Americans are now utterly intolerant of ever being told they’re wrong about almost anything

[mudwhistle]

More important, we need to start listening to each other with a greater assumption of good will. Cable news has become a gladiatorial exercise, but that doesn’t mean each of us must approach conversation as a fight to the finish.

I think the right-wing gave up any consideration of courtesy when they supported the Orange Nazi knowing damned well he had no business being president.

They put winning above the good of the country and common decency.

Ironically, they'll be the ones getting the worst of his policies, so it is truly karmic.

Actually that's what the left did when they supported a lunatic like Hillary.
The same goes for Obama.
The left would vote for a pile of shit if the media could convince them that the steaming pile was a shoe-in.

 

[mudwhistle]

Young, college educated, left wing millenials are the most suceptible to fake news......because they are trained by left wing professors to dismiss the truth, facts and reality ......in order to feel important....

You mean as opposed to Republicans who really think Obama was born in Kenya?

Considering they are all college educated....and more inclined to believe fake news...yep.

Education does not equal intelligence.
To liberals a degree is their God.
The more impressive, the more they feel they're better than everyone else.
I went to college. Most of what I learned couldn't be used in the real world much less get me a job.

 

[JoeB131]

Considering they are all college educated....and more inclined to believe fake news...yep.

Well, I can tell you don't need you no college learning, Cleetus!

But you avoided my point... that Trump ran on the Birther platform and that got him to the top...

 

[JoeB131]

Actually that's what the left did when they supported a lunatic like Hillary.
The same goes for Obama.
The left would vote for a pile of shit if the media could convince them that the steaming pile was a shoe-in.

Yawn, guy, i know you are denial about how you really messed this up.

The ironic thing is, Hillary would have probably strengthened your party. Trump will end up destroying it because you've already sacrificed your principles and it's becoming increasingly apparent you don't know how to govern...

 

[JoeB131]

Education does not equal intelligence.
To liberals a degree is their God.
The more impressive, the more they feel they're better than everyone else.
I went to college. Most of what I learned couldn't be used in the real world much less get me a job.

I think you are a little confused.

If anyone has turned a college degree into a requisite for employment, it's corporate America.

When the 2008 recession hit and cured me of being a Republican, there were three of us who were let go from our department for being too old when there were younger people willing to work cheaper. But I was only out of work for about two weeks, while the other two, who had just as much experience but no college degree, took months to find new jobs. 90% of jobs in our field were closed to them because they didn't have a degree.

That wasn't "liberals', that was Corporate America

 

[mudwhistle]

Actually that's what the left did when they supported a lunatic like Hillary.
The same goes for Obama.
The left would vote for a pile of shit if the media could convince them that the steaming pile was a shoe-in.

Yawn, guy, i know you are denial about how you really messed this up.

The ironic thing is, Hillary would have probably strengthened your party. Trump will end up destroying it because you've already sacrificed your principles and it's becoming increasingly apparent you don't know how to govern...

I'm not in a position to govern. That's why we have a representative going to Washington to do that for us. It's up to us to weed out the low-lifes and con-artists that represent us. Unfortunately the left feels that if you promise people the world and hide what you're really up to from them, you can get elected.

Hillary was about Hillary, not the people she was supposed to represent. The only time she was in a position of authority she failed. Why would anyone in their right mind want to vote for a selfish bitch who was out to screw us in the ass and line her own pockets?

Never mind the threat that someone like Hillary would pose to the public. She was already caught red-handed on two different occasions stealing secret files in order to build an enemy's list an information database to blackmail people with. She is a criminal and has no business being in a position of power at any level.

 

[Vastator]

The problem is that both sides dig-in and defend their version of fake-news. The version that supports their world view. How do you fix that?

Eliminate the opposition.

That's simply not going to happen.

Maybe look for a Plan B.
.

Plan A. Solve the problem.
Plan B. Learn to live with the problem.

Life doesn't have to be complicated...

 

[martybegan]

Writer Tom Nichols' efforts here will almost certainly be wasted, but it sure would be nice if this piece got around a bit:

Americans are now utterly intolerant of ever being told they’re wrong about almost anything

From the piece, my bold:

This isn't just human nature, but the result of a narcissism that took root in American society after the 1960s and has been growing ever since. Surrounded by affluence, enabled by the internet, and empowered by an educational system that prizes self-esteem over achievement, Americans have become more opinionated even as they have become less informed, and are now utterly intolerant of ever being told they’re wrong about almost anything.

Our republic thrives on open debate and the fair consideration of evidence. When our ability to maintain those democratic habits collapses, our system of government, along with our well-being as a people and a nation, will be in danger. There are a few steps we can take, including treating cable and the internet as we would treat our diet: by exercising portion control, healthy choices, and a varied mixture. We should especially make an effort to consider other sources that challenge us.

More important, we need to start listening to each other with a greater assumption of good will. Cable news has become a gladiatorial exercise, but that doesn’t mean each of us must approach conversation as a fight to the finish.

We must come out from behind our keyboards and smartphones and televisions and engage each other as citizens, rather than opponents. In an age of binary, win-at-all-costs politics, this is a tall order. But citizens need to be better examples to our political and media leaders than they’ve been to us.

There is still time to reconsider the path we’ve set upon in the past few decades, but one thing should be clear: We cannot continue this way much longer and survive as a vibrant democracy.
.

I know my own bias may come into play here, but to me most of the "my way or the highway" mentality is firmly fixed on the left these days. On the right, at least among federalists and "small l" libertarians the overwhelming desire is to just be left the hell alone on many policies and positions. When North Carolina passed the dreaded "Bathroom Bill" the people there did not try to impose said law on places like New York or California, they just wanted it in their own State.

You also don't see people on the Right trying to shut down speeches by people on the left, via either violence or the "heckler's veto". That is a purely left wing tactic currently.

Some, including myself, on the Right are probably much more shrill and mean than we used to be, but it is because we see core fundamentals of this country under attack. Freedom of Speech, Freedom of Religion, RKBA, Federalism in general.

If my side wins, people in States where they want Single payer, bathroom neutrality, welfare states, etc can still get what they want due to the miracle of federalism. If their side wins, we all have to live like they want us to live.

 

[Mac1958]

Writer Tom Nichols' efforts here will almost certainly be wasted, but it sure would be nice if this piece got around a bit:

Americans are now utterly intolerant of ever being told they’re wrong about almost anything

From the piece, my bold:

This isn't just human nature, but the result of a narcissism that took root in American society after the 1960s and has been growing ever since. Surrounded by affluence, enabled by the internet, and empowered by an educational system that prizes self-esteem over achievement, Americans have become more opinionated even as they have become less informed, and are now utterly intolerant of ever being told they’re wrong about almost anything.

Our republic thrives on open debate and the fair consideration of evidence. When our ability to maintain those democratic habits collapses, our system of government, along with our well-being as a people and a nation, will be in danger. There are a few steps we can take, including treating cable and the internet as we would treat our diet: by exercising portion control, healthy choices, and a varied mixture. We should especially make an effort to consider other sources that challenge us.

More important, we need to start listening to each other with a greater assumption of good will. Cable news has become a gladiatorial exercise, but that doesn’t mean each of us must approach conversation as a fight to the finish.

We must come out from behind our keyboards and smartphones and televisions and engage each other as citizens, rather than opponents. In an age of binary, win-at-all-costs politics, this is a tall order. But citizens need to be better examples to our political and media leaders than they’ve been to us.

There is still time to reconsider the path we’ve set upon in the past few decades, but one thing should be clear: We cannot continue this way much longer and survive as a vibrant democracy.
.

I know my own bias may come into play here, but to me most of the "my way or the highway" mentality is firmly fixed on the left these days. On the right, at least among federalists and "small l" libertarians the overwhelming desire is to just be left the hell alone on many policies and positions. When North Carolina passed the dreaded "Bathroom Bill" the people there did not try to impose said law on places like New York or California, they just wanted it in their own State.

You also don't see people on the Right trying to shut down speeches by people on the left, via either violence or the "heckler's veto". That is a purely left wing tactic currently.

Some, including myself, on the Right are probably much more shrill and mean than we used to be, but it is because we see core fundamentals of this country under attack. Freedom of Speech, Freedom of Religion, RKBA, Federalism in general.

If my side wins, people in States where they want Single payer, bathroom neutrality, welfare states, etc can still get what they want due to the miracle of federalism. If their side wins, we all have to live like they want us to live.

Certainly the Left has this fixation on shutting down opposing speech, I can't argue with that. It flies directly against what (I think) is our most important right, and they don't care. A bad, bad situation.

But, at the same time, look at his exchange:

The problem is that both sides dig-in and defend their version of fake-news. The version that supports their world view. How do you fix that?

Eliminate the opposition.

That's simply not going to happen. Maybe look for a Plan B..

Plan A. Solve the problem. Plan B. Learn to live with the problem. Life doesn't have to be complicated...

While the two "sides" do share many behaviors, it seems like the Right thinks it's going to somehow "win" this, and "beat" the other side. And that approach is certainly a part of what the article in the OP discusses.
.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

I thnk we can already see the OP being proved on this thread.

Yeah, it didn't take very long.

I don't know about the UK (I have a brother who lives there), but this has really infected our culture. Constructive communication is essentially non-existent.
.

I doubt that there is much difference. But........brexit was not partisan, there were supporters and detractors on both sides.
An issue like fracking also unites right and left. Nobody really wants it unless they are getting a big cheque from MegaCorp.
But generally there is a right/left split on most issues and then splits in both of those camps as well.
Corbyn has pissed off a lot of his supporters with his stance on brexit.
May is delighting the tory and ukip fanbase with her stance.
Its difficult to see common ground on issues though. Mainly being related to how much the upfront cost is.

 

[mudwhistle]

Education does not equal intelligence.
To liberals a degree is their God.
The more impressive, the more they feel they're better than everyone else.
I went to college. Most of what I learned couldn't be used in the real world much less get me a job.

I think you are a little confused.

If anyone has turned a college degree into a requisite for employment, it's corporate America.

When the 2008 recession hit and cured me of being a Republican, there were three of us who were let go from our department for being too old when there were younger people willing to work cheaper. But I was only out of work for about two weeks, while the other two, who had just as much experience but no college degree, took months to find new jobs. 90% of jobs in our field were closed to them because they didn't have a degree.

That wasn't "liberals', that was Corporate America

Liberals run Corporate America Dude. Didn't you know that?
You could always work in another field, but that would take some changes maybe some aren't willing to make.
I noticed when I was in the Army that officers tend to think they know more than the NCOs that work for them, and it's usually the other way around.
If you want to find out something about a unit in the military the best person to go to is the buck sgt. He's the guy on the ground dealing with all of the shit firsthand. He's not giving orders, he's carrying them out. You see it doesn't matter how much education you have if you can't apply what you learned to an occupation. That takes independent thought sometimes.
Oh, and blaming the president for a recession is a copout. It takes more than one man to cause negative growth in the economy. It's usually a concerted effort.

 

[JoeB131]

I'm not in a position to govern. That's why we have a representative going to Washington to do that for us. It's up to us to weed out the low-lifes and con-artists that represent us. Unfortunately the left feels that if you promise people the world and hide what you're really up to from them, you can get elected.

And the right is very good at playing on your racism, sexism, homophobia and fears to get you to vote away the things that your parents and grandparents fought very hard to win.

You see, the problem with guys like you is that when you think of "government benefits", you think of things like food stamps and section 8 (which actually benefit farmers and building owners just as much as they benefit poor people)

You don't think of Social Security, Medicare, Unemployment Insurance, which take up far more of government spending and are mostly utilized by middle class white people.

Hillary was about Hillary, not the people she was supposed to represent. The only time she was in a position of authority she failed. Why would anyone in their right mind want to vote for a selfish bitch who was out to screw us in the ass and line her own pockets?

Because Trump is an absolute lunatic with several mental disorders (Narcissism, Paranoia, Senile dementia) who has no business being near nuclear weapons?

Look, if you guys had nominated Kasich or Rubio or even Ted Cruz, you'd have probably had an argument. But you nominated Trump, someone 60% of your own voters thought was a bad idea....

Never mind the threat that someone like Hillary would pose to the public. She was already caught red-handed on two different occasions stealing secret files in order to build an enemy's list an information database to blackmail people with. She is a criminal and has no business being in a position of power at any level.

Yawn, guy, we've been hearing the "Hillary is going to get you" song from you guys for 25 years now, you've spent hundreds of millions of dollars investigating her and her husband and came up with exactly... nothing.

 

[mudwhistle]

I thnk we can already see the OP being proved on this thread.

Yeah, it didn't take very long.

I don't know about the UK (I have a brother who lives there), but this has really infected our culture. Constructive communication is essentially non-existent.
.

I doubt that there is much difference. But........brexit was not partisan, there were supporters and detractors on both sides.
An issue like fracking also unites right and left. Nobody really wants it unless they are getting a big cheque from MegaCorp.
But generally there is a right/left split on most issues and then splits in both of those camps as well.
Corbyn has pissed off a lot of his supporters with his stance on brexit.
May is delighting the tory and ukip fanbase with her stance.
Its difficult to see common ground on issues though. Mainly being related to how much the upfront cost is.

And you assume that everyone hates fracking......like it will kill the planet.
But fracking is the primary reason you aren't paying $4.00 per gallon in gas.

 

[JoeB131]

Liberals run Corporate America Dude. Didn't you know that?
You could always work in another field, but that would take some changes maybe some aren't willing to make.

Guy, after the 2008 recession, it was hard enough for people to get jobs they were qualified for. That's how bad Bush messed it up for everyone.

I noticed when I was in the Army that officers tend to think they know more than the NCOs that work for them, and it's usually the other way around.

um, you see, the thing is, the ARMY thinks that, which is why the officer is in charge and not the NCO. Now, this is an awful system we inherited from the British where we take a guy with too much education and put him in charge. It probably doesn't mean as much as it did 100 years ago when few people had college degrees.

If you want to find out something about a unit in the military the best person to go to is the buck sgt. He's the guy on the ground dealing with all of the shit firsthand. He's not giving orders, he's carrying them out. You see it doesn't matter how much education you have if you can't apply what you learned to an occupation. That takes independent thought sometimes.

Guy, I knew a lot of E-5's who were utterly worthless.

Oh, and blaming the president for a recession is a copout. It takes more than one man to cause negative growth in the economy. It's usually a concerted effort.

Yet Recessions always seem to happen when Republicans are in charge. Now why is that? The only Democrat recession in my lifetime of 55 years was the 1980 Recession under Carter. Compared to the five recessions that happened under Nixon, Ford, Reagan and the Bush Crime family.

 

[JoeB131]

And you assume that everyone hates fracking......like it will kill the planet.
But fracking is the primary reason you aren't paying $4.00 per gallon in gas.

No, the main reason is because the Saudis are keeping production a full tilt to keep the price down so we don't do more fracking and to fund their war in Yemen.

Fracking won't kill the planet, but it is going to mess up pristine parts of it.

 

[martybegan]

Writer Tom Nichols' efforts here will almost certainly be wasted, but it sure would be nice if this piece got around a bit:

Americans are now utterly intolerant of ever being told they’re wrong about almost anything

From the piece, my bold:

This isn't just human nature, but the result of a narcissism that took root in American society after the 1960s and has been growing ever since. Surrounded by affluence, enabled by the internet, and empowered by an educational system that prizes self-esteem over achievement, Americans have become more opinionated even as they have become less informed, and are now utterly intolerant of ever being told they’re wrong about almost anything.

Our republic thrives on open debate and the fair consideration of evidence. When our ability to maintain those democratic habits collapses, our system of government, along with our well-being as a people and a nation, will be in danger. There are a few steps we can take, including treating cable and the internet as we would treat our diet: by exercising portion control, healthy choices, and a varied mixture. We should especially make an effort to consider other sources that challenge us.

More important, we need to start listening to each other with a greater assumption of good will. Cable news has become a gladiatorial exercise, but that doesn’t mean each of us must approach conversation as a fight to the finish.

We must come out from behind our keyboards and smartphones and televisions and engage each other as citizens, rather than opponents. In an age of binary, win-at-all-costs politics, this is a tall order. But citizens need to be better examples to our political and media leaders than they’ve been to us.

There is still time to reconsider the path we’ve set upon in the past few decades, but one thing should be clear: We cannot continue this way much longer and survive as a vibrant democracy.
.

I know my own bias may come into play here, but to me most of the "my way or the highway" mentality is firmly fixed on the left these days. On the right, at least among federalists and "small l" libertarians the overwhelming desire is to just be left the hell alone on many policies and positions. When North Carolina passed the dreaded "Bathroom Bill" the people there did not try to impose said law on places like New York or California, they just wanted it in their own State.

You also don't see people on the Right trying to shut down speeches by people on the left, via either violence or the "heckler's veto". That is a purely left wing tactic currently.

Some, including myself, on the Right are probably much more shrill and mean than we used to be, but it is because we see core fundamentals of this country under attack. Freedom of Speech, Freedom of Religion, RKBA, Federalism in general.

If my side wins, people in States where they want Single payer, bathroom neutrality, welfare states, etc can still get what they want due to the miracle of federalism. If their side wins, we all have to live like they want us to live.

Certainly the Left has this fixation on shutting down opposing speech, I can't argue with that. It flies directly against what (I think) is our most important right, and they don't care. A bad, bad situation.

But, at the same time, look at his exchange:

The problem is that both sides dig-in and defend their version of fake-news. The version that supports their world view. How do you fix that?

Eliminate the opposition.

That's simply not going to happen. Maybe look for a Plan B..

Plan A. Solve the problem. Plan B. Learn to live with the problem. Life doesn't have to be complicated...

While the two "sides" do share many behaviors, it seems like the Right thinks it's going to somehow "win" this, and "beat" the other side. And that approach is certainly a part of what the article in the OP discusses.
.

I take the words/actions of people on a message board with a grain of salt. I am actually a far more reasonable person than I present on this board. This board is sometimes an outlet for me to let loose and let my anger out a bit. You then have to add in the sock/trolls who "play a persona on TV" and are not actually what they appear to be.

I usually look past words and concentrate on actions, and right now the Left has the monopoly on "fuck you" actions.

It always amazes me how the pendulum swings back and forth sometimes when it comes to political views and temperament. We are only a few decades out from the "Moral Majority" idiots and their attempts to stifle things they found "indecent".

 

[mudwhistle]

I'm not in a position to govern. That's why we have a representative going to Washington to do that for us. It's up to us to weed out the low-lifes and con-artists that represent us. Unfortunately the left feels that if you promise people the world and hide what you're really up to from them, you can get elected.

And the right is very good at playing on your racism, sexism, homophobia and fears to get you to vote away the things that your parents and grandparents fought very hard to win.

You see, the problem with guys like you is that when you think of "government benefits", you think of things like food stamps and section 8 (which actually benefit farmers and building owners just as much as they benefit poor people)

You don't think of Social Security, Medicare, Unemployment Insurance, which take up far more of government spending and are mostly utilized by middle class white people.

Hillary was about Hillary, not the people she was supposed to represent. The only time she was in a position of authority she failed. Why would anyone in their right mind want to vote for a selfish bitch who was out to screw us in the ass and line her own pockets?

Because Trump is an absolute lunatic with several mental disorders (Narcissism, Paranoia, Senile dementia) who has no business being near nuclear weapons?

Look, if you guys had nominated Kasich or Rubio or even Ted Cruz, you'd have probably had an argument. But you nominated Trump, someone 60% of your own voters thought was a bad idea....

Never mind the threat that someone like Hillary would pose to the public. She was already caught red-handed on two different occasions stealing secret files in order to build an enemy's list an information database to blackmail people with. She is a criminal and has no business being in a position of power at any level.

Yawn, guy, we've been hearing the "Hillary is going to get you" song from you guys for 25 years now, you've spent hundreds of millions of dollars investigating her and her husband and came up with exactly... nothing.

This is what power gets you.
Now Hillary has the goods on everyone. They can collect data on everyone. The surveillance on Trump proves it. All it takes is someone who doesn't like following the law and you get the kind of acts that Hillary is famous for.
And if we had run dipshits like Kasich or Rubio against Hillary they would have lost. You sucks tried furiously to tell us Trump would assure a loss and look what happens.

I suggest you stick to your fantasies, maybe try selling them to somebody less informed.

 

[mudwhistle]

And you assume that everyone hates fracking......like it will kill the planet.
But fracking is the primary reason you aren't paying $4.00 per gallon in gas.

No, the main reason is because the Saudis are keeping production a full tilt to keep the price down so we don't do more fracking and to fund their war in Yemen.

Fracking won't kill the planet, but it is going to mess up pristine parts of it.

There's a cause and effect involved in everything and this is no exception.

 

[Mac1958]

I suggest you stick to your fantasies try selling them to somebody less informed.

Back to the OP:

Do you feel that this climate is better and/or more constructive than one in which communication is more open and cooperative?
.

 

[Marion Morrison]

I think it comes back to education and what we learn as we grow up.
People lack the necessary skills to sift information and that leads to an acceptance of persuasively written propaganda.
Its about knowing when you are being played. It irritates me.
The best selling paper in the UK is the Sun. For decades it has spread social and political shite and paid up fortunes to its victims.
But it is still the best selling paper in the UK and all politicians kiss Murdochs ring in order to get the Suns blessing.
Until we can improve our education system and get some critical thinking in there we will not improve.

Typical snobbish liberal response.
Democrats cannot be honest to their own base because their base is too stupid to understand the complexities I suppose.
Obamacare was passed filled with "Tortured-Language" with the expressed intent to deny the truth and mislead the public is beyond dispute. Your statement proves that you agree that the public is too stupid to understand the truth even when it's presented to them.
Democrats haven't nominated an honest politician in our lifetime and their only defense is "They all do it", tells us everything we need to know.
It's not because they're too stupid and can't be trusted to make their own decisions. The problem is when you force your values down someone else's throat you tend to piss people off. So you lie to them and try to change their values and remove their principles.

This is how concentration camps became a reality in Germany. They wouldn't be possible without the acceptance of the public.

I didn't see anything that snobbish or liberal in Tommy Tainant's post.

He made a valid point, IMO.

Critical thinking is the key to unlock the brainwashed younger generation's mind.

I don't agree with 90% of what he posts, but in that regard I agree with him.

As for anything JoeB131 has posted, he's proving the OP 100% correct.

Logic defies JoeB131 and he defies logic right back.