The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate

[P F Tinmore]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
SUBTOPIC: Current Sovereign - Self-Determination
※→ P F Timore, et al,


I apologize, I was under the false impression that you had an understanding that made it this far.
Their mere act of discovery by one state is not enough to confer a title by occupation. There are two requirements (i) the territory subject to a claim must not be under the sovereignty of any state (terra nullius) (ii) the state must have effectively occupied the territory.

(COMMENT)

There is no one-step, simple explanation that you seem to seek. It requires an objective and uncompromised view in order to find the answers to these simple-sounding questions.

I've said this a number of different ways. But in essense, when you say that the Arab Palestinians declined or rejected the opportunity to organize self-governing institutions - that means the Arab Palestinians intentionally chose not to socially or politically organize to the path of self-determination. The Arab Palestinians did it twice then the Arab Palestinians rejected participation in the UK Administration of the Government of Palestine. When they did that (1923), the term "Palestine" from a domestic territorial affiliation, had no meaning. And again in January 1948, the Arab Palestinians refused to participate in the preparation of self-governing institutions. This meant, that when the Mandate terminated, they were (yet again) unorganized. To rub salt into the wound, when the Hashemite Kingdom cut all ties with its holdings west of the Jordan River, that left the West Bank "terra nullius" and effectively placed the territory into the hands of the Israeli Occupation Force because the Arab Palestinian was (one more time) unprepared to assume governmental responsibilities. Oddly enough, each of these very bad social and political decisions was made on their own - under the principle of (you guessed it) "self-determination." And it worked against them.

Now, the Arab Palestinians are whining to anyone that will listen about how it is so unfair for the Arab Palestinians to be penalized for their bad decisions. Well, any number of nations would lie to "do-over" some of the conflicts that did not turn out in their favor.

The longer the Arab Palestinians drag their feet in the hope that some miracle will pull their fat out of the fire, the greater the injury will be.

Again, don't you see the irony?

Abbas Wants Negotiations with Israel to Begin with Border Demarcation ​

Sunday, 12 December, 2021 - 10:00​

Most Respectfully,
R

Your link does not answer the question.

 

[P F Tinmore]

The Arab Palestinians did it twice then the Arab Palestinians rejected participation in the UK Administration of the Government of Palestine.

The Palestinians would have had to buy into the colonial project. That is what they rejected.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The Palestinians would have had to buy into the colonial project. That is what they rejected.

How's that working out for them so far?

 

[rylah]

The Palestinians would have had to buy into the colonial project. That is what they rejected.

That would make sense if your definition of "Palestinian"
wasn't to include any non-Jew who happened to reside
in a country whose name they can't even pronounce
properly, and for no longer than 2 years.

Isn't that colonialism?

 

[themirrorthief]

This thread was created in order to attempt to fix the significant derailment of another thread without having to delete posts.

The topic of this thread is one that comes up with regularity in IP, and is also a frequent derailer of active threads so it will now have a thread of it's own which will be pinned as a "stickie".

I apologize ahead of time for the bumpy discontinuous beginnig of this, but I think it will smooth out as discussion goes on.

The topic is: The history involving the creation of Israel, the British Mandate, and the applicable actions of the UN in that history.

all nations are created duh

 

[RoccoR]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
SUBTOPIC: Current Sovereign - Self-Determination
※→ P F Timore, et al,

The "Right of Self-Determination" does not acquire anything. It is the overt act by the people themselves that is the measure of "self-determination."

P F Tinmore said:
Self determination is a method of acquiring territory?

Link?

Your link does not answer the question.

(COMMENT)

Self-Determination promises nothing. But when people stand together and assemble the necessary self-governing institutions and put them to work, that is the product.

While the Arab Palestinians have the "Right to Self-Determination," they were not able to generate sufficient energy to create a nation. The choices they made (self-determined) were counterproductive. And in saying that, the outside observer can observe the narcissist culture that achieves very little. The Arab Palestinians operate in a fantasy world where they are perfect and everyone who disagrees with them is imperfect. They blame everyone but themselves, yet the actual outcome of their efforts is prima facie evidence of their incompetence (as a collective people) could not put the pieces together. They were given the exact same opportunities as the Jewish settlers, and had the home-court advantage, yet still could not make a go of it.

The reason the links I give to you do not answer the question is because → you will accept any NO answer that does not support your position.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

They blame everyone but themselves, yet the actual outcome to their efforts is prima facie evidence of their incompetence as a collective people could not put the pieces together.

Of course they were up against the world superpower of the time.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Self-Determination promises nothing. But when people stand together and assemble the necessary self-governing institutions and put them to work, that is the product.

That doesn't work in somebody else's country.The French can't go into Britain and claim self determination.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

That doesn't work in somebody else's country.The French can't go into Britain and claim self determination.

And the Arabs can't do it in Israel.

 

[P F Tinmore]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
SUBTOPIC: Current Sovereign - Self-Determination
※→ P F Timore, et al,

The "Right of Self-Determination" does not acquire anything. It is the overt act by the people themselves that is the measure of "self-determination."



(COMMENT)

Self-Determination promises nothing. But when people stand together and assemble the necessary self-governing institutions and put them to work, that is the product.

While the Arab Palestinians have the "Right to Self-Determination," they were not able to generate sufficient energy to create a nation. The choices they made (self-determined) were counterproductive. And in saying that, the outside observer can observe the narcissist culture that achieves very little. The Arab Palestinians operate in a fantasy world where they are perfect and everyone who disagrees with them is imperfect. They blame everyone but themselves, yet the actual outcome of their efforts is prima facie evidence of their incompetence (as a collective people) could not put the pieces together. They were given the exact same opportunities as the Jewish settlers, and had the home-court advantage, yet still could not make a go of it.

The reason the links I give to you do not answer the question is because → you will accept any NO answer that does not support your position.

Most Respectfully,
R

Your usual hit piece.

 

[rylah]

That doesn't work in somebody else's country.The French can't go into Britain and claim self determination.

Indeed, but you want Arab supremacists to have exclusive domination
over the entire Middle East and North Africa.

Why are you against self-determination
for minorities in the Middle East?

 

[P F Tinmore]

Palestine by Nur Masalha Book Summary - Review (AudioBook)​

 

[rylah]

Palestinian Information Center’s Timeline of Jerusalem

Admits Their History Begins With Islamic Conquest​

 

[P F Tinmore]

What actual step created Israel.

Military attacks on unarmed civilians.

You can't get any more candy ass than that.

 

[rylah]

Military attacks on unarmed civilians.

You can't get any more candy ass than that.

Attacks don't create states.

Curious that Arab supremacists
even suggest that, and all their states failed.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Attacks don't create states.

Only Arab supremacists would
suggest such nonsense to justify defeat.

It's true. Look it up.

 

[rylah]

It's true. Look it up.

Or...maybe because Arab supremacists believe
that attacks create states, they don't deserve any?

Basically, my solution is simple and just - to do Islam to Muslims.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Palestine by Nur Masalha Book Summary - Review (AudioBook)​

Lies!

Those losers have been whining for at least 5000 years.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Military attacks on unarmed civilians.

The invading Arab armies attacked unarmed civilians?

And still got their asses kicked?

Why are Arabs always getting their asses kicked?

 

[P F Tinmore]

The invading Arab armies attacked unarmed civilians?

And still got their asses kicked?

Why are Arabs always getting their asses kicked?

The Palestinians were the unarmed civilians.