Should The Rich Be Required To Pay Higher Taxes In the US?

One more time: The bottom 49% pay NOTHING towards our collective federal income tax burden yet have the same access to our infrastructure as those who do pay. How is that "fair?"

They don't have any money.

If you want that to change;

-Base Federal tax for corporations at 30% of revenue.

-Raise minimum wage to $23.50/hr. Based on where minimum wage should be using 1970-2015 rise in food, shelter, and transportation.

-Eliminate all business subsidies (deductions/write-offs/write-downs) except for employee expenses which are deducted dollar-for-dollar on all city, state, and Federal taxes and fees with the Feds refunding city, State, and fees.

-Companies with 500 employees or less, employee expenses above the deduction are subsidized at 100% with funds usually give back to the States.

-Adjust Social Security and private/public retirement and pension payments using 1970-2015 price structure.

-Remove the FICA limit.

-Back down ALL costs, prices, fees, to January 1, 2009 levels and hold them for 10 years which will eliminate inflation.

-Recall ALL off-shore investments tax free, and disallow any further off-shore investments.

-Make inversion illegal.


What a bunch of financially illiterate CRAP.

A 30% tax on corporate REVENUE? Grocery stores operate on 2-3% profit margins. So, either they increase prices 30% to cover this tax burden, or they go out of business. The neighborhoods most affected will be in POOR areas.

Your plan, quite ironically and likely intentionally, makes your Dreaded INEQUALITY worse. But that is the aim of Socialism - to benefit The Very Rich at the expense of the poor and the middle class.

With employee expenses and taxes currently being 50%-60% wouldn't that be a savings?

FYI: Nobody makes 2%-3% net profit. ALL corporations (even mine) are multi-tiered. The typical large grocery store chain has procurement, logistics, and transportation profits BEFORE the product hits the store which makes net closer to 20%.
 
The rich use more to the wear on our infrastructure. Why shouldn't they pay more to maintain what they use???

Honestly.

They do? How do they use more of our infrastructure than anybody else?

They buy more goods (roads), go on more vacations (FAA)


Distribution of Tax Expenditure Benefits Differs Greatly, and Is Much Less Favorable to the Middle Class and Low-Incomes Families



The top 1 percent of the population receives 23.9 percent of tax-expenditure benefits — more than eight times as much as the bottom fifth of the population
, and nearly as much as the middle 60 percent of the population.


Contrary to "Entitlement Society" Rhetoric, Over Nine-Tenths of Entitlement Benefits Go to Elderly, Disabled, or Working Households | Center on Budget and Policy Priorities

The top 1 percent of the population receives 23.9 percent of tax-expenditure benefits —

They paid nearly 40% of Federal Income Tax and received 23.9% of tax-expenditure benefits?
That's awful!
The bottom 20% received less than 3% of tax-expenditure benefits? While paying no income taxes?
That's even worse!!!


You MIGHT have something, IF the US collected only income taxes as revenues, since it's only about 45% of federal revenues, who give a fukkk?

The top 1 percent of the population receives 23.9 percent of tax-expenditure benefits — more than eight times as much as the bottom fifth of the population, and nearly as much as the middle 60 percent of the population.


Contrary to "Entitlement Society" Rhetoric, Over Nine-Tenths of Entitlement Benefits Go to Elderly, Disabled, or Working Households | Center on Budget and Policy Priorities

You MIGHT have something, IF the US collected only income taxes as revenues

You're whining about tax-expenditures and now you want to bring in other sources of revenue? LOL!
I accept your surrender.

Yep, BECAUSE the payroll trust funds weren't used ($3+ trillion) since Reaganomics to hide the real costs of tax cuts for the rich right?
 
I'd be happy to offer my perspective.
It is obvious that there is a problem that has been growing for decades, in regards to inequality, and it's not just in America.
20150817_Charts_2-2.png

20150817_Charts_3-1.png

"Despite huge advancements in technology and productivity, millions of Americans are working longer hours for lower wages. The real median income of male workers is $783 less than it was 42 years ago; while the real median income of female workers is over $1,300 less than it was in 2007. That is unacceptable and that has got to change."
20150817_Charts_4-1.png

AS PRESIDENT, SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS WILL REDUCE INCOME AND WEALTH INEQUALITY BY:


    • Demanding that the wealthy and large corporations pay their fair share in taxes. As President, Sen. Sanders will stop corporations from shifting their profits and jobs overseas to avoid paying U.S. income taxes. He will create a progressive estate tax on the top 0.3 percent of Americans who inherit more than $3.5 million. He will also enact a tax on Wall Street speculators who caused millions of Americans to lose their jobs, homes, and life savings.
    • Increasing the federal minimum wage from $7.25 to $15 an hour by 2020. In the year 2015, no one who works 40 hours a week should be living in poverty.
    • Putting at least 13 million Americans to work by investing $1 trillion over five years rebuilding our crumbling roads, bridges, railways, airports, public transit systems, ports, dams, wastewater plants, and other infrastructure needs.
    • Reversing trade policies like NAFTA, CAFTA, and PNTR with China that have driven down wages and caused the loss of millions of jobs. If corporate America wants us to buy their products they need to manufacture those products in this country, not in China or other low-wage countries.
    • Creating 1 million jobs for disadvantaged young Americans by investing $5.5 billion in a youth jobs program. Today, the youth unemployment rate is off the charts. We have got to end this tragedy by making sure teenagers and young adults have the jobs they need to move up the economic ladder.
    • Fighting for pay equity by signing the Paycheck Fairness Act into law. It is an outrage that women earn just 78 cents for every dollar a man earns.
    • Making tuition free at public colleges and universities throughout America. Everyone in this country who studies hard should be able to go to college regardless of income.
    • Expanding Social Security by lifting the cap on taxable income above $250,000. At a time when the senior poverty rate is going up, we have got to make sure that every American can retire with dignity and respect.
    • Guaranteeing healthcare as a right of citizenship by enacting a Medicare for all single-payer healthcare system. It’s time for the U.S. to join every major industrialized country on earth and provide universal healthcare to all.
    • Requiring employers to provide at least 12 weeks of paid family and medical leave; two weeks of paid vacation; and 7 days of paid sick days. Real family values are about making sure that parents have the time they need to bond with their babies and take care of their children and relatives when they get ill.
    • Enacting a universal childcare and prekindergarten program. Every psychologist understands that the most formative years for a human being is from the ages 0-4. We have got to make sure every family in America has the opportunity to send their kids to a high quality childcare and pre-K program.
    • Making it easier for workers to join unions by fighting for the Employee Free Choice Act. One of the most significant reasons for the 40-year decline in the middle class is that the rights of workers to collectively bargain for better wages and benefits have been severely undermined.
    • Breaking up huge financial institutions so that they are no longer too big to fail. Seven years ago, the taxpayers of this country bailed out Wall Street because they were too big to fail. Yet, 3 out of the 4 largest financial institutions are 80 percent bigger today than before we bailed them out. Sen. Sanders has introduced legislation to break these banks up. As President, he will fight to sign this legislation into law.


We've spent $19T on the War on Poverty, bub.

It's not a Coinkydink that the more we spend to fight poverty, the Richer the Socialist Cronies get.
 
I'd be happy to offer my perspective.
It is obvious that there is a problem that has been growing for decades, in regards to inequality, and it's not just in America.
20150817_Charts_2-2.png

20150817_Charts_3-1.png

"Despite huge advancements in technology and productivity, millions of Americans are working longer hours for lower wages. The real median income of male workers is $783 less than it was 42 years ago; while the real median income of female workers is over $1,300 less than it was in 2007. That is unacceptable and that has got to change."
20150817_Charts_4-1.png

AS PRESIDENT, SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS WILL REDUCE INCOME AND WEALTH INEQUALITY BY:


    • Demanding that the wealthy and large corporations pay their fair share in taxes. As President, Sen. Sanders will stop corporations from shifting their profits and jobs overseas to avoid paying U.S. income taxes. He will create a progressive estate tax on the top 0.3 percent of Americans who inherit more than $3.5 million. He will also enact a tax on Wall Street speculators who caused millions of Americans to lose their jobs, homes, and life savings.
    • Increasing the federal minimum wage from $7.25 to $15 an hour by 2020. In the year 2015, no one who works 40 hours a week should be living in poverty.
    • Putting at least 13 million Americans to work by investing $1 trillion over five years rebuilding our crumbling roads, bridges, railways, airports, public transit systems, ports, dams, wastewater plants, and other infrastructure needs.
    • Reversing trade policies like NAFTA, CAFTA, and PNTR with China that have driven down wages and caused the loss of millions of jobs. If corporate America wants us to buy their products they need to manufacture those products in this country, not in China or other low-wage countries.
    • Creating 1 million jobs for disadvantaged young Americans by investing $5.5 billion in a youth jobs program. Today, the youth unemployment rate is off the charts. We have got to end this tragedy by making sure teenagers and young adults have the jobs they need to move up the economic ladder.
    • Fighting for pay equity by signing the Paycheck Fairness Act into law. It is an outrage that women earn just 78 cents for every dollar a man earns.
    • Making tuition free at public colleges and universities throughout America. Everyone in this country who studies hard should be able to go to college regardless of income.
    • Expanding Social Security by lifting the cap on taxable income above $250,000. At a time when the senior poverty rate is going up, we have got to make sure that every American can retire with dignity and respect.
    • Guaranteeing healthcare as a right of citizenship by enacting a Medicare for all single-payer healthcare system. It’s time for the U.S. to join every major industrialized country on earth and provide universal healthcare to all.
    • Requiring employers to provide at least 12 weeks of paid family and medical leave; two weeks of paid vacation; and 7 days of paid sick days. Real family values are about making sure that parents have the time they need to bond with their babies and take care of their children and relatives when they get ill.
    • Enacting a universal childcare and prekindergarten program. Every psychologist understands that the most formative years for a human being is from the ages 0-4. We have got to make sure every family in America has the opportunity to send their kids to a high quality childcare and pre-K program.
    • Making it easier for workers to join unions by fighting for the Employee Free Choice Act. One of the most significant reasons for the 40-year decline in the middle class is that the rights of workers to collectively bargain for better wages and benefits have been severely undermined.
    • Breaking up huge financial institutions so that they are no longer too big to fail. Seven years ago, the taxpayers of this country bailed out Wall Street because they were too big to fail. Yet, 3 out of the 4 largest financial institutions are 80 percent bigger today than before we bailed them out. Sen. Sanders has introduced legislation to break these banks up. As President, he will fight to sign this legislation into law.


We've spent $19T on the War on Poverty, bub.

It's not a Coinkydink that the more we spend to fight poverty, the Richer the Socialist Cronies get.
And it has helped, without the war on poverty, the poor would be worse off.
https://courseworks.columbia.edu/ac...Papers for website/Anchored SPM.December7.pdf
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/10/us/food-stamp-program-helping-reduce-poverty.html?_r=0
Welfare programs shown to reduce poverty in America
Food Stamps Helped Reduce Poverty Rate, Study Finds - UC Davis Center for Poverty Research
 
One more time: The bottom 49% pay NOTHING towards our collective federal income tax burden yet have the same access to our infrastructure as those who do pay. How is that "fair?"

They don't have any money.

If you want that to change;

-Base Federal tax for corporations at 30% of revenue.

-Raise minimum wage to $23.50/hr. Based on where minimum wage should be using 1970-2015 rise in food, shelter, and transportation.

-Eliminate all business subsidies (deductions/write-offs/write-downs) except for employee expenses which are deducted dollar-for-dollar on all city, state, and Federal taxes and fees with the Feds refunding city, State, and fees.

-Companies with 500 employees or less, employee expenses above the deduction are subsidized at 100% with funds usually give back to the States.

-Adjust Social Security and private/public retirement and pension payments using 1970-2015 price structure.

-Remove the FICA limit.

-Back down ALL costs, prices, fees, to January 1, 2009 levels and hold them for 10 years which will eliminate inflation.

-Recall ALL off-shore investments tax free, and disallow any further off-shore investments.

-Make inversion illegal.


What a bunch of financially illiterate CRAP.

A 30% tax on corporate REVENUE? Grocery stores operate on 2-3% profit margins. So, either they increase prices 30% to cover this tax burden, or they go out of business. The neighborhoods most affected will be in POOR areas.

Your plan, quite ironically and likely intentionally, makes your Dreaded INEQUALITY worse. But that is the aim of Socialism - to benefit The Very Rich at the expense of the poor and the middle class.

With employee expenses and taxes currently being 50%-60% wouldn't that be a savings?

FYI: Nobody makes 2%-3% net profit. ALL corporations (even mine) are multi-tiered. The typical large grocery store chain has procurement, logistics, and transportation profits BEFORE the product hits the store which makes net closer to 20%.


B'loney. There are plenty of business which LOSE money, bub.

Whole Foods, which has Premium Pricing, last reported a 4% profit margin.

And without product hitting the stores, there are no profits as there is nothing to procure, "logistic" or transport, moron.
 
most of the richest Americans pay lower overall tax rates than middle-class Americans do.

It's weird that they don't give the income levels for the "richest" or "middle class" in their claim.
Why is that?


Go figure it out Bubs? lol;

Figure out the fake numbers your stupid source used? LOL!

Go figure you can't even use conservative "math" to figure it out. I'm shocked

Why would I bother trying to prove anything about the fake numbers the idiots pulled out of their asses?


AS opposed to your "beliefs" you pulled out of your ass?

What conservatives say — and why it’s wrong



Conservatives claim the wealthy are overtaxed. But the overall share of taxes paid by the top 1% and the top 5% is about their share of total income. This shows that the tax system is not progressive when it comes to the wealthy. The richest 1% pay an effective federal income tax rate of 24.7%. That is a little more than the 19.3% rate paid by someone making an average of $75,000. And 1 out of 5 millionaires pays a lower rate than someone making $50,000 to $100,000.

Conservatives claim that the estate tax is a “death tax,” wrongly implying that the tax is paid when every American dies. In fact, the tax primarily is paid by estates of multi-millionaires and billionaires. The vast majority of deaths — 99.9% — do not trigger estate taxes today


Fact Sheet: Taxing Wealthy Americans | Americans for Tax Fairness

The richest 1% pay an effective federal income tax rate of 24.7%. That is a little more than the 19.3% rate paid by someone making an average of $75,000.

24.7% is 28% more than 19.3%. Durr.
 
I'd be happy to offer my perspective.
It is obvious that there is a problem that has been growing for decades, in regards to inequality, and it's not just in America.
20150817_Charts_2-2.png

20150817_Charts_3-1.png

"Despite huge advancements in technology and productivity, millions of Americans are working longer hours for lower wages. The real median income of male workers is $783 less than it was 42 years ago; while the real median income of female workers is over $1,300 less than it was in 2007. That is unacceptable and that has got to change."
20150817_Charts_4-1.png

AS PRESIDENT, SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS WILL REDUCE INCOME AND WEALTH INEQUALITY BY:


    • Demanding that the wealthy and large corporations pay their fair share in taxes. As President, Sen. Sanders will stop corporations from shifting their profits and jobs overseas to avoid paying U.S. income taxes. He will create a progressive estate tax on the top 0.3 percent of Americans who inherit more than $3.5 million. He will also enact a tax on Wall Street speculators who caused millions of Americans to lose their jobs, homes, and life savings.
    • Increasing the federal minimum wage from $7.25 to $15 an hour by 2020. In the year 2015, no one who works 40 hours a week should be living in poverty.
    • Putting at least 13 million Americans to work by investing $1 trillion over five years rebuilding our crumbling roads, bridges, railways, airports, public transit systems, ports, dams, wastewater plants, and other infrastructure needs.
    • Reversing trade policies like NAFTA, CAFTA, and PNTR with China that have driven down wages and caused the loss of millions of jobs. If corporate America wants us to buy their products they need to manufacture those products in this country, not in China or other low-wage countries.
    • Creating 1 million jobs for disadvantaged young Americans by investing $5.5 billion in a youth jobs program. Today, the youth unemployment rate is off the charts. We have got to end this tragedy by making sure teenagers and young adults have the jobs they need to move up the economic ladder.
    • Fighting for pay equity by signing the Paycheck Fairness Act into law. It is an outrage that women earn just 78 cents for every dollar a man earns.
    • Making tuition free at public colleges and universities throughout America. Everyone in this country who studies hard should be able to go to college regardless of income.
    • Expanding Social Security by lifting the cap on taxable income above $250,000. At a time when the senior poverty rate is going up, we have got to make sure that every American can retire with dignity and respect.
    • Guaranteeing healthcare as a right of citizenship by enacting a Medicare for all single-payer healthcare system. It’s time for the U.S. to join every major industrialized country on earth and provide universal healthcare to all.
    • Requiring employers to provide at least 12 weeks of paid family and medical leave; two weeks of paid vacation; and 7 days of paid sick days. Real family values are about making sure that parents have the time they need to bond with their babies and take care of their children and relatives when they get ill.
    • Enacting a universal childcare and prekindergarten program. Every psychologist understands that the most formative years for a human being is from the ages 0-4. We have got to make sure every family in America has the opportunity to send their kids to a high quality childcare and pre-K program.
    • Making it easier for workers to join unions by fighting for the Employee Free Choice Act. One of the most significant reasons for the 40-year decline in the middle class is that the rights of workers to collectively bargain for better wages and benefits have been severely undermined.
    • Breaking up huge financial institutions so that they are no longer too big to fail. Seven years ago, the taxpayers of this country bailed out Wall Street because they were too big to fail. Yet, 3 out of the 4 largest financial institutions are 80 percent bigger today than before we bailed them out. Sen. Sanders has introduced legislation to break these banks up. As President, he will fight to sign this legislation into law.


We've spent $19T on the War on Poverty, bub.

It's not a Coinkydink that the more we spend to fight poverty, the Richer the Socialist Cronies get.
And it has helped, without the war on poverty, the poor would be worse off.
https://courseworks.columbia.edu/access/content/group/c5a1ef92-c03c-4d88-0018-ea43dd3cc5db/Working Papers for website/Anchored SPM.December7.pdf
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/10/us/food-stamp-program-helping-reduce-poverty.html?_r=0
Welfare programs shown to reduce poverty in America
Food Stamps Helped Reduce Poverty Rate, Study Finds - UC Davis Center for Poverty Research


Absolute Closed Loop Logic Poppycock.

As we haven't tried real Free Market Capitalism for a very long time, you have no idea what the opportunity cost of excessive government has wrought.

I'll refer you to Bastiat, although it's rather optimistic of me to think you might grok him.

That Which is Seen, and That Which is Not Seen; by Frederic Bastiat
 
Go figure it out Bubs? lol;

Figure out the fake numbers your stupid source used? LOL!

Go figure you can't even use conservative "math" to figure it out. I'm shocked

Why would I bother trying to prove anything about the fake numbers the idiots pulled out of their asses?


AS opposed to your "beliefs" you pulled out of your ass?

What conservatives say — and why it’s wrong



Conservatives claim the wealthy are overtaxed. But the overall share of taxes paid by the top 1% and the top 5% is about their share of total income. This shows that the tax system is not progressive when it comes to the wealthy. The richest 1% pay an effective federal income tax rate of 24.7%. That is a little more than the 19.3% rate paid by someone making an average of $75,000. And 1 out of 5 millionaires pays a lower rate than someone making $50,000 to $100,000.

Conservatives claim that the estate tax is a “death tax,” wrongly implying that the tax is paid when every American dies. In fact, the tax primarily is paid by estates of multi-millionaires and billionaires. The vast majority of deaths — 99.9% — do not trigger estate taxes today


Fact Sheet: Taxing Wealthy Americans | Americans for Tax Fairness

The richest 1% pay an effective federal income tax rate of 24.7%. That is a little more than the 19.3% rate paid by someone making an average of $75,000.

24.7% is 28% more than 19.3%. Durr.
?...
 
Go figure it out Bubs? lol;

Figure out the fake numbers your stupid source used? LOL!

Go figure you can't even use conservative "math" to figure it out. I'm shocked

Why would I bother trying to prove anything about the fake numbers the idiots pulled out of their asses?


AS opposed to your "beliefs" you pulled out of your ass?

What conservatives say — and why it’s wrong



Conservatives claim the wealthy are overtaxed. But the overall share of taxes paid by the top 1% and the top 5% is about their share of total income. This shows that the tax system is not progressive when it comes to the wealthy. The richest 1% pay an effective federal income tax rate of 24.7%. That is a little more than the 19.3% rate paid by someone making an average of $75,000. And 1 out of 5 millionaires pays a lower rate than someone making $50,000 to $100,000.

Conservatives claim that the estate tax is a “death tax,” wrongly implying that the tax is paid when every American dies. In fact, the tax primarily is paid by estates of multi-millionaires and billionaires. The vast majority of deaths — 99.9% — do not trigger estate taxes today


Fact Sheet: Taxing Wealthy Americans | Americans for Tax Fairness

The richest 1% pay an effective federal income tax rate of 24.7%. That is a little more than the 19.3% rate paid by someone making an average of $75,000.

24.7% is 28% more than 19.3%. Durr.



But but but...because EQUALITY!
 
AFTER Ronnie increased them and "simplified" the tax code according to you? lol


Capital Gains Tax Cuts ‘By Far’ The Biggest Contributor To Growth In Income Inequality, Study Finds



By far, the largest contributor to this increase was changes in income from capital gains and dividends. Changes in wages had an equalizing effect over this period as did changes in taxes. Most of the equalizing effect of taxes took place after the 1993 tax hike; most of the equalizing effect, however, was reversed after the 2001 and 2003 Bush-era tax cuts. […]

The large increase in the contribution of capital gains and dividends to the Gini coefficient, however, is due to the large increase in the share of after-tax income from capital gains and dividends, and to the increase in the correlation of this income source with after-tax income.

Hungerford’s findings are similar to a study he produced for the Congressional Research Service in 2011, which found that while income grew 25 percent from 1996 to 2006 for all Americans, it grew 74 percent for the top 1 percent and 96 percent for the top 0.1 percent. That study also found that tax cuts on capital gains were the biggest driver of the disparity.

Really? Then why did lowering the capital gains rates work so well for Bill Clinton? You know, the best economy in our lives?


work so well? Oh you meant take revenues from the treasury?

work so well? Oh you meant take revenues from the treasury?

What was government capital gains revenue at 28%? At 20%?
Less at 20% than 28% would've, according to EVERY serious economist at least!

So the revenue increased, even though the rate went down. It actually added revenue to the Treasury.

I'm glad you were able to admit your error.

Keep TRYING Bubba


Tax Foundation's Prante: "A Stretch" To Claim "Cutting Capital Gains Taxes Raises Tax Revenues."

Bush CEA Chair Mankiw: Claim That Broad-Based Income Tax Cuts Increase Revenue Is Not "Credible," Capital Income Tax Cuts Also Don't Pay For Themselves

Bush-Appointed Federal Reserve Chair Bernanke: "I Don't Think That As A General Rule Tax Cuts Pay For Themselves."


Conservative Economist Holtz-Eakin: "No Serious Research Evidence" Suggests Tax Cuts Pay For Themselves."



The supply-side theory that tax-cut proponents often espouse was demonstrated by the Laffer curve, named for economist Arthur B. Laffer. The curve suggests that a higher tax rate can generate just as much revenue as a lower rate. But most economists are not Laffer-curve purists. Instead, while they may believe in the power of tax cuts to create an economic boost, they don’t say that growth is enough to completely make up for lost revenue. For example, N. Gregory Mankiw, former chair of the current President Bush’s Council of Economic Advisers, calculated that the growth spurred by capital gains tax cuts pays for about half of lost revenue over a number of years and that payroll tax cuts generate enough growth to pay for about 17 percent of what is lost.

The Impact of Tax Cuts
 
Romney paid 1.94 million in taxes…he paid more than his fair share……did you pay 1.94 million in taxes asshole?
See everyone? I told you all that Republicans, if given the chance, would make the argument that a rich guy shouldn't pay any more taxes than a poor man. I KNEW IT!

That doesn't work stupid. And the guy who got rich didn't get rich in the utopia you dream of. In fact he would have NEVER gotten rich under your system of fairness and equality. You are a stupid fuck.


the richest got richer on your Progressive watch stupid.....................and they passed on their tax hikes to the poor in the form of higher prices for goods and services. great job leftard!!

For some inexplicable reason leftists just don't (or can't) understand that taxes on business are simply passed along to the consumer in the form of higher prices for goods and services and that much like sales taxes they place an inordinate burden on the poorer consumer.
So pass them on! If the economy is booming we can all afford it.

Wait ... so now that you understand that biz taxes are treated by businesses as sales taxes - to be collected from the consumer and passed on to the gov't - and knowing that those taxes hit the poor disproportionately, you still want them? I'm good with that but you will have to stop whining about the disproportionality and must spank every loony leftist who continues to do so.
Dayam ... and all this time I thought you guys were concerned about the plight of the poor. Woo. My bad.
What products are you referring to? Cable TV? The gov. Passed a law the major broadcasters have to provide free TV. So I bought an antenna now I get all the basics free.

What products are so important?

You know what? I'm not going to get into a pissing match with you period kit for cat a back and forth over your stupid little questions. All this can be very easily regulated by a government that looks out for we the people and not the corporations over the people. And if you're talking about necessities like gas which even that isn't a necessity but electricity and health care and food companies can get tax breaks. I'd go into it but I doubt I'd make a dent so why bother.

Dumb Republicans burn me out after awhile. I spent the 90's explaining this stuff. I've spent 35 years explaining. Yet here you are making the same circular BAD arguments you were making 35 years ago.

And when we explain you'll just move on to another right wing talking point. Eventually you'll circle the fuck around and make this bad argument again. I'm done.
 
I'd be happy to offer my perspective.
It is obvious that there is a problem that has been growing for decades, in regards to inequality, and it's not just in America.
20150817_Charts_2-2.png

20150817_Charts_3-1.png

"Despite huge advancements in technology and productivity, millions of Americans are working longer hours for lower wages. The real median income of male workers is $783 less than it was 42 years ago; while the real median income of female workers is over $1,300 less than it was in 2007. That is unacceptable and that has got to change."
20150817_Charts_4-1.png

AS PRESIDENT, SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS WILL REDUCE INCOME AND WEALTH INEQUALITY BY:


    • Demanding that the wealthy and large corporations pay their fair share in taxes. As President, Sen. Sanders will stop corporations from shifting their profits and jobs overseas to avoid paying U.S. income taxes. He will create a progressive estate tax on the top 0.3 percent of Americans who inherit more than $3.5 million. He will also enact a tax on Wall Street speculators who caused millions of Americans to lose their jobs, homes, and life savings.
    • Increasing the federal minimum wage from $7.25 to $15 an hour by 2020. In the year 2015, no one who works 40 hours a week should be living in poverty.
    • Putting at least 13 million Americans to work by investing $1 trillion over five years rebuilding our crumbling roads, bridges, railways, airports, public transit systems, ports, dams, wastewater plants, and other infrastructure needs.
    • Reversing trade policies like NAFTA, CAFTA, and PNTR with China that have driven down wages and caused the loss of millions of jobs. If corporate America wants us to buy their products they need to manufacture those products in this country, not in China or other low-wage countries.
    • Creating 1 million jobs for disadvantaged young Americans by investing $5.5 billion in a youth jobs program. Today, the youth unemployment rate is off the charts. We have got to end this tragedy by making sure teenagers and young adults have the jobs they need to move up the economic ladder.
    • Fighting for pay equity by signing the Paycheck Fairness Act into law. It is an outrage that women earn just 78 cents for every dollar a man earns.
    • Making tuition free at public colleges and universities throughout America. Everyone in this country who studies hard should be able to go to college regardless of income.
    • Expanding Social Security by lifting the cap on taxable income above $250,000. At a time when the senior poverty rate is going up, we have got to make sure that every American can retire with dignity and respect.
    • Guaranteeing healthcare as a right of citizenship by enacting a Medicare for all single-payer healthcare system. It’s time for the U.S. to join every major industrialized country on earth and provide universal healthcare to all.
    • Requiring employers to provide at least 12 weeks of paid family and medical leave; two weeks of paid vacation; and 7 days of paid sick days. Real family values are about making sure that parents have the time they need to bond with their babies and take care of their children and relatives when they get ill.
    • Enacting a universal childcare and prekindergarten program. Every psychologist understands that the most formative years for a human being is from the ages 0-4. We have got to make sure every family in America has the opportunity to send their kids to a high quality childcare and pre-K program.
    • Making it easier for workers to join unions by fighting for the Employee Free Choice Act. One of the most significant reasons for the 40-year decline in the middle class is that the rights of workers to collectively bargain for better wages and benefits have been severely undermined.
    • Breaking up huge financial institutions so that they are no longer too big to fail. Seven years ago, the taxpayers of this country bailed out Wall Street because they were too big to fail. Yet, 3 out of the 4 largest financial institutions are 80 percent bigger today than before we bailed them out. Sen. Sanders has introduced legislation to break these banks up. As President, he will fight to sign this legislation into law.


We've spent $19T on the War on Poverty, bub.

It's not a Coinkydink that the more we spend to fight poverty, the Richer the Socialist Cronies get.
And it has helped, without the war on poverty, the poor would be worse off.
https://courseworks.columbia.edu/access/content/group/c5a1ef92-c03c-4d88-0018-ea43dd3cc5db/Working Papers for website/Anchored SPM.December7.pdf
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/10/us/food-stamp-program-helping-reduce-poverty.html?_r=0
Welfare programs shown to reduce poverty in America
Food Stamps Helped Reduce Poverty Rate, Study Finds - UC Davis Center for Poverty Research


Absolute Closed Loop Logic Poppycock.

As we haven't tried real Free Market Capitalism for a very long time, you have no idea what the opportunity cost of excessive government has wrought.

I'll refer you to Bastiat, although it's rather optimistic of me to think you might grok him.

That Which is Seen, and That Which is Not Seen; by Frederic Bastiat
Sorry that the facts suck, all around the world, with the beginning of capitalism in europe after the overthrow of feudalism, the regulation free capitalist society in America.. a "free market" failed, monopolies occurred, capitalists influenced the state to benefit themselves, child labor was rampant, seniors were fucked unless they had a family, wages were low, labor unions were attacked.. It has failed everywhere, and led to regulations, state intervention. The cost of excessive government? The war on poverty needed to happen, and must continue to happen, the poor would just be worse off without it.
 
I'd be happy to offer my perspective.
It is obvious that there is a problem that has been growing for decades, in regards to inequality, and it's not just in America.
20150817_Charts_2-2.png

20150817_Charts_3-1.png

"Despite huge advancements in technology and productivity, millions of Americans are working longer hours for lower wages. The real median income of male workers is $783 less than it was 42 years ago; while the real median income of female workers is over $1,300 less than it was in 2007. That is unacceptable and that has got to change."
20150817_Charts_4-1.png

AS PRESIDENT, SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS WILL REDUCE INCOME AND WEALTH INEQUALITY BY:


    • Demanding that the wealthy and large corporations pay their fair share in taxes. As President, Sen. Sanders will stop corporations from shifting their profits and jobs overseas to avoid paying U.S. income taxes. He will create a progressive estate tax on the top 0.3 percent of Americans who inherit more than $3.5 million. He will also enact a tax on Wall Street speculators who caused millions of Americans to lose their jobs, homes, and life savings.
    • Increasing the federal minimum wage from $7.25 to $15 an hour by 2020. In the year 2015, no one who works 40 hours a week should be living in poverty.
    • Putting at least 13 million Americans to work by investing $1 trillion over five years rebuilding our crumbling roads, bridges, railways, airports, public transit systems, ports, dams, wastewater plants, and other infrastructure needs.
    • Reversing trade policies like NAFTA, CAFTA, and PNTR with China that have driven down wages and caused the loss of millions of jobs. If corporate America wants us to buy their products they need to manufacture those products in this country, not in China or other low-wage countries.
    • Creating 1 million jobs for disadvantaged young Americans by investing $5.5 billion in a youth jobs program. Today, the youth unemployment rate is off the charts. We have got to end this tragedy by making sure teenagers and young adults have the jobs they need to move up the economic ladder.
    • Fighting for pay equity by signing the Paycheck Fairness Act into law. It is an outrage that women earn just 78 cents for every dollar a man earns.
    • Making tuition free at public colleges and universities throughout America. Everyone in this country who studies hard should be able to go to college regardless of income.
    • Expanding Social Security by lifting the cap on taxable income above $250,000. At a time when the senior poverty rate is going up, we have got to make sure that every American can retire with dignity and respect.
    • Guaranteeing healthcare as a right of citizenship by enacting a Medicare for all single-payer healthcare system. It’s time for the U.S. to join every major industrialized country on earth and provide universal healthcare to all.
    • Requiring employers to provide at least 12 weeks of paid family and medical leave; two weeks of paid vacation; and 7 days of paid sick days. Real family values are about making sure that parents have the time they need to bond with their babies and take care of their children and relatives when they get ill.
    • Enacting a universal childcare and prekindergarten program. Every psychologist understands that the most formative years for a human being is from the ages 0-4. We have got to make sure every family in America has the opportunity to send their kids to a high quality childcare and pre-K program.
    • Making it easier for workers to join unions by fighting for the Employee Free Choice Act. One of the most significant reasons for the 40-year decline in the middle class is that the rights of workers to collectively bargain for better wages and benefits have been severely undermined.
    • Breaking up huge financial institutions so that they are no longer too big to fail. Seven years ago, the taxpayers of this country bailed out Wall Street because they were too big to fail. Yet, 3 out of the 4 largest financial institutions are 80 percent bigger today than before we bailed them out. Sen. Sanders has introduced legislation to break these banks up. As President, he will fight to sign this legislation into law.


We've spent $19T on the War on Poverty, bub.

It's not a Coinkydink that the more we spend to fight poverty, the Richer the Socialist Cronies get.
And it has helped, without the war on poverty, the poor would be worse off.
https://courseworks.columbia.edu/access/content/group/c5a1ef92-c03c-4d88-0018-ea43dd3cc5db/Working Papers for website/Anchored SPM.December7.pdf
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/10/us/food-stamp-program-helping-reduce-poverty.html?_r=0
Welfare programs shown to reduce poverty in America
Food Stamps Helped Reduce Poverty Rate, Study Finds - UC Davis Center for Poverty Research


Absolute Closed Loop Logic Poppycock.

As we haven't tried real Free Market Capitalism for a very long time, you have no idea what the opportunity cost of excessive government has wrought.

I'll refer you to Bastiat, although it's rather optimistic of me to think you might grok him.

That Which is Seen, and That Which is Not Seen; by Frederic Bastiat
Sorry that the facts suck, all around the world, with the beginning of capitalism in europe after the overthrow of feudalism, the regulation free capitalist society in America.. a "free market" failed, monopolies occurred, capitalists influenced the state to benefit themselves, child labor was rampant, seniors were fucked unless they had a family, wages were low, labor unions were attacked.. It has failed everywhere, and led to regulations, state intervention. The cost of excessive government? The war on poverty needed to happen, and must continue to happen, the poor would just be worse off without it.


Condolences on your complete and utter historical illiteracy.

Here's some homework. Get back to me when someone intelligent reads it out loud to you and explains the cause and effect relationships to you. See you in 2037!

http://www.amazon.com/Why-Nations-F...r=8-1&keywords=why+nations+fail&tag=ff0d01-20
 
I'd be happy to offer my perspective.
It is obvious that there is a problem that has been growing for decades, in regards to inequality, and it's not just in America.
20150817_Charts_2-2.png

20150817_Charts_3-1.png

"Despite huge advancements in technology and productivity, millions of Americans are working longer hours for lower wages. The real median income of male workers is $783 less than it was 42 years ago; while the real median income of female workers is over $1,300 less than it was in 2007. That is unacceptable and that has got to change."
20150817_Charts_4-1.png


We've spent $19T on the War on Poverty, bub.

It's not a Coinkydink that the more we spend to fight poverty, the Richer the Socialist Cronies get.
And it has helped, without the war on poverty, the poor would be worse off.
https://courseworks.columbia.edu/access/content/group/c5a1ef92-c03c-4d88-0018-ea43dd3cc5db/Working Papers for website/Anchored SPM.December7.pdf
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/10/us/food-stamp-program-helping-reduce-poverty.html?_r=0
Welfare programs shown to reduce poverty in America
Food Stamps Helped Reduce Poverty Rate, Study Finds - UC Davis Center for Poverty Research


Absolute Closed Loop Logic Poppycock.

As we haven't tried real Free Market Capitalism for a very long time, you have no idea what the opportunity cost of excessive government has wrought.

I'll refer you to Bastiat, although it's rather optimistic of me to think you might grok him.

That Which is Seen, and That Which is Not Seen; by Frederic Bastiat
Sorry that the facts suck, all around the world, with the beginning of capitalism in europe after the overthrow of feudalism, the regulation free capitalist society in America.. a "free market" failed, monopolies occurred, capitalists influenced the state to benefit themselves, child labor was rampant, seniors were fucked unless they had a family, wages were low, labor unions were attacked.. It has failed everywhere, and led to regulations, state intervention. The cost of excessive government? The war on poverty needed to happen, and must continue to happen, the poor would just be worse off without it.


Condolences on your complete and utter historical illiteracy.

Here's some homework. Get back to me when someone intelligent reads it out loud to you and explains the cause and effect relationships to you. See you in 2037!

http://www.amazon.com/Why-Nations-F...r=8-1&keywords=why+nations+fail&tag=ff0d01-20
That books description claims south korea is an example of some sort of "free market"
LOL.
Ok, sure.
 
Wait ... you're saying people pay taxes willingly, even eagerly, free from threat of draconian gov't sanctions enforced at gunpoint? Really?
Stop lying.

Shouldn't you pay taxes to support your own way. Everyone pays taxes.

Yes, everyone pays taxes, just not income taxes where all the goodies come from.

Where did the trust funds, raided to the tune of $3+ trillion the past 30 years go then????

What trust funds do you speak of? You mean Social Security? Social Security is a prime example of government rip-off. This year I had a family member pass away, a close friend, and last year, my neighbor. All died under the age which they could collect Social Security. What happened to all that money they (and their employers) contributed to this fund?


It's a PAY AS YOU GO SYSTEM (of course Ronnie increase SS taxes in 1986 to "save SS" BUT USED THE EXTRA REVENUES TO FUND GOV'T THE NEXT 30 YEARS. Weird you don't get that!
 
For some inexplicable reason leftists just don't (or can't) understand that taxes on business are simply passed along to the consumer in the form of higher prices for goods and services and that much like sales taxes they place an inordinate burden on the poorer consumer.


Weird, the rich can't get a smaller ROI?

And that's another concept our loony lefties just can't (or won't) grasp ... the fact that not all (or even most) biz owners (you know, those who collect biz taxes from consumers and pass them along to the gov't) are rich. To any sane biz owner, taxes are just another COGS to be figured into the price of their products and services but allow me to suggest that YOU establish a biz and give most (or even all) of YOUR proceeds to your employees, customers and the gov't. After all, that is why people start businesses, right?
:lmao:

Yet for 30+ years CONservatives/GOP policy has been written to benefit the plutocrat class over small Biz, go figure!
For 30 years we told them their policies would grow the gap between the rich and poor and they didn't care. They said let the free market decide.

NOW they acknowledge the gap and that its a problem, but they blame Democrats.

I hate Republicans.

Whoa, Princess! Not 10 minutes ago you posted your approval of biz taxes despite knowledge of the fact that they are treated as COGS and passed on to consumers, disproportionately hurting the poor just as sales taxes do. Now you are complaining about the income/wealth gap which is widened by the very biz taxes of which you just approved. The level of hypocrisy among this board's loony lefties is surpassed only by their monumental stupidity.
And if you do what Ford and gm do you pay all the workers well enough to be able to afford to fix the economy. Maybe instead of CEO pay going up 600% you share some of those profits with the workers of America.

Walmart just gave all their employees a raise. That's gonna hurt profits and the Walton's but not consumers. If Walton charges too much Kroger and neither kick Walton's ass.

You think so small.
 
Weird, the rich can't get a smaller ROI?

And that's another concept our loony lefties just can't (or won't) grasp ... the fact that not all (or even most) biz owners (you know, those who collect biz taxes from consumers and pass them along to the gov't) are rich. To any sane biz owner, taxes are just another COGS to be figured into the price of their products and services but allow me to suggest that YOU establish a biz and give most (or even all) of YOUR proceeds to your employees, customers and the gov't. After all, that is why people start businesses, right?
:lmao:

Yet for 30+ years CONservatives/GOP policy has been written to benefit the plutocrat class over small Biz, go figure!
For 30 years we told them their policies would grow the gap between the rich and poor and they didn't care. They said let the free market decide.

NOW they acknowledge the gap and that its a problem, but they blame Democrats.

I hate Republicans.

Whoa, Princess! Not 10 minutes ago you posted your approval of biz taxes despite knowledge of the fact that they are treated as COGS and passed on to consumers, disproportionately hurting the poor just as sales taxes do. Now you are complaining about the income/wealth gap which is widened by the very biz taxes of which you just approved. The level of hypocrisy among this board's loony lefties is surpassed only by their monumental stupidity.
And if you do what Ford and gm do you pay all the workers well enough to be able to afford to fix the economy. Maybe instead of CEO pay going up 600% you share some of those profits with the workers of America.

Walmart just gave all their employees a raise. That's gonna hurt profits and the Walton's but not consumers. If Walton charges too much Kroger and neither kick Walton's ass.

You think so small.

you complete idiot; if you divvied up the corporate compensation of every CEO across all the workers they'd get like a 38 cent raise

you think so small
 
most of the richest Americans pay lower overall tax rates than middle-class Americans do.

It's weird that they don't give the income levels for the "richest" or "middle class" in their claim.
Why is that?


Go figure it out Bubs? lol;

Figure out the fake numbers your stupid source used? LOL!

Go figure you can't even use conservative "math" to figure it out. I'm shocked

Why would I bother trying to prove anything about the fake numbers the idiots pulled out of their asses?


The fortunate 400: David Cay Johnston


Six American families paid no federal income taxes in 2009 while making something on the order of $200 million each.



In addition to the six who paid no tax, another 110 families paid 15 percent or less in federal income taxes.
That's the same federal tax rate as a single worker who made $61,500 in 2009.

Overall, the top 400 paid an average income tax rate of 19.9 percent, the same rate paid by a single worker who made $110,000 in 2009. The top 400 earned five times that much every day.

Just 82 of the top 400 were taxed in accord with the Buffett rule, which proposes a minimum tax of 30 percent on annual incomes greater than $1 million.

The fortunate 400: David Cay Johnston

Six American families paid no federal income taxes in 2009 while making something on the order of $200 million each.

But what was their taxable income in 2009?
 


Stop talking about yourself!!! you're the one kissing the rich mans ass over his own country.
BS.............I've stated that the tax system should be simplified....................Just to shut people like you up............You wouldn't be able to complain about loop holes.......................They'd be gone................

Our problem is we are spending more than we take in.................In to debt up to our asses...................and refuse to make the necessary cuts to ensure the dollars future and standard of living's future for the next generation. How does devaluating the dollar help anyone....................

Raising taxes when the investors can haul ass to other countries isn't the right strategy as well.................They don't have to stay here and they are leaving..................taxing the shit out of them doesn't create the jobs to keep our middle class alive...................The examples of California and Detroit being prime examples.........................

So..............LA LA LA LA................


MORE right wing garbage. MY GENERATION, bought into Reagan's BS putting things on the credit card AS he gutted revenues. Carter had US at nearly 20% of GDP, Ronnie cut it to 17%+. CLINTON GOT US back to 20% AND THEN DUBYA/GOP GUTTED IT TO LESS THAN 15% OF GDP (KOREAN WAR LEVELS!!!)


IT'S A REVENUE PROBLEM FOR 30+ YEARS!!!

Conflating a state (MY STATE, CALI IS DOING GREAT AFTER KICKING THE GOP GUV OUT) with a city? lol
 

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