Raise the minimum wage

[Againsheila]

Laziness and self pity are by far the most common......

Then there are other things, like disabilities, recovery from whatever, having been married for 20 years and a housewife and then having your husband leave you for someone else....etc.

Much less common than the two i listed......

I disagree. For one thing, MW jobs require a lot more work so laziness is just plain out.

 

[ConHog]

I'll assume I'm in the tiny minority on this. These questions seemed reasonable to me...

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I've already said, several times..a living wage is enough for ONE person to afford a roof over their heads in a cheap apartment, utilities, food, clothing, medical care and transportation to and from work. It's basic stuff. No one who wants the minimum wage raised expects minimum wage workers to suddenly be able to afford expensive cars, etc. The expect them to be able to afford the basic necessities without having to bum off of their family, friends and government. No one who is working should have to collect foodstamps. That amounts to welfare for the company that is employing them.

Why should it be ONE person?? People too good for roommates? Too good to live at home?? Too good to walk to work?

No.. minimum wage is not supposed to be an 'on your own' wage.. it is supposed to be a STARTER wage

Dave you keep saying that MW is a starter wage, not meant for adults. But that isn't true really. I mean look at Wal Mart, they start at like $8/HR around here, that's a mere 50 cents above MW . Which would be $20 week, IF they worked you a 40 work week, which they don't.

Now, I'm a supporter of Wal Mart, so I'm not bashing them, I'm just using them as an example.

Those are grown folk making $8/HR. Some of them hard working , but uneducated, people. Okay you can make the case that it is their own fault that they are uneducated, and in most cases that is true; BUT no matter where the MW is set at they are still uneducated and will be earning that amount or close to it.

So does it make sense to give that person making $8/HR for 32 hours a week thousands of dollars a year in welfare, or does it make more sense to tell Wal Mart that THEY will pay higher wages so that the bulk of their employees aren't on welfare?

I'm not talking about kids here Dave, I'm talking about adult workers who are trying to raise families. Oh by the way, fact those who are raised on welfare are likely to be welfare recipients themselves.

 

[The Rabbi]

I've already said, several times..a living wage is enough for ONE person to afford a roof over their heads in a cheap apartment, utilities, food, clothing, medical care and transportation to and from work. It's basic stuff. No one who wants the minimum wage raised expects minimum wage workers to suddenly be able to afford expensive cars, etc. The expect them to be able to afford the basic necessities without having to bum off of their family, friends and government. No one who is working should have to collect foodstamps. That amounts to welfare for the company that is employing them.

Why should it be ONE person?? People too good for roommates? Too good to live at home?? Too good to walk to work?

No.. minimum wage is not supposed to be an 'on your own' wage.. it is supposed to be a STARTER wage

A lot of MW workers don't have a home to live at, and some of them don't have people they can live with. How do you walk to work when work is 10 miles from your cheap apartment? Would you rather they pay 3 times for the apartment so they can walk to work? When I said transportation I didn't mean car, I meant bus. Remember most MW workers aren't teenagers living at home. Most of them are adults. Take a look around the next time you go to a restaurant. They pay MW, how many of the workers are teenagers?

And again, why do you believe MW workers today are worth less than they were in 1968?

Do you have any proof of that? BEcause most MW workers are part of someone else's household, re-entries into the workforce, teenagers or retirees.
Restaurant workers/servers make tips which may boost their salary well above min wage.

 

[driveby]

Then there are other things, like disabilities, recovery from whatever, having been married for 20 years and a housewife and then having your husband leave you for someone else....etc.

Much less common than the two i listed......

I disagree. For one thing, MW jobs require a lot more work so laziness is just plain out.

On which planet ? A burger flipper or shelf stocker works harder than a skilled tradesman, doctor, lawyer, the dreaded CEO etc.......? I think not....

 

[Redfish]

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Asking why the minimum wage shouldn't be $15 or $20 or $30 an hour seems reasonable to me. Where, precisely, is the line drawn, and (here's a great question) who gets to draw it?

But here's the question I have: What, exactly, is a "living wage"?

• Is it for one person working, or two?
• I pay around $400 a month for all our cell phones. Is that a right when calculating this?
• What about payments on credit cards being rung up on iPhones, video games, vacations and cool clothes?
• What about that $450 car payment you have instead of being smart and getting a more reasonably-priced car?
• What about booze, partying, eating out, movies whenever you feel like it?
• I assume Christmas and birthday presents should be factored in, right?
• What about geography? Some places are far more expensive to live in than others.

In other words, some people are far more responsible with a dollar than others. So precisely how are we to determine what an adequate "living wage" is for everyone? Since we're making up arbitrary numbers for what a "living wage" is, shouldn't we examine the other end of the balance sheet as well?

And who makes all these decisions?

Are these not reasonable questions?

.

I'll assume I'm in the tiny minority on this. These questions seemed reasonable to me...

.

I've already said, several times..a living wage is enough for ONE person to afford a roof over their heads in a cheap apartment, utilities, food, clothing, medical care and transportation to and from work. It's basic stuff. No one who wants the minimum wage raised expects minimum wage workers to suddenly be able to afford expensive cars, etc. The expect them to be able to afford the basic necessities without having to bum off of their family, friends and government. No one who is working should have to collect foodstamps. That amounts to welfare for the company that is employing them.

minimum wage should not be a lifetime wage, its a starting point, its for summer work for kids, its for high school drop outs until they can show some ability and move into lower management positions. Who the fuck wants to live his entire life on minimum wage?

the price for real work should be set by supply and demand. the greater your skills and abilities the more you earn.

 

[Againsheila]

I'll assume I'm in the tiny minority on this. These questions seemed reasonable to me...

.

I've already said, several times..a living wage is enough for ONE person to afford a roof over their heads in a cheap apartment, utilities, food, clothing, medical care and transportation to and from work. It's basic stuff. No one who wants the minimum wage raised expects minimum wage workers to suddenly be able to afford expensive cars, etc. The expect them to be able to afford the basic necessities without having to bum off of their family, friends and government. No one who is working should have to collect foodstamps. That amounts to welfare for the company that is employing them.

minimum wage should not be a lifetime wage, its a starting point, its for summer work for kids, its for high school drop outs until they can show some ability and move into lower management positions. Who the fuck wants to live his entire life on minimum wage?

the price for real work should be set by supply and demand. the greater your skills and abilities the more you earn.

Again, why do you think today's MW workers are worth less than MW workers in 1968?

 

[Lakhota]

The Minimum Wage: Myths & Facts

 

[Againsheila]

The Minimum Wage: Myths & Facts

from your site

If The Minimum Wage Reflected Increases In Worker Productivity, It Would Be Nearly $22 Per Hour. Citing a study done by the Center for Economic and Policy Research, The Huffington Post explained that the current minimum wage lags far behind what it should be after accounting for productivity increases. From The Huffington Post:

 

[Noomi]

You can raise the minimum wage by a dollar and there will be no effect. If an employer can't afford an extra dollar per hour they are obviously shitty employers.

Why bother raising MW by a dollar if it will have no effect?

It will have effect on the employer, which is what I meant.

 

[Noomi]

He likely has higher expectations of people. I wish more people would do likewise instead of accepting mediocrity. The minimum wage is a manifestation of low expectations as your own. I doesn't stop there though. People instill mediocrity in their children and in doing so perpetuate ignorance and poverty. That is the reason for people making minimum wage, and a tragedy to boot.

There are many people who want to get somewhere in life, but sometimes, circumstances don't allow for that to happen. Its life, and people need to accept that.

Laziness and self pity are by far the most common......

Spoken like a true conservative.

 

[Noomi]

Much less common than the two i listed......

I disagree. For one thing, MW jobs require a lot more work so laziness is just plain out.

On which planet ? A burger flipper or shelf stocker works harder than a skilled tradesman, doctor, lawyer, the dreaded CEO etc.......? I think not....

Have you ever worked in fast food? Most people who look down upon it haven't worked in that kind of business before, but they consider themselves experts in it.

I have worked in fast food for almost 7 years. I would be a manager but the fact that I am partially deaf means I can't wear a headset to run drive thru, and I also can't work nights, so that cancels me out. I stay longer, I come in to work on my days off with a half hours notice, I am about to head home when some fuck wit calls up sick and I have to stay an extra few hours. I don't complain. I work my arse off and have done for 7 fucking years, and when dickheads like you presume to think that people who work in fast food are uneducated and stupid, that insults me.

I get paid $16.75 an hour, and I am worth every damned penny of that, thank you very much. Plus, we get a pay rise every year, which is more than I can say for the people who work 12 hour shifts at the local McDonalds and take home less than half of what I get paid per week.

 

[Meathead]

I disagree. For one thing, MW jobs require a lot more work so laziness is just plain out.

On which planet ? A burger flipper or shelf stocker works harder than a skilled tradesman, doctor, lawyer, the dreaded CEO etc.......? I think not....

Have you ever worked in fast food? Most people who look down upon it haven't worked in that kind of business before, but they consider themselves experts in it.

I have worked in fast food for almost 7 years. I would be a manager but the fact that I am partially deaf means I can't wear a headset to run drive thru, and I also can't work nights, so that cancels me out. I stay longer, I come in to work on my days off with a half hours notice, I am about to head home when some fuck wit calls up sick and I have to stay an extra few hours. I don't complain. I work my arse off and have done for 7 fucking years, and when dickheads like you presume to think that people who work in fast food are uneducated and stupid, that insults me.

I get paid $16.75 an hour, and I am worth every damned penny of that, thank you very much. Plus, we get a pay rise every year, which is more than I can say for the people who work 12 hour shifts at the local McDonalds and take home less than half of what I get paid per week.

When people after a certain age do it, unless they're immigrants in the kitchen with limited local language skills or seniors trying to supplement their pensions, it's not all that impressive. Still, it's better than sucking on the public teat.

 

[Noomi]

On which planet ? A burger flipper or shelf stocker works harder than a skilled tradesman, doctor, lawyer, the dreaded CEO etc.......? I think not....

Have you ever worked in fast food? Most people who look down upon it haven't worked in that kind of business before, but they consider themselves experts in it.

I have worked in fast food for almost 7 years. I would be a manager but the fact that I am partially deaf means I can't wear a headset to run drive thru, and I also can't work nights, so that cancels me out. I stay longer, I come in to work on my days off with a half hours notice, I am about to head home when some fuck wit calls up sick and I have to stay an extra few hours. I don't complain. I work my arse off and have done for 7 fucking years, and when dickheads like you presume to think that people who work in fast food are uneducated and stupid, that insults me.

I get paid $16.75 an hour, and I am worth every damned penny of that, thank you very much. Plus, we get a pay rise every year, which is more than I can say for the people who work 12 hour shifts at the local McDonalds and take home less than half of what I get paid per week.

When people after a certain age do it, unless they're immigrants in the kitchen with limited local language skills or seniors trying to supplement their pensions, it's not all that impressive. Still, it's better than sucking on the public teat.

I got my first job at the age of 22. I had personal reasons for not starting work earlier. I have learning difficulties which means I am not skilled, and never will be skilled to get a high paying job. Yet people continually accuse people like me of being lazy, even though I work my butt off and don't sit on my butt leeching off the government like others are known to do.

 

[jgarden]

Since 1979 the average pre-tax income for the bottom 90% of households has decreased by $900, while that of the top 1% increased by over $700,000, as federal taxation became less progressive. From 1992-2007 the top 400 income earners in the U.S. saw their income increase 392% and their average tax rate reduced by 37%.

During the economic expansion between 2002 and 2007, the income of the top 1% grew 10 times faster than the income of the bottom 90%. In this period 66% of total income gains went to the 1%, who in 2007 had a larger share of total income than at any time since 1928.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distribution_of_wealth

The American middle and working classes should know their place which is defending the country by storming the beaches of Normandy and Iwo Jima - the top 1% promise to be grateful and look after your best interests if you get back!

 

[gallantwarrior]

You can raise the minimum wage by a dollar and there will be no effect. If an employer can't afford an extra dollar per hour they are obviously shitty employers.

Why bother raising MW by a dollar if it will have no effect?

It will have effect on the employer, which is what I meant.

You are correct, it will have a significant effect on the employer. I know this has been explained before, and better than I can explain it, but in small words and short sentences: it isn't likely that we're talking about an employer with one employee, so you'll have to multiply your example by the number of minimum wage employees on staff, then calculate the additional costs of deductions and taxes the employer must then also pay. Oh, and here's a question none of you have apparently considered, what about the rest of the employees who are already earning better than MW? Do they just get to piss up a rope, or is it fair to give them all raises, too?
There's a whole lot more that goes into running a profitable business than a simple "dollar and hour" raise. (By-the-way, most raises I have ever gotten were a percent basis, not flat rate. I.e. You get a 2% raise, I don't get a simple $1/hr more.) But then, you have never run a business, you have never even worked in the US. Based on your opinions, I would venture to say that you are a victim of liberal biased media.

 

[Noomi]

Sorry GW, I meant that it wouldn't have an effect. I made a typo - if you hadn't quoted my post I wouldn't have known about it!

 

[gallantwarrior]

Sorry GW, I meant that it wouldn't have an effect. I made a typo - if you hadn't quoted my post I wouldn't have known about it!

OK, in that case, you are quite wrong. I can and most likely will have a significant effect on the employer.

 

[neomalthusian]

I'm not talking about kids here Dave, I'm talking about adult workers who are trying to raise families.

Go to the Bureau of Labor Statistics and figure out the number or percentage of families earning the minimum wage.

They exist, but you'll figure out they're such a relative rarity among minimum wage workers that they don't make sense to display as an archetypal example of a minimum wage employee.

 

[Rozman]

Minimum wage is not to be a living wage.. it is a STARTER wage... for the ones with zero experience, just beginning their working careers...

This is a simple concept that left wingers just cannot seem to understand

If you are trying to raise a family and you are in a job where you are making minimum
wage..... you obviously made some bad career choices.And you want to blame it all on
republicans of course as to why you are not making a salary where you could support
that family.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Minimum wage is not to be a living wage.. it is a STARTER wage... for the ones with zero experience, just beginning their working careers...

This is a simple concept that left wingers just cannot seem to understand

.....Or, REPUBLICANS....dependent (of course) on whether The President is.....

.....Black or White.

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