Taxing The Rich

[Brain357]

Exactly right. The "rich" in the eyes of the Democrats are the working wealthy, not the multi-billionaire elitists. The reason Gates and Bezos are Democrats and push a globalist agenda is because they will be the ones getting all the spoils in such a scheme. They want to punish the working successful folks to a point where they are right in line with the rest of the peasants. They then have us exactly where they want us all...dependent upon them.

There is a theory out there that Democrats absolutely despise, it's called Cause and Effect.

What they don't understand is that when you tax the rich man, you actually have to pay for those taxes. If the rich guy owns a business, he may freeze pay raises, have his employees pay a larger share of their healthcare insurance bill, increases the costs of the services or products he provides, invest in automation to replace humans to recoup that loss.

Sure and the giant tax cuts brought down the prices of everything? You have some imagination...

 

[Maxdeath]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

 

[kaz]

The Democrat plans to tax the rich are futile and ignorant. They sound good to the uneducated, but they don't work very well. When you raise tax rates or reduce deductions on the rich, their typical response is to divert more of their money into tax shelters where they pay less tax. They can afford tax lawyers and CPAs who find ways to reduce their taxes dramatically and it's all legal.

Donald Trump knows how. For several years at a time, he paid no income tax. I don't know all the shelters he used but I can guess. One would be accelerated depreciation on the buildings and furniture he owns. Another would be Net Loss Carryover. When you have a loss in one year, the IRS Code allows you to deduct that loss on the returns for following years. If the NLC is large enough, it can give you zero tax liability for 5 or 6 years. Even people of moderate income can use tax shelters. I have 2 of them.

If you don't try and target the rich, they will pay a fair share of taxes just like everybody else. If you target them with high tax rates, they run for tax shelters.

"If you want more of something, subsidize it. If you want less of something, tax it."
Ronald Reagan

How does taxing the rich any more help one person in this forum? How does it help one person anywhere? All it does is give money to government for them to waste. The problem is not revenue income, it's spending. Look at this so-called stimulus bill for instance. They've been bickering about it for months now. Did anybody die because of it? Would it really save the lives of some Americans? No. 2 trillion dollars we didn't spend yet, and everybody is surviving.

Democrats subscribe to the fixed pie theory.

They think there is a certain amount of money. So if they take more money from the rich, then everyone else will somehow have that money.

That is of course retarded. The pie is not fixed and they are shrinking it. The rich and they both have less pie from Democrat policies.

Winston Churchill: The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal distribution of blessings. The inherent virtue of socialism is the equal distribution of misery

 

[kaz]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

Yep. When you increase the minimum wage, you increase everyone else's wages because minimum wage by definition goes to the lowest value employees. So you have to pay the others proportionately more.

Then their companies raise prices and it all balances out again. Then a Democrat raises their hand and says I have an idea, let's increase the minimum wage ...

The problem is that's best case for low end workers, that it just doesn't work. The reality is that businesses constantly use those increased costs to streamline, optimize and automate processes. Which results in fewer low end jobs.

The low end workers are actually the victims of minimum wage increases. Democrats of course don't care, it was never about helping anyone. They want them to be poor so they stay Democrats

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Democrats subscribe to the fixed pie theory.

They think there is a certain amount of money. So if they take more money from the rich, then everyone else will somehow have that money.

That is of course retarded. The pie is not fixed and they are shrinking it. The rich and they both have less pie from Democrat policies.

Winston Churchill: The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal distribution of blessings. The inherent virtue of socialism is the equal distribution of misery

Absolutely correct. If our economy was finite with only so much money, what would happen is that if I applied for a car loan, the bank would tell me they'd love to give me one, but they can't because the rich have all the money. Or if I asked my employer for a raise, he would tell me the same thing.

In this wonderful and free country of ours, money is limitless. You can make as much or as little as you desire unless you have mental or physical disabilities. You can choose to buy that new iPhone, or you can get a much cheaper phone and put the remaining money in investments.

What I have found throughout the years is that most people with wealth envy never risked a dime in their life. They work, get a paycheck, complain that it isn't enough, but never try to make any money for themselves. Sure, they may own a house that will appreciate in value, maybe have an IRA at work or something, but that's as close to investments as they'll ever get.

 

[kaz]

Democrats subscribe to the fixed pie theory.

They think there is a certain amount of money. So if they take more money from the rich, then everyone else will somehow have that money.

That is of course retarded. The pie is not fixed and they are shrinking it. The rich and they both have less pie from Democrat policies.

Winston Churchill: The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal distribution of blessings. The inherent virtue of socialism is the equal distribution of misery

Absolutely correct. If our economy was finite with only so much money, what would happen is that if I applied for a car loan, the bank would tell me they'd love to give me one, but they can't because the rich have all the money. Or if I asked my employer for a raise, he would tell me the same thing.

In this wonderful and free country of ours, money is limitless. You can make as much or as little as you desire unless you have mental or physical disabilities. You can choose to buy that new iPhone, or you can get a much cheaper phone and put the remaining money in investments.

What I have found throughout the years is that most people with wealth envy never risked a dime in their life. They work, get a paycheck, complain that it isn't enough, but never try to make any money for themselves. Sure, they may own a house that will appreciate in value, maybe have an IRA at work or something, but that's as close to investments as they'll ever get.

Brainless doesn't get it, LOL

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Sure and the giant tax cuts brought down the prices of everything? You have some imagination...

It may have helped keep jobs in the country. It was responsible for people getting pay increases and a new high in median household income.

I have more than some people. Others have more than I do. I'm sure you're no different. Would it be fair that government take money from you to give to somebody that has less? After all, if you rob Peter to pay Paul, the Paul's of your society generally have no objection.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Not taxing them isn’t working either. We can’t borrow forever.

Correct. However the people who don't have to pay the bill could care less about our deficit or debt. That's why everybody needs to pay. If we all had to pay, people would elect more frugal representatives instead of loading these spending bills with pork and returned favors.

 

[gipper]

Not taxing them isn’t working either. We can’t borrow forever.

While that’s an issue, the much bigger issue is the ultra wealthy buy all sorts of benefits from government. They get what they want and it is almost always at the detriment of the rest of us.

A good example is around 70% of Americans, including many enlightened republicans, want Medicare for All. However, since the ultra wealthy don’t want this, it doesn’t happen.

 

[kaz]

Not taxing them isn’t working either. We can’t borrow forever.

Correct. However the people who don't have to pay the bill could care less about our deficit or debt. That's why everybody needs to pay. If we all had to pay, people would elect more frugal representatives instead of loading these spending bills with pork and returned favors.

You're totally right that they think that. The problem is that they don't realize they are paying for it. Taxes are baked into the price of the products we buy. People like brainless don't understand that. Low end workers lose their jobs when government sticks their employers with too much cost. Government importing illegals costs the poor even more jobs and drives down their wages.

When the poor think they are voting for Democrats out of their own interest, they are actually voting for the shit to roll down the hill, and they are the ones furthest down the hill

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Not taxing them isn’t working either. We can’t borrow forever.

While that’s an issue, the much bigger issue is the ultra wealthy buy all sorts of benefits from government. They get what they want and it is almost always at the detriment of the rest of us.

A good example is around 70% of Americans, including many enlightened republicans, want Medicare for All. However, since the ultra wealthy don’t want this, it doesn’t happen.

I'm not wealthy and I don't want it.

Government has been looking to control the people forever. They've been somewhat successful. The only two vestiges stopping them from total control over us are healthcare and energy. Once government controls those two things, they have the ability to to totally control our lives from birth to death.

 

[gipper]

Not taxing them isn’t working either. We can’t borrow forever.

While that’s an issue, the much bigger issue is the ultra wealthy buy all sorts of benefits from government. They get what they want and it is almost always at the detriment of the rest of us.

A good example is around 70% of Americans, including many enlightened republicans, want Medicare for All. However, since the ultra wealthy don’t want this, it doesn’t happen.

I'm not wealthy and I don't want it.

Government has been looking to control the people forever. They've been somewhat successful. The only two vestiges stopping them from total control over us are healthcare and energy. Once government controls those two things, they have the ability to to totally control our lives from birth to death.

Lol. Well that does it. You don’t want it so that’s the end of story.

Of course you’ve been duped by the wealthy to think as you do.

Our HC system is a total failure. Time to change it.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

You're totally right that they think that. The problem is that they don't realize they are paying for it. Taxes are baked into the price of the products we buy. People like brainless don't understand that. Low end workers lose their jobs when government sticks their employers with too much cost. Government importing illegals costs the poor even more jobs and drives down their wages.

When the poor think they are voting for Democrats out of their own interest, they are actually voting for the shit to roll down the hill, and they are the ones furthest down the hill

And it's the same with global warming. They interview people and ask if they'd like to see a cleaner planet. The response they get is "uh.......yeah!" Proposed honestly, ask them if they want a greener planet at a cost to them of about $1,000 a year.

People, particularly on the left don't understand that costs come out of their pocket. It's hidden so they can't see it, but they're paying for it.

Look at a highway sometime. Notice all those trucks delivering goods all over the country. Thanks to green, it's costing the transportation industry tens of billions of dollars more to make those deliveries than it did 15 years ago. When they get hit with higher bills for cleaner fuel, DEF fluid, more computers in trucks, they have to recoup that money somewhere, and that somewhere is higher freight costs we all have to pay.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Lol. Well that does it. You don’t want it so that’s the end of story.

Of course you’ve been duped by the wealthy to think as you do.

Our HC system is a total failure. Time to change it.

Only a fool would believe the people who created a problem would have a solution to it--author unknown.

Yes, our healthcare system is a mess. This started years ago during the big union days. I worked in medical at the time. We were erecting a pharmacy in the warehouse to mix drugs for our patients. UPS was on strike at the time. We hired a pharmacist well versed in government regulation to oversee the construction. She approached me one day very angry. She handed me her pharmacy magazine which highlighted the UPS strike.

In the article it said the average pay for a pharmacist was 60K a year. The average pay for a UPS driver was 54K a year. Mad as hell she said "Do you know what I went through to become a pharmacist? Do you know what my parents went through? The years I had to study, the repaying of my college loans, giving up the best years of my life? For what, to make six grand more than the guy that drops off boxes and tells me to sign here?"

Today the medical field is still understaffed, especially when it comes to registered nurses. They only way to draw them into that field of work is to pay them much better than a UPS or UAW worker. That's one of the many reasons our healthcare costs are so high.

 

[Oldestyle]

The Democrat plans to tax the rich are futile and ignorant. They sound good to the uneducated, but they don't work very well. When you raise tax rates or reduce deductions on the rich, their typical response is to divert more of their money into tax shelters where they pay less tax. They can afford tax lawyers and CPAs who find ways to reduce their taxes dramatically and it's all legal.

Donald Trump knows how. For several years at a time, he paid no income tax. I don't know all the shelters he used but I can guess. One would be accelerated depreciation on the buildings and furniture he owns. Another would be Net Loss Carryover. When you have a loss in one year, the IRS Code allows you to deduct that loss on the returns for following years. If the NLC is large enough, it can give you zero tax liability for 5 or 6 years. Even people of moderate income can use tax shelters. I have 2 of them.

If you don't try and target the rich, they will pay a fair share of taxes just like everybody else. If you target them with high tax rates, they run for tax shelters.

These Dem idiots never learned what Kennedy, Reagan and Trump learned. Cutting taxes puts more money into the economy and the Fed coffers than raising them ever did. They will never, ever learn that lesson.

Imbeciles is what they are.

Trickle down economics has never worked, but it does enrich the rich enormously.

Trickle down economics doesn't work...BECAUSE TRICKLE DOWN ECONOMICS DOESN'T EXIST! It's something that was made up by the left to denigrate Supply Side Economics. Whenever someone starts talking about trickle down economics it's a sure sign they don't have a clue about economics in general!

 

[AZrailwhale]

The Democrat plans to tax the rich are futile and ignorant. They sound good to the uneducated, but they don't work very well. When you raise tax rates or reduce deductions on the rich, their typical response is to divert more of their money into tax shelters where they pay less tax. They can afford tax lawyers and CPAs who find ways to reduce their taxes dramatically and it's all legal

Which sounds like another problem with capitalism; since those who write the laws are bought and paid for by a small minority of taxpayers who call themselves "owners" and "shareholders," we should expect parasites like Trump to exploit their legal free ride.

The Divine Right of Capital by Marjorie Kelly: A Summary

Every other governmental and economic system devised by man has the same problem. There is always a favored section of the population that does far better than most. Capitalism allows anyone to join that favored section. Capitalism also works best for most of the population.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Trickle down economics doesn't work...BECAUSE TRICKLE DOWN ECONOMICS DOESN'T EXIST! It's something that was made up by the left to denigrate Supply Side Economics. Whenever someone starts talking about trickle down economics it's a sure sign they don't have a clue about economics in general!

They believe that trickle down economics doesn't work, but trickle down taxes do.

 

[danielpalos]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

No, it doesn't. Some studies show less than five percent increase in prices. Simply beating the rate of inflation means greater purchasing power for Labor and their propensity to consume. The doubling of the minimum wage will not result in a doubling of prices for anything.

 

[Theowl32]

The Democrat plans to tax the rich are futile and ignorant. They sound good to the uneducated, but they don't work very well. When you raise tax rates or reduce deductions on the rich, their typical response is to divert more of their money into tax shelters where they pay less tax. They can afford tax lawyers and CPAs who find ways to reduce their taxes dramatically and it's all legal.

Donald Trump knows how. For several years at a time, he paid no income tax. I don't know all the shelters he used but I can guess. One would be accelerated depreciation on the buildings and furniture he owns. Another would be Net Loss Carryover. When you have a loss in one year, the IRS Code allows you to deduct that loss on the returns for following years. If the NLC is large enough, it can give you zero tax liability for 5 or 6 years. Even people of moderate income can use tax shelters. I have 2 of them.

If you don't try and target the rich, they will pay a fair share of taxes just like everybody else. If you target them with high tax rates, they run for tax shelters.

Just stuff that causes demagoguery. Where they take on the image where they are the sweet shop owner candidates promising free feasts at the expense of the voting base with far fewer people.

The ignorant of course buy into that centuries old robin hood fairy tale. When their promises turn out to false, they then need to, through propaganda and pets in the media, prop up the scapegoat.

The ignorant never see who has been running their cities for 50 years, 100 years. Why don't the ignorant see it? Cause they are ignorant.

 

[danielpalos]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

Yep. When you increase the minimum wage, you increase everyone else's wages because minimum wage by definition goes to the lowest value employees. So you have to pay the others proportionately more.

Then their companies raise prices and it all balances out again. Then a Democrat raises their hand and says I have an idea, let's increase the minimum wage ...

The problem is that's best case for low end workers, that it just doesn't work. The reality is that businesses constantly use those increased costs to streamline, optimize and automate processes. Which results in fewer low end jobs.

The low end workers are actually the victims of minimum wage increases. Democrats of course don't care, it was never about helping anyone. They want them to be poor so they stay Democrats

The left has a solution for that. Equal protection of the laws for unemployment compensation our at-will employment States.