoring the Stack comparison because he did exactly what the other terrorists did yet the fbi and ntsb did their own investigations, unlike 9E.

When you have a single fact to prove the 95% claim is true then provide it. Until then you got nothing but an unsupported claim from an unqualified source. (if the fbi was capable of doing a crash investigation they would not have needed assistance from the experts at ntsb.)

you are saying the lead investigative agency is not an authority. got you. you are are a complete moron.

now you are claiming Stack hijacked a commercial airplane?

 

[DiveCon]

Col. George Nelson, MBA, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Former U.S. Air Force aircraft accident investigator and airplane parts authority. Graduate, U.S. Air Force War College. 34-year Air Force career.

Licensed commercial pilot. Licensed airframe and powerplant mechanic.
Essay: "In all my years of direct and indirect participation, I never witnessed nor even heard of an aircraft loss, where the wreckage was accessible, that prevented investigators from finding enough hard evidence to positively identify the make, model, and specific registration number of the aircraft -- and in most cases the precise cause of the accident. ...

The government alleges that four wide-body airliners crashed on the morning of September 11 2001, resulting in the deaths of more than 3,000 human beings, yet not one piece of hard aircraft evidence has been produced in an attempt to positively identify any of the four aircraft. On the contrary, it seems only that all potential evidence was deliberately kept hidden from public view. …

With all the evidence readily available at the Pentagon crash site, any unbiased rational investigator could only conclude that a Boeing 757 did not fly into the Pentagon as alleged. Similarly, with all the evidence available at the Pennsylvania crash site, it was most doubtful that a passenger airliner caused the obvious hole in the ground and certainly not the Boeing 757 as alleged. …

As painful and heartbreaking as was the loss of innocent lives and the lingering health problems of thousands more, a most troublesome and nightmarish probability remains that so many Americans appear to be involved in the most heinous conspiracy

Lt. Col. Jeff Latas, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Former combat fighter pilot. Aerospace engineer. Currently Captain at a major airline. Combat experience includes Desert Storm and four tours of duty in Northern and Southern Watch. Aircraft flown: McDonnell Douglas F-15E Strike Eagle and General Dynamics F-111 Aardvark fighter/bomber. Former President, U.S. Air Force Accident Investigation Board. Also served as Pentagon Weapons Requirement Officer and as a member of the Pentagon's Quadrennial Defense Review. Awarded Distinguish Flying Cross for Heroism, four Air Medals, four Meritorious Service Medals, and nine Aerial Achievement Medals. 20-year Air Force career.
Audio interview with Rob Balsamo 6/25/07: Regarding the 9/11 Commission's account of the impact of Flight 77 at the Pentagon and discrepancies with the actual Flight Data Recorder information:

"After I did my own analysis of it, it's obvious that there's discrepancies between the two stories; between the 9/11 Commission and the flight data recorder information. And I think that's where we really need to focus a lot of our attention to get the help that we need in order to put pressure on government agencies to actually do a real investigation of 9/11. And not just from a security standpoint, but from even an aviation standpoint, like any accident investigation would actually help the aviators out by finding reasons for things happening. ...

The things that really got my attention were the amount of descent rate that you had to have at the end of the flight, of Flight 77, that would have made it practically impossible to hit the light poles. [Editor's note: Destruction of the light poles near the Pentagon by Flight 77 was stated in the 9/11 Commission Report.] Essentially it would have been too high at that point to the point of impact where the main body of the airplane was hitting between the first and second floor of the Pentagon. ...

You know, I'd ride my bike to the Pentagon. So, you know I'm a little bit familiar with that area. [Editor's note: Lt. Col. Latas served as a Weapons Requirement Officer at the Pentagon.] But, you know, that kind of descent rate it would have been impossible essentially for the results that we see physically from what the flight data recorder was recording. Like I say, that's an area that I think deserves explanation. ...

The ground track [the path of the airplane] is off from the 9/11 Commission. There are several things that can be brought up but it's been a while since I've seen the film and looked at the flight data recorder. And I can't think of all the discrepancies I saw, but there are several there. [The film he refers to is Pandora's Black Box, Chapter 2, Flight of American 77.] ...


Lt. Col. David Gapp, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Retired Pilot and Qualified Aircraft Accident Investigator. Served as President, Aircraft Accident Board. Military aircraft flown: McDonnell Douglas F-4 Phantom, Cessna T-37 Dragonfly "Tweet", Northrup T-38 Talon. 3,000+ total hours flown. 31 years of U.S. Air Force service. One year as commercial pilot for Continental Airlines. Commercial aircraft flown: ATR-42.


Member: Pilots for 9/11 Truth Association Statement: "Pilots for 9/11 Truth is an organization of aviation professionals and pilots throughout the globe that have gathered together for one purpose. We are committed to seeking the truth surrounding the events of the 11th of September 2001. Our main focus concentrates on the four flights, maneuvers performed and the reported pilots. We do not offer theory or point blame. However, we are focused on determining the truth of that fateful day since the United States Government doesn't seem to be very forthcoming with answers."


Lt. Cdr. Bernard J. Smith, U.S. Nay (ret) – Retired carrier Naval Aviator and former aircraft accident investigator.
Statement in support of Architects and Engineers petition:

"From my several years experience as an aircraft accident investigator for the U.S.Navy, I am appalled at the basic principles of investigation being ignored; ie, premature destruction of evidence, reliable eye witness accounts ignored, etc. To allow the official version to be the final word in this planned event, as is evident from the AE9/11 investigation, would be a major disservice to the victims and the nation." AE911Truth


Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report

were any of them there at the Pentagon on 9/11/2001?

what a retarded question how often do you think crash investigators wittiness the crashes they investigate ?

ok dipshit, you took it too literal as usual
how many were ever involved in the entire 9/11 pentagon crash site?

 

[DiveCon]

I bet divedickhead never questioned how many fbi agents were in a field in shanksville when 93 crashed......more painfully obvious OCTA hypocrisy.

another stupid fucking moronic troofer

 

[Fizz]

what a retarded question how often do you think crash investigators wittiness the crashes they investigate ?

where did he say they witnessed the crash? he asked if they went to the pentagon on 9/11 like the FBI did.

 

[CurveLight]

were any of them there at the Pentagon on 9/11/2001?

what a retarded question how often do you think crash investigators wittiness the crashes they investigate ?

ok dipshit, you took it too literal as usual
how many were ever involved in the entire 9/11 pentagon crash site?

Rotfl.....back...back...backstroke!

You specifically asked if they were there ON 9E you dishonest stoopid ****......now you want to change it.....what a useless bitch.

 

[CurveLight]

what a retarded question how often do you think crash investigators wittiness the crashes they investigate ?

where did he say they witnessed the crash? he asked if they went to the pentagon on 9/11 like the FBI did.

It's so cute when you try to help each other bail out of your stoopidity.

 

[DiveCon]

what a retarded question how often do you think crash investigators wittiness the crashes they investigate ?

ok dipshit, you took it too literal as usual
how many were ever involved in the entire 9/11 pentagon crash site?

Rotfl.....back...back...backstroke!

You specifically asked if they were there ON 9E you dishonest stoopid ****......now you want to change it.....what a useless bitch.

talk about useless
tell us all again how my phone has flight or airplane mode and then prove it has an offline mode again
dipshit
fuck off and die dipshit

 

[DiveCon]

what a retarded question how often do you think crash investigators wittiness the crashes they investigate ?

where did he say they witnessed the crash? he asked if they went to the pentagon on 9/11 like the FBI did.

It's so cute when you try to help each other bail out of your stoopidity.

are you too fucking stupid to understand that "on 9/11" encompasses MORE than just when the plane crashed?

you know each day has 24 hours, right?

 

[Fizz]

what a retarded question how often do you think crash investigators wittiness the crashes they investigate ?

where did he say they witnessed the crash? he asked if they went to the pentagon on 9/11 like the FBI did.

It's so cute when you try to help each other bail out of your stoopidity.

no. whats really stupid is assuming that if someone is at the pentagon on 9/11 they were there when they plane crashed into the building.

 

[eots]

Lt. Col. Karen U. Kwiatkowski, PhD, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Former Political-Military Affairs Officer in the Office of the Secretary of Defense. Also served on the staff of the Director of the National Security Agency. 20-year Air Force career. Member adjunct faculty, Political Science Department, James Madison University. Instructor, University of Maryland University College and American Public University System. Author of African Crisis Response Initiative: Past Present and Future (2000) and Expeditionary Air Operations in Africa: Challenges and Solutions (2001).
Contributor to 9/11 and American Empire: Intellectuals Speak Out 8/23/06: Account of Lt. Col. Karen Kwiatkowski, Pentagon employee and eyewitness to the events at the Pentagon on 9/11. "I believe the Commission failed to deeply examine the topic at hand, failed to apply scientific rigor to its assessment of events leading up to and including 9/11, failed to produce a believable and unbiased summary of what happened, failed to fully examine why it happened, and even failed to include a set of unanswered questions for future research. ...

It is as a scientist that I have the most trouble with the official government conspiracy theory, mainly because it does not satisfy the rules of probability or physics. The collapses of the World Trade Center buildings clearly violate the laws of probability and physics. ...

There was a dearth of visible debris on the relatively unmarked [Pentagon] lawn, where I stood only minutes after the impact. Beyond this strange absence of airliner debris, there was no sign of the kind of damage to the Pentagon structure one would expect from the impact of a large airliner. This visible evidence or lack thereof may also have been apparent to the secretary of defense [Donald Rumsfeld], who in an unfortunate slip of the tongue referred to the aircraft that slammed into the Pentagon as a "missile". ...

I saw nothing of significance at the point of impact - no airplane metal or cargo debris was blowing on the lawn in front of the damaged building as smoke billowed from within the Pentagon. ... all of us staring at the Pentagon that morning were indeed looking for such debris, but what we expected to see was not evident.

The same is true with regard to the kind of damage we expected. ... But I did not see this kind of damage. Rather, the facade had a rather small hole, no larger than 20 feet in diameter. Although this facade later collapsed, it remained standing for 30 or 40 minutes, with the roof line remaining relatively straight.

The scene, in short, was not what I would have expected from a strike by a large jetliner. It was, however, exactly what one would expect if a missile had struck the Pentagon. ...

More information is certainly needed regarding the events of 9/11 and the events leading up to that terrible day."

Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report

 

[Fizz]

Lt. Col. Karen U. Kwiatkowski, PhD, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Former Political-Military Affairs Officer in the Office of the Secretary of Defense.

and how many aircraft crash investigations has she been a part of?

let's see if curvelight jumps all over your ass for his "fallacy of an appeal to authority" argument because this is a perfect example.